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Surround Music Formats > What are your most recent Hi-Res purchases?
SoundofMind's Avatar SoundofMind 05:05 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I received a few SACDs yesterday with Art Blakey & The Jazz Messengers - Moanin' among them. I have to admit on the first listen today I'm somewhat disappointed by this title. This album was recorded in 1958 and it does not have much in way of music centered between my speakers. In other words this was recorded (early stereo?) with each instrument being located in either the right or left speaker. Not much center fill which is what I like to see in the music I buy...

Got Neo:6?

pepar's Avatar pepar 05:09 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

Mick,

I hope you enjoy these, but I've made a habit to wait till the reviews flow on the SHM SACDs...really a mixed bag with these.

The early comments on the Queen releases...same mastering as the 2011 catalogue release...which are compressed. Your satisfaction may depend on your tastes/sensitivity to brightness.

The Feb 12 Dire Straits releases have been tarred and feathered as well. Those with multiple copies almost unanimously prefer the blue/orange swirl redbooks.

Hope your mileage differs, but I'm going to hold off on these and I really wanted the DS stuff to be good. I have the S/T and Love Over Gold SHMs, which I enjoy a lot.

As long as people buy unquestioningly, "they" will keep delivering marginally better sound quality.



INSIST on a multichannel mix as that assures that they had to go back to the multitrack masters and go "forward" from there digitally with today's gear.

Jeff
Djoel's Avatar Djoel 06:29 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

Dan,

You may not remember "Foghat", but I bet you remember these tracks:

1. Fool For The City
3. Slow Ride

Slow ride take it easy!!!
Yup, I have listen to them back when they're use to be a Classic Rock station here in NYC..They might be one still but I stop listening to radio for almost 10 years now..Anyway I like the first link too, very bluesy!

Awesome stuff.

Thanks

Dan
MickB's Avatar MickB 07:07 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

Mick,

I hope you enjoy these, but I've made a habit to wait till the reviews flow on the SHM SACDs...really a mixed bag with these.

The early comments on the Queen releases...same mastering as the 2011 catalogue release...which are compressed. Your satisfaction may depend on your tastes/sensitivity to brightness.

The Feb 12 Dire Straits releases have been tarred and feathered as well. Those with multiple copies almost unanimously prefer the blue/orange swirl redbooks.

Hope your mileage differs, but I'm going to hold off on these and I really wanted the DS stuff to be good. I have the S/T and Love Over Gold SHMs, which I enjoy a lot.

I was disappointed in the Queen SACD, it is compressed. I was happy with the Dire Straits albums. I will have to take your advise and wait for the reviews next time.
JJHXBR's Avatar JJHXBR 08:24 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post




Jeffrey,

Definitely a great collection of Dire Straits SACDs! I have BIA on both SACD and DualDisc as well as the S/T SHM-SACD. Love Over Gold is one of my all time favorite albums without a doubt. I just have been hesitant to buy the SHM-SACD due to some mixed reviews I have read. I just wish the prices of the SHM-SACDs were not so high.

Bill


Bill,

Thanks!
You can tell I like my "Dire Straits"
I certainly can identify with your hesitation about NOT wanting to buy some of the SHM-SACD's.
The mixed reviews and steep prices are certainly some the biggest reasons for not wanting to pull the trigger. The entire SHM-SACD catalog is a real mixed bag, IMO. You have some real stand outs and others that are mediocre at best. There is no doubt in my mind that SHM could have done a better job with some of these SACD's, but I'm pretty sure it's all boils down to money.
Personally I could handle the steep SHM-SACD prices much better if these were M-CH instead of stereo, but can look past that if it's a stellar recording and mastering.
Bottom line: One needs to do there homework before forking over their hard earned cash.

