Premier Acoustic PA-120 - Page 53 - AVS Forum
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post #1561 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 08:53 AM
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thanks for the responses guys
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post #1562 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 10:52 AM
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still no luck with the subwoofer. run the auto set up again, this time with the sub in the "on" position. still little to no volume out of the sub. i have adjusted the manual settings for the sub, but for the LFE volume it says it can be anywhere from -20 to 0db. it is currently on 0. is this where it is supposed to be? the sub is crossed over at 100hz on the subwoofer and receiver, and the gain is at +6, and the phase it set to the front of the room. distance to the subwoofer is set at 8.5 feet. i was watching the bass heavy scenes from kung fu panda, and a little tv, but no significant amount of bass came from the subwoofer. anybody have any ideas on what my problem is?

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post #1563 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 12:15 PM
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Sounds like a faulty sub. I recommend you call PA for replacement. The sub crossover should me turned to max btw.
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post #1564 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 12:29 PM
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what do you mean by this? would it make a big difference in performance?

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post #1565 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 12:49 PM
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Well, you should let the receiver handle the sub frequency, and basically disable the one on the sub by turning it all the way to the max frequency. The receiver will send a signal up to 120Hz which is what the LFE should be set to in the receiver.
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post #1566 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 02:53 PM
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Hi,

I have a Denon 1909 connected to the PA 120, along with 2 Polk M60s, a CS2 and a pair of surrounds. I get good bass from the PA120 while watching movies from my PS3. But, when I listen to music either from the PS3 or my DVD player, the bass is not that great.
How is the PA120 doing for others as far as playing music is concerned?
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post #1567 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mentalic View Post

Hi,

I have a Denon 1909 connected to the PA 120, along with 2 Polk M60s, a CS2 and a pair of surrounds. I get good bass from the PA120 while watching movies from my PS3. But, when I listen to music either from the PS3 or my DVD player, the bass is not that great.
How is the PA120 doing for others as far as playing music is concerned?

I have the same issue. I just bump it up about 6db in the receiver for music.

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post #1568 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mentalic View Post

Hi,

I have a Denon 1909 connected to the PA 120, along with 2 Polk M60s, a CS2 and a pair of surrounds. I get good bass from the PA120 while watching movies from my PS3. But, when I listen to music either from the PS3 or my DVD player, the bass is not that great.
How is the PA120 doing for others as far as playing music is concerned?

Music generally isn't bass heavy, at least the way it was meant to be listened to. Also, normally when there is bass, it doesn't hit very low frequencies. Music the way it's supposed to be listened to is nothing like the amped up stereo in a teenager's car.
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post #1569 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 04:46 PM
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i just got home and followed subiefast's directions and the sub now works. i'm very impressed by this subwoofer. thanks for everyone's help. should i keep the crossover in the receiver at 120hz too, or leave it at 100hz?

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post #1570 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jibbyjeep View Post

i just got home and followed subiefast's directions and the sub now works. i'm very impressed by this subwoofer. thanks for everyone's help. should i keep the crossover in the receiver at 120hz too, or leave it at 100hz?

Unless you have very small satellite mains leave the crossover on the receiver at 100 or better yet 80 depending on your speakers.
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post #1571 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 05:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jibbyjeep View Post

i just got home and followed subiefast's directions and the sub now works. i'm very impressed by this subwoofer. thanks for everyone's help. should i keep the crossover in the receiver at 120hz too, or leave it at 100hz?

The LFE in the receiver should be at 120Hz.
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post #1572 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakeman02 View Post

Unless you have very small satellite mains leave the crossover on the receiver at 100 or better yet 80 depending on your speakers.

No, the LFE is NOT a crossover like the speaker crossover. It's a totally separate signal. Set the LFE at 120Hz so that the receiver can send the whole LFE signal instead of a stripped down signal. Speaker crossovers are different. When you set a speaker crossover at 80Hz, It will re-direct the bass below 80Hz to the sub and the sub will play that and the LFE signal.
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post #1573 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 05:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

No, the LFE is NOT a crossover like the speaker crossover. It's a totally separate signal. Set the LFE at 120Hz so that the receiver can send the whole LFE signal instead of a stripped down signal. Speaker crossovers are different. When you set a speaker crossover at 80Hz, It will re-direct the bass below 80Hz to the sub and the sub will play that and the LFE signal.

LFE/Bass Management is one in the same in the receivers I'm familiar with. Unless your running your sub(s) near your mains 120hz cutoff is too high and can easily be locatable and/or distracting.
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post #1574 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt34 View Post

LFE/Bass Management is one in the same in the receivers I'm familiar with. Unless your running your sub(s) near your mains 120hz cutoff is too high and can easily be locatable and/or distracting.

LFE, and the crossover frequency for speakers are totally different in receivers. LFE is totally independent of speaker crossover, and LFE is not a crossover at all in itself. Every movie has it's own separate LFE track, which doesn't affect the speakers at all. LFE at 120Hz can be localized, but it's only localized by very few people and most can't localize 120Hz. If you can't localize the bass, then why not send the whole 3Hz-120Hz LFE signal track to the sub? It's part of the movie that you will be missing, and the director intended for you to hear.

