BIC America F12 sub anyone ? - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 2865 Old 02-17-2009, 05:21 AM
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i hope it will be deeper and more crisp than the velo. my room is about 20x20 so i'm definitely undersubed.
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post #32 of 2865 Old 02-18-2009, 07:46 PM
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I got my F12 today from Beach Audio, 3 days after ordering it..nice. I just set it up and am impressed with it so far. My wife doesn't like it though... I really did not get a chance to put it thru the ringer because it is late where I live, and the little ones are asleep.

I have it hooked up to a Denon 789, and I noticed Audyssey set the distance of the sub at 19 feet..where it was actually only 10 feet away from the calibration mic. Does anyone know why this might be? Maybe I did not set it up right? I had the phase set to zero, since it is right next to my right front speaker, and the subs crossover frequency control disabled.

I checked the Audyssey thread, and this is what it states...

"Many powered subwoofers do not provide the capability to defeat the built-in low-pass filter. These filters, by their nature, introduce additional delay in the signal and MultEQ finds that and reports it. The optimum solution is to turn the filters off (often called "LFE mode" in subwoofers). If that is not possible, set the low pass frequency to the highest possible setting and leave the distance reported as is. MultEQ will compensate for the added delay and time align the subwoofer to the satellite channels so that the optimum blend is achieved."

From how I read it..it seems to say to leave the crossover frequency knob on it's highest setting?..but the sub has a switch on it to disable the crossover frequency knob, and I selected that option when I set it up. I just want to make sure I did everything right as far as setup is concerned, and my distance with what Audyssey reports might be common with subs. Any info would be much appreciated.

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post #33 of 2865 Old 02-18-2009, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tingham View Post

From how I read it..it seems to say to leave the crossover frequency knob on it's highest setting?..but the sub has a switch on it to disable the crossover frequency knob, and I selected that option when I set it up. I just want to make sure I did everything right as far as setup is concerned, and my distance with what Audyssey reports might be common with subs. Any info would be much appreciated.

Some subwoofers don't have the switch or option to disable the crossover, in that case one would set the crossover adjustment knob to the highest position possible.

This point is mute in your case as your sub has the disable option. When you switch the crossover to disable it's bypassing the subs crossover so it doesn't matter where the knob is.
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post #34 of 2865 Old 02-18-2009, 11:00 PM
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My Bic F12 does not have an on/off switch for the crossover, just the 40-180 hz knob. Check the earlier schematic. This is my first true subwoofer, but I will say that for under $200, I am not at all disappointed with its performance. Still trying to set volume knob correctly so I dont have to mess with it anymore. Sometimes a commercial comes on and the bass is so high it scares the cat. Guess its a fine line.
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post #35 of 2865 Old 02-19-2009, 05:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unkleer View Post

My Bic F12 does not have an on/off switch for the crossover, just the 40-180 hz knob. Check the earlier schematic. This is my first true subwoofer, but I will say that for under $200, I am not at all disappointed with its performance. Still trying to set volume knob correctly so I dont have to mess with it anymore. Sometimes a commercial comes on and the bass is so high it scares the cat. Guess its a fine line.

If you read the manual..it states if the receiver type toggle switch is set to the Digital Receiver 5.1, 6.1, 7.1 position, the Crossover Frequency control does not affect the signal. So I am assuming it disables the crossover frequency knob?

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post #36 of 2865 Old 02-19-2009, 08:40 AM
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Might be just the Audyssey. Turn it off and use manual setup.
Phase to "0". Crossover knob on sub to max to 180hz. Gain at 10 o'clock. Receiver crossover to 80hz. Set front speakers to "small." That should be it. Adjust the gain until you feel/sound is ok. There are many that are using the Audyssey and it sets the sub very low.
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post #37 of 2865 Old 02-19-2009, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unkleer View Post

Sometimes a commercial comes on and the bass is so high it scares the cat. Guess its a fine line.

This is actually a feature, scaring cats can only be a good thing.

