Emotiva Ultra Subwoofers - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by automaton View Post

Yeah, that's basically what I'm wondering...the Lava 12" would be under $300, I've also been looking at the Elemental Designs A3S - 250 for a bit more.

Edit: I want "musicality" vs. home theater in my sub, which is why I was thinking the ED or Emotiva, but read that Lava does well w/music too.

I had an Ultra 12. Sold it and bought a used eD A3S-250 to gain back a little cash.

Based on listening experience only - ie. no measurements - my opinion is that the eD keeps up with the Ultra 12. I think the Ultra 12 is probably capable of more output, but the eD is pretty impressive considering the smaller 10" driver. I also felt the Ultra 12 was a bit tighter sounding... but overall SQ was close.

I can't speak for extension because I don't have measurements, but both subs were fun when listening to some of the bass heavy scenes from Transformers, Kung Fu Panda, ect.

For $350, I'd easily take the eD over the Ultra 10 priced at $369. Now if the Ultra 12 were $359 again, I'd go for that, but mainly for reasons outside of just sound quality... although as I mentioned, I thought the Ultra was a bit "tighter" sounding.
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post #452 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post

I had an Ultra 12. Sold it and bought a used eD A3S-250 to gain back a little cash.

Based on listening experience only - ie. no measurements - my opinion is that the eD keeps up with the Ultra 12. I think the Ultra 12 is probably capable of more output, but the eD is pretty impressive considering the smaller 10" driver. I also felt the Ultra 12 was a bit tighter sounding... but overall SQ was close.

I can't speak for extension because I don't have measurements, but both subs were fun when listening to some of the bass heavy scenes from Transformers, Kung Fu Panda, ect.

For $350, I'd easily take the eD over the Ultra 10 priced at $369. Now if the Ultra 12 were $359 again, I'd go for that, but mainly for reasons outside of just sound quality... although as I mentioned, I thought the Ultra was a bit "tighter" sounding.

Thanks for that, it's very helpful. What about the Ultra 10 @ sub-$300, assuming it drops again? I've considered Hsu as well, but am thinking sealed will be better in my condo-- any boom=bad for me.
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post #453 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 05:35 PM
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I'm selling my Emo 12 for $300 if anyone is interested. I'm in Jacksonville, FL. PM for details.
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post #454 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 07:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by automaton View Post

Thanks for that, it's very helpful. What about the Ultra 10 @ sub-$300, assuming it drops again? I've considered Hsu as well, but am thinking sealed will be better in my condo-- any boom=bad for me.

I haven't heard the Ultra 10... so not sure. But if it goes back down below $300, it's a more compelling buy.

I do think the Ultra 12 was a very good performer for $359... so I'd guess the Ultra 10 to be a great deal at the $249 price... and still probably a decent deal at $289.

I just think $369 is too high for the 10, regardless of finish.


I wouldn't rule out the HSU STF-2 though. HSU has a very solid reputation for clean, accurate sounding subs. And just because it's ported doesn't mean it's going to be more of an issue for neighbors than sealed. Alot of that is dependent on sub placement and listening habits.

Also, there is the b-stock Outlaw LFM-Compact for $349 with free shipping. It's designed by HSU and very similar to the STF-2.
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post #455 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by skooba View Post

I'm selling my Emo 12 for $300 if anyone is interested. I'm in Jacksonville, FL. PM for details.

Why are you selling?
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post #456 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 07:56 PM
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Why are you selling?

Upgrading, I have a 4,000 cu ft room and need something more powerful. Looking at the HSU VTF-15H
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post #457 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by skooba View Post

Upgrading, I have a 4,000 cu ft room and need something more powerful. Looking at the HSU VTF-15H

I saw your ad at the emotiva forum. Did you decide to ship now, or still local sale only?
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post #458 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by skooba View Post

Upgrading, I have a 4,000 cu ft room and need something more powerful. Looking at the HSU VTF-15H

Yeah, I bet thing will thump. I'm in cali - I may have to go down there and have a listen

Did you like the quality of the ultra 12 (if not the power)?
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post #459 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post


I saw your ad at the emotiva forum. Did you decide to ship now, or still local sale only?

Yeah I guess I can ship it, I just don't have the original box so I have to find something that will work. I'm nervous that it will get damaged in shipment.
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post #460 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiff69 View Post


Yeah, I bet thing will thump. I'm in cali - I may have to go down there and have a listen

Did you like the quality of the ultra 12 (if not the power)?