Latest additions :
R.E.M. - Monster - DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M - Green - DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M. - New Adventures In Hi Fi -DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M. - Reveal - DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M - Up - DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M. - Around The Sun - DVD-A 5.1

Already have: In Time: The Best of R.E.M. 1988-2003 DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M. - Automatic For The People DVD-A 5.1
R.E.M - Out Of Time DVD-A 5.1
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 09:06 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Got Neo:6?

SoM,

I sure do but I prefer to listen to 2CH music through my Parasound 2100.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

As long as people buy unquestioningly, "they" will keep delivering marginally better sound quality.



INSIST on a multichannel mix as that assures that they had to go back to the multitrack masters and go "forward" from there digitally with today's gear.

Jeff

Jeff,

I know we have debated this in the past, in a good way. But just because a SACD has a MCH layer does not guarantee that it will be a quality mix or mastering. I have bought MCH SACDs that I did not care for the MCH mix. So just as one can buy a 2CH SACD that is not stellar in SQ the same can happen with a MCH SACD as well IMO. If one limits oneself to only MCH SACDs then they are missing some excellent 2CH SACDs again IMO.

Bill
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 09:28 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

I certainly can identify with your hesitation about NOT wanting to buy some of the SHM-SACD's.
The mixed reviews and steep prices are certainly some the biggest reasons for not wanting to pull the trigger. The entire SHM-SACD catalog is a real mixed bag, IMO. You have some real stand outs and others that are mediocre at best. There is no doubt in my mind that SHM could have done a better job with some of these SACD's, but I'm pretty sure it's all boils down to money.
Personally I could handle the steep SHM-SACD prices much better if these were M-CH instead of stereo, but can look past that if it's a stellar recording and mastering.
Bottom line: One needs to do there homework before forking over their hard earned cash.

Jeffrey,

I listened to the Dire Straits S/T SHM-SACD today. Then I decided to do a informal totally unscientific comparison to the West German Vertigo (orange swirl) CD that I have. After going back and forth between discs I found I preferred the WG Vertigo CD to the SHM-SACD. I found the the WG Vertigo to be smoother (not as bright) and it seemed to have better dynamics. I listened to the Love Over Gold WG Vertigo after listening to the S/T version and it sounds excellent as well. I do not have the SHM-SACD version to compare it to but I'm quite happy with these versions of both discs.

If you visit the Steve Hoffman forum do a search for "Dire Straits" in the Music Corner sub forum. You will find quite a bit of discussion about different titles and what some think are the best versions. Both Communique and Making Movies SHM-SACDs are not getting very good reviews over at the SH forum.

Bill
Pet Motel's Avatar Pet Motel 10:14 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

As long as people buy unquestioningly, "they" will keep delivering marginally better sound quality.



INSIST on a multichannel mix as that assures that they had to go back to the multitrack masters and go "forward" from there digitally with today's gear.

Jeff

Nice sentiment, but I don't see how we (those desiring the best possible SQ in a multi-channel format) can insist on a whole lot of anything. Where is the incentive?

We are a niche market at best, realistically I don't see anyone catering to meet our needs other than those that do it out of love for the music like Steve Wilson. The audiophile market continues to shrink, those of us posting in these types of threads are an endangered species.

As much as I would surely LIKE to agree with you, the stone cold realities aren't looking favorable to me. I've got quite a few MoFi titles (they're of course all stereo) SQ is very good, and I know you'd have to pry my Patricia Barber MoFis from my cold dead fingers to get them from me .
JJHXBR's Avatar JJHXBR 10:26 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Jeffrey,

If you visit the Steve Hoffman forum do a search for "Dire Straits" in the Music Corner sub forum. You will find quite a bit of discussion about different titles and what some think are the best versions. Both Communique and Making Movies SHM-SACDs are not getting very good reviews over at the SH forum.

