SHOOTOUT! Epik Empire vs HSU VTF-15H vs CHT CS18.1 vs Rythmik FV15 vs eD A7s-450 - Page 40 - AVS Forum
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post #1171 of 1257 Old 09-13-2011, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matrixj3 View Post

Just wondering about the organ music disk that Dr. Hsu includes with every Hsu sub...what frequencies are those songs hitting?

The Saint Saenz track hits 16hz towards the end. It is very impressive on subs that can pull it off. It isn't just the 16hz that the sub has to handle, but also the proper harmonics that go along with the organ(and makes the organ an organ) at the same time.

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post #1172 of 1257 Old 09-17-2011, 12:00 PM
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Thanks.
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post #1173 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 04:14 PM
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I'm planning on buying a sub. I may end up writing electronic music again so I'd like to buy it primarily for that purpose, but I also want to use the sub for home theater use.

I'm thinking about the Rythmik F15HP with XLR inputs: http://rythmikaudio.com/F15HP.html Would this be the best for pro audio and music production, especially since it uses direct servo technology?

And I just saw these at NewEgg. I'm guessing they're probably not nearly as good, but they're very highly rated and are much much cheaper. Has anybody had experience with these? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16882269022

Any other thoughts would be much appreciated. Most likely I'll make my purchase at the beginning of October. Thanks!
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post #1174 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 05:29 PM
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you don't want those newegg 8" subs for electronic music. You are very likely going to be bumping their lower limits with anything below 35 or 40hz in real world playback.

"Without subs it's just background music - with subs it's the main event!"
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post #1175 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 05:57 PM
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So would the best sub be the Rythmik F15HP?

I got a PM with the opinion that it would be between that and the HSU. From what I understand the Rythmik is supposed to be better although more expensive.
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post #1176 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 06:02 PM
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The Energy subs will make a very effective paper weight/door stop at 7.6kg (similar weight to just the amp from the Rythmik), but will make a practically useless sub. The Rythmik would be an excellent choice for studio type use and will perform well for HT provided your room isn't too massive.
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post #1177 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 06:08 PM
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Yeah, I'm thinking the Rythmik it is. The room is kind of big, but I think it will be fine. I could buy another sub in the future too, although I don't want to spend that kind of money...and these things are large and heavy.
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post #1178 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 06:26 PM
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I was just notified by Rythmik that they expect stock by 2-2012 on the XLR amps. I'm not sure if "by" means they may get them sooner.

I may have to upgrade my monitors to the ADAM A8Xs instead...maybe I'll buy a sub later if the Rythmiks still look like the best then.
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post #1179 of 1257 Old 09-27-2011, 09:57 PM
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Perhaps you should consider an epik empire. Great sealed sound for music!

"Without subs it's just background music - with subs it's the main event!"
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post #1180 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 07:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

Perhaps you should consider an epik empire. Great sealed sound for music!

Unfortunately, Epik also has supply issues. I believe the Empires have been out-of-stock since August and don't expect to start shipping until mid-October.

http://www.epiksubwoofers.com/blog/?p=274

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post #1181 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 02:06 PM
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How does Epik compare to Rythmik? I like the idea of the direct-servo technology.
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post #1182 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 04:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David H. View Post

How does Epik compare to Rythmik? I like the idea of the direct-servo technology.

David I agree with what Archea and Avgass said. Don't even bother with that Energy sub. WTF is right most ID brands are having supply issues except maybe HSU I think. They're also a brand you should look at. I think you would be more than happy with a F15HP, HSU ULS15, or an Empire. If you don't want to wait though it would make the decision easier. I personally think that Rythmik sounds better then an Epik sub but that's strictly subjective so take it FWIW. Have fun in your search.
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post #1183 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 05:50 PM
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I think there are two frequency ranges that are taking effect here.