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post #38 of 2865 Old 02-20-2009, 02:46 PM
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I figured out what was causing Audyssey to report a inaccurate distance on my F12. It was a bad subwoofer cable, Audyssey has it spot on now. Apparently my old cable was chewed on by my family's now deceased pet rabbit. That rabbit chewed alot of wires in my house. I wonder sometimes how it never got electrocuted .... If anyone is ever thinking of getting a rabbit..make sure you rabbitproof your wires..they are known for their chewing.

I have to say that the F12 sounds pretty good to my ears, it's way better than my old Yamaha. So much more defined and punchy, and it sounds pretty good for music too. I'm sure it will only get better once it breaks in a little and I experiment with tweaking it and maybe other placement locations. I am very happy for $196.00

I finally completed my 7.1 system with the purchase of the F12, and now that I have heard what I have been missing with the addition of a decent inexpensive good sub, and the Denon 789's great features..my home theater is now complete and much more satisfying.
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post #39 of 2865 Old 02-20-2009, 11:40 PM
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I got my F-12 today for the bedroom. Took some pictures of it next to it's older brother, Bic H-100. First off, the Bic looks so much better with it's black piano finish. Let me know what you think.

Now as far as sound goes, it kicks as much ass as the Bic. Love both of them. Glad I have a house right now. Watching Black Hawk Down. Loving it.






















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post #40 of 2865 Old 02-20-2009, 11:43 PM
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Overall, how does the F12 sound?

Chris
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post #41 of 2865 Old 02-21-2009, 07:33 AM
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[quote=insanecollector;15876049]I got my F-12 today for the bedroom. Took some pictures of it next to it's older brother, Bic H-100. First off, the Bic looks so much better with it's black piano finish. Let me know what you think.

Now as far as sound goes, it kicks as much ass as the Bic. Love both of them. Glad I have a house right now. Watching Black Hawk Down. Loving it. [quote]


I do like the looks of the h100 better. I guess they have to cut costs somewhere..I'm sure that's one of the places they could do it. I like how the front speaker cover recesses into the h100..where the F12 just sits on top of the box frame.

Congrats on the purchase..my wife would have a fit if I had 2 of these in separate rooms in my home.

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post #42 of 2865 Old 02-22-2009, 09:17 AM
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Where did you guys get the F12 from. I was going to order it from beachaudio but they dont have any left. Is there anywhere else selling them?

Thanks
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post #43 of 2865 Old 02-22-2009, 10:27 AM
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Amazon is also indicating out of stock, plus they raised the price to $251.47 including shipping.

Beech Audio is still listing it at $190.99 plus $5 shipping, but, yes, they're out right now.
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post #44 of 2865 Old 02-22-2009, 01:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pheons View Post

Amazon is also indicating out of stock, plus they raised the price to $251.47 including shipping.

Beech Audio is still listing it at $190.99 plus $5 shipping, but, yes, they're out right now.

Yea the other day they had 3 in stock and I was going to order and by the time i was done setting up an account they were out of stock. I a hoping they get some in soon.
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post #45 of 2865 Old 02-22-2009, 06:26 PM
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Originally Posted by pheons View Post

Beech Audio is still listing it at $190.99 plus $5 shipping, but, yes, they're out right now.

Wow..they went from 15 units to "0" in a week. Glad I got mine when I did.

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post #46 of 2865 Old 02-23-2009, 05:30 PM
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F12 back in stock at beach audio in case anyone is interested!
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post #47 of 2865 Old 02-24-2009, 04:01 PM
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F12 back in stock at beach audio in case anyone is interested!

Thank you! I just ordered one from there. I cant wait to get it. This will be my first real sub going from my HTIB setup.
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post #48 of 2865 Old 02-24-2009, 06:06 PM
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Anyone have a PA-120 to compare with? I just got the 120 and I love it =)
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post #49 of 2865 Old 02-25-2009, 10:52 AM
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Anyone have a PA-120 to compare with? I just got the 120 and I love it =)

I would also be very interested in this comparison as I am shopping for a decent budget sub right now and both the F12 and PA-120 are on my list.

