Originally Posted by [KYA]Mega
Thank you so much for taking the time to give such a thorough response. You have convinced me to go borderless, especially since that is the least permanent solution if I don't like it, but it sounds like I already have a lot going for me to do borderless.
Glad to be able to help! Designing Theaters is what I do, albeit in a somewhat different vein that most.
The main reason I was planning to start off with the entire room dark was simply because I was going to start of with a TV in there and thought a light wall behind it would be silly. But I'm sure I can come up with something dark that wouldn't mess up the pristine wall until I get a projector.
Absolutely you can....and it can / should be the exact color & paint your going to eventually use for you Screen.
But please...don't hang the TV on a Wall Mount. To put Holes in the eventual Screen wall (Mounting Holes...110 outlet...HDMI Cable...) would be entirely self defeating.
If you own a TV already...one large enough to be worthy of watching in a room that size, then hopefully it has a Stand, and you could set it on a Table. Of course you still have to have a 110 outlet and HDMI run to that wall location...just have them placed as low as Code will allow.
(Horizontally, just above Baseboard height is good. Paint all Plates the same color as the Wall they are on.)
Don't own a TV for that room? Well Sheesh! There are several sub-$800 projectors that will make a mockery of any 65"er with at least a stunning 110" 1080p screen for the meanwhile. (...afterwards, you can "hand me down" to the Kids...or use it for a Outdoor Party PJ...)
Your a Texan! Go big...or eat grass!
One question I have regarding paint: What is the school of thought when it comes to white vs. grey? From the reading I've done so far I thought white was best for the darker rooms and grey was better if you had a room with more ambient light or lighter walls. So am I wrong or is there another reason you suggest grey?
Here's the skinny.....,
Yes...under ideal Room Color / Lighting conditions and when using a Projector that has mega- "Native" contrast and ultra deep Blacks, a white will suffice nicely enough. Smooth white surfaces tend to "disappear" as far as being seen as a "screen".
Not so much if anything above is left to wanting...especially the PJ's own specifications.
I've been advocating the use of Grey surfaces since 2003-4, for & under ALL
circumstances, but with almost all having positive gain characteristics because of the use of Metallic and Polyurethane additives.
In the beginning, the primary reasoning was twofold...to increase off-the-screen brightness ( my Screens were all BIG...) and to boost the perceived on-screen contrast by greatly improving the depth of the projected Blacks while not crushing detail or turning Whites into a dull mess. Also, such higher gain Greys did wonderful things to color depth and saturation. These Screen were almost all of them in either dedicated Theaters or Media Rooms.
However it became apparent quickly that an additional benefit was greatly improved ambient light resistance, because when one of those screens...by me or other Forum members...did go into a Family room setting, it was obvious that image quality remained exceptional under modest to medium ambient light.
From that point on, already knowing that the "Dark room" needs had been met, the emphasis went toward developing true Ambient Light Screen applications. The rest of the story is Forum history....and need not be repeated.
Even with today's PJs...4K or otherwise...both Native Contrast and Blacks can "almost"
always use some help. I say almost
because if you choose a top end JVC 4K with 160,000:1 Native Contrast and over 1.8 M:1 Dynamic Contrast, ....yep, dark room performance will be stunning....with just a plain ol smooth Matte White Screen.
.........if you turn on any lights, or the room itself works against those deep Blacks because of reflection, then that is where the use of a higher gain Grey can be / is wholly advantageous. Such a Paint certainly won't detract from image quality under those less-than-ideal conditions, it can only ever help.
And no matter what else is said, my 39 years doing this sorta thing has shown that contrary to what people say they "won't" do...they always have reason to turn the lights on...sometime or another. So it helps to have help when that happens.
Your room's current design illustrates that need, if only because your placing a Door right up to the left side of the screen. I can hear the plea now: "Close that Door!
(...make sure the door open inward toward the Screen and that will help...)
So here are some responses to your questions:
Give 'em up!
I am having a semi-custom home built and ground has not been broken yet, so there is plenty of time to make decisions. I chose the grey color for the room this week but I still have 2 more design center meetings before that is even considered "final". We estimate a move-in date in January 2018.
That's cool...glad to know your not pressed to make hasty decisions. You have a opportunity to get virtually everything done exactly as it should be...and how you want it to be, so your eventual satisfaction index should be sky high.
Here is the floor plan but we have modified it a bit: https://www.rialtotexas.com/tx/san-a...eek/the-sandra
I'll be doing the downstairs media room option. But we modified the utility room so the entry to the media room will be in the corner of the side with the TV and the platform for 2nd row seating on the side closest to the garage.
I have attached a more detailed version from the blueprint and I photoshopped the door to closer to the correct location and ironically I just noticed they already had the platform on the garage side so the furniture placement on the web floorplan is wrong. LOL
Yeah...noted...and lamented. Iffin' it were me...I'd reverse the orientation of the Utility Room, pushing the appliances toward the Kitchen, and enter the Theater from under the Stairs, stepping up to the Platform Level. Consider this...the under-stairs space becomes a Theater Ante area, perhaps with a Mini-Bar / Concession.
Better still, leave the Door in place, but flip the room so that the Screen Wall is common with the Garage. You'd still step-up, but at no time when people are entering or leaving the Room will that interfere with the Mood or Image quality. Also...having the main Front Sound Stage opposite a Bedroom Wall is never a great idea.
