Official Rythmik Audio Subwoofer thread - Page 742 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews

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post #22231 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 09:11 AM
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It's a few Hz below 20 Hz so I really doubt you'd notice. Room gain will probably provide as much or more, and you'll have smoother response. If you have the extra money and space now, going for the 15" makes sense if you may move to a larger space later. If not, and you still have the extra money, I will most unselfishly volunteer to accept the extra money to spare you the temptation.

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post #22232 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldark View Post
That's the way I'm leaning right now - a 2nd LV12R - it would be a lot cheaper too. But the extra extension of an FV15HP does have me wondering "what if"
Ah the infamous "what if" don't worry your not alone.

Display - LG 65EF9500
Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
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post #22233 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meli View Post
I currently have an L22 and have measured two room nodes (or, at least, major dips), one around 41Hz and another around 50Hz. Would adding a second sub eliminate the room nodes? Or are room nodes inherent to the room dimensions and can't be nullified?
If you have a closed, rectangular room, check out the REW room simulator (free) to check out the impact of placement and multiple subs.
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post #22234 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:07 PM
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The New LVX12 is in stock and ready to ship. We have four units in stock and more coming by mid January. Pictures and specifications are up in our website already. Introductory price is $799 shipped.

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/LVX12.html



Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Polk LSiM705s, LSiM706C, LSiM703s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet + Duet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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post #22235 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:15 PM
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@goldark . There you go, the new lvx12.
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post #22236 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:18 PM
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Cool, congrats!

Although, IMO, you are going to be spending more time trying to explain the differences among all the various models to potential (and existing) customers. You might want to consider adding a page with a comparison table (more than the little chart of max output). It takes some time (or maybe I'm just slow) to figure out what distinguishes the various models from one another by wading through all the product pages.

Suggested columns off-the-cuff:
Model - Driver size - Vented/Sealed - Max Output @ 20 Hz - Max (min) LF corner - Amp Model - <feature column or three like LPF, Phase, etc.> - Size - Weight - Comments (e.g. paper/Al cones)

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #22237 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:19 PM
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Enrico or Brian, how does the new lvx12 compare to the lv12r or fv15hp output wise? You know this question will be asked. Thanks.

By the way, when are the FV18 and FV25 available? Very soon?

Last edited by tvuong; 12-23-2015 at 12:23 PM.
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post #22238 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post
Cool, congrats!

Although, IMO, you are going to be spending more time trying to explain the differences among all the various models to potential (and existing) customers. You might want to consider adding a page with a comparison table (more than the little chart of max output). It takes some time (or maybe I'm just slow) to figure out what distinguishes the various models from one another by wading through all the product pages.

Suggested columns off-the-cuff:
Model - Driver size - Vented/Sealed - Max Output @ 20 Hz - Max (min) LF corner - Amp Model - <feature column or three like LPF, Phase, etc.> - Size - Weight - Comments (e.g. paper/Al cones)
Yes, I'm working on this. Next week I will update the Subwoofer Comparison Chart and will add all models to date


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Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Polk LSiM705s, LSiM706C, LSiM703s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet + Duet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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post #22239 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
Enrico or Brian, how does the new lvx12 compare to the lv12r or fv15hp output wise? You know this question will be asked. Thanks.

By the way, when are the FV18 and FV25 available? Very soon?
LVX12 is +4dB compared to F12 baseline so output wise is at same level as F15HP and L22. Also LVX12 is tuned to 14Hz in one port mode and 20Hz in two ports mode.



Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Polk LSiM705s, LSiM706C, LSiM703s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet + Duet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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post #22240 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:44 PM
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Dual L22's or F12's for music-priority Sierra Tower-based system?

Newbie to the forum!

With respect to musicality/SQ which would be better, dual L22's or F12's?

Background: Music 80%, HT 20%. Room size is 1700 cu ft, with openings to another 1800 cu ft. Sub budget: $1000-1600. System will include (on order) Ascent RAAL towers/Sierra-2 center. Receiver: Marantz SR7009.