Bill

Bill,

I'm a member at the SH forum and do read most of the music reviews.
Regarding the SHM-SACD's, there is definitely quite a bit of criticism.
Some of it's completely valid IMO, and some of it's just outright bashing.
Like with almost anything, it's mostly in the eyes or (in this case:ears) of the beholder.
Bottom Line: If YOU like it, that's all that really matters.
5150zx's Avatar 5150zx 11:09 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

Martin:

Thank you for taking the time to re-listen to this. It 'seems' that OP does the scatting on the more high energy songs and 'We Get Requests' is a bit more subdued (except the last song), so perhaps it's not as bad as other discs I've heard. Also, after having acquired many Ray Brown discs over the last few weeks, I've noticed he does it as well on rare occasions. The main reason I'm interested in this disc is Ray Brown and his bass! Just listening to the MP3 :30 second clips on Amazon, Ray's bass sounds phenomenal on We Get Requests. I'm guessing the SACD brings his bass to another level?

George

George...it was my pleasure to re-listen .

You're absolutely spot on...they behave during the more subdued/quite passages and they seem to get caught up when they get rolling. Actually I was wondering if some of it was coming from Brown...coming from the same location as the bass, not just centered on piano.

By the time this was released the trio had been together 5 years and to be honest, the performance/collection of songs are terrific. I'm a brass guy and I didn't miss the horns on this one. I'm somewhat new to the jazz scene, but it's quite obvious Bay Brown is the man on bass and this remaster is well done and he's well represented. Again, the AQ is right in line with most of the AP SACD stuff with this one getting the bonus of having the MCH (L, C, R) option.

For less than $25 to the door, it's highly recommended with an * for the occasional "tourrettes" outbreak [/quote]

Martin:

On that recommendation, me thinks it's time to add another SACD to my collection!
USAFChief's Avatar USAFChief 11:19 PM 02-29-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

Bill,

I'm a member at the SH forum and do read most of the music reviews.
Regarding the SHM-SACD's, there is definitely quite a bit of criticism.
Some of it's completely valid IMO, and some of it's just outright bashing.
Like with almost anything, it's mostly in the eyes or (in this case:ears) of the beholder.
Bottom Line: If YOU like it, that's all that really matters.

The beneficial element to these threads, when you hang out enough, you start to find those with similar ears, with similar opinions/recommendations. It's not 100% fail proof, but gives you some insulation from paying too much for discs that may not satisfy.

Let's face it, the SACD market is a perfect example of supply and demand...we pay too much money for a lot of these discs to make too many poor decisions. I don't stress over the <$20 discs, but with most discs above that price point I'll hesitate and do a bit more homework. That or I've already done it and it's on my wish list when I pull the trigger.

On a some rarer occasions, I'll play Russian Roulette with those high demand/low-density discs having emotional tiebacks/memories.
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 12:35 AM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pet Motel View Post

I know you'd have to pry my Patricia Barber MoFis from my cold dead fingers to get them from me .

Jay,

Same here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post

Bill,

I'm a member at the SH forum and do read most of the music reviews.
Regarding the SHM-SACD's, there is definitely quite a bit of criticism.
Some of it's completely valid IMO, and some of it's just outright bashing.
Like with almost anything, it's mostly in the eyes or (in this case:ears) of the beholder.
Bottom Line: If YOU like it, that's all that really matters.

Jeffrey,

I agree that the bottom line is that if you like any specific format or title that is all that really matters. I wasn't trying to say the SHM-SACDs as a whole are not worth it. Just that there are options that might sound as good (possibly) at a lower cost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

The beneficial element to these threads, when you hang out enough, you start to find those with similar ears, with similar opinions/recommendations. It's not 100% fail proof, but gives you some insulation from paying too much for discs that may not satisfy.

Let's face it, the SACD market is a perfect example of supply and demand...we pay too much money for a lot of these discs to make too many poor decisions. I don't stress over the <$20 discs, but with most discs above that price point I'll hesitate and do a bit more homework. That or I've already done it and it's on my wish list when I pull the trigger.

On a some rarer occasions, I'll play Russian Roulette with those high demand/low-density discs having emotional tiebacks/memories.

