RS-MMMaxx questions - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 540 Old 10-20-2005, 10:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Let me preface my questions with a little backround:

I have a 125" MDF screen with a Sanyo Z-3. With a 3/8 nap roller I rolled two coats of primer and two coats of UPW High Gloss enamel with the board flat on the ground. Between each coat of primer and UPW I used a wet sanding sponge over the entire surface to smooth out any roller marks and bumps, but I didn't completely sand it smooth to the touch. I now have the board permanently mounted on the wall (long story) but have not yet applied the two coats of RS-MMMaxx or sanded the final coat of UPW. I plan on renting a sprayer, practicing with it and spraying it in place on the wall. I plan on renting a HD sprayer, and I hope it's up to the task.

Now to the questions...

I notice that the final coats of UPW has left somewhat of a "texture" on the board. When projected upon, there is a sheen of hotspotting over the entire surface of the board, but it's only noticeable from looking at the board straight ahead from your sitting position. I assume this is caused by the small "bumps" that have not yet been sanded and the UPW gloss. Am I correct in assuming this or is my paint job pure crap?

Should I sand this final layer until is is smooth to the touch? Should I just even everything up with the sponge or should I get out the palm sander and work it?

Should I still use two coats of RS-MMMaxx with the sprayer or more? Should I add 4 more oz of Distilled Water for spraying or more? My current mix is:

1qt Behr Ultra Pure White Flat Exterior (HD)
12 oz. Behr Deep Base Flat Exterior (HD)
3 (8oz) bottles - Delta Ceramcoat Metallic Silver #02603 (Michaels)
1 (8oz) bottle - Delta Ceramcoat Pearl #02601 (Michaels)
16 oz. Minwax Polycrylic Satin Finish (HD)
12 oz. Distilled Water

Should I sand in any way the RS-MMMaxx final coat or use as is?

Thanks guys!
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post #2 of 540 Old 10-20-2005, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks bro, I really do appreciate the help.

One other thing. I know this was in a thread somewhere, but I can't find it.

What does my sprayer need in order to lay the mix on correctly and what nozzle should I use?

Would the $60 HD sprayer do the trick?
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post #3 of 540 Old 10-20-2005, 03:10 PM
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This is an amazing formula, anyone who wants to do a DIY screen, by rolling or spraying the screen this could not be any easier, and you are assured that it will compete with expensive screen materials.

HIGHLY recommended!!!
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post #4 of 540 Old 10-20-2005, 04:07 PM - Thread Starter
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I'll post up some pics when it's done, but I'm going to wait the full week after completion to give it the benefit of the doubt.


Any requests for a particular screenshot?
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post #5 of 540 Old 10-20-2005, 10:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post

wow have you got a lot of patience... 'ya mind sharin' some of that with the rest of us?!

I didn't say I wouldn't be watching for a week, just posting screenshots
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post #6 of 540 Old 10-22-2005, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Finished the last coat on the RS-MMMaxx screen last night. It comes out as a light grey that is "almost-but-not-quite" shiny. I wouldn't realize that the RS-MMMaxx is grey if it were not for the UPW coat to compare it to.

The RS-MMMaxx screen was sprayed on in 3 coats over a well sanded base of primer and two coats of UPW High Gloss enamel.

Even without the proper cure time I'm liking what I see. I would put the gain closer to 0.8 rather than 1.2 or so, but I have yet to hit it with a sanding sponge (not sure if I will as the sprayed on RS-MMMaxx is pretty smooth). The ambient light qualities are clearly there. There is no viewing cone whatsoever.

I did have to adjust gamma and brightness very slightly to get the punch that I like, but the colors are vibrant and the shadow detail seems quite good. Granted alot of this has to do with the projector, but so far this beats any of the previous matte white screens (and the cheapy one that comes with the 4805). To clarify, I am using a Sanyo Z-3.

Cheers
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post #7 of 540 Old 10-24-2005, 11:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx View Post

good feedback on all accounts and certainly what folks need to hear from a nuetral member. but couldn't you have given me .9 instead of a .8 gain?!