Thanks
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post #50 of 2865 Old 02-25-2009, 11:27 AM
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I'm deciding between the same 2, I don't think the PA is magnetically shielded though so I may not have a choice as the sub will be placed right next to my CRT
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post #51 of 2865 Old 02-25-2009, 06:06 PM
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I don't have the Pa-120. For what its worth, the guy who sells them on ebay rates the BIC100...F12 (equivalent?), lower than the Pa-120. I have some more thoughts on my purchase though.

I have my new F12 in a 18'x 23' carpeted family room, fully furnished with window treatments. The F12 rocks for me..in both music and movies. Movies sound fantastic. I watched the "The Dark Knight" on blu-ray, and it shook the house with impressive clean lows in my setup. I have mains with 12" subs that the specs state can go down to 30db..but when I added this thing, it took my 7.1 system to a whole new level from my previous cheap Yamaha sub.

I watched the "Genesis: When in Rome" DVD concert the other night, and I had goosebumps from the tremendous bass that this thing was putting out in my room. When the bass pedals kicked in, I could feel it in my chest...and I haven't even tapped this things full potential in my setup yet.

I'm sure I will upgrade at some point, if the wife can stand more bass, "doubtful..but she will have to deal with it". I will get something that's more expensive, and more powerful. But for now, this thing rocks! For $196.00 shipped, I am one happy camper.

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post #52 of 2865 Old 02-26-2009, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tingham View Post

I don't have the Pa-120. For what its worth, the guy who sells them on ebay rates the BIC100...F12 (equivalent?), lower than the Pa-120. I have some more thoughts on my purchase though.

I have my new F12 in a 18'x 23' carpeted family room, fully furnished with window treatments. The F12 rocks for me..in both music and movies. Movies sound fantastic. I watched the "The Dark Knight" on blu-ray, and it shook the house with impressive clean lows in my setup. I have mains with 12" subs that the specs state can go down to 30db..but when I added this thing, it took my 7.1 system to a whole new level from my previous cheap Yamaha sub.

I watched the "Genesis: When in Rome" DVD concert the other night, and I had goosebumps from the tremendous bass that this thing was putting out in my room. When the bass pedals kicked in, I could feel it in my chest...and I haven't even tapped this things full potential in my setup yet.

I'm sure I will upgrade at some point, if the wife can stand more bass, "doubtful..but she will have to deal with it". I will get something that's more expensive, and more powerful. But for now, this thing rocks! For $196.00 shipped, I am one happy camper.

I just got my Bic F12 today from beach audio. I ordered on Wednesday and it arrived today very fast and great service. But anyway I just hooked the sub up with basic defult settings and then ran the MACC on my Pioneer receiver and but in transformers on bluray and watched alittle but. I am really amazed with this being my first real subwoofer. It gives the movie a whole new viewing experience that I never had before. Once I have more time and can play with the settings I will give a better review but as of right now I love this thing.

I was stuck between the F12 and the PA-120 and i went went the F12 from beach audio for $40 cheaper and I am very glad i did.
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post #53 of 2865 Old 02-26-2009, 05:01 PM
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I have been looking at the Bic VK 12 and the Bic F12, why is the VK 12 double the price? Had anyone compared the two? is the VK12 worth the extra $$? I am looking for a Sub under $400 but if I can get the F12 for almost $200 cheaper and I am not going to sacrifice much I will go that route. Thanks for the input!
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post #54 of 2865 Old 02-26-2009, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by andyb22 View Post

I just got my Bic F12 today from beach audio. I ordered on Wednesday and it arrived today very fast and great service. But anyway I just hooked the sub up with basic defult settings and then ran the MACC on my Pioneer receiver and but in transformers on bluray and watched alittle but. I am really amazed with this being my first real subwoofer. It gives the movie a whole new viewing experience that I never had before. Once I have more time and can play with the settings I will give a better review but as of right now I love this thing.

I was stuck between the F12 and the PA-120 and i went went the F12 from beach audio for $40 cheaper and I am very glad i did.