Martin,

That is a good thought process as to buying SACDs. Between doing homework on a specific title and recommendations here I have not bought many SACD/DVD-As that were not to my liking. Of course some are more enjoyable than others but for the most part my luck has been good.

Bill
pepar's Avatar pepar 06:36 AM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Jeff,

I know we have debated this in the past, in a good way. But just because a SACD has a MCH layer does not guarantee that it will be a quality mix or mastering. I have bought MCH SACDs that I did not care for the MCH mix. So just as one can buy a 2CH SACD that is not stellar in SQ the same can happen with a MCH SACD as well IMO. If one limits oneself to only MCH SACDs then they are missing some excellent 2CH SACDs again IMO.

Bill

Sure, I post like it's a Core Truth Of Life, but it is really only my opinion based on my experience, but with with very few exceptions. (Friday Night In San Francisco is the only one I have come across.) It's not that the surround mix will be good in the sense that it has all the qualities that make a surround mix outstanding while still remaining faithful to the original album, just that the sound quality is better than a stereo only title.

YMMV

Jeff
pepar's Avatar pepar 06:40 AM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pet Motel View Post

Nice sentiment, but I don't see how we (those desiring the best possible SQ in a multi-channel format) can insist on a whole lot of anything. Where is the incentive?

We are a niche market at best, realistically I don't see anyone catering to meet our needs other than those that do it out of love for the music like Steve Wilson. The audiophile market continues to shrink, those of us posting in these types of threads are an endangered species.

As much as I would surely LIKE to agree with you, the stone cold realities aren't looking favorable to me. I've got quite a few MoFi titles (they're of course all stereo) SQ is very good, and I know you'd have to pry my Patricia Barber MoFis from my cold dead fingers to get them from me .

Well, I don't insist on anything; I simply don't buy them.

I am glad that you have stereo titles that you enjoy ... enjoying music is what it's all about.

Jeff
SoundofMind's Avatar SoundofMind 07:28 AM 03-01-2012
re: "Got Neo:6"?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

SoM,
I sure do but I prefer to listen to 2CH music through my Parasound 2100.

I remember, Bill. I was just suggesting you mebbe try the other route for this disc to hear if it's overall more pleasing to you. Then you can further tweak the CC, in effect panning the instruments, using the ch level trim.

As I've expanded my music collection beyond the great reference-type HiRes titles and acquired lesser SQ HiRes and RBCDs, when the mix is so far off (read: I don't like what I hear), I've started experimenting with a little "doctoring" including upmixing Stereo to Neo:6, DEQ, adding DSW wides, Tone Control, etc.

I use Audyssey MultEQXT32 w/ a Pro calibration as my baseline DSP RC as it beats any pure analog/Direct setting. So it's easy for me to "tweak" some of the displeasing mixes with a click of a button. It's purely preference of course, and I of course listen to all really good mixes in native format.
SoundofMind's Avatar SoundofMind 07:50 AM 03-01-2012
Guys:

I'm absolutely floored with this disc! Thanks for bringing it to my awareness. Superb playing and recording-a great classic jazz SACD and a true value at this price.

However, I'm interested on your thoughts about the mastering. I'd like to know if any of you share my impression that the mix is a tilted to the right? I tweaked the L channel up 1 dB and the R down 1 dB. The result is that the piano integrates much better across the soundstage, the bass ends up dead center and it's simply more balanced overall.

Is it just me, or....
Pet Motel's Avatar Pet Motel 09:36 AM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Well, I don't insist on anything; I simply don't buy them.

I am glad that you have stereo titles that you enjoy ... enjoying music is what it's all about.

Jeff

I understand, and respect your opinion. Personally, I'd rather have a less than perfect stereo title that I REALLY enjoy, than a stellar SQ, and multi-mix title of music that's just OK.

I think we can all agree that enjoyment of what we appreciate is the ultimate payoff.