My first thought was dual L12's. Due to room size (3500 cu ft incl. adjacent rooms) I began leaning toward the F12's with greater output, and PEQ.

I spoke with Enrico at Rythmik. He suggested the L22's due to higher output, and because the F12's PEQ is superfluous since the SR7009 has Audyssey multieq-xt32 to handle the sub's eq.

Thanks,
Steve
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post #22241 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 12:51 PM
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Again, my recommendation is for dual L22s. The L22 is very musical and in terms of SQ and output at the par of the E15HP/F15HP subwoofers.



Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Polk LSiM705s, LSiM706C, LSiM703s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet + Duet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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post #22242 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
@goldark . There you go, the new lvx12.
That's a very solid option. However, it's not too much less than the FVX15 right now which is on sale. Hmm.
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post #22243 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
Yes, I'm working on this. Next week I will update the Subwoofer Comparison Chart and will add all models to date
<elided>
Who's da' man? You da' man!

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post #22244 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbromley View Post
Newbie to the forum!

With respect to musicality/SQ which would be better, dual L22's or F12's?

Background: Music 80%, HT 20%. Room size is 1700 cu ft, with openings to another 1800 cu ft. Sub budget: $1000-1600. System will include (on order) Ascent RAAL towers/Sierra-2 center. Receiver: Marantz SR7009.

My first thought was dual L12's. Due to room size (3500 cu ft incl. adjacent rooms) I began leaning toward the F12's with greater output, and PEQ.

I spoke with Enrico at Rythmik. He suggested the L22's due to higher output, and because the F12's PEQ is superfluous since the SR7009 has Audyssey multieq-xt32 to handle the sub's eq.

Thanks,
Steve
Listen to Enrico, he knows what he's talking about. With that much room volume, and no need for the fancier amp features, a pair of L22's are likely your optimum choice for performance and reasonable cost. Their 4 dB higher output over the F12's means they should have slightly lower distortion for the same volume so (especially with the servo circuit) SQ is probably a wash.

Of course, there's always dual F25's, or quad F12's, should anyone be so daring...

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #22245 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 04:06 PM
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I'm in the market for a sub. I love everything I've read about the Rythmik LV12. It's at the top of my short list along with the SVS 1000, and Martin Logan Dynamo 700. I have Martin Logan Motion 40's as my fronts and a Motion 8 center channel. They're being pushed by a Pioneer SC-81.

I like the bass from the 40's, however I'd like a lil more punch and extension. It will probably probably be 75%music and 25% home theater. My question is how much more detailed and articulate will the sealed vs ported sub be? I listen to a lot of metal, plus some jazz, classical, blues, breakbeat, and R&B if that helps any?
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post #22246 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 04:06 PM
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I'm in the market for a sub. I love everything I've read about the Rythmik LV12. It's at the top of my short list along with the SVS 1000, and Martin Logan Dynamo 700. I have Martin Logan Motion 40's as my fronts and a Motion 8 center channel. They're being pushed by a Pioneer SC-81.

I like the bass from the 40's, however I'd like a lil more punch and extension. It will probably probably be 75%music and 25% home theater. My question is how much more detailed and articulate will the sealed vs ported sub be? I listen to a lot of metal, plus some jazz, classical, blues, breakbeat, and R&B if that helps any?
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post #22247 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
Yes, I'm working on this. Next week I will update the Subwoofer Comparison Chart and will add all models to date


You might want to add weight.
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post #22248 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post
Well in my case my room is big and open, so I wanted more output on tap and deeper extension. I typically listen to content around -15 to -10. As far as how the deeper extension is perceived I'd say that most of the time it's felt, but once it gets to a certain point you just see the driver flapping like crazy, but get no sensation.
I am looking to purchase two subs that will work well, and hopefully create a synergistic effect, with my current Klipsch Reference Series II collection. I can afford each of the three options listed below, I am not concerned about the size of these three subs, I listen to Music 2 channel plus subs (10%), Home Theater 11 channels plus subs (10%), T.V. mostly stereo to all speakers plus subs (55%) and Gaming mostly stereo signal to all speakers plus subs (25%), and I definitely listen at levels louder than the general population and want the ability to play at rock concert/club levels at times. I have always preferred bass reflex over sealed subs.