One range is shaking the couch and the other is the one you hear. Looks like the Epic is missing something or cancelling something or the others are producing distortions that your not supposed to hear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by below90hz View Post

Don't know why i missed this comment before, but I've noticed the same thing with the Empire. At around 2hrs 8minutes 50seconds into Transformers 2, some columns fall on a Decepticon. Four of the subs from the shootout (vented and sealed) shake the couch and I can "hear" bass and pictures rattling in sync with the couch shake. The Empire is the only one that I hear absolutely NOTHING at that moment but the couch shakes pretty good three times. It's actually a pretty neat effect. Perhaps it's the dual-opposed drivers...

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post #1184 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 10:33 PM
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I just purchased the Empire in this shootout from Madaeel. I will hopefully have it in my HT within a few days time. I am coming from a Hsu VTF-3 HO w/ turbo (used w/ out also). Prior to that I've owned an ED A5-350 (latest version), Hsu STF-3 & STF-2, BA VR500, and currently I have a Bic H-100 in my computer room. I'm really excited to hear this thing.

I want way more midbass impact and more musicality. If it's anything like the Hsu's, but with more midbass output I'll be very happy indeed.

The sub will be connected to an Emotiva UMC-1, along with two UPA-1 mono amps powering Pioneer Hpm-100 speakers.
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post #1185 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by WesM228 View Post

I just purchased the Empire in this shootout from Madaeel. I will hopefully have it in my HT within a few days time. I am coming from a Hsu VTF-3 HO w/ turbo (used w/ out also). Prior to that I've owned an ED A5-350 (latest version), Hsu STF-3 & STF-2, BA VR500, and currently I have a Bic H-100 in my computer room. I'm really excited to hear this thing.

I want way more midbass impact and more musicality. If it's anything like the Hsu's, but with more midbass output I'll be very happy indeed.

The sub will be connected to an Emotiva UMC-1, along with two UPA-1 mono amps powering Pioneer Hpm-100 speakers.

How do you think the ED A5-350 stacks up against the HSU VTF 15H. I'm looking for something for ht use and I guess output is my main priority.

I'd rather not go up to the $1000 mark for the HSU but if the extra $200 is worth it I would.
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post #1186 of 1257 Old 09-28-2011, 11:12 PM
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I have not heard the Hsu VTF-15 but I'm sure with all it's extra options and their focus on SQ you can have it sound a lot tighter than the ed ever did. The ed got very loud easily but it never impressed with explosions in movies. It would have crazy output and vibrate everything but the immediate slam/impact I wanted was not there. I'm sure there's a ton of factors that come into play here, room acoustics, etc. So everyone will have a different experience. This was mine. I actually thought the VTF-3 HO was an upgrade over the A5 subwoofer. It just had more impactful bass (in my room, my subjective opinion). But it also seemed to be able to be over driven more easily than the ed was. I noticed this more with the turbo in place. It seemed to allow the 'small' 12 inch woofer to extend further than it was capable of during loud passages occasionally making a strange noise.
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post #1187 of 1257 Old 09-29-2011, 04:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WesM228 View Post

I have not heard the Hsu VTF-15 but I'm sure with all it's extra options and their focus on SQ you can have it sound a lot tighter than the ed ever did. The ed got very loud easily but it never impressed with explosions in movies. It would have crazy output and vibrate everything but the immediate slam/impact I wanted was not there. I'm sure there's a ton of factors that come into play here, room acoustics, etc. So everyone will have a different experience. This was mine. I actually thought the VTF-3 HO was an upgrade over the A5 subwoofer. It just had more impactful bass (in my room, my subjective opinion). But it also seemed to be able to be over driven more easily than the ed was. I noticed this more with the turbo in place. It seemed to allow the 'small' 12 inch woofer to extend further than it was capable of during loud passages occasionally making a strange noise.

Hey by any chance are you in the Philly area? I would love to hear the empire in person!
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post #1188 of 1257 Old 09-29-2011, 11:46 AM
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Adam,

How do you think the ULS15 sounds compared to the Rythmik? Also, awhile ago I was looking at the Hsu VTF series, but I'm guessing the ULS is better for musical purposes?

