Polyurethane over paint - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 44 Old 03-31-2006, 06:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T_MINTON
Bud can we get some pics?? I was looking at maybe canvas for a larger screen..
T_Minton

I have had plans to get some pictures 2 weekends in a row now and I think this coming one is going to be the one. I will post the “pics are in†here as soon as I do it.

As a side note to anyone that thinks AVS DIY pages are not viewed. The webshot page I have the pictures hosted at has been getting 5000 plus hits a week ever week.

If all those people start posting paint recipes we are going to be busy reading. :eek:


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post #32 of 44 Old 04-01-2006, 05:34 AM
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Look forward to seeing them...I may be wanting to try canvas for my next 2.35:1 screen
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post #33 of 44 Old 04-01-2006, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I took a few more screen shots and put them on the link in my signature. When you get to the webshot link there are 3 pages of pictures now. I tried to clean it up also in chronological order. All the new pictures were taken with a tripod and I switched the DVD player to pause and let the cam set the exposure. When viewing them back I feel most capture pretty closely what I’m seeing. If anything the picture has more of a life like feel in person. I don’t know what happens when you pause a DVD but without the frame to frame blending you seem to loose a little. Hope the pictures help someone out that’s on the fence about a DIY screen. I haven’t used any calibration disc or anything other than adjust to eye. After doing the topcoat I did bump a couple of the settings around a little. I’ll post what I’m now using over on the XR10X calibration thread later.
You can also blow the picture up bigger at webshots they fit them to your screen but if you click below the picture it goes full size.


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post #34 of 44 Old 04-01-2006, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
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This morning I was getting ready to take the screen shots that I just posted about, and I was watching a skiing show and noticed a few very light streaks in my topcoat just enough to bug me I really haven’t seen them before this but they were there. So I got out the rest of the top coat mix I had left and gave it a second top coat not knowing what to expect. It didn’t really change the properties at all but I did find a painting technique that might help some if painting on canvas or whatever else. I have been brush painting and I have been doing strips up and down about 18 inches at a pass. I think I was alright with the matte finishes because no overlaps would show but with the poly in the mix it would tack up just enough by my next pass to mess me up. This new top coat I started at the top and worked left to right but with narrow strips 2 brush widths max. and I could get to the other side and be back just below where I started before the poly tacked. By doing this I was always brushing into wet paint. This time it dried out beautifully.

So I wanted to pass on the painting tip as simple as it might seem it didn’t occur to me to do it that way before. I guess I painted to many houses and when you put up the ladder you don’t keep moving it.

Secondly anyone doing this I wanted to point out a second topcoat using this method didn’t seem to change anything.


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post #35 of 44 Old 04-02-2006, 08:08 PM
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I thought Poly turned colors over time?

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post #36 of 44 Old 04-02-2006, 08:42 PM
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The addition of a small amount of water helps keep the Poly fluid enough to spread.

Usually, if you add 1/4 Water to 3/4 Poly, you will experience no tacking and spreading into a area already coated will not leave brush marks.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #37 of 44 Old 04-02-2006, 09:42 PM - Thread Starter
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I just added 9 more screen shots to the end of the photos in my signature link below called DIY screen shots. The pictures were taken with my test screen sitting in front of my finished screen. Along with the test screen I hung a piece of BOC over the upper right hand corner of my finished screen. The test screen divided into fourths showing the effect of the poly as follows.

Upper left 1:1 poly : paint two topcoats applied
Upper right 2:1 poly : paint
Lower left pure poly as a top coat
Lower right 1:1 poly : paint one topcoat applied

The pictures try to show the hot spotting in the higher gains but the cam didn’t quite catch it as good as I would have liked.
One interesting to note the two pictures taken of the screens without the projector on, one with flash and one with no flash. The lower left cell that looks to be the darkest gray with the pure poly topcoat comes to life under the flash in the second picture. Now compare that to the BOC. This shows the combined effect of the gray and the max gain to produce a bright white under high lumens. Viewing with my projectors lumens that exact same effect takes place. You can also see from those two pictures and a couple more how the BOC under high lumens starts to fail.

I think these pictures if studied give a good explanation how gray can both darken a black and at the same time hold on to whites. And it really shows true as the screen gain is increased.

You can draw your own conclusions.

MM
Thanks for the H2O tip. I will try that out.

Dnoyeb
I don’t think the water based polyurethane’s are as susceptible to the yellow change as the old poly’s. The water based poly’s are acrylic based I believe. At least that’s what I’m told.


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post #38 of 44 Old 04-03-2006, 07:00 AM
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Bud,

How's the ambient light performance? I know you've mentioned it as something you were interested in, but how happy are you with the results?

-dave
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post #39 of 44 Old 04-03-2006, 08:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ORPhD
Bud,

How's the ambient light performance? I know you've mentioned it as something you were interested in, but how happy are you with the results?

