Official Rythmik Audio Subwoofer thread - Page 892 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 10-24-2016, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
You must be looking into the wrong item. Here is the link for the F12:

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/F12.html

Like I said, only the F12G has paper cone driver which is made by GR Research. BTW, I work for Rythmik Audio

The main difference between the F12 and F12G is the driver. The F12G extend up to 120Hz while the F12 up to 90Hz. If you plan to crossover below 90Hz then go with the F12 with aluminum cone.
Sorry, I mixed up with L12. I gave the dimension of L12 which is smaller.

Good, you know Rythmik, One question is how do you compare L12 with F12 in terms of sound quality? Is there a big difference?
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Old 10-24-2016, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by alan0354 View Post
Thanks for the suggestion, I'll look into them.

I went on Rythmik site, they said it's paper cone. Question whether it makes any difference or marketing?

I do like the size of the F12, it's smaller than my Velodyne, it will fit my glass better. If I get the SE, I have to buy another custom cut glass that's going to be over $100!!!

Thanks
I don't know why you would buy the F12 SE which will cost you $150 more for the same driver/amp as the F12 (size is identical) and then use it as a coffee table mostly out of sight.

The piano black is strictly for looks and easily scratches, can it be hit by people stretching out with their feet under the coffee table... Of course it's your money and you get to decide. As Enrico pointed out the F12 and F12 SE are the same except for the finish, and in my opinion identical if you close your eyes, only the finish is different, not the sound.

Have fun and enjoy whatever way you go

Regards, Ken (Retired)
9.1) Denon 4520CI; Samsung 55H8000 & BD-F7500; LRS/L/R SVS Ultra BS, Ultra Center;
RRS Celestion 5; FH & SS Polk; Rythmik F12; CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD (x2)
2.1 Ch.) Nakamichi RE-1, CDC-4A, CR7A, Denon 300F/Ortofon 2M Bronze;
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Old 10-24-2016, 08:27 PM
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Hahahaha. 90% of the music I listen to is from 70s, 80s and 90s. Like I said, mostly jazz. New jazz groups? Snarky Puppy is one of my favorites new jazz bands so far.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_XJ_s5IsQc

The F12 and F12SE have aluminum cone. The F12G is the one with paper cone.
I got to see Snarky Puppy play on ucla campus (royce hall) last year. They sound even better live.

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Old 10-25-2016, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alan0354 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
You must be looking into the wrong item. Here is the link for the F12:

http://www.rythmikaudio.com/F12.html

Like I said, only the F12G has paper cone driver which is made by GR Research. BTW, I work for Rythmik Audio

The main difference between the F12 and F12G is the driver. The F12G extend up to 120Hz while the F12 up to 90Hz. If you plan to crossover below 90Hz then go with the F12 with aluminum cone.
Sorry, I mixed up with L12. I gave the dimension of L12 which is smaller.

Good, you know Rythmik, One question is how do you compare L12 with F12 in terms of sound quality? Is there a big difference?
To answer your question, the main difference between the F12 and L12 is the premium amp controls and connections on the F12. It also has a aluminum cone instead of a paper cone unless you get the F12G.

One other difference is the F12 is -3dB at 14Hz anechoic whereas the L12 is -3dB at 18Hz. The F12 also has a bit more power and a different class of amp.

In a nutshell, the SQ differences should be minimal but if you want the premium amp controls and connections go for the F12. But if you have to choose between one F12 and a pair of L12s, go for the pair.
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Old 10-25-2016, 01:36 PM
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I'm interested in the F12 sub, but see that the A370-PEQ3 amp is on backorder. The F12 is currently available with the A370-PEQ amp. However, I'd be using the sub with a HT receiver with bass management. What is the benefit of the PEQ3 amp over the PEQ amp? The performance specs appear to be the same. Is there a benefit to the PEQ3's LFE input over the PEQ's line in? I thought they were the same? Doesn't the PEQ amp provide more flexibility if I ever use the sub with a non-HT system, as it has high level inputs in addition to line in? Confused.
Mike
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Old 10-25-2016, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
To answer your question, the main difference between the F12 and L12 is the premium amp controls and connections on the F12. It also has a aluminum cone instead of a paper cone unless you get the F12G.

One other difference is the F12 is -3dB at 14Hz anechoic whereas the L12 is -3dB at 18Hz. The F12 also has a bit more power and a different class of amp.

In a nutshell, the SQ differences should be minimal but if you want the premium amp controls and connections go for the F12. But if you have to choose between one F12 and a pair of L12s, go for the pair.
Thanks

Loudness is not important for me, I listen at relative low sound level. Even my old Velodyne 1210 is plenty loud already. So the slightly lower power L12 is not an issue at all.

Between F12SE and F12, I'd choose the SE for extra $150 as it looks better. But L12 is so much cheaper. IF L12 sounds the same, only lower power, that would be my choice.

