FnEasy DIY Painted Screen Solution - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiddler View Post

IMHO the real magic is taking place at the interface between the flat paint surface and the poly, not the surface sheen.

Please explain. I would tend to think it's simply the increased sheen causing the increase in gain. Sheen = reflectivity = gain = reduced viewing cone IMO.
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post #92 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 01:28 PM
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Hello again....

More questions. As I said before, I'm thinking of SW Gray Screen + Behr Poly. I saw stevem991's images here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&page=12&pp=30

Compairing the FnEasy UPW mix, w/ and w/o poly, and the same for SW GS. It appears there is very little difference between Gray Screen w/ and w/o Poly. Is there less of a difference as the shade of the screen gets darker? Or is the difference, some how, not showing up in the pictures?

Also, the projector he is using is 900 ANSI, 2000:1 CS. The one I'll be picking up is 1500 ANSI, 2500:1 CS. Would the added brightness increase the effect the poly has on the GS?

*My name is supposed to be NJScorpio...
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post #93 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 01:56 PM
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Okay....he is working with the IN72 (per his posts), and I'll be working with the HD1000U...which is funny, as I almost bought the IN72.

*My name is supposed to be NJScorpio...
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post #94 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 02:17 PM
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So, I could expect similar results as his test? Mainly I want to know if the Behr Poly makes a noticable difference on the GS, as I don't see a real difference in those pictures. Earlier in that thread someone mentioned how the Poly made the image look out of focus compaired to just GS. I see great results of the Poly on the UPW mix, and was hoping someone could confirm the same boost works with GS.

*My name is supposed to be NJScorpio...
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post #95 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiddler View Post

I would do the GS first. Use it for a while and see what you think. If you buy some poly and try it and don't like it you will have 3/4 gallon of Gray Screen to over coat it right.

Sound good! I guess I am getting ahead of myself. I just like to have every little detail planned out ahead of time. Plan your work, and work your plan.

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post #96 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 05:23 PM
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Tiddler, well you and wet1 are both right.

Both surfaces reflect light.

The first, or outer face reflects about 10% of the initial light. The second layer is different as it will depend upon the color, shade of grey or shiny silver that resides behind it.

That 10% on the top layer will reflect all light and is the same amount when using either Gloss or Matt.

To make sense of that statement, remember the difference between Gloss and Matt is where the light goes, not how much there is. The light value is the same.

What the top layer application is doing is recapaturing directionally the 10% initial light power the Matt and color effect of the base paint scatters and absorbs.

Of note, that 10% loss at the surface will mean that the following layers have 10% less light to work with. Oh and it is a log loss beyond that.

What I am working on is a an easy roller solution aswell, although I am using the pearl metallic still. The main difference is that I am using layers, rather than a one thickness mix as the other formulations do.

I am experimenting with greys right down to N4 level, but I think I will end up around the N6 area.

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post #97 of 380 Old 02-07-2007, 06:30 PM
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I read in this topic somewhere that someone used KILZ Premium instead of Kilz2, Im just wondering if thats acceptable?

thx

EDIT: Oh yeah I should say that Im going to just try the poly over the Kilz. If that makes a difference.

Trevor
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post #98 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 04:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiddler View Post

I assume the Kilz premium is a flat white base. Any flat paint you choose is acceptable.

It's basically the same as the std Kilz, the premium just has a higher concentration of pigment.
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post #99 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titch-- View Post

I read in this topic somewhere that someone used KILZ Premium instead of Kilz2, Im just wondering if thats acceptable?

titch -- I bought and used the Kilz Premiuma and it worked fine. The Home Depot employee told me the only difference was that the Premium has more white pigment than Kilz 2 (as Wet1 said). I put on 2 coats, had to do some minor drywall mud filling on some dips that became apparent after the first 2 coats, then added a 3rd coat to cover up the mud spots.
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post #100 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 07:24 AM
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Right on guys thanks for the replies.

Im going to get a quart (1's enough?)of it today, but first I have to do alittle mudding to smoothen of some of the drywall. Should have 2 coats up by friday's movie night. I watch a few movies this weekend and by the end of the weekend I'll get some polly up and see how that goes.

cheers

Trevor
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post #101 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 10:17 AM
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My question of the day:

Why is it that the UPW mix (202 197 203) appers lighter in pictures I've seen than the SW Gray Screen (199 203 203)?

