Official JTR Orbit Shifter Subwoofer Thread - Page 46 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1351 of 1374 Old 02-05-2015, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nabs17 View Post
@yosh7 ....now that you've sold your subM's....did you end up getting dual OS's?
Man, it was close! I had emailed and called Jeff and he completely lived up to his excellent reputation. I had a list of questions and concerns and he addressed them very patiently. It ultimately came down to aesthetics and also the worry and conquest of missing out on <20HZ material.

I ended up going with three custom dual opposed 18" sealed subs (6 total 18" drivers) that are being made by Jeremy with Reaction Audio. I am hoping they give me the output above 20HZ (the nice tactile chest thump) along with the ULF that I just didn't want to give up on. I realize that Cap S2's were also an option and they too were on my short list of: 1. Orbit shifter lfu's 2. Custom Reaction Audio dual opposed sealed 3. Cap S2 4. DIY. 5. Waiting for the Submersive XL's to become a reality. Being very familiar with the sound of the sealed, dual opposed design of the SubM's that I sold, I felt it was a logical evolution to go with a similar design with larger drivers, more drivers, and more output.

Thanks to all of the advice of the JTR experts on this thread!
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post #1352 of 1374 Old 02-05-2015, 07:48 PM
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Congrats on your purchase. I actually came across this while looking in the reaction audio sub thread.

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post #1353 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 11:25 AM
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I have considered an Orbit Shifter since I could hide it behind a screen wall and I'm looking for 99% movie use. However, if I wanted a balancing sub in the back of the room, I wouldn't want another Orbit Shifter back there...since it looks like it was created by the Borg. Are people balancing an Orbit Shifter with a different...more attractive sub? What would work back there?
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post #1354 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romans828 View Post
I have considered an Orbit Shifter since I could hide it behind a screen wall and I'm looking for 99% movie use. However, if I wanted a balancing sub in the back of the room, I wouldn't want another Orbit Shifter back there...since it looks like it was created by the Borg. Are people balancing an Orbit Shifter with a different...more attractive sub? What would work back there?
How big is your room and is it be sealed or open?

You won't need more than one, but if you want two, both can go behind the screen. The OS can go so loud, balance is not what my concern when I've just run one in my room.

But if you want nearfield, you could get the non-LFU version and lay it behind the sofa...less obtrusive. At least you'll know it can keep up with each other.

My preference is two LFU behind screen.

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gear: 3x JTR 212HT ~ 4x JTR 8LP ~ 2x JTR Orbit Shifter LFU ~ 11x Elemental Designs eD6c ~ Marantz SR7008 ~ Panasonic PT-AE8000U ~ Elite 176" 2.35 ATS
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post #1355 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
How big is your room and is it be sealed or open?

You won't need more than one, but if you want two, both can go behind the screen. The OS can go so loud, balance is not what my concern when I've just run one in my room.

But if you want nearfield, you could get the non-LFU version and lay it behind the sofa...less obtrusive. At least you'll know it can keep up with each other.

My preference is two LFU behind screen.
This will be for a new house build that should begin in April. The room will be sealed. Attached is an initial sketch. The room will be 25L X 17W X 10H
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post #1356 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post

My preference is two LFU behind screen.
I would definitely prefer behind the screen. When I model my room dimensions with REW, a rear sub seems to improve things...but that is just a computer model without actual testing.
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post #1357 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 03:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romans828 View Post
This will be for a new house build that should begin in April. The room will be sealed. Attached is an initial sketch. The room will be 25L X 17W X 10H
Two subs placed between LCR...like so...
L--OS-C-OS--R

Keep each OS LFU about 12-18 inches away from the center speaker...it will give clean bass without boominess from side walls.

You might as well start with two shifters to save not only shipping, but curiosity will get the best of you later if you don't get both now. On the flip side, one will be plenty for 99% of the population and you can spend the 3k on other HT necessities...always can add another later.

Also, may want to ask on the JTR thread if anyone living within a couple hours of you has dual os to demo...let your ears decide.