Thanks,

David
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post #1189 of 1257 Old 09-29-2011, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by David H. View Post

Adam,

How do you think the ULS15 sounds compared to the Rythmik? Also, awhile ago I was looking at the Hsu VTF series, but I'm guessing the ULS is better for musical purposes?

Thanks,

David

I would imagine the ULS can compete SQ wise with the Rythmik no problem. The FV15 and VTF-15 sounded very good with music so I can only imagine their sealed brothern sound even better. If IIRC the HSU is a couple hundred more than the Rythmik so it would come down to cost, size, and features for me. If music is your main concern then yes I would stick with sealed.
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post #1190 of 1257 Old 10-01-2011, 08:49 PM
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I think I'll just have to wait on Rythmik to get their stock in. I've been reading comparisons between Rythmik and Hsu, and it seems like Rythmik has the edge...probably due to the direct servo technology.

I would like to have the sub now, but I could buy a pair of Adam A8Xs to work on music with.
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post #1191 of 1257 Old 10-02-2011, 03:56 PM - Thread Starter
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I think I'll just have to wait on Rythmik to get their stock in. I've been reading comparisons between Rythmik and Hsu, and it seems like Rythmik has the edge...probably due to the direct servo technology.

I would like to have the sub now, but I could buy a pair of Adam A8Xs to work on music with.

Right now HSU has the ULS 15 on sale for $1099 plus shipping. That's cheaper than the Rythmik and it's in stock. Just saying.
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post #1192 of 1257 Old 10-08-2011, 04:45 PM
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I bought the Epik Empire in this shootout from Adam (Madaeel) and I LOVE this subwoofer. In my opinion it's a HUGE improvement in sound quality over my previous subs (ED A5-350, Hsu VTF-3 HO, etc.). Music is incredible with every note being tight, clear and defined. I also was surprised with it's HT capability. I did have to tuck it a good ways in the corner for maximum impact as my living space is over 3k cubic feet total. However even with such placement it still retains it's excellent musicality and never sounds boomy. If you're coming from a large ported and used to ported subs the sound will be VERY different and may take some time getting used to. I was not impressed with its output early on but a week later and it's definitely not too shabby. And you can turn the gain up more than ported because there is little to no risk of over driving the woofers.

I love the midbass punch of this thing too. Even if some feel it's gimmicky or not truly audiophile (ie. neutral) because of the boost in it's upper range this is exactly what I had been looking for with every subwoofer I purchased prior, but never was satisfied with. It can really scare you with explosions and gunshots at moderate volume. I have jumped from loud sound effects with this sub and its awesome!

I'm very impressed with the build quality as well. The grills are thick mdf (painted black) with quality fabric and large metal grill pins. I definitely prefer the look with grills on.

My only small issue is that a large part of the plate amp stays warm even on standby which none of my other subs did or at least it was in just one small part of the plate. I'm not sure if this speaks to its efficiency or what.
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post #1193 of 1257 Old 10-31-2011, 06:21 AM
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+1 for vtf15h sounds amazing.

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post #1194 of 1257 Old 11-05-2011, 03:47 PM
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What is meant by "flexibility" in the sections of who this sub is for?

For example, you say the Hsu and Rythmik are "flexible" while the Epik isn't mentioned this way.

As you can tell, these are the three I'm trying to decide between!
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post #1195 of 1257 Old 11-05-2011, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfer View Post

What is meant by "flexibility" in the sections of who this sub is for?

For example, you say the Hsu and Rythmik are "flexible" while the Epik isn't mentioned this way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfer View Post



As you can tell, these are the three I'm trying to decide between!



Good question!

The HSU and Rythmik have multiple settings on the amp for different listening modes as well the ability to plug one or both ports (only the HSU does both ports tho). That's what we meant by "flexibility".

However, I should point out something we also mentioned about the Empire - it was flexible in a different sense: unlike the other two sealed subs, it
didn't suffer as badly from being placed in a non-optimal location (if it even suffered at all).

