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post #751 of 777 Old 08-24-2014, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Debonaire View Post
Mm,

CMRA'S original darker version was 192,193,185, yours was lighter. The darkest a Basics silver and Heavy Body iridescent silver can get at 2:1 is 170,170,170. I wish I had RGB of your Liquitex Basics screen. But even Basics Silver alone full strength can't get darker than 171, 171, 170.
Switching first to Delta Ceramcoat Silver (my first several S-I-L-V-E-R S) and then having a few do S-I-L-V-E-R using the Liquitex certainly created lighter versions than what was the result from the Behr Faux Silver. Beyond the depth of Gray the silver imparts, as well as the concentration of Silver within the mix, it's all about the degree of translucency and the White Base behind.

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post #752 of 777 Old 08-24-2014, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narhic_fd View Post
greg...i to have the graco 1900 unit and am curious as to how much water you had to add for the s-i-l-v-e-r to spray out properly. I havent tried to spray any of the paint mixes on here with the 1900 unit and could use some info on water amounts.Have you sprayed silver fire with it??? If so how much water did you end up using for silver fire??
I have made both screens and S-I-L-V-E-R is a great screen for me as I have total light control and like running my JVC on eco
mode. I tried the liquitex and Martha Stewart but prefer a professional grade air brush aluminum. I used 1 quart of faux glaze,4 oz air brush aluminum and 12 oz of water applying 8 dusters. Just threw my screen away and am going to make a larger version tomorrow.
Going from 92" to 110". I will post some pics of the process. Unless Mississippi has another mix he thinks I should try????

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post #753 of 777 Old 08-24-2014, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg1292 View Post
I have made both screens and S-I-L-V-E-R is a great screen for me as I have total light control and like running my JVC on eco
mode. I tried the liquitex and Martha Stewart but prefer a professional grade air brush aluminum. I used 1 quart of faux glaze,4 oz air brush aluminum and 12 oz of water applying 8 dusters. Just threw my screen away and am going to make a larger version tomorrow.
Going from 92" to 110". I will post some pics of the process. Unless Mississippi has another mix he thinks I should try????
Which brand and color? Was it one of these?

http://www.dickblick.com/airbrush/colors/

My guess is its Createx Pearl Silver.
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Last edited by Debonaire; 08-25-2014 at 12:39 AM.
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post #754 of 777 Old 08-26-2014, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Debonaire View Post
Which brand and color? Was it one of these?

http://www.dickblick.com/airbrush/colors/

My guess is its Createx Pearl Silver.
yes sir...

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post #755 of 777 Old 08-26-2014, 08:54 PM
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yes sir...
Which brand and model sprayer with nozzle size used?
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post #756 of 777 Old 08-27-2014, 06:37 AM
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Graco with 1.0 tip

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post #757 of 777 Old 08-29-2014, 09:42 PM
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Originally Posted by greg1292 View Post
Graco with 1.0 tip
I was going to get the Wagner CS with the 1.5mm tip. So that means your mix will be too wet. How much less water for a 1.5mm tip compared to a 1.0mm?
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post #758 of 777 Old 08-30-2014, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Debonaire View Post
I was going to get the Wagner CS with the 1.5mm tip. So that means your mix will be too wet. How much less water for a 1.5mm tip compared to a 1.0mm?
Can't help you with
that I do advise a 1.0 tip

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post #759 of 777 Old 08-30-2014, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Debonaire View Post
I was going to get the Wagner CS with the 1.5mm tip. So that means your mix will be too wet. How much less water for a 1.5mm tip compared to a 1.0mm?
Be careful when buying the wagner control spray. I think they now come with a slandered 2.0 tip instead of 1.5 tip but i may be wrong. I know the replacement tips you can buy from gleam are only 2.0 tip now and when i was thinking about buying the Wagner CS i couldnt find a replacement 1.5 tip to buy anywhere. Try to find a refurbished graco 1900 if you need to go easy on money. You will still need to buy a 1.0 tip though for the gun. The 1.0 needle tip is different for the graco 1900 unit though. Here's a link to a previous post about the 1900 that i made:

Refurbished Graco 1900 for GREAT price!!

when i bought the 1900 from the website it had it for $49 i think but now it's gone up to $99 and you will need to look on amazon or somewhere else. I think it Will be getting little hard to find the graco, 2900, 3900 spraystation units since i believe graco has discontinued them due to there newer model the HV2901....I could be wrong on that.