Especially the Master Bedroom. This is a Room that will never be anything else but a Theater, so the thought and design must reflect that, lest at some future date of Resale, someone asks, :Why?" or worse, "I don't like that arrangement". (ie: a Wife)
This company will be doing all my low voltage wiring: https://www.bsgtexas.com/
I have requested them to wire and plate for 7.1.4. I currently have a 7.1 receiver and will someday upgrade to probably 5.1.4 or 7.1.2 (11 channels is probably out of my price range). So I may never use all 11 channels at once but I wanted the flexibility and the fact I can use 7.1 now.
Proper Wiring placement will be critical, and if you are to go with Cabinet Surrounds, the choice of same will be of paramount importance
Also I've requested conduit for the projector already.
That's fine, but the additional Cost of such would be better spent pre-installing a Future-Proof Fiber Optic 4K Certified HDMI, one that supports over 58 gigs....fully 3x the current standard for SUHD-4K
Phase 1 will be a normal 3-person couch below the riser. I may or may not choose to add a 2nd row but I probably will. The default platform they have in the blueprint is 6". Should I ask them to make it 10"?
Yes.....no question about that. Your eventual screen size will demand a angle of view from a Rear Row that will clear the Heads of those up front when they are not reclined.
9' 1 1/8"
That can / will work, but you'll have virtually no leeway to design the room any other way than how I'm suggesting. 10' would be better...both design-wise and also "sonic-ally".
Fronts are floor standing Klipsch KG 5.5
s, so yeah, I gotta make room for them. I currently phantom the center so I don't have one. I never felt the need with those horns pointing at me.
Well........if you've never had the advantage of object based directional output at Center, along with the very real impact that comes from dedicated Center Channel content.....you really can't judge the "need" you've been denying yourself.
Don't hate me. And that's another good reason for a 10' Ceiling....room to place a Klispch In-Wall Center Channel in a Canter-leveled mount above the Screen, directed downward to the listening position.
For surrounds I forget the model, but they are not going to be in-wall they will be mounted or maybe on some custom shelves. For safety they'll be about 7' high.
are good'ns that are Low Profile, and also be used as Atmos Ceiling Drivers.
I also have a pretty large HSU VTF-3 MK3
sub that I will place in a corner most likely. I'll probably do a crawl test to place it, but subs usually like corners.
Multiple choice of location means multiple Wiring, unless you opt for a "good" wireless sub Transmitter / Receiver package. Believe it or not, the Klispch WA-2 unit is junk. This'n
is a great choice...and costs almost 2/3rds less.
I'm having them wire for 4 wall sconces and I'll probably pick those up on my own as nothing the design center had was remotely close to what I want.
Put no Sconces further forward than almost adjacent to the sides of the Front Row seating. 2 at that location and 2 in each corner of the Rear wall.
I also want a ceiling fan in there (probably with no light kit or a very low profile one), but not sure how limited that will make the projector placement, but I could go with the projector on the back wall rather than ceiling mounted. Not sure about that yet but I do need to plan that out.
Brother...you will absolutely need a 10' Ceiling. And NO light Kit.
A Wall mounted PJ above a Platform is a poor choice...and it will lessen your Projector's performance.
Having said that...building a 24" wide by 20" deep "Through the Garage Wall & Flush " Projector Enclosure, one that loads from the Front is an option if indeed you can restrict your ambient light enough to optimize the PJ's output / Screens reflective-ness.
My preference with lighting is: I like to watch movies in total darkness. So I haven't been worrying too much about dimming capabilities. But I have never had a room painted dark before so not sure how much or little lighting I'll need. But I like your ideas with Halogen spots with a remote dimmer. I know I want indirect lights so they don't ruin your night vision.
Directional Spots that aimed at the upper 1/3rd of the Walls, or Wall Wash lenses that create the same effect are "best choices"....and having the Lights and Sconces on separate $35.00 Remote IR Dimmers means you might actually get some decent use out of 'em.
I have to sell my current home before I know how soon I'll have a projector budget, but I totally agree with waiting until I can get the right one rather than buying something I'm going to want to upgrade soon after. A dream I've had for a long time is passive 3D, but after some research I decided that was going to be way too expensive to consider, so that is when I decided I at least wanted 4K especially with a screen big enough to appreciate that resolution. But I was surprised to see how far behind 4K is on projectors compared to TVs especially since the use case seems even better than a small screen. Active 3D seems to be fading away too as it seems the newest 4K DLP chips do not support it. So I'm not going to let 3D stand in the way of getting a good projector. But I said all that to say my projector research has just begun and I am VERY open to suggestions and there will likely be more choices before I am ready to buy... but I will limit myself on price.
The above is a subject that is my specialty. Now unless you really think your in the running for a true 4K machine, and are willing to part with $10k+ "minimum", you best'est choice is a JVC EShift PJ. They all support 3D as well...and it is spectacular 3D too! I know.....my last several installations have all been JVC EShift'ers
You can never tell what kinda price you might swing into on one. The current JVC Model year is going on discount as I type, with the Flagship DLA- x970r going for under $6000.00! And the x570r for under $3K! Now mind you, those are Distributor prices...but if you can find a Dealer willing to help, you might just get what you really want a lot sooner than you expected! Stranger things have happened.
Once again thank you so much for taking the time to help out! I'm really excited.
I fully understand! Even after many dozens of such experiences, I too always get excited at the prospect of someone getting more than they ever considered possible...for less than they imagined.