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post #1358 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 05:49 PM
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Placing the OS LFU near wall will act as additional horn path which can increase output some on the low end. Best to measure because in some set ups it will be better corner loaded and in some better as assofi1 described. Depends on room acoustics. In my room corner loaded was better.

as far as balancing the OS with other subs, I have had multiple configurations and when I had one OS LFU I was running it with an Epik empire and two velodyne SC-12's sealed subs. The main issue is different phase repsonses over the frequency range but it can be done with some systematic measuring and tweaking of independant time delay, XO type and slop and phasing.

When I went to all OS LFU the job became easier because the all have almost identical FR and phase alignment.

If the room needs different subs, then get a mini DSP balanced 2x4, measure with REW and you will be amazed what you can achieve.

good luck
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post #1359 of 1374 Old 03-05-2015, 09:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Romans828 View Post
I have considered an Orbit Shifter since I could hide it behind a screen wall and I'm looking for 99% movie use. However, if I wanted a balancing sub in the back of the room, I wouldn't want another Orbit Shifter back there...since it looks like it was created by the Borg. Are people balancing an Orbit Shifter with a different...more attractive sub? What would work back there?
I currently have ONE OS LFU which is placed nearfield to my bed.. and 2 x HSU 15 inch subs... It always sounds better with all 3 subs turned on vs just the LFU... but not necessarily 'louder'.. just smoother and better.. that's as best as i can describe it.. with just the 1 LFU, you get as loud as most ppl would ever want, but something's missing for me.. like i feel it's 'too hot' or 'not as balanced or smooth'... the sealed subs sort of add in the missing parts... .and balances everything out..
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post #1360 of 1374 Old 03-06-2015, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Romans828 View Post
I would definitely prefer behind the screen. When I model my room dimensions with REW, a rear sub seems to improve things...but that is just a computer model without actual testing.
Btw, you may already know this, but just make sure your electrician runs 12awg wiring and 20a outlets in your HT...at least wherever the subs, rack, and pj will be. For subs, back wall and front wall in case you ever do want to add/move some subs n the back wall....and each OS on its own 20a breaker...I've got both of mine on one 20a breaker, and I still can't push them to their limit...for instance, EOT trips the breaker at -10db...I'd like to experience that at reference, but am limited by my electric panel only havinh one slot available for the new 20a breaker....

So...large enough panel, enough 20a outlets for all equip/locations, and dedicated breaker for each sub location.

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post #1361 of 1374 Old 03-08-2015, 02:34 PM
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FYI, I just put my 2 cap 1000's up in the classified section if anyone is interested.

2 jtr cap 1000's

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post #1362 of 1374 Old 04-11-2015, 08:02 AM
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I've been on a journey to replace my dual Ultras for longer than I've expected . Some have you have already helped lead me towards Jeff's subs and some of you have confused the hell out of me First I started off with the thought of opting for dual Submersives. Then it was made clear to me that dual S2's would cost a bit more but would provide more output. Now virtually everything I've read says the OS (even one) would probably outperform for movie use (theater is 100% movies, separate music system). One of the main reasons the Ultras did not really do it for me were tactile or visceral feel ad mid bass. I felt that to get enough I had to use Hsu MBM's nearfield. This resulted in a bit of localization when I had them running up to 120hz.

My room is a smallish 14x15x10 (2100 cubes) on slab but 40% of it is on a riser (not sand filled but OC filled, single row of seats). The room is sealed except there are two 4x6 windows that are covered with ATS Acoustics 2in panels. Two of the walls have 2 inch concrete block exterior (stucco home). There are really only two options for placement of an OS in this room. One would be at the left of the screen wall at the corner where the entry door is. Another would be behind the single row of seats anywhere along the rear of the room along the riser.

Do you see this as a better fit for an OS, dual S2's, or even a single S2? I'm also still confused about suspended flooring and not sure if the riser would allow me to benefit from the sub 20hz stuff.
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My Theater Room JVC RS4910, Panamorph UH480, 148 in. 2.40:1 Dalite HD Pro 1.3, Klipsch THX Ultra II's x 7, Quad JTR Captivator S1 subs
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post #1363 of 1374 Old 04-27-2015, 04:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobZ View Post
I've been on a journey to replace my dual Ultras for longer than I've expected . Some have you have already helped lead me towards Jeff's subs and some of you have confused the hell out of me First I started off with the thought of opting for dual Submersives. Then it was made clear to me that dual S2's would cost a bit more but would provide more output. Now virtually everything I've read says the OS (even one) would probably outperform for movie use (theater is 100% movies, separate music system). One of the main reasons the Ultras did not really do it for me were tactile or visceral feel ad mid bass. I felt that to get enough I had to use Hsu MBM's nearfield. This resulted in a bit of localization when I had them running up to 120hz.