-dave
Dave

I’m quite happy with the ambient light performance. I don’t think I can take credit for most of it because I’m sure a good deal of it is brought about thru the higher lumens the projector produces. That was why I was at first in a quandary as to how best to tame them and I made a request of the forum with a post titled
“ND2 Filter vs. Gray screenâ€
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=639117

My logic lead me in two directions having a light controlled room my ambient light was mainly going to be back wash of the projected light. So the conventional wisdom says cut the projected light back at the source less back wash = better picture. But then experiencing the improvements with blacks and being able to still support the whites with the extra lumens on a gray screen gave me reason to think more light on a darker screen might produce a good ambient result due to the fact that the proportion of the good lumens to the bad lumens so to speak would fall in my favor. I have had the paint for the ceiling for some time and purposely have left it white to encourage some back wash to see just how things worked. At this point all I can do is improve my image by darkening down things like the ceiling. I have read a lot of posts from people that for whatever reason have to leave things like ceilings etc white, so I thought why not experiment with it.
If you look at one of the screen shots I posted of a test screen (checker board) that was shot with 8 ceiling can lights turned on full. 4 of them are relatively close to the screen. plus I had several other light sources on and this test pattern also throws a good amount of light back at the room. It was very bright and granted the image is mostly black and white with a few colors more of a power point type image. It was running in eco mode. But the image is pretty watch able. Things like sports and a lot of regular TV have a similar overall brightness to the picture. I leave 4 of the 60W floods on often and shut the 4 up by the screen off. The picture looks pretty good IMO. My favorite viewing light for sports is the two floods over the seating area on full and the next 2 up at half power. For movies I like the 2 over the seating area half power and all others off. I only see a very tiny improvement when shutting them off during a very dark movie even. I feel having them on a bit helps my eyes with the shock of scene changes.

I think some feel I’m plowing an old field here. And I hope my personal efforts with something pretty basic to this forum is not being viewed as trying to disparage anyone else’s efforts into taming ambient light issues. Like I said I started into this thinking total control was paramount to success. Any small steps I made towards something that works well at some levels of ambient light were purely icing on the cake. And my only reason for posting any results is in a hope someone may pick something useful out of this.


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post #40 of 44 Old 04-03-2006, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415

I think some feel I’m plowing an old field here. And I hope my personal efforts with something pretty basic to this forum is not being viewed as trying to disparage anyone else’s efforts into taming ambient light issues. And my only reason for posting any results is in a hope someone may pick something useful out of this.
There is nothing wrong with turning over old ground. Every Farmer worth a Hoot 'n Holler knows that is how it get's renewed. Besides..., how's ya gonna plant any new seeds to grow somethin' ta eat ifin' ya don't make tha furrows to get started. Without those furrows, all the Birds will just "peck yer plantins' to death."

Only in the case where the earth has become severely Alkaline, or has had all it's value used up by overdoing a singular crop is it sometimes a effort in frustration. But usually, that frustration comes from those who personally feel that your waisting what they think is others' valuable Forum space & time, and that you are leading others down a path so well worn, it has become a chasm in which they might fall into, never to climb out of again.

Strangly, these same people also cry loudly how too much emphasis is placed on a few popular DIY applications. It seems that all they want to see is something new & better, not efforts be made to help those who feel they have found something that is within their grasp and ability to make happen. At least ya haven't been plagued with such stuff on yar.

Nope. What is old is new again if someone takes the time to post their opinions, work to explore deviations on the theme, and offer their efforts up in such a way that those who might benefit can do so.

You go Guy. It's all good, if the intent is good.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #41 of 44 Old 04-04-2006, 05:15 AM - Thread Starter
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MM
Thanks for the folksy analogy to my analogy and your points are well taken. Staying with the farm theme here one thing I’m certain of the ground here at AVS DIY Screen Forum will never become barren. In my short time here I have seen liberal daily applications of some of the richest bovine produced fertilizer I have ever witnessed spread.
At first I thought the rate of fertilizing was a bit excessive to the point of not being able to see the crops over the manure. But now that I have settled in a little and grown accustom to the smells I’m seeing some nice crops flourish. I’m still not sure I want to eat them all quite yet and for sure not without rinsing them a little first.

Anyway over the last week I have spent more time watching my screen than I have painting it. I’m taking that as a move in the positive direction. I also find myself really liking it when a movie or TV has a scene change where the screen fades to white. They just don’t leave it white long enough and they put that darn movie back on.

Oh well I guess I’ll work on a new paint mix now. The mud names seem to be all taken I wonder if anyone would paint a screen with a paint I concocted called “manure16415†:D


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post #42 of 44 Old 04-04-2006, 06:34 AM
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what the significance of 16415?
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post #43 of 44 Old 04-04-2006, 07:52 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx
what the significance of 16415?
That's how many posts you have to read in the DIY section before you find something of use! :eek: :) :)

bud, you can raise it to 16416 now, thank you!

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post #44 of 44 Old 04-04-2006, 08:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb_maxxx
what the significance of 16415?
It’s the number the USA postal service assigned to my small village to improve mail delivery. (zip code) :)


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