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post #1 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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I was reading on the Audyssey site that the LPF setting for the LFE should be set to 120htz since this is not a crossover but a filter for 5.1 content. Can anyone verify this??? I have mine set to 80htz and I am guessing this is incorrect.

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post #2 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

I was reading on the Audyssey site that the LPF setting for the LFE should be set to 120htz since this is not a crossover but a filter for 5.1 content. Can anyone verify this??? I have mine set to 80htz and I am guessing this is incorrect.

That is correct though there is some disagreement on the matter. The LPF on the LFE channel applies only to the content in the LFE channel, so if you set that to 120Hz then all LFE content between 80 and 120Hz will essentially be lossed.
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post #3 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 06:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JN99 View Post

That is correct though there is some disagreement on the matter. The LPF on the LFE channel applies only to the content in the LFE channel, so if you set that to 120Hz then all LFE content between 80 and 120Hz will essentially be lossed.

So, Should I keep[ it at 80HTZ???? That is what it is set to now.

Thanks for the help!!

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post #4 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 07:05 PM
 
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yes,keep it at 80 hz,unless your sub has a switch for out or off.
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post #5 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by JN99 View Post

That is correct though there is some disagreement on the matter. The LPF on the LFE channel applies only to the content in the LFE channel, so if you set that to 120Hz then all LFE content between 80 and 120Hz will essentially be lossed.

Wrong. If the LPF is 120Hz, the sub will reproduce everything from the LFE below 120Hz. It is independent of the crossovers for the main channels. Nothing is lost.

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post #6 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

So, Should I keep[ it at 80HTZ???? That is what it is set to now.

No. Set the LPF for the LFE at 120Hz and the crossovers for the other channels as needed, typically (but not always) 80Hz.

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Originally Posted by DDigitalGuy05 View Post

yes,keep it at 80 hz,unless your sub has a switch for out or off.

Well, that depends on the sub. OTOH, most modern subs can bypass their built-in crossovers or, at the least, turn them up to 150Hz or more.

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post #7 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

I was reading on the Audyssey site that the LPF setting for the LFE should be set to 120htz since this is not a crossover but a filter for 5.1 content. Can anyone verify this??? I have mine set to 80htz and I am guessing this is incorrect.

The LPF of LFE is not "a filter for 5.1 content." It is a Low Pass Filter, (it allows the lows to pass through it, and it filters out the highs.) It affects *only* the .1 channel, which is the LFE channel. It has no affect on the bass that is re-directed from the mains to the subwoofer output.

The .1 LFE channel should not have anything in it above about 80 Hz, so setting the filter at 80 Hz is mostly not an issue. However, some recording engineers do place some content in the LFE channel above 80 Hz, and if you have the LPF of LFE set to 80 Hz, you will lose that content. If you are afraid you might be losing some content, set it to 120 Hz.

Or, try it both ways. It doesn't cost anything, and you can always reset it to the setting you prefer.

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post #8 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 07:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by craig john View Post

The LPF of LFE is not "a filter for 5.1 content." It is a Low Pass Filter, (it allows the lows to pass through it, and it filters out the highs.) It affects *only* the .1 channel, which is the LFE channel. It has no affect on the bass that is re-directed from the mains to the subwoofer output.

The .1 LFE channel should not have anything in it above about 80 Hz, so setting the filter at 80 Hz is mostly not an issue. However, some recording engineers do place some content in the LFE channel above 80 Hz, and if you have the LPF of LFE set to 80 Hz, you will lose that content. If you are afraid you might be losing some content, set it to 120 Hz.

Or, try it both ways. It doesn't cost anything, and you can always reset it to the setting you prefer.

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That was a great post! So by setting it to 120htz will only let more content be heard....nothing will be lost?

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post #9 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 07:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

No. Set the LPF for the LFE at 120Hz and the crossovers for the other channels as needed, typically (but not always) 80Hz.

Well, that depends on the sub. OTOH, most modern subs can bypass their built-in crossovers or, at the least, turn them up to 150Hz or more.

mine only goes up to 150htz....but I am getting a much better sub in a week our so lol!

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post #10 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 08:47 PM
 
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thanks for the heads up
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post #11 of 47 Old 02-23-2011, 08:54 PM
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Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

That was a great post! So by setting it to 120htz will only let more content be heard....nothing will be lost?

Nothing will be lost, but you'll have to decide if the content from 80 to 120 Hz is worth retaining. If it causes your sub to become directional, (IOW, you start to hear sounds coming directly from the sub), then the LPF of LFE may be set too high. That's why I said try it both ways and see what you like. I have mine set to 80 Hz, and I don't feel like I'm missing anything. I've also had it to 120 Hz, and didn't feel like I gained anything. There is so little intended content in the LFE channel from 80 to 120 Hz that it's really not that important.