Speaking of which, just listened to a new (for me) Chesky jazz title Clark Terry's "One on One" which was very nice. 14 Top notch jazz pianists doing tributes to famous jazz composers with a bit of mellow trumpet accompaniment by Clark. Bring the mixed drink, close your eyes, lean back, and get dreamy eyed!
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 09:39 AM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

re: "Got Neo:6"?

I remember, Bill. I was just suggesting you mebbe try the other route for this disc to hear if it's overall more pleasing to you. Then you can further tweak the CC, in effect panning the instruments, using the ch level trim.

As I've expanded my music collection beyond the great reference-type HiRes titles and acquired lesser SQ HiRes and RBCDs, when the mix is so far off (read: I don't like what I hear), I've started experimenting with a little "doctoring" including upmixing Stereo to Neo:6, DEQ, adding DSW wides, Tone Control, etc.

I use Audyssey MultEQXT32 w/ a Pro calibration as my baseline DSP RC as it beats any pure analog/Direct setting. So it's easy for me to "tweak" some of the displeasing mixes with a click of a button. It's purely preference of course, and I of course listen to all really good mixes in native format.

SoM,

Thanks for your thoughts. I am off today and I am going to try different surround mode options with my 886. Who knows maybe I'll like it and remove the 2100 from my system. It is not that I am trying to only listen to a specific title as is but more about not spending the time trying to dial in each title to my preference. I'm certainly not saying that by doing that it is a waste of time by no means.

My thoughts are I spend enough time trying to tweak my system and to then tweak each specific title would lessen the overall enjoyment for me. In other words instead of just puitting a disc on and pushing play I can see myself spending hours just trying to get the sound to my liking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Sure, I post like it's a Core Truth Of Life, but it is really only my opinion based on my experience, but with with very few exceptions. (Friday Night In San Francisco is the only one I have come across.) It's not that the surround mix will be good in the sense that it has all the qualities that make a surround mix outstanding while still remaining faithful to the original album, just that the sound quality is better than a stereo only title.

YMMV

Jeff

Jeff,

I respect that experience and value your opinion. I know your preference is for MCH music which at times is mine as well. But when a title is mixed to MCH and you are not familiar with it to begin with you really have no idea if it is faithful to the original 2CH version. Certainly not a big deal but just because you now have multiple speakers playing a specific title does not always make it better listening experience IMO.

A good example for me is the Byther Smith - Addressing the Nation with the Blues SACD. I was listening to this SACD in MCH over a friends house and thought why is the lead guitar coming mostly from the left surround. We checked the levels with a SPL meter and they were all correct. I felt that this was not a very good mix as I feel the lead guitar should be in the front LCR speakers not in one of the surrounds. I found this also with Jeff Beck's Blow By Blow MCH SACD. The MCH mix for the SACD was taken from the original quad album mix which was focused on four identical speakers with the listener dead center. Unfortunately my system is not set up that way and found Jeff Beck's guitar in the surrounds distracting. As was suggested one can change the levels to suit a specific title but should you really have to do that?

Although the majority of MCH SACD/DVD-As I own are very enjoyable and ones that are not are the rare exception. Due to the fact that my listening habits are now totally shifted to jazz there are not as many MCH SACDs as there are 2CH ones. I wish there were more MCH jazz titles like Gene Harris' Listen Here! and At Last to name a few. But there are not and the many 2CH SACD jazz titles from Analogue Productions that are mastered by Steve Hoffman and Kevin Gray are excellent. Some of these titles are fifty years old and still sound quite good.

In the end it is all about preference without a doubt.

Bill
SoundofMind's Avatar SoundofMind 10:12 AM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

...I am going to try different surround mode options with my 886. Who knows maybe I'll like it and remove the 2100 from my system....

I doubt will happen till you get XT32.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

...It is not that I am trying to only listen to a specific title as is but more about not spending the time trying to dial in each title to my preference. I'm certainly not saying that by doing that it is a waste of time by no means.