I definitely cannot localize my sub at 120Hz, and it sounds great.
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post #1575 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:02 PM
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Here's a photo of my menu as well for my bedroom setup. It has independent crossovers for speakers, and than another option for the LFE track. Notice speakers are at 80Hz, and LFE is set at 120Hz. Well, the surrounds are at 100Hz since they're small speakers.

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post #1576 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

No, the LFE is NOT a crossover like the speaker crossover. It's a totally separate signal. Set the LFE at 120Hz so that the receiver can send the whole LFE signal instead of a stripped down signal. Speaker crossovers are different. When you set a speaker crossover at 80Hz, It will re-direct the bass below 80Hz to the sub and the sub will play that and the LFE signal.

Yes I'm aware of that. I took it as he was talking about the speakers crossover and yes LPF of LFE or however it's phrased in the menu should be set at 120.
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post #1577 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakeman02 View Post

Yes I'm aware of that. I took it as he was talking about the speakers crossover and yes LPF of LFE or however it's phrased in the menu should be set at 120.

Hehe... a bit of miscommunication there.
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post #1578 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

Hehe... a bit of miscommunication there.

Not really, in post 1569 that I responded to jibbyjeep ask about the crossover in the receiver. He mentions nothing about the LFE setting.
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post #1579 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:23 PM
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That's not the case with every receiver then. It may be true on the Onkyo models using Audyssey MultEQ but not every receiver has that option.
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post #1580 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakeman02 View Post

Not really, in post 1569 that I responded to jibbyjeep ask about the crossover in the receiver. He mentions nothing about the LFE setting.

I figure when people talk about the crossover in the sub they're talking about the LPF of LFE, since there really is no subwoofer crossover, there are only speaker crossovers. It might of been miscommunication on my part.
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post #1581 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt34 View Post

That's not the case with every receiver then. It may be true on the Onkyo models using Audyssey MultEQ but not every receiver has that option.

I think the majority of receivers have speaker crossovers, and separate LFE settings, but then again as you said some might not. I haven't seen the yammys menus for example.
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post #1582 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

I think the majority of receivers have speaker crossovers, and separate LFE settings, but then again as you said some might not. I haven't seen the yammys menus for example.

The Yamaha's and Pioneer's that I have don't....or I'm not looking in the right menus.
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post #1583 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt34 View Post

The Yamaha's and Pioneer's that I have don't....or I'm not looking in the right menus.

Possibly, I've never worked with a yamaha or pio, only marantz, denon, and onkyo.
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post #1584 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 08:35 PM
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I have both Audio Acoustic HD-SUB12 and PA120 (both are 12" subs) hooked up to Denon AVR1910, the receiver's crossover is set at 80hz and both sub's crossovers are set to max, and I have to turn up PA120's volume to 8 to match AA's at 5, is there anyone has the similar situation that PA120 does not match with the other sub? Denon 1910 has only one sub pre-out, so the signal is split and then connected to both subs.
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post #1585 of 2113 Old 07-01-2009, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theWalkinator View Post

I have both Audio Acoustic HD-SUB12 and PA120 (both are 12" subs) hooked up to Denon AVR1910, the receiver's crossover is set at 80hz and both sub's crossovers are set to max, and I have to turn up PA120's volume to 8 to match AA's at 5, is there anyone has the similar situation that PA120 does not match with the other sub? Denon 1910 has only one sub pre-out, so the signal is split and then connected to both subs.

Which you one sounds better, has a better response?
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post #1586 of 2113 Old 07-02-2009, 05:26 AM
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Hi All,
I am glad I found this thread. I purchased my PA-120 back in Nov of 2006 and was really impressed with it. I really thought people were looking past it as a great budget sub. My only small gripe is that it does not dig as deep as I woould like. I have paired it with my HSU 2.3 and they get along very very well. Can anyone tell me if there have been any improvements to this sub? Also has anyone heard the BIC Acoustech PL 200. Thanks for your help.
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post #1587 of 2113 Old 07-02-2009, 07:31 AM
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ok time to pissed some ppl off.... why is the LFE not a xover....
a xover can be hipass lopass or bandpass and it appears to be a lopass filter...aka a xover
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post #1588 of 2113 Old 07-02-2009, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by jaejw1 View Post

ok time to pissed some ppl off.... why is the LFE not a xover....
a xover can be hipass lopass or bandpass and it appears to be a lopass filter...aka a xover

Because LFE doesn't crossover to anything. It's just a cutoff. Speaker crossovers redirect sound to the sub. Crossovers in speakers redirect signal from tweeter to mid-range driver.
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post #1589 of 2113 Old 07-02-2009, 07:46 AM
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My sub is being delivered tomorrow. I never set up a sub before, can you guys give me direction on how I should set the knobs on the sub in the back before I run the set up on my Onkyo 606? The sub will be next to the front left speaker facing the seating area. thank you.
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post #1590 of 2113 Old 07-02-2009, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by subiefast View Post

Because LFE doesn't crossover to anything. It's just a cutoff. Speaker crossovers redirect sound to the sub. Crossovers in speakers redirect signal from tweeter to mid-range driver.

doesnt the LFE send a lopass signal to the sub at a particular freq,,,, that is what my rcvr manual states...
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