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post #12 of 47 Old 04-02-2011, 06:53 PM
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What if you have dual subs ? Can you set one too 80hz on the sub and the other use the LPF setting on the receiver .... @ 120 hz ?
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post #13 of 47 Old 04-03-2011, 06:35 AM
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Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post

What if you have dual subs ? Can you set one too 80hz on the sub and the other use the LPF setting on the receiver .... @ 120 hz ?

This is not recommended. You have an advantage by using two subs. You should be able to use 120hz for your LPF of LFE setting without subwoofer localization issues. Single sub users run the most risk of sub localization problems setting the LPF of LFE at 120hz.
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post #14 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 06:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

This is not recommended. You have an advantage by using two subs. You should be able to use 120hz for your LPF of LFE setting without subwoofer localization issues. Single sub users run the most risk of sub localization problems setting the LPF of LFE at 120hz.

what do you suggest setting the LPF or LFE to?

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post #15 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 03:54 PM
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Ok tried them all ...Think 90 Hz's some times 100 for music is best for me....I have a Velodyne Optimum 12 and Klipsch RW-10d.. 2500 cubic feet... Is perfect..now for the Hz for the rest of the system
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post #16 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

what do you suggest setting the LPF or LFE to?

Set the LPF of LFE to 120hz.
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post #17 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

No. Set the LPF for the LFE at 120Hz and the crossovers for the other channels as needed, typically (but not always) 80Hz.

I am curious, what receivers or processors have a separate setting for the LFE/LPF and bass LPF/HPF? Just to be clear, I hope some of the posters here are not confusing this with the LPF setting on the sub. From what I have learned in the past, the LPF on the sub should always be turned off or as high as possible if using LP from the processor. Setting two crossover slopes close to each other can cause unwanted effects.
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post #18 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 07:43 PM
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120 hz is too high sounds very boomy.... Don't listen to anyone on this ...listen to your ears. 90hz is Great for me.... Any one that says 120hz.. Ask them what system they have first
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post #19 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post

120 hz is too high sounds very boomy.... Don't listen to anyone on this ...listen to your ears. 90hz is Great for me.... Any one that says 120hz.. Ask them what system they have first

I don't have a receiver where I can adjust LPF. But I would think that there's little content above 80 hz. So I am not sure why it would sound boomy to set it at 120hz.

Why would I want to lose part of the LFE channel by setting it lower than 120? Makes no sense to me.

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post #20 of 47 Old 04-04-2011, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post

120 hz is too high sounds very boomy.... Don't listen to anyone on this ...listen to your ears. 90hz is Great for me.... Any one that says 120hz.. Ask them what system they have first

Much of that boomy sound comes from using an 80hz crossover for all speakers. I have speakers that can play lower than 80hz. Just because subwoofers do a good job of producing bass doesn't mean that you have to send everything below 80hz to the subs. I don't use 80hz crossovers in my system because my speakers can play down below 80hz and I have the dedicated amplifier power to do it. Using an 80hz crossover in my system makes it sound to boomy. I do use an 120hz LPF of LFE setting.
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Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post
120 hz is too high sounds very boomy.... Don't listen to anyone on this ...listen to your ears. 90hz is Great for me.... Any one that says 120hz.. Ask them what system they have first
Accepting your experience is untainted by expectations, etc., what makes you think that what happens in your room (which hugely controls bass response) with your subwoofer is automatically what other people, with different rooms and different subwoofers, will experience. Chiming in with your experience can potentially be valuable. Assertin everybody must see it your way is not especially helpful.

I don't have any "Boom" problems with my LPF at 120. I'd rather not cut off part of the content the movie's director, sound mixers and sound effects creators put in on purpose unless there's an overwhelming reason to do so.
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post #22 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 11:08 AM
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Ok what kind of speakers do you own...... @ 120hz when I'm watch TV every sound and speaking of bass comes though the sub and is not pleasant .... It's all about your Speakers, Setup and your ears.. 90 hz's is perfect ...trust me did it a 100 plus times listening to the same things over and over sounds better like this..have my Fronts RF-82 II crossover at 90 hz ...RC-64 crossed at 120 hz RS-62 II @ 100 hz .....definitive pro 800's @ 120 hz...... Sounds Amazing..... Even I called Velodyne to ask them and they said for there Sub 120 hz was too high...but who are they .... They only make Subs.....lol
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post #23 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 11:39 AM
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120 hz is too high sounds very boomy.... Don't listen to anyone on this ...listen to your ears. 90hz is Great for me.... Any one that says 120hz.. Ask them what system they have first

Not that it matters at all...... I set my LFE LP to 120Hz

You want to compare what each of us owns?

btw, I do think you are talking about something different. Main speaker XO is different then the LFE Low pass setting. You are simply removing LFE content when you choose any setting other then 120Hz. I choose to try and have ALL content.