My thoughts are I spend enough time trying to tweak my system and to then tweak each specific title would lessen the overall enjoyment for me...Bill

I get it. I got started on this latest OCD kick in anticipation of hosting a local Hi-Fi meet. I started taking notes on the proper MV setting for a Goldilocks "not too loud, not too soft, just-right" SPL for very nice demo discs/cuts, so I wouldn't have to guess when I put the disc on. Also in prep for the meet, I noted any SPL difference from the CD layer to SACD layer so I could level-match for a fun BAB test activity. I did the same for Stereo Mode with Audyssey vs DSD Direct Stereo Mode.

Besides, it drives the wife nuts when I keep switching modes and repeating passages...
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 10:51 AM 03-01-2012
[quote=SoundofMind;21719339]
Quote:


I doubt will happen till you get XT32.

You could be right. But isn't XT32s biggest gain over XT the additional filters for the sub?

Quote:


I get it. I got started on this latest OCD kick in anticipation of hosting a local Hi-Fi meet. I started taking notes on the proper MV setting for a Goldilocks "not too loud, not too soft, just-right" SPL for very nice demo discs/cuts, so I wouldn't have to guess when I put the disc on. Also in prep for the meet, I noted any SPL difference from the CD layer to SACD layer so I could level-match for a fun BAB test activity. I did the same for Stereo Mode with Audyssey vs DSD Direct Stereo Mode.

Besides, it drives the wife nuts when I keep switching modes and repeating passages...

I can definitely relate to any and all OCD issues. Before I started playing some music I had to dust my entire system. It sure does sound better now. That sounds great that you are having a GTG at your house. Of course you want your system in tip top shape for sure. Let us know how everything goes.

No easier way to drive our wifes crazy than to play the same tune or a portion of it over and over again.

Well I just tried Neo:6 with the Art Blakey Moanin' SACD and it really did not provide any further additional fill. There was output from the center but it was almost all ambiance or fill and did not place specific instruments any further to the center. Worth a shot for sure and I will experiment some more today.

Bill
SoundofMind's Avatar SoundofMind 12:16 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

But isn't XT32s biggest gain over XT the additional filters for the sub? Bill

I thought you'd never ask. I'm successfully hijacking the thread yet again. Here's my answer and a link to a another post on this.

Yes, there's more filters available in the sub channel of XT32. But there's two important additional features.

One, it's not just the sheer greater quantity of filters but the smarter, more precise filtering implemented by the more sophisticated algorithm present in XT32 courtesy of a programming breakthrough allowing more clever use of available DSP. The fuzzy logic samples the room and then prioritizes allocation of filter points to fix the worst problems detected.

Two, that same exact greater filter power and smarter implementaion that XT32 offers in the sub channel is also present in each of the satellite channels. The usual result is a prioritization of filters to fixing the bass problems not fixed by EQing the sub channel-those from the xover up to the Schroeder Freq. Those issues have to be fixed by EQing the sat channels and XT doesn't have what it takes qualitatively and quantitatively. Those two things combined in both the sub and sat channels account for the frequent reports of smoother, tighter, more impactful bass with XT32.

In addition, many folks, myself included, hear very significant improvements with XT32 in fine detail/ambiance, imaging, surround bubble, and improved intelligibility of dialog on film. As I've reported, these are as good or better than any special DAC/prepro/direct analog path I've tried in my room. IMO much of this is doubtless because better bass is better precisely because one has cleaned up a lot of extraneous reflection and bloated freqs in the room-and this can improve the overall SQ throughout the entire freq spectrum. I agree with those who speculate that one of the reasons some audiophiles disdained Audyssey is because prior versions including XT were simply not powerful and accurate enough. One way to think of that was that it wasn't good enough to effectively fix problems and leave what is really good alone. That seems to have been solved.
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 12:39 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

I thought you'd never ask. I'm successfully hijacking the thread yet again. Here's my answer and a link to a another post on this.

