Official Rythmik Audio Subwoofer thread - Page 551 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #16501 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steveting99 View Post
Get a calibrated mic from Cross Spectrum Labs here: http://www.cross-spectrum.com/

AVS member Jerry Austin has generously written a step-by-step guide here: Simplified REW Setup and Use (USB Mic & HDMI Connection) Including Measurement Techniques and How To Interpret Graphs

The guide contains a few gems of information in general. There is some basic assumptions and equipment you'll have beforehand, this includes:

(1) A windows laptop/PC with a HDMI and USB port;
(2) HDMI and USB extension cable(s); and
(3) Boom stand mic.

Once you're familiar with REW, it is a very useful measurement tool.

Thanks to all for the advice so far.

So the difference with cross-spectrum is the USB drive with the frequencies for $20 extra over buying the UMIK-1 direct from miniDSP?


Also, so if you use my HTPC connected to my Denon X4000 and projector I will only need an extra long USB cable, correct?


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post #16502 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by LowellG View Post
Thanks to all for the advice so far.

So the difference with cross-spectrum is the USB drive with the frequencies for $20 extra over buying the UMIK-1 direct from miniDSP?


Also, so if you use my HTPC connected to my Denon X4000 and projector I will only need an extra long USB cable, correct?


Thanks,
Cross Spectrum is the way to go, because it includes a 90 degree measurement file. That's worth the extra $20.
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post #16503 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LowellG View Post
Thanks to all for the advice so far.

So the difference with cross-spectrum is the USB drive with the frequencies for $20 extra over buying the UMIK-1 direct from miniDSP?


Also, so if you use my HTPC connected to my Denon X4000 and projector I will only need an extra long USB cable, correct?


Thanks,
Yes, long extra USB extension cable that allows you to place your mic at MLP. The crossspectrum one is individually calibrated for the unit you buy, 90% measurement and can measure down to single digit hz which makes it worth over the miniDSP one.

Last edited by tvuong; 08-15-2014 at 05:20 PM.
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post #16504 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
Yes, long extra USB extension cable that allows you to place your mic at MLP. The crossspectrum one is individually calibrated for the unit you buy, 90% measurement and can measure down to single digit hz which makes it worth over the miniDSP one.
Just ordered one from Cross-Spectrum. Thanks for all the help again. Hope to be calibrating by next weekend.

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post #16505 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 06:06 PM
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^^ Nice. Please post graphs. Which subs do you have again?
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post #16506 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
^^ Nice. Please post graphs. Which subs do you have again?
I have 2 PSA XS30s. So I should probably post the graphs in the PSA thread.

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post #16507 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by LowellG View Post
I found the umik-1. USB. Is that the one. Where does the hdmi fit in and that's all I need.
If you need any help just pm me. I will do my best to assist you.


All I do is plug a hdmi cable from my laptop to the aux. hdmi in on my AVR. Next I plug the cross spectrum mic into my laptop via usb. using hdmi bypasses the sound card calibration and simplifies things a bunch. REW is really not that bad, but I suggest downloading it now, open it up and start tinkering. Also, watch the youtube video at the same time. GL


I can about gurantee you are sitting in a null...those 30's should be slamming you in the chest. My XV15's just about take your breath away when they hit, but again placement is everything.
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post #16508 of 20198 Old 08-15-2014, 09:09 PM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
If you need any help just pm me. I will do my best to assist you.


All I do is plug a hdmi cable from my laptop to the aux. hdmi in on my AVR. Next I plug the cross spectrum mic into my laptop via usb. using hdmi bypasses the sound card calibration and simplifies things a bunch. REW is really not that bad, but I suggest downloading it now, open it up and start tinkering. Also, watch the youtube video at the same time. GL


I can about gurantee you are sitting in a null...those 30's should be slamming you in the chest. My XV15's just about take your breath away when they hit, but again placement is everything.

Thanks for the offer, if I can't figure it out I will PM you.


Also, I would think those 30s should do that. My only concern is I don't have a lot of room to move them around. I have though about placing them in the center as one giant woofer. Also I have the woofers facing forward and back. I could face them so they are each firing at the side walls.

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post #16509 of 20198 Old 08-17-2014, 04:52 AM
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Originally Posted by LowellG View Post
Thanks for the offer, if I can't figure it out I will PM you.