Can you please advise as to the advantages/disadvantages each of these three options have for my listening needs while giving consideration for how well you believe they would perform with my current speakers. Thanks.

In no particular order:
1) SVS PB13 Ultra
2) Power Sound Audio V3600
3) Rythmik F25

Klipsch:
4 Klipsch R-115SW powered subwoofers
1 Klipsch RF-7 II center speaker (it replaced the RC-64 II center speaker shown in the photos)
2 Klipsch RF-7 II front speakers
2 Klipsch RF-7 II side surround speakers
2 Klipsch RB-81 II front wide surround speakers
2 Klipsch RB-81 II front height surround speakers
2 Klipsch RB-81 II rear surround speakers

Klipsch: 5 RF-7 IIs (center, front mains & side surrounds), 6 RB-81 IIs (front-wide, height & rear surrounds), 4 R-115SW subs. Power Sound Audio: 2 V3600i dual 18" subs. ATI amplifiers: AT6005 & AT4006 Morris Kessler Signature series. Denon: AVR-X5200W. Belden: 10 AWG copper speaker wire. Sewell Direct Deadbolt banana plugs. SVS: sub interconnects. Blue Jeans Cables: interconnects. Mediabridge: Ultra series HDMI, Mid Atlantic: RCS-27U rack w/fans. Epson: 5030UBe projector. Elite: 125" AT screen.
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post #22249 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 09:23 PM
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^^ the F25 is sealed sub.
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post #22250 of 27131 Old 12-23-2015, 10:47 PM
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I have no experience with SVS or PSA.

Rythmik designs use a servo circuit to reduce distortion and better control the drivers. This can provide lower frequency response and higher output with lower distortion than competing (open-loop) designs. In particular, Rythmik's servo can compensate for both short term dynamic distortion caused by amplifier or the nonlinear EM field of the voice coil, and compensate thermal distortion that some other servo systems cannot. The servo essentially makes the amplifier look like it has much lower output impedance (it does, in fact) and thus acts like a much more powerful amplifier (hand waving, sorry).

Less technically, the cone distorts less, and starts and stops with much less over/undershoot and ringing, so you get much cleaner bass. It is hard to describe how much better your whole system sounds with a clean subwoofer; hearing is believing.

After researching and building various subs over thirty years ago, I built a servo design very similar to the design used by Rythmik (I should have patented it, but what does a snot-nosed college kid know?) I worked for a couple of high-end audio stores so had access to many SOTA subs of the day for comparison. It blew away all the other subs in the stores where I worked and I made a tidy pile of spending money making others for a while until I graduated.

Fast forward to about five or ten years ago when I decided to rebuild my main stereo system. Some listening and a lot of research led me to Rythmik along with a few other subs in the $3k to $5k range (had not realized how prices had risen!) Some discussion with Brian Ding (the man behind Rythmik, and a fellow EE with similar day job) led me to order a couple. They matched, and often overmatched, subs costing two to three times their price.

Chances are most folk will not really notice the difference, and there are a lot of good subs around these days (unlike back then), but I think Rythmik represents leading-edge performance and value.

IME/IMO - Don
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"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #22251 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 12:50 AM
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Quote:
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You might want to add weight.

And the driver size, and number of them.
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post #22252 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 07:51 AM
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Merry Christmas everyone!

Display - LG 65EF9500
Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #22253 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
^^ the F25 is sealed sub.
Thanks. Saw that last night after I posted. I have removed it from my final list.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonH50 View Post
I have no experience with SVS or PSA.