Since I have nothing to measure the actual gain, I could give you .9 easily The truth of it is, the gain is somewhat less than matte white.... soo, it's < 1.

I'm not sure why either, as the mix is BARELY grey. Perhaps the lack of a viewing cone... ie, the light is dispersing in all directions due to the SM instead of directly at the viewer. Either way, it's MORE than bright enough with my 800 ANSI lumens rated projector.

I'm still fiddling with the colors and such, but I'll report back when I get it where I like it and post some screenshots. I can tell you already that what I am seeing has been represented in the numerous "other" screenshots on this forum about the mix. I have no complaints.

thanks pb_maxxx and MM

(by the way, I don't know them, nor am I on their payroll :P )
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post #8 of 540 Old 10-24-2005, 11:46 AM - Thread Starter
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I wouldn't mind getting ahold of Benven's "Super Grey" formula to do my own testing and comparing with... I would definately give them both a fair shake.
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post #9 of 540 Old 10-24-2005, 03:38 PM
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PWRDrill, I am putting the fianl touches on the mix. Keep an eye out on the dark gray thread for more info.

Meow.
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post #10 of 540 Old 10-25-2005, 10:40 AM
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So now I'll have to feather in less than 8 oz, accounting for what I've already used out of the original mix in the can. Nah, I'll just dump the whole thing in there. If doubling the amount is good, an extra ounce won't kill.

Patrick

Wow, did the basement really take four years to build out?  It seems like fifteen minutes.... under water!

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post #11 of 540 Old 10-25-2005, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psennett View Post

So now I'll have to feather in less than 8 oz, accounting for what I've already used out of the original mix in the can. Nah, I'll just dump the whole thing in there. If doubling the amount is good, an extra ounce won't kill.

I wouldn't bother. PB forgot to mention that you'll probably be losing a bit of the good black quality of the screen by whitening it up.

The mix is pretty damn good where it is imho...

till they kill PB, or something better comes along... (what movie?)
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post #12 of 540 Old 10-25-2005, 05:59 PM
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Is it preferred to give the final coat a light sand?
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post #13 of 540 Old 10-26-2005, 10:38 AM
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Maybe I missed something. Is this formula a good choice for light controlled rooms? I won't have any significant ambiant light.

If not, than any other suggestions?

As always, thanks.

Laz
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post #14 of 540 Old 10-26-2005, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LazMan View Post

Maybe I missed something. Is this formula a good choice for light controlled rooms? I won't have any significant ambiant light.

If not, than any other suggestions?

As always, thanks.

Laz

The other part of light control is the color of the surfaces in the room. If one has light-colored walls and ceiling (like I do), then, even with no external light spillage, the projected image itself may light up the room to such as extent as to start washing out the blacks in the image. Silver- and gray-screen solutions help in preventing this.

There may be other benefits in the mix, even for completely light controlled rooms, but not having tried it, I can't say for sure.
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post #15 of 540 Old 10-26-2005, 01:50 PM
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Oh no, another formula: LL?

Right now I have very bright yellowy walls but will be paiting the ceilings and walls some very dark colour. I'm thinking chestnut or burgundy. Who knows.

I have a 1100 lumen projector (ae900) in low mode, but still quite bright for my small room.

I think I'll stick with the RS. But of course, that's a bit of a guess.

Thanks again,

Laz
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post #16 of 540 Old 10-26-2005, 03:30 PM
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Does the soooooper-secret coming involve a mirror?

Patrick

Wow, did the basement really take four years to build out?  It seems like fifteen minutes.... under water!

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post #17 of 540 Old 10-27-2005, 07:47 AM
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Certainly MY version does. And speaking for pb_Maxxx I feel safe in saying that his personal efforts will follow suit. But for the "Mirror" challenged, the revelation will still perform well in it's own right on a wall or baord.