Also, I would think those 30s should do that. My only concern is I don't have a lot of room to move them around. I have though about placing them in the center as one giant woofer. Also I have the woofers facing forward and back. I could face them so they are each firing at the side walls.
If you have a closed rectangular room, the room simulator in REW 5.01 is a great way to quickly experiment with placement options. It doesn't replace the need for measurements, but I have found it to be pretty accurate.
http://www.roomeqwizard.com

For rotation, the best thing to do is experiment and measure. It shouldn't make a huge difference, but sometimes one way works better, so it's worth a try.
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post #16510 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 07:42 AM
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It's been quiet here. Folks must be enjoying the sub(s). To stir thing up, is it not a good idea to run one fv15 in one port open and another one in 2 ports open feeding off an XT32 with subeqHT receiver? I have not seen or heard anyone running dual subs with this configuration. Is it a crazy idea? Would one get the best of both world: low extension from one sub and high output from another that is? Wonder how Audyssey subeqHT is going to handle this? Your thought?
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post #16511 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
It's been quiet here. Folks must be enjoying the sub(s). To stir thing up, is it not a good idea to run one fv15 in one port open and another one in 2 ports open feeding off an XT32 with subeqHT receiver? I have not seen or heard anyone running dual subs with this configuration. Is it a crazy idea? Would one get the best of both world: low extension from one sub and high output from another that is? Wonder how Audyssey subeqHT is going to handle this? Your thought?
I've actually been meaning to try exactly what you mention but just have not had a chance.

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post #16512 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 07:58 AM
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^^ let me know the result once you try as I am too lazy to try now. I have done lots of measurements and just want to sit down and enjoy now.
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post #16513 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 08:05 AM
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This is probably why it has been so quiet in here. Everyone's kicking back enjoying their subs. I know that's all I have been doing as of late. Some time ago I was playing around a lot with 1 port vs 2 port mode and in the end I chose to chase that deep extension.

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #16514 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 08:15 AM
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Does anyone know how long it usually takes for subs to ship after they're ordered? I ordered 2 F12SEs on Wednesday. I received the confirmation of payment immediately, but as of yet, have not received an email saying that they had shipped.
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post #16515 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 08:31 AM
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I would message Brian on here or give him a ring. If the subwoofer is in stock it should ship fairly quickly.

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #16516 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
It's been quiet here. Folks must be enjoying the sub(s). To stir thing up, is it not a good idea to run one fv15 in one port open and another one in 2 ports open feeding off an XT32 with subeqHT receiver? I have not seen or heard anyone running dual subs with this configuration. Is it a crazy idea? Would one get the best of both world: low extension from one sub and high output from another that is? Wonder how Audyssey subeqHT is going to handle this? Your thought?
It's generally best to match filter settings and ports between multiple subs so that you can get consistent phase for all frequencies, rather than cancellation in some frequencies. You can tune the phase/delay independently, though, so you can time align them.

As long as you measure, you might find a happy exception, but generally, you want the output from multiple subs to be as consistent as possible.
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post #16517 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace Deprave View Post
Does anyone know how long it usually takes for subs to ship after they're ordered? I ordered 2 F12SEs on Wednesday. I received the confirmation of payment immediately, but as of yet, have not received an email saying that they had shipped.
Ace, sorry for the delay but the container with the F12SE boxes is gonna be at our warehouse between tomorrow and Wednesday. As soon we get the container in we are gonna start assembling and shipping subwoofers.

Best Regards,

Enrico Castagnetti
Rythmik Audio

 

My Multimedia Room Gallery

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post #16518 of 20198 Old 08-18-2014, 02:41 PM
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Ace, sorry for the delay but the container with the F12SE boxes is gonna be at our warehouse between tomorrow and Wednesday. As soon we get the container in we are gonna start assembling and shipping subwoofers.
Great, thanks for the update!
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post #16519 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 11:44 AM
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Has anyone tried medium dampening in one port mode? I've tried high and low, but not medium. Isn't 0.7 Q supposed to be perfection? Which is what medium dampening would yield. I'm no expert, so please feel free to correct me.

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's

Last edited by JT78681; 08-20-2014 at 11:56 AM.
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post #16520 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 12:44 PM
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The more I read it looks like a Q of 0.5 is preferred by most. This would be high dampening on Rythmik subs. To be honest I prefer low over high dampening. The bass is more full bodied, hence has more ringing, but it just sounds better with movies to me.