I am not into loud music, I am not into HT(had one, took it down, I hate the voice coming from the center speaker), I just watch tv shows at ordinary level. I don't want the sub to shake the room, I just want good base sound quality. Money is not an issue, but if L12 sounds the same but just lower power, it would be better as I can use my existing glass top for it as a coffee table.

Somehow, to me, a good stereo sound so much better than HT for tv. I still have a Kef Reference series center sitting on top of the tv collecting dust and the two rear speakers in the shed in the yard.

Last edited by alan0354; 10-25-2016 at 01:42 PM.
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Old 10-25-2016, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alan0354 View Post
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
To answer your question, the main difference between the F12 and L12 is the premium amp controls and connections on the F12. It also has a aluminum cone instead of a paper cone unless you get the F12G.

One other difference is the F12 is -3dB at 14Hz anechoic whereas the L12 is -3dB at 18Hz. The F12 also has a bit more power and a different class of amp.

In a nutshell, the SQ differences should be minimal but if you want the premium amp controls and connections go for the F12. But if you have to choose between one F12 and a pair of L12s, go for the pair.
Thanks

Loudness is not important for me, I listen at relative low sound level. Even my old Velodyne 1210 is plenty loud already. So the slightly lower power L12 is not an issue at all.

Between F12SE and F12, I'd choose the SE for extra $150 as it looks better. But L12 is so much cheaper. IF L12 sounds the same, only lower power, that would be my choice.

I am not into loud music, I am not into HT(had one, took it down, I hate the voice coming from the center speaker), I just watch tv shows at ordinary level. I don't want the sub to shake the room, I just want good base sound quality.

Somehow, to me, a good stereo sound so much better than HT for tv. I still have a Kef Reference series center sitting on top of the tv collecting dust and the two rear speakers in the shed in the yard.
How are your speakers hooked up/integrated with the sub? That might help determine if you need the F12's extra connections and controls or not.

In terms of SQ and overall performance the L12 should be more than enough, but the above is an important consideration especially if you are not using an AVR or pre-pro with digital bass management.
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Old 10-25-2016, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
How are your speakers hooked up/integrated with the sub? That might help determine if you need the F12's extra connections and controls or not.

In terms of SQ and overall performance the L12 should be more than enough, but the above is an important consideration especially if you are not using an AVR or pre-pro with digital bass management.
I have a preamp I designed and a Nakamichi PA-7 power amp. I have a pair of JM LAB Spectral 913.1. I don't have any fancy AVR or anything. Right now I just tap off the speaker cable to drive into the sub.

Is L12 only have RCA input? That I need to have RCA cable from preamp out to drive the sub. I can modify the preamp to have an extra set of RCA output identical to the output that drive the power amp.
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Old 10-25-2016, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by alan0354 View Post
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
How are your speakers hooked up/integrated with the sub? That might help determine if you need the F12's extra connections and controls or not.

In terms of SQ and overall performance the L12 should be more than enough, but the above is an important consideration especially if you are not using an AVR or pre-pro with digital bass management.
I have a preamp I designed and a Nakamichi PA-7 power amp. I have a pair of JM LAB Spectral 913.1. I don't have any fancy AVR or anything. Right now I just tap off the speaker cable to drive into the sub.

Is L12 only have RCA input? That I need to have RCA cable from preamp out to drive the sub. I can modify the preamp to have an extra set of RCA output identical to the output that drive the power amp.
I use an AVR so I don't know too much about this but how is the current sub hooked up?

Can you take a pic of the sub plate amp to see how things are hooked up?
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Old 10-25-2016, 02:58 PM
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The L12 has 2 rca line ins and one rca lfe in.

If you need speaker wire connections (and possibly hpf for the speakers) then you need an F12. As to which exact F12 model and amp, Enrico should be able to determine that.
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Old 10-25-2016, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
I use an AVR so I don't know too much about this but how is the current sub hooked up?

Can you take a pic of the sub plate amp to see how things are hooked up?
It's very simple, it has L and R speaker inputs. All you have to do is run two wires from the main speaker to the sub.
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Old 10-25-2016, 03:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alan0354 View Post
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
I use an AVR so I don't know too much about this but how is the current sub hooked up?

Can you take a pic of the sub plate amp to see how things are hooked up?
It's very simple, it has L and R speaker inputs. All you have to do is run two wires from the main speaker to the sub.
If you are using speaker wire connections, then an F12 would be the right choice.
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Old 10-25-2016, 07:52 PM
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Look at the different amplifiers on the Rythmik site. It sounds like you may want to pick up one with the PEQ amp that has both RCA inputs and a high-pass filter output to drive your main power amp (unless you already have an appropriate crossover).

