Wrapping Black Velvet on Trim...... with Mitered or Butt joined ends. - Page 5 - AVS Forum
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post #121 of 136 Old 04-22-2013, 08:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by brendelac View Post

So light absorption would be flat black rather than glossy, correct?

Maybe I'll just go with the stuff that MM linked to in post #94. Probably cheaper than what I'd get locally and I can be sure that it's the right stuff.

That would be choosing....wisely. cool.gif Even when there are 40% off sales like are now going on at JoAnn Stores, you'd be hard pressed to find Triple Plush Black "Dress" Velvet for anything under $12.00 yard.
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One more question - in the original post, MM says that he ripped the 3.25" moulding down to 2.5. Is there a particular reason for that? I'm going to build a 120" screen and am thinking of leaving the border at 3.25". My 60" plasma has a 2" border so I don't think 3.25" would be disproportionate for a 120" screen. Is it just personal preference or is the another factor to consider?

Mostly personal preference. Truth is, the larger the screen is, the less it matters. But the smaller a screen....that can make a difference. In the case I posted about 2.5" trim, the screen was only going to be 84" diagonal.

Nowadays, what with the "Ultra Thin Bezel Trim' look being considered as "way cool', thinner (skinnier) stock would be the 2.25" trim, but I have also wrapped 1-3/4" pieces for 120"+ Screens because that is what was wanted. And when "inserting" Trim within a Painted Wood "Picture Frame", skinny is the only way to go.

So....design criteria and / or personal preference both play important parts in choosing Screen trim dimensions.

Wide Black Trim has always served as a "reference Black" for the content's Black levels, and can fool the eye into thinking the Blacks within the image are darker than they really are. Then there is the "Over spill" issue. But super high Contrast levels on today's PJs, and better, more precise Formatting have greatly reduced the need for W---I---D---E Trim. But as previously stated, on larger Screens, it not only helps everything look better within the image, it also adds distinction outside the Image.

And lemmie tell ya sumpthin......ain't no one ever "Ooooh'ed" & "Aaaaahh'ed" when they got up close and personal and touched Black Velor. rolleyes.gif

'Cept'n maybe good 'ol Ernest

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #122 of 136 Old 04-22-2013, 08:53 PM
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I placed an order through SY. I'm hoping they add a bit more than 3 yards (108") as I need 113-115" according to my number crunching. I guess worst case scenario, my screen won't quite be 120"
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post #123 of 136 Old 05-18-2013, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

Nowadays, what with the "Ultra Thin Bezel Trim' look being considered as "way cool', thinner (skinnier) stock would be the 2.25" trim, but I have also wrapped 1-3/4" pieces for 120"+ Screens because that is what was wanted. And when "inserting" Trim within a Painted Wood "Picture Frame", skinny is the only way to go.

MM, wanted your quick advice on materials for screen frame:

Lowe's 2-1/4" Primed Pine, 14' long

Projector screen is ~128" wide and ~72" high. Any problem with that gradual curved taper? What is the advantage of MDF (your preferred frame material) over dried pine?

This will be my second screen. For the first screen I made around 7 years ago, I used 1X3 treated pine boards, and the bottom board wanted to twist like crazy, so I understand that is not the way I want to go with this one, but if the pine is dried, that should take twisting out of the equation.

Actually, I still have the leftover black cloth material that I used the first time around (yes, I'm a hoarder), and it worked so well I'm going to use it for this one, too. I picked it up at Wal-Mart way back when. It has a little stretchiness to it that really worked well when stapling it to the board. Only problem is I'm going to have to join two pieces of the fabric together (the old one was a 4 X 3 frame and was only ~100" wide, so only 3 yards of material was all I needed back then). I figured I would put the joint in the direct center of the frame board to make it symmetrical, and I would just fold the ends under, butt them together and staple them down. Any experience/advice with that?

Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us. Also, thank you for the Unique Gray suggestion for the SW paint you have made in other threads, really helps keep the contrast sharp on my new 3000 lumen projector. I'm very pleased with how that turned out.
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post #124 of 136 Old 05-18-2013, 07:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CartmanDDT View Post

MM, wanted your quick advice on materials for screen frame:

Lowe's 2-1/4" Primed Pine, 14' long

Projector screen is ~128" wide and ~72" high. Any problem with that gradual curved taper? What is the advantage of MDF (your preferred frame material) over dried pine?