*My name is supposed to be NJScorpio...
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post #102 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJScorio View Post

My question of the day:

Why is it that the UPW mix (202 197 203) appers lighter in pictures I've seen than the SW Gray Screen (199 203 203)?

Download a program like the one below. (Freeware) then you can type in RGB codes and compare colors at the same time on your monitor. That's not saying your monitor is correct but you can compare.

Visual Color Picker 2.6

Looking at pictures of screen shots etc are way off and wont work for comparisons, IMO.


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post #103 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post

Download a program like the one below. (Freeware) then you can type in RGB codes and compare colors at the same time on your monitor. That's not saying your monitor is correct but you can compare.

Visual Color Picker 2.6

Looking at pictures of screen shots etc are way off and wont work for comparisons, IMO.

Thanks, I'll do that when I get home from work.

*My name is supposed to be NJScorpio...
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post #104 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 11:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titch-- View Post

Im going to get a quart (1's enough?)of it today, but first I have to do alittle mudding to smoothen of some of the drywall. Should have 2 coats up by friday's movie night. I watch a few movies this weekend and by the end of the weekend I'll get some polly up and see how that goes.

I used up the entire quart of Kilz Premium putting down 3 coats. My screen size is 92" x 52" or 106" diagonal (plus 2 widths of 2" blue painter's tape for masking). As I did, you might see some additional imperfections on the "smoothed" wall once you put on the 2nd coat of Kilz. I suspect its the wet sheen of the fresh paint that allowed me to see the couple of dips/scrapes after sanding the mud. I had opened up an adjacent window's blinds that allowed some light to rake across the surface and I saw the missed spots. I filled them in, sanded and put on one last coat of Kilz, then the custom tinted UPW and Poly went on... I will say that the Poly definitely increases gain - no more dull whites like with the tinted UPW alone.

If anyone is interested, I'll post some pics as soon as I think of a good method for adhering the fabric-wrapped frame to the wall - it's just hanging like an empty picture frame right now, but I would like it to be flat against the wall (it's is slightly twisted/warped).
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post #105 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 01:41 PM
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Pics are always welcome.

Im just going to start with alittle sanding the drywall that I have up now, then Im going to put up alittle mud in some spots. Hopefully after alittle more sanding it will be smooth as a babies bum. heh

Trevor
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post #106 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post

Download a program like the one below. (Freeware) then you can type in RGB codes and compare colors at the same time on your monitor. That's not saying your monitor is correct but you can compare.

Visual Color Picker 2.6

Looking at pictures of screen shots etc are way off and wont work for comparisons, IMO.

Neat program, Bud. Don't know if you meant to include a link, but here's one:

Visual Color Picker 2.6

Garry
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post #107 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 06:22 PM
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I used the Behr UPW 060/030 custom tint w/ 2 coats Poly you suggested -- I think it looks great. I framed it with 1x4 covered in black wool (sort of a mix between felt and velvet).
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post #108 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titch-- View Post

Im just going to start with alittle sanding the drywall that I have up now, then Im going to put up alittle mud in some spots. Hopefully after alittle more sanding it will be smooth as a babies bum. heh

The sanding made one heck of a mess, especially since I had just painted the room the weekend before to a dark burgundy color (white powder on dark burgundy

I believe someone (maybe Wet1?) suggested using tack cloth to wipe down the sanded surface. I didn't have any on hand, so I used a damp sponge to clean the surface before priming.
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post #109 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wack70 View Post

I believe someone (maybe Wet1?) suggested using tack cloth to wipe down the sanded surface. I didn't have any on hand, so I used a damp sponge to clean the surface before priming.

That will work fine!
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post #110 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wack70 View Post

The sanding made one heck of a mess, especially since I had just painted the room the weekend before to a dark burgundy color (white powder on dark burgundy

BTW, If your walls are flat or matte, I wouldn't try cleaning up the mess (on you newly painted walls) with a cloth or even wipe it off in any way... you'll probably just end up with all kinds of white smudges everywhere you wipe on those dark walls (unless they have some good gloss to them). Clean them with a soft brush attachment on your vacuum-cleaner wand. It will take sometime, but this should take it right up w/o making a mess of your newly painted walls.
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post #111 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 08:15 PM
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Well the sanding went good. I just wanted to start with a nice and flat surface. In between sanding and cleaning off the mess I grabbed a spare light so I could see the walls alot better, and oh my god is my wall ever bad. lol Its not flat that much, you can see 2 spots where the studs are very easy. Oh well Im going to put on the Kilz and experiment and see what the out come is.