Now, I will say that some subs just can not play very well above 120Hz so it depends on the quality of components. Maybe your sub just is not good enough to play above 90Hz ??

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post #24 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by RDKing2 View Post

I am curious, what receivers or processors have a separate setting for the LFE/LPF and bass LPF/HPF? Just to be clear, I hope some of the posters here are not confusing this with the LPF setting on the sub. From what I have learned in the past, the LPF on the sub should always be turned off or as high as possible if using LP from the processor. Setting two crossover slopes close to each other can cause unwanted effects.

I think all mid to high end AVRs and Pre/pros will have separate settings for each.

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post #25 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 01:32 PM
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That shows what you know never heard of Velodyne......lol lol Optimum 12. 1200 watts RMS 2400 peak...lol yeah it can't handle it...lol. You guys make me laugh just trying to help the guy out with settings...It shouldn't be 120 hz.... My speakers handle all hz.... Nothing is lost anywhere .... I have a high end Onkyo...that send the sound to different speakers..
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post #26 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post

That shows what you know never heard of Velodyne......lol lol Optimum 12. 1200 watts RMS 2400 peak...lol yeah it can't handle it...lol. You guys make me laugh just trying to help the guy out with settings...It shouldn't be 120 hz.... My speakers handle all hz.... Nothing is lost anywhere .... I have a high end Onkyo...that send the sound to different speakers..

I don't think you fully understand the LPF of LFE. The LFE channel can contain information up to 120hz. If you set your LPF of LFE lower than 120hz. You are throwing that information away. This setting does not apply to music. It applies to sources with .1 encoded information.
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post #27 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post

Ok what kind of speakers do you own...... @ 120hz when I'm watch TV every sound and speaking of bass comes though the sub and is not pleasant .... It's all about your Speakers, Setup and your ears.. 90 hz's is perfect ...trust me did it a 100 plus times listening to the same things over and over sounds better like this..have my Fronts RF-82 II crossover at 90 hz ...RC-64 crossed at 120 hz RS-62 II @ 100 hz .....definitive pro 800's @ 120 hz...... Sounds Amazing..... Even I called Velodyne to ask them and they said for there Sub 120 hz was too high...but who are they .... They only make Subs.....lol

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That shows what you know never heard of Velodyne......lol lol Optimum 12. 1200 watts RMS 2400 peak...lol yeah it can't handle it...lol. You guys make me laugh just trying to help the guy out with settings...It shouldn't be 120 hz.... My speakers handle all hz.... Nothing is lost anywhere .... I have a high end Onkyo...that send the sound to different speakers..

I think you're confused. You're either referring to the "crossover frequency" in the receiver's Bass Management, or you're referring to the LPF on the sub? Either way, neither of those is what this thread is about. It's about the LPF of LFE built into modern receivers and pre/pros. If you have an older receiver, you may not have an LPF of LFE in your receiver.

The LPF of LFE only became a feature when the lossless codec's were introduced. Prior to their introduction, the LFE channel was brick-wall filtered at 120 Hz in the recording process. Therefore, it contained nothing above 120 Hz, and no filter was needed. Because the lossless codec's allowed the LFE channel to contain full range content, a filter was added on the playback end to cut it off at an appropriate frequency. Since content above about 80 Hz can start to cause subwoofer lacalizability, a setting of the filter above 80 to 120 Hz is not advised.

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post #28 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 03:32 PM
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That is what I have been saying.....thx
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post #29 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 04:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomeTheater1010 View Post

Ok what kind of speakers do you own...... @ 120hz when I'm watch TV every sound and speaking of bass comes though the sub and is not pleasant .... It's all about your Speakers, Setup and your ears.. 90 hz's is perfect ...trust me did it a 100 plus times listening to the same things over and over sounds better like this..have my Fronts RF-82 II crossover at 90 hz ...RC-64 crossed at 120 hz RS-62 II @ 100 hz .....definitive pro 800's @ 120 hz...... Sounds Amazing..... Even I called Velodyne to ask them and they said for there Sub 120 hz was too high...but who are they .... They only make Subs.....lol

If your sub doesn't sound good, maybe it isn't set up correctly. But as indicated above, we're not talking about the crossover setting in the receiver or the low pass filter setting on the back of a sub. We're talking about a setting that ONLY affects the LFE (0.1) channel, contained on multichannel movies.
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post #30 of 47 Old 04-05-2011, 04:49 PM
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LFE is set to 80 or 90 hz.......that's it ! I really don't care anymore mine sounds Perfect ..... Take care all !
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