I like the sub and the price, I just wish I had a smaller room. The sub is pretty light, and the finish matches my speakers which us a plus. I live in a townhouse and my neighbor two houses down said they could hear me playing call of duty and I definitely wasn't playing it that loud.
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post #461 of 703 Old 12-09-2010, 08:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaeelarr View Post

Yes, it is. "Significant" is subjective.

You double the drivers, and you double the power. Yes, it will be significant. Do the math.

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post #462 of 703 Old 12-10-2010, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post



I wouldn't rule out the HSU STF-2 though. HSU has a very solid reputation for clean, accurate sounding subs. And just because it's ported doesn't mean it's going to be more of an issue for neighbors than sealed. Alot of that is dependent on sub placement and listening habits.

Also, there is the b-stock Outlaw LFM-Compact for $349 with free shipping. It's designed by HSU and very similar to the STF-2.

Any more thoughts on the differences between the two? I didn't see it for $349, only $399.
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post #463 of 703 Old 12-10-2010, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyng_fool View Post

You double the drivers, and you double the power. Yes, it will be significant. Do the math.

Wait...THAT'S you're overwhelming evidence? I understand your logic, but that's not how it works. It has been debated on here whether having two subs increases your db by a "significant" amount, and the answer is not as clear as you think it is. Yes, you DO get an increase, but its is absolutely NOT "double". Some say its only a 2-3 db increase at the most.

Two subs mainly smooth out nulls, dips, peaks, and voids. Maybe because of this, you THINK its "double" in db's? Not sure. Anyhow, thats why its subjective.
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post #464 of 703 Old 12-10-2010, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by automaton View Post

Any more thoughts on the differences between the two? I didn't see it for $349, only $399.

https://www.outlawaudio.com/mofcart/bstock.html

I think the main differences are cabinet aesthetics and port placement (down instead of rear firing).

The Outlaw sub is HSU designed, and I believe uses the same driver. Amp appears the same, although Outlaw says 225W RMS and HSU says 200W RMS.
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post #465 of 703 Old 12-10-2010, 09:00 AM
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Ah thanks! The rest of my system has been pretty easy to pick out, the sub is where I can't decide how much to spend (been between $250 and $350) and what the extra $$$ will get me, seeing as the sub will probably be turned down most of the time....I have a 5.0 setup now and it gets nice bass, tight and clear, but obviously doesn't dig as deep as it could, and make the mids not as clear as I think they'll be with a sub.
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post #466 of 703 Old 12-10-2010, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaeelarr View Post

Wait...THAT'S you're overwhelming evidence? I understand your logic, but that's not how it works. It has been debated on here whether having two subs increases your db by a "significant" amount, and the answer is not as clear as you think it is. Yes, you DO get an increase, but its is absolutely NOT "double". Some say its only a 2-3 db increase at the most.

Two subs mainly smooth out nulls, dips, peaks, and voids. Maybe because of this, you THINK its "double" in db's? Not sure. Anyhow, thats why its subjective.

Of course it's not double. You think 3-6 db's isn't significant? Really?

Television: Mitsubishi WD65737 DLP
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Amps: Carver AV 806x/Behringer EP4000
Mains: DCM TimeFrame 600 Center: AT 453C
Surrounds: AT 251.1 Sub: Danley DTS-10
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post #467 of 703 Old 12-10-2010, 03:10 PM
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Just pulled the trigger on an Emotiva 10"-- they still had black ash in stock, so I got one of those. Not sure if the 12" are still available...hoping the 10" will fill my room pretty well.
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post #468 of 703 Old 12-25-2010, 11:48 AM
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Not much activity here at the moment so I'm not sure how many people this will help but the Ultra 10 is currently available on eBay for $249 shipped.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Emotiva-Audio-Ho...item43a40f7b8b

This is a factory authorized closeout of the old black ash finish which have been replaced by a new satin black finish.They are A stock and come directly from Emotiva.

Since this is direct from Emotiva itself I figure this post complies with the MSRP only rule.
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post #469 of 703 Old 12-25-2010, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by dcg44s View Post

Not much activity here at the moment so I'm not sure how many people this will help but the Ultra 10 is currently available on eBay for $249 shipped.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Emotiva-Audio-Ho...item43a40f7b8b

This is a factory authorized closeout of the old black ash finish which have been replaced by a new satin black finish.They are A stock and come directly from Emotiva.

Since this is direct from Emotiva itself I figure this post complies with the MSRP only rule.

I'm listening to my Ultra-10 in my office now.
Good for a small room.
Great price.