This will be my second screen. For the first screen I made around 7 years ago, I used 1X3 treated pine boards, and the bottom board wanted to twist like crazy, so I understand that is not the way I want to go with this one, but if the pine is dried, that should take twisting out of the equation.

It should, but that's not an absolute given.....
I myself use a Gradual taper style Trim when available, Kiln Dried Prime Pine is OK to use if it's nailed down sufficiently. I prefer MDF because it cuts easier, doesn't splinter, and it takes a direct and profuse contact with water to make it swell or warp. Pine can...and often does twist and warp as it continues to Dry.
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Actually, I still have the leftover black cloth material that I used the first time around (yes, I'm a hoarder), and it worked so well I'm going to use it for this one, too. I picked it up at Wal-Mart way back when. It has a little stretchiness to it that really worked well when stapling it to the board. Only problem is I'm going to have to join two pieces of the fabric together (the old one was a 4 X 3 frame and was only ~100" wide, so only 3 yards of material was all I needed back then). I figured I would put the joint in the direct center of the frame board to make it symmetrical, and I would just fold the ends under, butt them together and staple them down. Any experience/advice with that?

Ugh. Yeah. It will become a very obvious thing. About the only material that can blend well at such Butt joints is the plush Black Velvet. If you determined to use the Black Cloth, then don't scrimp...go get another piece you can put all the way across. Your screen is epic in proportions, and by virtue of the comment below, seems to be performing for you very well. Don't degrade the proposition by fudging on the perimeter cosmetics.
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Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us. Also, thank you for the Unique Gray suggestion for the SW paint you have made in other threads, really helps keep the contrast sharp on my new 3000 lumen projector. I'm very pleased with how that turned out.

Basic Grays are not usually on my "Go To" list, but as in cases like yours there are exceptions. I'm not against suggesting simpler options when they can perform well, not just suffice. And with a Gray as dark as the "Unique" combined with 3K Lumen output, such a combo can indeed "git'ter dun".

Just be sure to come back a chuck a rock at whoever comes up with that "You never suggest basic solutions..." rant. I can use the occasional "Got'cher back". wink.gif

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #125 of 136 Old 05-18-2013, 03:14 PM
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MM. thank you for the input. I'm going to give the casing a go and see if it does the job for me. Can't be any worse than the "wet" treated pine I used the last go 'round.

When I said cloth, it isn't just black cloth. It's a suede-like microfiber material. It absorbs light great, but also has a little stretchiness as well. I doubt I'll find another piece of it in Wal-mart 7 years later, so I think I have to try using what I have (did I mention I'm cheap?) by butting two pieces together. If it doesn't work out, I can always remove the staples and fabric and try something else.

I'll try to come back and share how it turns out.
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post #126 of 136 Old 05-20-2013, 02:23 PM
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If you are going to butt the seams symmetrically as you stated, you might be able to take some extra material and fold it over across the back to make a narrow, thicker pice of fabric that could be wrapped over the seam and stapled to the back of the trim. this is how they used to cover seams on waterbed rails.
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post #127 of 136 Old 09-06-2013, 07:22 PM
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So I finally learned that people are nailing in the velvet wrapped MDF to the frame to keep it in place. I never knew how that worked since you could probably see the nails, but it appears as though it doesn't end up to be a problem. This leads me to a few questions: What size and type of nails are people using when nailing into the MDF? I figure they can't be too long so they don't shoot out the other side. And how far apart do these need to be nailed in? Thanks!
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post #128 of 136 Old 09-07-2013, 11:04 PM - Thread Starter
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post #129 of 136 Old 09-07-2013, 11:42 PM
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Thanks. And how far apart should the nails be?
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post #130 of 136 Old 09-08-2013, 03:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by butie120 View Post

Thanks. And how far apart should the nails be?

I myself only use 5 nails on the long ends (one each in the Corners...3 spaced out...) and 3 on most short ends ( corners again...and one at center.)