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post #760 of 777 Old 08-30-2014, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg1292 View Post
I have made both screens and S-I-L-V-E-R is a great screen for me as I have total light control and like running my JVC on eco
mode. I tried the liquitex and Martha Stewart but prefer a professional grade air brush aluminum. I used 1 quart of faux glaze,4 oz air brush aluminum and 12 oz of water applying 8 dusters. Just threw my screen away and am going to make a larger version tomorrow.
Going from 92" to 110". I will post some pics of the process. Unless Mississippi has another mix he thinks I should try????
Have you sprayed a Silver Fire screen with the 1900 unit?? If so, do you remember how much water you ended up using for the gun to spray properly?
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post #761 of 777 Old 09-09-2014, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narhic_fd View Post
Have you sprayed a Silver Fire screen with the 1900 unit?? If so, do you remember how much water you ended up using for the gun to spray properly?
I have 122" screen with a Mitsubihi HC-5 1176 hours on lamp in eco mode. Iphone 5 does not do the image justice but 1.0 tip is awesome. Simple but amazing and cheap paint
solution. In fact 20.00 in paint what a deal.

No idea on water just add till the viscosity is right.
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post #762 of 777 Old 09-11-2014, 07:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greg1292 View Post
I have 122" screen with a Mitsubihi HC-5 1176 hours on lamp in eco mode. Iphone 5 does not do the image justice but 1.0 tip is awesome. Simple but amazing and cheap paint
solution. In fact 20.00 in paint what a deal.

No idea on water just add till the viscosity is right.
Great looking images Greg
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post #763 of 777 Old 09-11-2014, 08:50 AM
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Great looking images Greg
All credit goes to Mississippi abd PBmaxx still learnig the HC5 picture is getting better. Thanks for the kind words.

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post #764 of 777 Old 08-30-2015, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
Switching first to Delta Ceramcoat Silver (my first several S-I-L-V-E-R S) and then having a few do S-I-L-V-E-R using the Liquitex certainly created lighter versions than what was the result from the Behr Faux Silver. Beyond the depth of Gray the silver imparts, as well as the concentration of Silver within the mix, it's all about the degree of translucency and the White Base behind.
The Liquitex Silver shade of darkness, or lack there of, made it not usable for a S-I-L-V-E-R screen in my opinion. That's why my attempts at a "S-I-L-V-E-R" screen ended in futile. I would lay down 7 or 8 dust coats, and that was with the proper amount of water in the mix as well as speed and distance of spraying with my graco 3900 unit, but it barely looked like anything had been laid down by the 8 coat. And because it was so light color,when I would then shine my projector image on it, it looked like the image was being shine through a dirty or clouded window and not a grey screen. I couldn't figure out what i was doing wrong.
Any way, I think it's been a while since someone has tried a S-I-L-V-E-R screen and I'm still curious on how it would look compared to my current screen, especially since I'll be using the darker Rustolium silver this time vs the Liquitex silver. I have about 2- 4 oz of the Rustolium Silver left and though i would make up 1/2 batch or more like 1/4 of batch since i might not have the full 4oz of the Rustolium silver to make 1/2 a batch. 1/4 of a batch will be fine anyway since I'm just spraying a test trip to shine my image on. I figure I'll use the amount of water the gentleman up top used for his Graco 1900 unit since that's the same unit I'll be using. So I guess it will be:

16 oz of Behr Faux glaze
2 oz Rustolium silver
6 oz water
graco 1900 unit with 1.0 needle

Sound good??
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post #765 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 06:45 AM
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I wonder if matte water-based poly would be better than the glaze because it should lay smoother (if anything) and glaze tends to have a satin or higher gloss?

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Easy $25-40 DIY black/dark-grey ambient-light rejecting screen, grab two things from a local store..mix..roll..done.
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post #766 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 10:32 AM
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I'll be very interested to see how the Poster can conjure up the Behr Premium Plus Faux Glaze "Silver Metallic" considering that it's been discontinued for over 4-5 years.

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post #767 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 10:35 AM
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I wonder if matte water-based poly would be better than the glaze because it should lay smoother (if anything) and glaze tends to have a satin or higher gloss?
S-I-L-V-E-R is what it is and did/does what it does because the Faux Glaze has specific "dulling" properties inherent to Glazes.

But who knows...eh? It might just simply be about getting the right ratio of Silver Metallic within a clear Poly Base.