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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Old 10-25-2016, 08:25 PM
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tell me i'm not the only one checking this thread for fv18hp updates?

my fv15hp needs a big brother.
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Old 10-25-2016, 09:09 PM
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Does Rythmik have special for F12SE or others during the holidays?
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Old 10-26-2016, 12:59 PM
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mostly music in big room

I am trying to figure out which pair of Rhythmik subwoofers to buy.
My current setup is:

Denon 4311CI AVR 140 watts, using Audyssey 32
ATI AT1803 amp 180 watts
Definitive Technology Mythos One tower speakers -dual 5 ¼ drivers
dual Polk PSW505 12 inch subs

Room size is approximately 7344 cubic feet (34X27X8)
My main importance is quality music, but I do have a 5.2 setup.
The subs using Audyssey 32 are set at volume of 2.5 out of 10.
I don't need more bass, just concerned with better sound.
For me I don't see much difference between using the amp and not using it.
Main listening positions are between 9 and 11 feet from the speakers,
although sometimes we sit at a table that is 25 feet away.
I have plenty of volume with this setup.
Edit: Sorry I did not say budget, how about $2000 for both subs.

Thoughts? Thanks!

Last edited by culliganman; 10-26-2016 at 01:50 PM.
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Old 10-26-2016, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by culliganman View Post
I am trying to figure out which pair of Rhythmik subwoofers to buy.
My current setup is:

Denon 4311CI AVR 140 watts, using Audyssey 32
ATI AT1803 amp 180 watts
Definitive Technology Mythos One tower speakers -dual 5 ? drivers
dual Polk PSW505 12 inch subs

Room size is approximately 7344 cubic feet (34X27X8)
My main importance is quality music, but I do have a 5.2 setup.
The subs using Audyssey 32 are set at volume of 2.5 out of 10.
I don't need more bass, just concerned with better sound.
For me I don't see much difference between using the amp and not using it.
Main listening positions are between 9 and 11 feet from the speakers,
although sometimes we sit at a table that is 25 feet away.
I have plenty of volume with this setup.
Edit: Sorry I did not say budget, how about $2000 for both subs.

Thoughts? Thanks!
If you don't need more output, then a pair of L12s or F12s would be good sealed choices.

(Or dual L22s instead of dual F12s for most bang for the buck.)

For ported, a pair of LV12Rs or LVX12s should be more than enough for your needs.

The way to determine which of these models is ideal for you is to decide how much you want to spend and whether you have a preference for sealed or ported.

If you want something close to what you have now then a pair of ported 12s (LV12R or LVX12) would be the 2 options.
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Old 10-26-2016, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by culliganman View Post
I am trying to figure out which pair of Rhythmik subwoofers to buy.
My current setup is:

Denon 4311CI AVR 140 watts, using Audyssey 32
ATI AT1803 amp 180 watts
Definitive Technology Mythos One tower speakers -dual 5 ¼ drivers
dual Polk PSW505 12 inch subs

Room size is approximately 7344 cubic feet (34X27X8)
My main importance is quality music, but I do have a 5.2 setup.
The subs using Audyssey 32 are set at volume of 2.5 out of 10.
I don't need more bass, just concerned with better sound.
For me I don't see much difference between using the amp and not using it.
Main listening positions are between 9 and 11 feet from the speakers,
although sometimes we sit at a table that is 25 feet away.
I have plenty of volume with this setup.
Edit: Sorry I did not say budget, how about $2000 for both subs.

Thoughts? Thanks!
With a $2000 budget I would go with a pair of FVX15s ($1809 shipped). If the FVX15 is too big then a pair of LVX12s ($1518 shipped) would be my recommendation. It's important that you check the size of the FVX15 because it's big. I have a customer returning a FV15HP today because he did not check the size and he said it's too big in his room.



Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers w/ RAAL, Horizon w/ RAAL & Sierra 2s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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Old 10-26-2016, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
With a $2000 budget I would go with a pair of FVX15s ($1809 shipped). If the FVX15 is too big then a pair of LVX12s ($1518 shipped) would be my recommendation. It's important that you check the size of the FVX15 because it's big. I have a customer returning a FV15HP today because he did not check the size and he said it's too big in his room.
Thank you for the quick reply.
The FVX15 is way too big for me and 120 lbs wow!
So do I need the large subs for the large room even if I don't need the high spl's or down to 14 Hz capability to create high quality music?
I take it the LVX12 will give me better quality sound than an F12 or L12?
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Old 10-26-2016, 03:20 PM
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In terms of SQ both of them are more alike than different. The LVX12 has the advantage in output, around +4dB more than the F12 and +5dB more than the L12. In a room that big a ported subwoofer like the LVX12 would work better than a sealed subwoofer like the F12. If you are worried about musicality and prefer a sealed subwoofer then go with a pair of L22s ($1638 shipped). The L22 is basically two L12s stacked and it has the same output as the LVX12.