"When" it's released, that is, and that is still under advisement, consideration, and will happen when there is no more "tinkerin' " to be done.

In my mind and seculative thinking, that is still two/three weeks off. But don't hold me to that timetable, just use it as a jolt of 'hopefullness'.

Thanksgiving is a wonderful time to be "thankful", and comes in plenty of time to still allow one to herald in Christmas & the New Year with a new Toy.

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #18 of 540 Old 10-27-2005, 08:51 AM
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Freddy Kruger ain't got nuthin' on me.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #19 of 540 Old 10-27-2005, 07:41 PM
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post #20 of 540 Old 10-29-2005, 01:01 PM
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Anyone know where I can get the Delta Ceramcoat paints here in Toronto? Or, are there alternatives, particularly Behr alternatives?

Thanks

Laz
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post #21 of 540 Old 10-29-2005, 01:31 PM
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Next question: OKay, never mind the above post. I couldn't find Michael's in Toronto. However, my wife is familiar with the place and I found it!

Now, do I get all the paints on the list (the 2 behr paints, the 2 delta paints, the minwax stuff and the water) and mix it all together? Will they mix it for me at Home Depot?

Thanks,

Laz

(getting closer)
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post #22 of 540 Old 10-29-2005, 01:46 PM
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From previous posts, I'll answer your question, Laz.

Whether Home Depot will mix or not depends on how good a relationship you have with them. For a couple of bucks, you can just get a paint mixer that you put on an electric drill and mix it yourself. The advantage in mixing yourself is that you don't have to rush home and do the painting. You can mix it at your leisure.

Don't forget, if you don't have an empty and clean paint can or some other container to mix it in, you'll need one of those. Any sort of clean container will work, if you can seal it up (I'm thinking of gallon jars or equivalent.)

Patrick

Wow, did the basement really take four years to build out?  It seems like fifteen minutes.... under water!

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post #23 of 540 Old 10-29-2005, 01:58 PM
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LazMan

Just buy the paint then buy the empty gallon can sold at the same store, then get them to shake it, it is is better especially when mixing a few different paints. Some clerks might have problems with it but if you are persistent and have already paid for the items it should be no big deal

Mixing different paints requires a lot of mixing with those little drill attachments .
I am not sure why you would need to rush home after you mixed it

Bruce
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post #24 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 04:40 AM
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If you buy one of those "squirrel cage" mixers, it's really quite efficient. And if you run it in a bucket of water afterwards, it cleans itself.

This RS-MMMaxx mix will striate after 24 hours in the can, so that's why I made the suggestion. pbMaxx says to shake the heck out of it, but I went ahead and bought the $5 mixer attachment and I'm glad I did with the subsequent adjustments to the Pearl proportion.

Patrick

Wow, did the basement really take four years to build out?  It seems like fifteen minutes.... under water!

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post #25 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 05:43 AM
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Yep. It's the best mixer out there.

Bar none.

I recently got the 5 gallon size and MAN!!!!! You shoud see how that sucker 'whrilpools' even a large amount of paint in the Three Gallon Buckets I use to ship MMud overseas.

Just recently I beat my old record on getting a LF screen completely done from scratch, and ready to transport.

2 Hrs 30 Min.

Each coat went onto a 140" diagonal Mirror in under 5 minutes.

30 Minutes of Forced air Heating for the Primer coat (Two "QUICK" passes each row.)
30 minutes of Forced air heating for the 1st coat.
1 Hour INTENSE Forced air heating of the 2nd thicker coat ( Applied until there was no reflection )


Heres a revelation.

With 1:1:1 MMud alone, if the coating isn't thick enough to prevent any trace of being able to see the reflection of the PJ's lamp when viewed up colse to the surface and at the right angle, you have 'fuzzienes' issues.

With RS-MaxxMudd or the newest BSLF mixture especially, that become so very less of an issue because the increase in SM and the darker hue that itself is very reflective, in a positive way, seems to negate the blurring effect so that instead, the addtional illumination from behind just seems to give the whole equation a boost.