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's

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post #16521 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post
Has anyone tried medium dampening in one port mode? I've tried high and low, but not medium. Isn't 0.7 Q supposed to be perfection? Which is what medium dampening would yield. I'm no expert, so please feel free to correct me.
Sounds like somebody needs to try medium damping. Flip that switch and report back, please.
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post #16522 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 02:28 PM
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Sounds like somebody needs to try medium damping. Flip that switch and report back, please.
I would but I'm away on business. I'll try it when I get back.
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post #16523 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 02:45 PM
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^^ if you calibrate Audessey on low damping, all you need to do to experiment is to flip the sub switch; on the other hand, if hi damping was calibrated, switching to med or low damping requires (preferably) rerun Audessey cal.
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post #16524 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 02:48 PM
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The more I read it looks like a Q of 0.5 is preferred by most. This would be high dampening on Rythmik subs. To be honest I prefer low over high dampening. The bass is more full bodied, hence has more ringing, but it just sounds better with movies to me.
Hi damping is preferred for accurate music reproduction. For movie, low is fine and perhaps is preferred for 'full body' sound.
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post #16525 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 03:10 PM
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Since JT mentioned the damping effects, can someone explain to me again how low damping setting has more output than hi and how low damping can have more 'full body' sound than hi based on my graph of the three damping settings in my room? My graph shows Hi damping setting rolls off at 10hz where as lo damping at 15hz (big different for bass to be felt, hint: should be more 'full body' sound with hi damping). Above 15hz, all three settings has identical response.
Note: each graph was measured after each Audessey recal with Aud on and DynEQ off.
Thanks.

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post #16526 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
Since JT mentioned the damping effects, can someone explain to me again how low damping setting has more output than hi and how low damping can have more 'full body' sound than hi based on my graph of the three damping settings in my room? My graph shows Hi damping setting rolls off at 10hz where as lo damping at 15hz (big different for bass to be felt, hint: should be more 'full body' sound with hi damping). Above 15hz, all three settings has identical response.
Note: each graph was measured after each Audessey recal with Aud on and DynEQ off.
Thanks.
Audyssey is throwing things off, since it is applying variable EQ. Measure again without Audyssey.


Low damping has a steeper filter slope, which cuts power-intensive low frequencies more aggressively for more headroom and adds a bit of ringing (smear).


"Full body" can be a nice way to describe ringing or sometimes distortion. Generally, neither ringing nor distortion are considered desirable, but some people prefer them, because it sounds louder and fuller.
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post #16527 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 07:01 PM
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^^ I can try to measure without Audessey to see my responses between the three settings but it does not do me any good when I watch a movie with Audessey always on, one of the main reason for buying my X4000 Denon. Why would xt32 with subeqHT throws things off? Isn't it one of the best out there?
So low damping does not translate to more output? Just more head room? I don't think I want to give up 10-15hz for that beside from having more ringing/distortion as you pointed out with low damping. Thanks Rcohen.
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post #16528 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
^^ I can try to measure without Audessey to see my responses between the three settings but it does not do me any good when I watch a movie with Audessey always on, one of the main reason for buying my X4000 Denon. Why would xt32 with subeqHT throws things off? Isn't it one of the best out there?
So low damping does not translate to more output? Just more head room? I don't think I want to give up 10-15hz for that beside from having more ringing/distortion as you pointed out with low damping. Thanks Rcohen.
More output and more headroom are the same thing. You do give up the lowest frequencies for it. It doesn't add distortion, just a bit of ringing for the lowest frequencies. I just meant that sometimes "full body" is also used to describe distortion. For some rooms and tastes, low damping is best. It's easy enough to try.

Audyssey tries to flatten out the EQ, so it hides what the sub filter settings are doing. You can (and probably should) still use it, especially if you like the sound better that way. I just meant to turn it off if you want to see what the sub filter settings do.
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post #16529 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 08:17 PM
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According to http://www.rythmikaudio.com/eq.html, low dampening is supposed to also provide a 1.5 dB boost, which is missing from your curve:

That was my understanding, that you get more output in the upper frequencies (20 Hz)by making the amp not work as hard in the lower frequencies.
Since I favor music, I calibrated Audyssey with the high damping setting, and have never tried the other settings.
I bought a Cross-Spectrum Umik and got everything ready for HDMI REW before I got my F15HPs a few months ago, but I've been enjoying them so I haven't bothered to do any measurements yet :-) But I'll have some time in a couple weeks.
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post #16530 of 20198 Old 08-20-2014, 09:52 PM
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1.5 db won't make any major difference in the HT or with music except on graph paper for the most part.
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