Enrico Castagnetti @ Rythmik Audio
Media Room: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers w/ RAAL, Horizon w/ RAAL & Sierra 2s | Rythmik F12SE (x2) | Marantz SR7008 | Parasound Halo P5 | Emotiva XPA-3 & XPA-200 | Oppo 105D | Sony HW40ES |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet | 27" iMac|
Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz NR1606 | Emotiva XPA-200 Gen 2 | Samsung UN50JU6500 |
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Old 10-26-2016, 03:58 PM
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If you don't need more output, then a pair of L12s or F12s would be good sealed choices.

(Or dual L22s instead of dual F12s for most bang for the buck.)

For ported, a pair of LV12Rs or LVX12s should be more than enough for your needs.

The way to determine which of these models is ideal for you is to decide how much you want to spend and whether you have a preference for sealed or ported.

If you want something close to what you have now then a pair of ported 12s (LV12R or LVX12) would be the 2 options.
Thanks, I missed your comments because I only saw the end one.
Anyway yea, I don't need more output.
In reading though it does appear that lower extension is not a waste for music.
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Old 10-26-2016, 04:09 PM
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Thanks, I missed your comments because I only saw the end one.
Anyway yea, I don't need more output.
In reading though it does appear that lower extension is not a waste for music.
In that case, a pair of LVX12s or L22s would be my recommendations. The L22 is pretty heavy though since it is like 2 L12s. Both offer similar output and extension, though the L22 could go deeper than the LVX12 with room gain (though likely not in a large room like yours).

UN46EH6030 Calibration/Settings
Samsung UN46EH6030; Yamaha HTR-3066, SVS Prime Bookshelf Mains and Prime Center, Cambridge S20 Surrounds, Rythmik LV12R; PS4, Xbox One, Xfinity X1 (CI CXD01ANI)
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Old 10-26-2016, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
In terms of SQ both of them are more alike than different. The LVX12 has the advantage in output, around +4dB more than the F12 and +5dB more than the L12. In a room that big a ported subwoofer like the LVX12 would work better than a sealed subwoofer like the F12. If you are worried about musicality and prefer a sealed subwoofer then go with a pair of L22s ($1638 shipped). The L22 is basically two L12s stacked and it has the same output as the LVX12.
I guess ported is the way I would go then. Now I'm leaning towards the LVX12.
What would I be missing with the LV12R? It's a bit smaller for the wife factor?

For some reason I'm not getting you guys's responses on time, so bear with me.
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Old 10-26-2016, 04:21 PM
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Just like to add, modern blues (Beth Hart for example) and rock are what I listen to the most but I listen to everything from country to jazz.
For a bass test I have used "My Name is Mud" by Primus.
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Old 10-26-2016, 04:53 PM
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I guess ported is the way I would go then. Now I'm leaning towards the LVX12.
What would I be missing with the LV12R? It's a bit smaller for the wife factor?

For some reason I'm not getting you guys's responses on time, so bear with me.
The LVX12 is rated down to 14Hz, the LV12R is down to 19Hz. The latter is a bit smaller, especially in depth.

The former has 14Hz and 20Hz modes (14Hz with one port plugged, 20Hz with both open and 20Hz mode will likely have a bit more output above 20Hz)... the LV12R is 19Hz only.

UN46EH6030 Calibration/Settings
Samsung UN46EH6030; Yamaha HTR-3066, SVS Prime Bookshelf Mains and Prime Center, Cambridge S20 Surrounds, Rythmik LV12R; PS4, Xbox One, Xfinity X1 (CI CXD01ANI)
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Old 10-26-2016, 04:55 PM
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Also the LVX12 is 1.5dB more powerful than LV12R
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Old 10-26-2016, 05:07 PM
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The bass extension switch settings are different on the LVX12 and LV12R.
Is that a big deal?
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Old 10-26-2016, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by culliganman View Post
The bass extension switch settings are different on the LVX12 and LV12R.
Is that a big deal?
Your room is way too large to worry about output below 20hz, so with either, set the extension switch to whichever position provides the most output.

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Old 10-26-2016, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by culliganman View Post
The bass extension switch settings are different on the LVX12 and LV12R.
Is that a big deal?
They are basically the same. The main difference is in the LVX12 the bass extension switch works in conjunction with the multi-tune (1 or 2 ports open)
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Old 10-26-2016, 05:22 PM
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it changes the sound... high damping is cleaner/faster/tighter etc., which is great for music (but possibly movies too for some)


low damping is more full bodied (boomy) with more weight to the sound, best for movies

the LV12R also has a 3rd option, mid damping... which splits the difference

another way of looking at damping is how thick or thin the low end is... high damping sounds thinner/faster and low damping is thicker/slower
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