Mike
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post #470 of 703 Old 12-25-2010, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

I'm listening to my Ultra-10 in my office now.
Good for a small room.
Great price.

Mike

I wasn't planning to buy a new sub just yet but at that price I simply couldn't resist.If you consider that it includes shipping (43lb) it makes it seem an even better bargain.I think that the Ultra 10 will meet my needs for now and be a nice upgrade over my old smaller less powerful Klipsch.This will be my first Emotiva product and I'm looking forward to trying it out.
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post #471 of 703 Old 12-30-2010, 02:42 PM
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I just got my second Ultra Sub10 in the mail today, and I couldn't be happier. I have a small 10 x 12 foot room and I swear I could not imagine any more bass. Inception at -5 db almost tore my house down. I've never heard bass like that in my life. We will see how then do when I go back to my apartment, a 20x15 foot room.
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post #472 of 703 Old 01-01-2011, 09:04 AM
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I have had my Ultra 10 for a few weeks now. I must say that I am very impressed with this sub. Even taking it out of the box I could tell this was something special. Things like the soft rubber push on tabs to hold the grill in place (and to also prevent rattle) and threaded inserts for the feet (two kinds no less). It's attention to detail like this that marks a quality product. This would have been a good deal at it's normal selling price but at the closeout price? WOW!

The Ultra 10 is replacing my 28 year old 12" M&K Goliath 2A sub (which now has a different speaker and a built-in power amp). The new sub is in a 1200 cu/ft room and sits in a cabinet under the display about 2 feet out from a corner boundry. After a week of breaking it in, I must say that this is one impressive subwoofer. Now, it won't shake the rafters in larger rooms, but when using it in the environment it was designed to function in, it can. Good low frequency extension and impressive cone excursion. A very musical sub. The amp is clean, quite and has good headroom. I was planning on using my M&K in the opposite back corner of the room to give a little more low frequency oomph (<40 hz) and I still may, but right now, I am pleased with just the Ultra. I plan to hook up my Berringher DSP 8024 and see what kind of frequency curves I am getting and go from there. As it stands right now (and from a subjective standpoint), music and LFE from movies are being reproduced faithfully.

If you are looking for a sub to fill a smaller size room then you would be wise to consider placing this on your shopping list. Well done Emotiva!
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post #473 of 703 Old 01-06-2011, 02:07 PM
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Alright, time to join in on the Emotiva thread. Going from a HSU STF-1 to the Ultra12 in my small bedroom setup, 8" ported to a 12" sealed. Hopefully will be a big improvement, and I think it will be!
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post #474 of 703 Old 01-07-2011, 12:40 AM
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Originally Posted by thehappytech View Post

Well the Ultra 12 arrived. Just got a chance in set it up yesterday. Well I did get to meet the neighbors, well not actaully, I got the foot stomp on the floor above me (almost paid them a visit but thats another story). Anyway I am very happy.. This was an upgrade from an STF-1. I will say the STF-1 did have more midbass loudness with low to mid volume levels ( if that makes sense) but clearly the Ultra 12 digs much deeper and will pound if cranked. I don't listen to Rap but used it to test and wow what a difference. The good news is I move into a house in a couple of months.. I figure I will have to leave it turned way down until then.

I am also going from a STF-1 to the ultra12. It is for a small apartment room. I listen at low to medium levels and mainly music. Are u saying that the STF-1 is better for music since it has better mid bass at low volumes? Music doesn't go that deep so does that mean I didn't make a good buy?
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post #475 of 703 Old 01-07-2011, 07:01 PM
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My ultra 12 arrived today, I quickly unpacked and set it up in a corner of my room. The sub is really very nicely finished, was well packed, and looks to quality built too.

I did some quick in-room measurements using the Real Traps test tones. For reference the room is 1800 cu. ft., carpeted, and closed with windows on two sides with full blinds. I played the tones from 10Hz up through 69Hz. I wasn't expecting much below 25Hz or so but what I found seems both odd and disappointing. From 33 - 69Hz, apart from what I assume is a room acoustics issue around the 50Hz mark, the results are relatively flat. But at 33Hz it drops off like a rock, down 20db from 33 to 29Hz. How can this be? I could understand that kind of rolloff lower down, but at 33Hz and a full 20db drop across only a 4Hz range?