Yes, there's more filters available in the sub channel of XT32. But there's two important additional features.

One, it's not just the sheer greater quantity of filters but the smarter, more precise filtering implemented by the more sophisticated algorithm present in XT32 courtesy of a programming breakthrough allowing more clever use of available DSP. The fuzzy logic samples the room and then prioritizes allocation of filter points to fix the worst problems detected.

Two, that same exact greater filter power and smarter implementaion that XT32 offers in the sub channel is also present in each of the satellite channels. The usual result is a prioritization of filters to fixing the bass problems not fixed by EQing the sub channel-those from the xover up to the Schroeder Freq. Those issues have to be fixed by EQing the sat channels and XT doesn't have what it takes qualitatively and quantitatively. Those two things combined in both the sub and sat channels account for the frequent reports of smoother, tighter, more impactful bass with XT32.

In addition, many folks, myself included, hear very significant improvements with XT32 in fine detail/ambiance, imaging, surround bubble, and improved intelligibility of dialog on film. As I've reported, these are as good or better than any special DAC/prepro/direct analog path I've tried in my room. IMO much of this is doubtless because better bass is better precisely because one has cleaned up a lot of extraneous reflection and bloated freqs in the room-and this can improve the overall SQ throughout the entire freq spectrum. I agree with those who speculate that one of the reasons some audiophiles disdained Audyssey is because prior versions including XT were simply not powerful and accurate enough. One way to think of that was that it wasn't good enough to effectively fix problems and leave what is really good alone. That seems to have been solved.

SoM,

Man I walked right into that one. Thanks for the explanation and you never know that I might have a XT32 equipped prepro someday. I'm using Neo:6 on Herbie Hancock's Maiden Voyage and it sounds quite good. But don't tell anyone.

Bill
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 12:51 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

Guys:

I'm absolutely floored with this disc! Thanks for bringing it to my awareness. Superb playing and recording-a great classic jazz SACD and a true value at this price.

However, I'm interested on your thoughts about the mastering. I'd like to know if any of you share my impression that the mix is a tilted to the right? I tweaked the L channel up 1 dB and the R down 1 dB. The result is that the piano integrates much better across the soundstage, the bass ends up dead center and it's simply more balanced overall.

Is it just me, or....

I have the CD version of Soular Energy on the way. So when it arrives I will see if the CD is biased towards the right. I was going to grab the SACD but the prices were up there. I thought I would demo the CD and if it is really as good as I believe it will be I'll look for the SACD. I bought a sealed copy of The Red Hot Ray Brown Trio SACD as I could not find the CD for under $29.00. I should have that one next week.

Bill
pepar's Avatar pepar 01:17 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post


Yes, there's more filters available in the sub channel of XT32. But there's two important additional features.

Three, IMO. XT 32 will be in a receiver/processor that is new this year, and unless you are upgrading from a one-year old model, there will be changes in the internals that will improve the audio quality. Many find it difficult if not impossible to A/B XT with XT 32 for this reason. My 5508 is a lot better than my 885, but I am not able to apportion that betterness between XT 32 and the circuitry changes.

Jeff
holt7153's Avatar holt7153 02:34 PM 03-01-2012
No experience with XT, but for me XT32 definitely deserves the hype. My former AVR was a very solid Pioneer Elite SC-05 but XT32 on the new AVR is a dramatic improvement in my room.
USAFChief's Avatar USAFChief 03:05 PM 03-01-2012
You guys are giving me a headache...I think I'll buy an SACD
Bill Mac's Avatar Bill Mac 03:45 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

You guys are giving me a headache...I think I'll buy an SACD

Martin,

Sure beats aspirin for that headache. If buying one doesn't do the trick keep at it till the headache goes away. My PCP Dr. Hy Rez writes me scrips all the time for multiple SACD purchases. I just have to get my insurance company to accept all my Paypal payments to importcds. I told them importcds stands for Import Consumer Drug Store. So far they're not buying it.