To quote James T. Kirk;
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post #131 of 136 Old 09-09-2013, 05:52 AM
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Originally Posted by butie120 View Post

So I finally learned that people are nailing in the velvet wrapped MDF to the frame to keep it in place. I never knew how that worked since you could probably see the nails, but it appears as though it doesn't end up to be a problem. This leads me to a few questions: What size and type of nails are people using when nailing into the MDF? I figure they can't be too long so they don't shoot out the other side. And how far apart do these need to be nailed in? Thanks!

I nailed through my trim, and they are definitely visible next to the screen, but 6-8 feet back you'll never see them, especially in a dark theater room. However, if this was my living room screen, I would probably try and do it another way.
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post #132 of 136 Old 09-09-2013, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by farleyville View Post

I nailed through my trim, and they are definitely visible next to the screen, but 6-8 feet back you'll never see them, especially in a dark theater room. However, if this was my living room screen, I would probably try and do it another way.

Did you try using a black marker over the nails? I hear that's the remedy people do in order to hide the nails
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post #133 of 136 Old 09-09-2013, 10:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Whats the issue with gently tapping the nails in using the Nail Set method? confused.gif I posted a link above that shows what the darn thing is, and it certainly isn't expensive. Locally at Home Depots and Lowes, they sell the same items for cheap...as in inconsequentially expensive.

Once the nails are just below the surface of the Velvet, the material closes in over them. But you do have to use a small "Finish Nail sized" Nail Set so that you do not punch a big hole.

Using Black Felt Marking Pens is something of a last resort, and while better than a bright nail head, if the head of the nail is still protruding so far it is an issue, then someone hasn't "set it".....obviously

But lets say for some reason .buying / acquiring / using a Hammer and a Nail Set is just not gonna happen. Well, use a little Bottle of Modelers Flat Black Enamel and a tiny brush and place a drop of "REAL" opaque Black paint on the heads of those nails.

I might seem to be a bit OC on this matter, but in the end all, sweating about the minor things is just as critical to me to see done as the biggies are, when I'm trying to help people do it right, and do it the best way possible the first time around.

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post #134 of 136 Old 09-13-2013, 08:40 AM
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I finished up my screen last weekend and I could not be happier. 3.25" fluted casing flanking a fixed mount 100-inch Elite Sable. I ended up using 5/4" x 4" board (actual dimensions are 1 1/8" thick X 3 1/2"W) behind the 3/4" thick fluted casing so it brought the casing out flush with the velvet frame on the Elite screen. I ripped the 5/4 board with a table saw so that it was only 2 13/16"W. That allowed me to recess it behind the fluted casing so it is not flush with the casing on the sides. It also leaves the door open for some LED soft white LED strip lighting behind/around the perimeter if I decide to go that route in the future. smile.gif

I bought the 5/4 board and the fluted casing already primed from my local lumber yard and then hit it (and the rosettes) with three coats of Benjamin Moore Advance (Satin) before cutting and installing. The Satin finish looks gorgeous. I said it before and I'll say it again, it is hands down the best paint I've ever come across. The color of the fluted casing matches the baseboard and trim paint that will be used throughout the room. When the walls are finally painted, the screen should "pop" nicely.

My apologies for the awful pics but I just can't figure out the flash/lighting with my Canon SLR or my phones. I'd rather spend my time building down there than screwing around with photos!









Thanks again for the inspiration MM. So glad a came across that pic of yours a while back.

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post #135 of 136 Old 11-30-2013, 12:29 PM
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Bump!

MississippiMan, did I understand correctly that it is okay to use a finish nailer (a nail gun) to fire a nail through an already wrapped piece of trim? Well, into the trim, through the velvet.

That sounds nice and easy, but I wanted to confirm that the nailer won't shred the velvet horribly.
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post #136 of 136 Old 11-30-2013, 01:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by DaveNagy View Post

Bump!

MississippiMan, did I understand correctly that it is okay to use a finish nailer (a nail gun) to fire a nail through an already wrapped piece of trim? Well, into the trim, through the velvet.

That sounds nice and easy, but I wanted to confirm that the nailer won't shred the velvet horribly.

I do it at least 50% of the time using either a Pneumatic or Battery powered Finish Nailer.

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