My room is a smallish 14x15x10 (2100 cubes) on slab but 40% of it is on a riser (not sand filled but OC filled, single row of seats). The room is sealed except there are two 4x6 windows that are covered with ATS Acoustics 2in panels. Two of the walls have 2 inch concrete block exterior (stucco home). There are really only two options for placement of an OS in this room. One would be at the left of the screen wall at the corner where the entry door is. Another would be behind the single row of seats anywhere along the rear of the room along the riser.

Do you see this as a better fit for an OS, dual S2's, or even a single S2? I'm also still confused about suspended flooring and not sure if the riser would allow me to benefit from the sub 20hz stuff.
How do these big boys connect to the sub out on the receiver...anything special? Asking because I'm running smurf tubing from equipment room to potential sub locations and I'm using 3/4 tubing. Now I'm wondering if that isn't big enough? Do you guys run anything other that RCA to these heavy hitters?

Thanks,
Chad
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post #1364 of 1374 Old 04-27-2015, 09:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cshuff View Post
How do these big boys connect to the sub out on the receiver...anything special? Asking because I'm running smurf tubing from equipment room to potential sub locations and I'm using 3/4 tubing. Now I'm wondering if that isn't big enough? Do you guys run anything other that RCA to these heavy hitters?

Thanks,
Chad
The OS has a Speakerpower SP1-4000 amp built into the sub with XLR connection. If using RCA cables just get an xlr to rca adapter.
http://www.speakerpower.net/

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post #1365 of 1374 Old 04-28-2015, 11:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobZ View Post
I've been on a journey to replace my dual Ultras for longer than I've expected . Some have you have already helped lead me towards Jeff's subs and some of you have confused the hell out of me First I started off with the thought of opting for dual Submersives. Then it was made clear to me that dual S2's would cost a bit more but would provide more output. Now virtually everything I've read says the OS (even one) would probably outperform for movie use (theater is 100% movies, separate music system). One of the main reasons the Ultras did not really do it for me were tactile or visceral feel ad mid bass. I felt that to get enough I had to use Hsu MBM's nearfield. This resulted in a bit of localization when I had them running up to 120hz.

My room is a smallish 14x15x10 (2100 cubes) on slab but 40% of it is on a riser (not sand filled but OC filled, single row of seats). The room is sealed except there are two 4x6 windows that are covered with ATS Acoustics 2in panels. Two of the walls have 2 inch concrete block exterior (stucco home). There are really only two options for placement of an OS in this room. One would be at the left of the screen wall at the corner where the entry door is. Another would be behind the single row of seats anywhere along the rear of the room along the riser.

Do you see this as a better fit for an OS, dual S2's, or even a single S2? I'm also still confused about suspended flooring and not sure if the riser would allow me to benefit from the sub 20hz stuff.

I don't know about the s2, but I can tell you that a single OS is more output that I'm able to handle in my 14x20x8 living room that is open to the kitchen/dining room. It can vibrate the hell out of my clothes from four feet away without any bad noises whatsoever.
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post #1366 of 1374 Old 04-30-2015, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cshuff View Post
How do these big boys connect to the sub out on the receiver...anything special? Asking because I'm running smurf tubing from equipment room to potential sub locations and I'm using 3/4 tubing. Now I'm wondering if that isn't big enough? Do you guys run anything other that RCA to these heavy hitters?

Thanks,
Chad
I have three runs of RCA and plan to use an adapter.