Rythmik designs use a servo circuit to reduce distortion and better control the drivers. This can provide lower frequency response and higher output with lower distortion than competing (open-loop) designs. In particular, Rythmik's servo can compensate for both short term dynamic distortion caused by amplifier or the nonlinear EM field of the voice coil, and compensate thermal distortion that some other servo systems cannot. The servo essentially makes the amplifier look like it has much lower output impedance (it does, in fact) and thus acts like a much more powerful amplifier (hand waving, sorry).

Less technically, the cone distorts less, and starts and stops with much less over/undershoot and ringing, so you get much cleaner bass. It is hard to describe how much better your whole system sounds with a clean subwoofer; hearing is believing.

After researching and building various subs over thirty years ago, I built a servo design very similar to the design used by Rythmik (I should have patented it, but what does a snot-nosed college kid know?) I worked for a couple of high-end audio stores so had access to many SOTA subs of the day for comparison. It blew away all the other subs in the stores where I worked and I made a tidy pile of spending money making others for a while until I graduated.

Fast forward to about five or ten years ago when I decided to rebuild my main stereo system. Some listening and a lot of research led me to Rythmik along with a few other subs in the $3k to $5k range (had not realized how prices had risen!) Some discussion with Brian Ding (the man behind Rythmik, and a fellow EE with similar day job) led me to order a couple. They matched, and often overmatched, subs costing two to three times their price.

Chances are most folk will not really notice the difference, and there are a lot of good subs around these days (unlike back then), but I think Rythmik represents leading-edge performance and value.

IME/IMO - Don
Sorry, you missed out on the patent!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post
Merry Christmas everyone!
Thanks. Hope you and the family have a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year as well!

Klipsch: 5 RF-7 IIs (center, front mains & side surrounds), 6 RB-81 IIs (front-wide, height & rear surrounds), 4 R-115SW subs. Power Sound Audio: 2 V3600i dual 18" subs. ATI amplifiers: AT6005 & AT4006 Morris Kessler Signature series. Denon: AVR-X5200W. Belden: 10 AWG copper speaker wire. Sewell Direct Deadbolt banana plugs. SVS: sub interconnects. Blue Jeans Cables: interconnects. Mediabridge: Ultra series HDMI, Mid Atlantic: RCS-27U rack w/fans. Epson: 5030UBe projector. Elite: 125" AT screen.
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post #22254 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cain View Post
You might want to add weight.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BDP24 View Post
And the driver size, and number of them.
Got this. Thanks!!
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Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Polk LSiM705s, LSiM706C, LSiM703s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet + Duet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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post #22255 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 08:19 AM
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Merry Christmas



Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Polk LSiM705s, LSiM706C, LSiM703s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet + Duet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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post #22256 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 08:33 AM
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Merry Christmas everyone!
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Merry Christmas
And the same to you and yours!


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post #22257 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 08:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonycpa2004 View Post
I am looking to purchase two subs that will work well, and hopefully create a synergistic effect, with my current Klipsch Reference Series II collection. I can afford each of the three options listed below, I am not concerned about the size of these three subs, I listen to Music 2 channel plus subs (10%), Home Theater 11 channels plus subs (10%), T.V. mostly stereo to all speakers plus subs (55%) and Gaming mostly stereo signal to all speakers plus subs (25%), and I definitely listen at levels louder than the general population and want the ability to play at rock concert/club levels at times. I have always preferred bass reflex over sealed subs.

Can you please advise as to the advantages/disadvantages each of these three options have for my listening needs while giving consideration for how well you believe they would perform with my current speakers. Thanks.