I have had some back issues this week so I'm following Martin's lead and I bought:

Ray Brown Trio - Soular Energy SACD

Bill
USAFChief's Avatar USAFChief 04:33 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I have had some back issues this week so I'm following Martin's lead and I bought:

Ray Brown Trio - Soular Energy SACD

Bill

When it hurts enough, it doesn't matter what it costs.
JJHXBR's Avatar JJHXBR 05:55 PM 03-01-2012
Speaking of hurting,

I just lost Alison Krauss - "Forget About It" SACD (New & Sealed) on ePay today.
Was outbid by only a couple of dollars.
This would have cracked the hundred dollar barrier for me, but I would have gladly paid the piper for this title.
Doubt there will be many more sealed copies of this floating around up for grabs.
I would also settle for a used like new copy so maybe there is still hope.
USAFChief's Avatar USAFChief 06:58 PM 03-01-2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

You guys are giving me a headache...I think I'll buy an SACD

It was a migraine, but I’m feeling better now (hope I don’t OD):

1. Various Artists / Man of the World - Reflections on Peter Green ($5 sale)
2. Various Artists / Original Motion Picture Soundtrack - The Hot Spot (AP)
3. Bill Evans Trio - Moon Beams (AP)
4. Grant Green - Idle Moments (AP)
5. Kenny Burrell – Midnight Blue (AP)
6. Oliver Nelson Sextet – The Blues and the Abstract Truth (AP)
7. Lee Morgan – Sidewinder (AP)
8. Dexter Gordon – Go (AP)
9. Ry Cooder/V.M. Bhatt – A Meeting by the River (AP) - this one has my interest:

"Recorded in a chapel using custom-built vacuum-tube microphones, the record was produced without overdubs or equalization. It's unusually quiet but with an immediate atmosphere; a slight increase in volume reveals wonders." Music = 5/5; Sound = 5/5 – Dave Oliver, Hi-Fi Choice, August 2008

"…The sound is about as good as it gets, with almost no sense of recording gear between the listener and musicians, who are laid out in a solid horizontal line. The remarkable air and tangible 'thereness' will take your breath away." – Wayne Garcia, The Absolute Sound, August 2008

"…The opening ten-minute title track is a fascinating spontaneous expression by the two musicians, and it soon become clear that there really isn't that great a gulf between the musical culture of the bottleneck guitar and that of the Indian vina…This album won a Grammy in 1993 and it's easy to understand why…Analogue Productions (really Acoustic Sounds) is to be congratulated for bringing it out on SACD, where we can fully appreciate the super-high-end approach Water Lily used in recording these two wonderful players." – John Henry, Audiophile Audition

"As spontaneous as music-making gets, this East meets West improv session between two masters of slide-based stringed instruments is like eating at the most exotic Indian restaurant that adds Tex-Mex flavors to its dishes. The sound is very natural, almost achingly beautiful." – Playback, June 2008

"…This record is a must-have for fans of Ry Cooder's explorations into global sounds. The playing is out of this world, and, on these cuts, it has less of a world music feel, and is almost bluesy at times. With the original sessions captured at 15 i.p.s. on all custom deParavicini gear, this is the ultimate stereo test record. The sound is as real, open and airy as it gets; not one more molecule of tone could possibly be put onto these black discs!" – Jeff Dorgay, Tone Audio, No. 15, 2008

"…Astonishingly, the four conversational yet adventurous tracks captured on A Meeting by the River were unrehearsed jams between the two masters, who had met only minutes before the session. The lesson is that Cooder and Bhatt not only knew how to play, but how to listen." – Daniel Durchholz, Stereophile, February 2007

And a redbook to help with the nausea:
Gary Clark Jr. – Bright Lights

BTW, Analogue Productions just named me the customer of the month. It’s important to have goals folks!
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