IMHO.....it's doubtful.

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post #768 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 01:29 PM
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I'll be very interested to see how the Poster can conjure up the Behr Premium Plus Faux Glaze "Silver Metallic" considering that it's been discontinued for over 4-5 years.
Wait..what the Behr Faux glaze is discontinued!! That stinks..what now, Lol. Is that the end of s-i-l-v-e-r?
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post #769 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 01:35 PM
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Wait..what the Behr Faux glaze is discontinued!! That stinks..what now, Lol. Is that the end of s-i-l-v-e-r?
You can still get the Gallon of actual Clear Faux Glaze....but the Original Behr Silver Metallic Faux Finish is long been discontinued.

many have done S-I-L-V-E-R using the older Delta Ceramcoat SM...and more than a few using the Liquetex SM.

But the core ingredient...Clear Matte Behr Faux Glaze still remains as being absolutely required.................


Well sorta..........unless someone does in fact find a substitute. Of course then they will probably call it something else anyway.

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post #770 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 05:16 PM
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Should untinted deep-base (transparent or nearly transparent base used for dark paint) have a similar dulling effect?

When I was comparing glaze and poly and untinted deep-base, the deep-base seemed a good match for the glaze except that it (the base) was more flat/matte and dried significantly faster (I believe I was using a DutchBoy glaze..but that was kind of a while ago).
The poly settled thinner and smoother while also drying the fastest, but I can definitely imagine the glaze and DeepBase having a stronger effect on the metallic unless they are quite thinned...that might equal things a bit more.

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post #771 of 777 Old 08-31-2015, 06:16 PM
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S-I-L-V-E-R is thinned with a considerable amount of water////at least 33 1/3 of Total content

Even with the added evaporation rate, after the 4th - 5th coat, drying time increases by 15-20 additional minutes per each subsequent coat.

Absolutely, go ahead and try to reinvent the Wheel. But be advised it will be a "start from scratch" affair using anything else than the Behr Faux Glaze as the primary ingredient. (60% content)

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post #772 of 777 Old 09-01-2015, 01:35 AM
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S-I-L-V-E-R is thinned with a considerable amount of water////at least 33 1/3 of Total content

Even with the added evaporation rate, after the 4th - 5th coat, drying time increases by 15-20 additional minutes per each subsequent coat.

Absolutely, go ahead and try to reinvent the Wheel. But be advised it will be a "start from scratch" affair using anything else than the Behr Faux Glaze as the primary ingredient. (60% content)
Because SF is also 31-33% water, do its 6th,7th and 8th+ coats require 1/2-1hours+ drying time as well?

I'm guessing this is an across-the-board aspect of spraying?
This also sounds like thoroughly cleaning the gun between every coat after the 4th/5th becomes mandatory from the waiting.

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post #773 of 777 Old 09-01-2015, 06:20 AM
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Because SF is also 31-33% water, do its 6th,7th and 8th+ coats require 1/2-1hours+ drying time as well?

I'm guessing this is an across-the-board aspect of spraying?
This also sounds like thoroughly cleaning the gun between every coat after the 4th/5th becomes mandatory from the waiting.
No, that is not the case at all.

The properties of the Glaze are much like Polyurethane, so one must imagine diluting Poly with 1/3 water content.

SF has far more a percentage of Acrylic Latex components...it's Poly content is much lower.

Water itself does not increase drying time, in fact the opposite is true when Dusting is employed, as the high water content allows for faster evaporation of sparsely applied coats. However the more layers applied over the multiple Duster process do tend to absorb more of the water content each subsequent coat adds, making drying "a bit" more protracted.

In truth, it's the actual drying conditions that make the real difference. Cool and / or humid conditions can greatly prolong drying times. In my cases as shown, I at minimum use a clean 18" Pole Fan set on Medium / High and "centered" on the screen at a distance of 6' to 8' away. If possible I up the room's temperature to 80 degrees (...or higher...) as well. With Fan & Heat combined, I get honest initial 15 minutes drying time per coat up to the 4th-5th coats, and at most 25-30 minutes drying time per coat for the rest. And I'm talking "DRY". The benefits are many...but paramount is the rapid shrinkage of the paint droplets works to flatten and smooth texture. Prolonged drying allows for the surface of Paint to develop a "skin" that creates texture,(...think: Scab ) while the underlying paint retains moisture that also adds weight to succeeding coats, and that accumulation can cause Orange Peel as well as sagging.