Of course, I had a 2600 Lumen -LCD PJ at the location the BSLF screen was being "Beta'ed" so today I'm taking over a measely 1000 lumen DLP (SE-50HD) to see how the screen will respond.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #26 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 07:25 AM
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Hi. After reading, and reading, and reading, and before I go out and buy all the stuff for the RS-MMMaxx formula, I would like your opinions on it's advantages over UPW flat or egshell.

I will be putting it in a light controlled room on a 100' screen with a ae900u (1100 lumens, but using low mode).

Initally I'll just paint the screen and will have a lot of ambiant light from the light yellow walls. After the screen is done, I'll paint the walls and maybe also the ceiling in some dark light-sucking colour.

I'm not sure I need too much help controlling for ambiant light and the new Panasonic seems to have a ton of contrast.

I'm wondering if I'll get a result nearly as good as RS-MMMaxx with 2 coats of glossy base and 2 or 3 coats of plain white flat or egshell.

Is flat better than eggshell?

Expert opinions please!

As always, thanks!

Laz
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post #27 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 09:44 AM
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Laz,

In actuallity, you cannot do wrong by yourself by getting some UPW Eggshell and painting a "Flat" white primed surface. It's cheap, easy, and if you want to upgrade later after having done some large test surfaces with another special paint mix you acquire from "who knows where?", it will not hinder you to do so, with your having expended so little money and effort on the first go-round.

If you find yourself happy with your initial effirts, then so much the better for that.

MMan

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post #28 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 10:08 AM
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Thanks,

To clarify: should I start with a glossy base, then paint a coat or two of eggshell?

And, before I wimp out, what are the dissadvantages of this of RS-MMMaxx? Is there less contrast enhancement or poorer blacks?

Thanks,

Laz
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post #29 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LazMan View Post

Thanks,

To clarify: should I start with a glossy base, then paint a coat or two of eggshell?

The glossy base is not required. The use of Eggshell is based on it's being somewhat semi-glossy. A Bright White Flat base of Kilz will do just fine

And, before I wimp out, what are the dissadvantages of this over RS-MMMaxx? Is there less contrast enhancement or poorer blacks?

Exactly. To hedge your bet, you could be the first to try a more user friendly version of a SM/MM screen.

Go to Michaels and pick up the Delta CeramCoat "Gleems" Silver Metallic #02603
4 Bottles at $3.99 ea, and mix it with 16 Oz of the Kilz or some UPW Flat, then spray, or roll iffin' ya gotta, using a 3/8" nap roller. This SM does not give one the Red Ass like dealing with the Behr variety, and as a basecoat under as thin and even coating of the EggShell as you can put up, you should get substancially better blacks and contrast. apply the Top Coat only as thick as is needed to just barely cover the SM enhanced basecoat until it no longer looks noticably grey.

If you do this, and it works out for you, we'll call it; LazKEgg_SM V.1


Thanks,

Laz


Thank you! I hope it blows you away!

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post #30 of 540 Old 10-30-2005, 12:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Just wanted to update my progress with the RS-MMMaxx mix...

Looking for more gain, I decided to sand the sprayed on RS-MMMaxx. With a palm sander using fine grit sand paper I carefully sanded 1/2 of the screen and left the other "as-is". The resulting image was far improved and I doubt I'll be looking for much else in terms of a paint on solution. I got more gain, and my colors improved noticably.

Sanding off a fine layer of the RS-MMMaxx mix revealed much more of the metallics in the paint. So much so that at about 6" - 1' viewing distance you can see tiny sparkles of hotspotting. (this could not be seen on the unsanded surface) Not your standard hotspotting, but just tiny little bits from the metallics in the paint. Standing back around 3ft from the screen you cannot see this effect.

Let me tell ya, doing this has changed an already great mix into one that is even better. Blacks are still black, and the gain is at least 1. It still retained the ambient light qualities and no viewing cone. I have subsequently sanded the entire screen.

I highly recommend doing this.
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