Congrats..please post back with more thoughts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sledder69 View Post

I have been looking at the Bic VK 12 and the Bic F12, why is the VK 12 double the price? Had anyone compared the two? is the VK12 worth the extra $$? I am looking for a Sub under $400 but if I can get the F12 for almost $200 cheaper and I am not going to sacrifice much I will go that route. Thanks for the input!

I was looking at the VK 12 also. I don't think it's twice the price. I believe it can be had on E-bay for $329. It has a Bash amp that is 250 watts RMS vs. the Bash designed 150 watt RMS amp in the F12. I also believe the vk-12 has a Kevlar woofer. I don't know if the Kevlar woofer makes a difference or not. Maybe someone else can chime in in that one.

I guess it all comes down to your budget and room size/setup. The F12 is fine for my setup. I would think the vk-12 is going to be better just for the fact it has the bigger amp.

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post #55 of 2865 Old 02-27-2009, 10:47 AM
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Beachaudio is out of stock but I just ordered an F12 from thenerds. $174 shipped after MS cashback and coupon (googled for it). I don't think they're an authorized dealer... will that matter for warranty?

This will replace my Energy ESW-8 which I sold on craigslist for same price I bought it for. Hoping to hear some improvement.
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post #56 of 2865 Old 03-02-2009, 03:26 PM
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Thenerds.net has 16 in stock now at $173 + $10 shipping. You can save more with a coupon and with live cashback. The sub might not show up using the site's search feature, but you can find it through the sidebar menu.

I ordered Friday morning and am still waiting for shipping confirmation. I don't know if it's an authorized dealer.
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post #57 of 2865 Old 03-02-2009, 05:14 PM
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Hey all,

Found this thread just as I had a sub (KEF PSW2150) die on me just out of warranty, and right before I was about to pop Killzone 2 into my PS3 for the first time (great!). The F-12 will probably cost about the same as taking the old one in for repair, plus from what I read it will actually perform much better. One question: is Beach Audio an authorized dealer, and will BIC honor the warranty if you don't buy from an authorized dealer? Also, for any of you guys (girls) that have it, does the warranty specify 5 years for the electronics as well?

This sub seems like an unbelievable deal in this price range.
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post #58 of 2865 Old 03-02-2009, 05:22 PM
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Seems like a nice sub. Have any of you taken the woofer out to have a look at it?
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post #59 of 2865 Old 03-02-2009, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deecee20 View Post

Hey all,

Found this thread just as I had a sub (KEF PSW2150) die on me just out of warranty, and right before I was about to pop Killzone 2 into my PS3 for the first time (great!). The F-12 will probably cost about the same as taking the old one in for repair, plus from what I read it will actually perform much better. One question: is Beach Audio an authorized dealer, and will BIC honor the warranty if you don't buy from an authorized dealer? Also, for any of you guys (girls) that have it, does the warranty specify 5 years for the electronics as well?

This sub seems like an unbelievable deal in this price range.

Beach Audio is a authorized dealer. I don't know about them honoring a warranty from an unauthorized dealer. How do you know the place you might purchase it from is not a authorized dealer? Give them a call and ask....888-242-4551.

The warranty states all parts on the unit are covered for 5 years, for the original purchaser. I have heard BIC's warranty service is excellent. They have even repaired parts out of warranty free of charge. That's why I bought a BIC.

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post #60 of 2865 Old 03-02-2009, 07:11 PM
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Beach Audio is a authorized dealer. I don't know about them honoring a warranty from an unauthorized dealer. How do you know the place you might purchase it from is not a authorized dealer? Give them a call and ask....888-242-4551.

The warranty states all parts on the unit are covered for 5 years, for the original purchaser. I have heard BIC's warranty service is excellent. They have even repaired parts out of warranty free of charge. That's why I bought a BIC.

Thanks, just verifying an actual experience. Sometimes you call these online retailers you don't get a straight answer, or when you end up talking to the manufacturer, they don't recognize a place as authorized. It's good to ask someone who has dealt with them, especially for something like a sub, which does have a decent chance of failure before the warranty ends.
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