Hope that helps. Very glad to see people are still finding our thread useful.

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post #1196 of 1257 Old 11-05-2011, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by below90hz View Post



Good question!

The HSU and Rythmik have multiple settings on the amp for different listening modes as well the ability to plug one or both ports (only the HSU does both ports tho). That's what we meant by "flexibility".

However, I should point out something we also mentioned about the Empire - it was flexible in a different sense: unlike the other two sealed subs, it
didn’t suffer as badly from being placed in a non-optimal location (if it even suffered at all).

Hope that helps. Very glad to see people are still finding our thread useful.

Very much so!!!!! Really appreciate you two putting it together.

Thanks for the clarification as well!

Also, I think I have my sub picked. :-D
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post #1197 of 1257 Old 11-06-2011, 12:24 AM
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Very much so!!!!! Really appreciate you two putting it together.

Thanks for the clarification as well!

Also, I think I have my sub picked. :-D

If I may ask, what sub did you decide to go with?

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post #1198 of 1257 Old 11-06-2011, 08:27 AM
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If I may ask, what sub did you decide to go with?

I reserve the right to change my mind again but here is what I'm getting and why.

Hsu VTF 15H

1. As you can tell by reading my ignorant questions on AV forum, I'm a relative newb. I used to be into car stereo (love JL, Infinity & MB Q), but never HT (don't know jack except Bose sucks and B&W is high roller). I love the fact that the Hsu seems newb friendly in the $1000 range with high quality. The Rythmik (which was a close second for me) seemed more advanced in setting up with different settings for HT v music. I could see me forgetting this setting, putting in a movie and blowing it up, or my kid would flip it when I'm not looking. As described in the shootout, the Hsu is indestructable.
2. I'm more worried about sound quality than dB.
3. Really like the flexibility of one port plugged and two for more sealed sound. I like punk music and this should help with more sub control, but still let me open a port for the low end HT.
4. Disclamer on this one. This is just my gut feeling. I have no proof to back this up whatsoever, but the empires scared me b/c why are they the cheapest with the biggest amp and double drivers? Maybe its great but just counter intuitive to me.
5. Guilty pleasure here, but I love the way the Hsu looks overall (also love the Rythmik driver looked the most)
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post #1199 of 1257 Old 11-06-2011, 08:44 AM
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That's what this site is about, collecting info to narrow choices down to what suits your preferences/needs. No one should fault you for your choice (doesn't stop a few from trying). Sometimes a forum member or two feel others need to make the same choice doesn't they did which is absurd.
Give us some feedback once you set it up.
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post #1200 of 1257 Old 11-06-2011, 08:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfer View Post

I reserve the right to change my mind again but here is what I'm getting and why.

Hsu VTF 15H

1. As you can tell by reading my ignorant questions on AV forum, I'm a relative newb. I used to be into car stereo (love JL, Infinity & MB Q), but never HT (don't know jack except Bose sucks and B&W is high roller). I love the fact that the Hsu seems newb friendly in the $1000 range with high quality. The Rythmik (which was a close second for me) seemed more advanced in setting up with different settings for HT v music. I could see me forgetting this setting, putting in a movie and blowing it up, or my kid would flip it when I'm not looking. As described in the shootout, the Hsu is indestructable.
2. I'm more worried about sound quality than dB.
3. Really like the flexibility of one port plugged and two for more sealed sound. I like punk music and this should help with more sub control, but still let me open a port for the low end HT.
4. Disclamer on this one. This is just my gut feeling. I have no proof to back this up whatsoever, but the empires scared me b/c why are they the cheapest with the biggest amp and double drivers? Maybe its great but just counter intuitive to me.
5. Guilty pleasure here, but I love the way the Hsu looks overall (also love the Rythmik driver looked the most)

Sounds like you've made an excellent choice based on your needs and wants. Congrats if this ends up being the one.

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