I got a question for you guys. Is polly easy to sand off? I was thinking of trying that sometime this weekend.

thx

Trevor
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post #112 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wet1 View Post

BTW, If your walls are flat or matte, I wouldn't try cleaning up the mess (on you newly painted walls) with a cloth or even wipe it off in any way... you'll probably just end up with all kinds of white smudges everywhere you wipe on those dark walls (unless they have some good gloss to them). Clean them with a soft brush attachment on your vacuum-cleaner wand. It will take sometime, but this should take it right up w/o making a mess of your newly painted walls.

Now he tells me...
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post #113 of 380 Old 02-08-2007, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titch-- View Post

Well the sanding went good. I just wanted to start with a nice and flat surface. In between sanding and cleaning off the mess I grabbed a spare light so I could see the walls alot better, and oh my god is my wall ever bad. lol Its not flat that much, you can see 2 spots where the studs are very easy. Oh well Im going to put on the Kilz and experiment and see what the out come is.

I got a question for you guys. Is polly easy to sand off? I was thinking of trying that sometime this weekend.

thx

Yes, as soon as I opened up the blinds on a bright Texas afternoon, man you could see the imperfections -- and I had thought I was done w/ the mud and sanding... but I am glad I did it b/c being a perfectionist, I would hate to start all over once I had it primed/painted/poly'd. I think it would have only affected off-angle viewers, but my personal seat location is smack-dab in the middle.
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post #114 of 380 Old 02-11-2007, 11:52 AM
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Your in Ottawa right? Have you tried Rona? Thats where I found it here.

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post #115 of 380 Old 02-11-2007, 05:40 PM
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Damn that sucks

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post #116 of 380 Old 02-12-2007, 12:09 PM
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Tiddler:

I think I can save you some of the guinea pig work.

My wall had Glidden Gripper primer on it. I'm surprised the off-axis sheen was so high on it (and that you could fix this by adding poly to it!!! :-), but that would explain why I could see my wall imperfections so easily. The Glidden primer did have close to a satin sheen to my eyes. The GTI N8 I have on it is *MUCH* flatter, so I don't see any reflections off it at all, even off axis.

The one nice thing about the Glidden primer was that the off-axis sheen gave really good off-center viewing angles; the image looked the same even at 45 degree angles. I projected an AX100 on it and the only tweak I had to do was to cut the color intensity in the menu or everything seemed too oversaturated.
I've attached an image I took of a football game on it and an image of The Return of the King (when Theodin gets killed by the wraith). As you can see the fleshtones look great.

edit: ok...now they're attached...da** 800x600 size limit...

ken
LL
LL
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post #117 of 380 Old 02-13-2007, 06:50 AM
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It rolled out great. I really like how Glidden rolls out and hate Behr despite them being the same company...actually, Behr rolls out smooth as well, but can't cover for beans :-)

As for Glidden Gripper being a good solution for a white screen, I'd say only if you have a relatively flat surface. I noticed that it showed a *lot* more imperfections than the flat gray I have on it now. If you've ever seen horsehair plaster, you'd know it's a lot less smooth than sheetrock. The bumps were visible w/ Gripper, but are not w/ the flat paint, so my conclusion is that you should stay away from satin/gloss paints for projector walls that are not smooth.

As for color rendition, it showed too much red (lips were overly red, faces were overly red) but it may be because it amplified everything. I had to turn the default color saturation down by -10 on my AX100. In contrast, the flat gray needed no adjustments after I reset it to factory settings.

So the short answer is yes if you need white, but if your projector has enough output, a gray screen truly is better.
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post #118 of 380 Old 02-14-2007, 06:50 AM
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Nice work Todd... on all three of your projects.
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post #119 of 380 Old 02-14-2007, 08:04 AM
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Hi all,

I stumbled upon this thread a few days a go and am watching it very closely. My Husband and I are in the process of building an HT in the basement and we'll probably go with a white FnEasy screen for our PLV-Z5 PJ. I can't wait to see how these two primers compair to the UPW.
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post #120 of 380 Old 02-14-2007, 11:39 AM
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Mr. Swallow is indeed a lucky man.


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