Now many, if not most cannot follow both those dictates, a Fan being the easiest to oblige. The "Fan only" method, when used under normal conditions, (70 degrees - 80% humidity) allows for initial 20 minute dry times and 30 minutes dry times for later coats.

As far as Gun Cleaning......first and foremost it's the type Gun used that dictates the needed cleaning regimen. "One Piece" Wagners tend to heat up the Gun Components, and cause "baking" within the Plastic Needle / Nozzle assembly, so rinsing between coats is advisable. The separate Turbine Guns with metal Needles are different. What with the SF being such a loose, water saturated paint, and with the lack of heat at the Nozzle, cleaning is initially limited to once after the first 3 coats, and once after each of the next 2 coat cycle.

But why the sad face? I mean really! All the Gun heads disassemble in about 30 seconds...and you just rinse the parts with a strong stream of water. Sheesh! All told it takes about 3-4 minutes. I can assure you it takes FAR longer to rinse a Roller! The latter being a lot messier to do as well.

In the end, if one wants absolute maximum assured performance out of a Gun, then they'll Man-Up and rinse the thing if the time between coats exceeds 30 minutes. (..one additional tip though...wipe the outside needle tip area immediately after each coat...)

Of course repeated use and familiarization makes both spraying and cleaning seem so much easier. That is why practice makes for perfect...and when one wants perfection in a surface, to not practice only means one is either too lazy or doesn't want to bother. One thing is for certain though...no one can say I never bother to advocate practicing, nor do I gloss over potential pratfalls. Why bother when in reality there are so few to worry about that to ignore those few is simply a case of not really wanting to do the best job possible. I repeat such instructions time and again because I want everyone's screens to be everything they can be. Mostly, that's what happens....but every now and again along comes someone who just ups and does it without checking, reading, or following the oft-repeated instructions. Then............there comes along the
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post #774 of 777 Old 09-01-2015, 09:07 AM
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For a little more clarification what I'm comparing at the moment..even using a strong stream of water and occasionally a toothbrush I've later discovered small dried paint-specs in parts of the tip assembly, and I have learned to not bother rinsing rollers when $2 saves so much time and gives better results.
I've essentially gotten used to needing less prep and cleanup than a single duster along with a fairly comparable dry-time. My frown is more the pout of a spoiled brat.

That said, I do recognize the advantage of a properly sprayed surface and I really appreciate all the direct advice/tips particularly in the face of having repeated them no doubt ad-nauseam through all these years.
I think I'll simply have to learn some added patience as well as remember that thorough drying the internal nozzle parts of the washed gun isn't strictly necessary when it isn't getting packed away for the day..and I really need to get an extra fan in the practice space for drytimes.

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post #775 of 777 Old 09-01-2015, 09:22 AM
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...here's the best way to clean the internals of the Wagner.

After you are done spraying...empty the spray cup. Quickly rinse it. Then fill half way with water and attach it back up. Shake/sloss the unit. Empty the cup and again fill it 1/2 up with water. Now put it on full bore and spray the water for a minute or two. Then unscrew the cup and spray head and rinse.

You'll never want to clean up a roller again.
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That's what I've been doing (and what's needed to clear some of the internal parts that can't be reached).
Cleaning a roller involves throwing away the used pad and less than 30seconds of rinsing the roller itself..with the additional benefit of missing some paint won't hurt anything while missing dried paint on part of the sprayer nozzle might cause it to sputter or otherwise malfunction.
I think that's my main fear/concern; if I'm not SUPER thorough with cleaning the gun, it'll need to be fixed or replaced if there's something I can't properly clean later..like one of the air divots or a small port that I can't see all the way through to check properly. The paint is sticking like sneaky glue every once in a while and I really don't want to break the new toy.

Am I being paranoid? Is the gun more forgiving than I'm thinking before stuck paint hurts its performance?

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post #777 of 777 Old 09-01-2015, 11:31 AM
DIY Grand Dad (w/help)
 
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Location: Byhalia, Mississippi. Waaaay down in the Bottoms
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A Pin or Toothpick will rout out the air holes...(...pay particular attention to the needle orifice) and the Gun comes with a Brush to scrub accessible parts.

If you take the Gun (Wagner) part immediately after each spraying, it will rinse out clean as a whistle. I personally do not hold to spraying water through the Gun. Yeah...can't hurt....but rinsing immediately does just as good a job.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"

http://www.invisiblestereo.com
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