My Theater Room JVC RS4910, Panamorph UH480, 148 in. 2.40:1 Dalite HD Pro 1.3, Klipsch THX Ultra II's x 7, Quad JTR Captivator S1 subs
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post #1367 of 1374 Old 04-30-2015, 10:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobZ View Post
I've been on a journey to replace my dual Ultras for longer than I've expected . Some have you have already helped lead me towards Jeff's subs and some of you have confused the hell out of me First I started off with the thought of opting for dual Submersives. Then it was made clear to me that dual S2's would cost a bit more but would provide more output. Now virtually everything I've read says the OS (even one) would probably outperform for movie use (theater is 100% movies, separate music system). One of the main reasons the Ultras did not really do it for me were tactile or visceral feel ad mid bass. I felt that to get enough I had to use Hsu MBM's nearfield. This resulted in a bit of localization when I had them running up to 120hz.

My room is a smallish 14x15x10 (2100 cubes) on slab but 40% of it is on a riser (not sand filled but OC filled, single row of seats). The room is sealed except there are two 4x6 windows that are covered with ATS Acoustics 2in panels. Two of the walls have 2 inch concrete block exterior (stucco home). There are really only two options for placement of an OS in this room. One would be at the left of the screen wall at the corner where the entry door is. Another would be behind the single row of seats anywhere along the rear of the room along the riser.

Do you see this as a better fit for an OS, dual S2's, or even a single S2? I'm also still confused about suspended flooring and not sure if the riser would allow me to benefit from the sub 20hz stuff.
Do you have 23" of space between sofas and back wall? This would be good for the os lf....already would get the nearfield effect but even more warping of senses from being on a riser.

---------------------------------------------------------------
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post #1368 of 1374 Old 05-01-2015, 05:14 AM
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Quote:
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Do you have 23" of space between sofas and back wall? This would be good for the os lf....already would get the nearfield effect but even more warping of senses from being on a riser.
I had thought about it but I opted for four S1's after all

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post #1369 of 1374 Old 05-01-2015, 09:37 AM
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I had thought about it but I opted for four S1's after all
Good choice as well...plenty of placement options. Look forward to hearing your feedback.

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post #1370 of 1374 Unread Yesterday, 01:00 AM
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Anyone see any problems with orienting the sub so that the mouth is facing the floor? If not, about how much space would be recommended between floor and mouth?
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post #1371 of 1374 Unread Yesterday, 01:07 PM
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Anyone see any problems with orienting the sub so that the mouth is facing the floor? If not, about how much space would be recommended between floor and mouth?
I don't think Jeff would reccomend that. Hopefully he will chime in, but I recall getting the mouth close to facing a side wall and I think he said something like 24 inches away if facing the wall. That is not true if the surface is adjacent to the horn opening and in fact that essentially lengthens the horn path, but facing straight down is going to need some space.

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post #1372 of 1374 Unread Yesterday, 02:44 PM
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I don't think Jeff would reccomend that. Hopefully he will chime in, but I recall getting the mouth close to facing a side wall and I think he said something like 24 inches away if facing the wall. That is not true if the surface is adjacent to the horn opening and in fact that essentially lengthens the horn path, but facing straight down is going to need some space.
As a matter of neither restricting nor necessarily enhancing its response, my thinking is that if the mouth is facing the floor and unobstructed on all four sides, then the height would need to be 1/4 of the mouth's width. If it's obstructed on 1 (against wall) or 2 (in corner) sides, then a height of 1/3 and 1/2 the mouth's width respectively would be called for. My thinking here is with regard to equaling the horn mouth's area so as not to restrict flow. Firing at a right angle into the floor shouldn't be a big deal as the entire horn path is filled with right angles. Again, this is just me thinking, I may be totally wrong.

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post #1373 of 1374 Unread Yesterday, 10:41 PM
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Thanks guys. Having to raise it by even half the height of the mouth width would raise the enclose to pretty much its standing height. I'm just trying to find a nicer way of using it nearfield, aka behind the couch massager.
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post #1374 of 1374 Unread Today, 09:08 AM
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Thanks guys. Having to raise it by even half the height of the mouth width would raise the enclose to pretty much its standing height. I'm just trying to find a nicer way of using it nearfield, aka behind the couch massager.
ca you lay it on its side. I used to run my that way and it worked well. Only issue is you have all the connectors on the back and it may need to be covered if it doesnt fit the look you want?

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