It strikes me as odd and I am definitely disappointed with these results but don't really know/understand the cause. I only experimented with placement in and near one corner so maybe results will be better with the sub placed somewhere else. Could that much of a drop starting at 33Hz be a room acoustics issue or am I just seeing the limitations of this sub?
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post #476 of 703 Old 01-07-2011, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JN99 View Post

My ultra 12 arrived today, I quickly unpacked and set it up in a corner of my room. The sub is really very nicely finished, was well packed, and looks to quality built too.

I did some quick in-room measurements using the Real Traps test tones. For reference the room is 1800 cu. ft., carpeted, and closed with windows on two sides with full blinds. I played the tones from 10Hz up through 69Hz. I wasn't expecting much below 25Hz or so but what I found seems both odd and disappointing. From 33 - 69Hz, apart from what I assume is a room acoustics issue around the 50Hz mark, the results are relatively flat. But at 33Hz it drops off like a rock, down 20db from 33 to 29Hz. How can this be? I could understand that kind of rolloff lower down, but at 33Hz and a full 20db drop across only a 4Hz range?

It strikes me as odd and I am definitely disappointed with these results but don't really know/understand the cause. I only experimented with placement in and near one corner so maybe results will be better with the sub placed somewhere else. Could that much of a drop starting at 33Hz be a room acoustics issue or am I just seeing the limitations of this sub?

If you look at the measurements in the Audioholics review of this sub, you'll see that below the low 30Hz range the response falls off a cliff.
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/s...2-measurements

It looks like there is a steep high pass filter in place, and perhaps some boost above the filter to give a relatively flat response in the 30's-100Hz range.

The roll off on the low end looks steeper than the natural 12db/octave roll off you'd see with a sealed sub with no filter in place.

That said, what is somewhat surprising is that you are not getting any room gain to help out that low end, even with corner placement... and in fact the low end seems to drop even faster in your room.

The Audioholics measurements were 1M ground plane, so there is no low end gain... but in your room I'd think you'd see some sort of help down low.

Seems like room acoustics are coming into play, but maybe someone with more knowledge than I can chime in.

BTW... where were the measurements done - 1 meter, 2 meters, listening position, ect.?
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post #477 of 703 Old 01-07-2011, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post

If you look at the measurements in the BTW... where were the measurements done - 1 meter, 2 meters, listening position, ect.?

The measurements were done at listening position. Yep, I expected more with a little help from room gain too. The roll off on the audioholics review is steep, but the drop doesn't happen nearly as quickly as mine, i.e. it looks like they are all the way down to abot 20Hz before the see a 20dB loss, and it looks like only a 6-7db from 33 down to 29Hz.
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post #478 of 703 Old 01-08-2011, 10:18 AM
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My Ultra 10 has a lower frequency response than that in my room, down to 25Hz no problem (not at full volume). Definitely acoustics and/or placement.
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post #479 of 703 Old 01-08-2011, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by vitocorleone View Post

My Ultra 10 has a lower frequency response than that in my room, down to 25Hz no problem (not at full volume). Definitely acoustics and/or placement.

The dirty little secret to ALL subwoofers is that free field measurement doesn't correlate well to in-room measurement. You can buy a sub that is said to get 100db at 20hz, but when you put it in your room you find it only gets to 27hz or it plays down to 18hz at that SPL. You just never know.

I have an Ultra 12 and no matter if it's in a corner or along a wall somewhere, it SHARPLY falls off at 30hz. It's almost flat down to 30hz and then there's a cliff it goes over. Some have speculated that Ultra 12 has a high pass filter at 30hz.
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post #480 of 703 Old 01-08-2011, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vitocorleone View Post

My Ultra 10 has a lower frequency response than that in my room, down to 25Hz no problem (not at full volume). Definitely acoustics and/or placement.

But how much does it fall off and where? I can't imagine the U10 outperforming the 12 regardless of the room

Quote:
Originally Posted by openvista View Post

The dirty little secret to ALL subwoofers is that free field measurement doesn't correlate well to in-room measurement. You can buy a sub that is said to get 100db at 20hz, but when you put it in your room you find it only gets to 27hz or it plays down to 18hz at that SPL. You just never know.

I have an Ultra 12 and no matter if it's in a corner or along a wall somewhere, it SHARPLY falls off at 30hz. It's almost flat down to 30hz and then there's a cliff it goes over. Some have speculated that Ultra 12 has a high pass filter at 30hz.

Yep, pretty much what I am seeing but sadly it happens even higher at 33Hz. I have only tried a couple placements, will keep experimenting and try some different placements but doubt I'll wring much more from this sub. Very disappointing given the in-room freq. response Emo claims for this sub
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