In no particular order:
1) SVS PB13 Ultra
2) Power Sound Audio V3600
3) Rythmik F25

Klipsch:
4 Klipsch R-115SW powered subwoofers
1 Klipsch RF-7 II center speaker (it replaced the RC-64 II center speaker shown in the photos)
2 Klipsch RF-7 II front speakers
2 Klipsch RF-7 II side surround speakers
2 Klipsch RB-81 II front wide surround speakers
2 Klipsch RB-81 II front height surround speakers
2 Klipsch RB-81 II rear surround speakers
1) SVS PB13 Ultra

Pros - Digs deep and maintains excellent composure, top notch finishes, great warranty and trade-up program, built like a tank

Cons - The only real con I can think of is price. For instance you can snag the V3600 and it would stomp the Ultra for the same price. Also, the FV15HP is hundreds less and pretty much hangs with the Ultra.

2) Power Sound Audio V3600

This one is fairly new, but from what I've heard it's a brute, some might not like the finish or size? PSA has a great warranty and reputation, customer service is top notch

3) You should also consider the Rythmik FV15HP
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Display - LG 65EF9500
Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #22258 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post
1) SVS PB13 Ultra

Pros - Digs deep and maintains excellent composure, top notch finishes, great warranty and trade-up program, built like a tank

Cons - The only real con I can think of is price. For instance you can snag the V3600 and it would stomp the Ultra for the same price. Also, the FV15HP is hundreds less and pretty much hangs with the Ultra.

2) Power Sound Audio V3600

This one is fairly new, but from what I've heard it's a brute, some might not like the finish or size? PSA has a great warranty and reputation, customer service is top notch

3) You should also consider the Rythmik FV15HP
Thanks for the feedback. I purchased 2 PSA a few hours ago, partially for the reason you mentioned...1,700W RMS from an ICEPower amp vs. 1,000W RMS from an A/B amp. The other factors that swayed me where the visual impact of having 4 18" subs vs. 2 13.5" subs along with the enclosure size and weight. When I learned the owner of PSA founded SVS and designed the PB-13 Ultra...it settled it for me.

Klipsch: 5 RF-7 IIs (center, front mains & side surrounds), 6 RB-81 IIs (front-wide, height & rear surrounds), 4 R-115SW subs. Power Sound Audio: 2 V3600i dual 18" subs. ATI amplifiers: AT6005 & AT4006 Morris Kessler Signature series. Denon: AVR-X5200W. Belden: 10 AWG copper speaker wire. Sewell Direct Deadbolt banana plugs. SVS: sub interconnects. Blue Jeans Cables: interconnects. Mediabridge: Ultra series HDMI, Mid Atlantic: RCS-27U rack w/fans. Epson: 5030UBe projector. Elite: 125" AT screen.
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post #22259 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 11:55 AM
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Sweet congrats!

Display - LG 65EF9500
Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Klipsch RF-82 II's, RC-62 II, RB-61 II's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #22260 of 27131 Old 12-24-2015, 05:03 PM
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All this talk about isolation feet/pads/bases, made me try out the supplied isolation feet on my LV12R, even though I have a carpeted floor with some sort of (likely cheap) wood underneath.

I noticed that after installing the feet, I could barely budge the sub along the carpet and so I got out my carpet friendly furniture sliders and got the sub in place and then removed them. I then tweaked the position a bit with some mild pushing along the carpet.

Given the 60 lb weight of the sub, plus the sticky and flat bottom of the supplied feet, the sub doesn't want to move along the carpet at all.

This brings me to a question, are furniture sliders required to move the sub even a few feet along the carpet once the isolation feet are installed or is it mainly to make it a lot less work/force applied?

And by that, I mean are the feet sturdy enough to withstand the forces of being pushed on carpet or could they fall off/apart if enough force is applied when the sub stubbornly clings to the carpet? And on that note can the carpet be damaged too?

My previous sub was 45 lbs and had built in plastic feet that were like dull spikes/tips and that wasn't too hard to slide on carpet though not exactly super easy either.

Just asking because I don't want to break anything. Also, if I can move the sub without furniture sliders, is there a preferred technique or just pushing horizontally?
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f12g subwoofer , lv12r , Rythmik , Rythmik Audio , Rythmik Audio F12 Direct Servo Subwoofer , Rythmik Audio F15 Subwoofer , servo sub

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