The New Master List of BASS in Movies with Frequency Charts - Page 511 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews

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post #15301 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 12:14 PM
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Please give me one scenario where it would not improve overall response

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So what you're saying is 8 subs in a room will always sound better than 4? Because....

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post #15302 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 12:20 PM
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Are we talking 8 vs 4 here!? Four should be enough for most rooms.

Define better. Will 8x18" sealed subs sound better in a room than four? There are enough members here Who will say unequivocally yes. The graphs prove it too.
If you have never had or heard multiple subs then you cannot really participate in this conversation.
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post #15303 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 12:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Come on, who was a going to go dual sub without at least some sort of correction software? I am assuming that the person who installs dual subs has at least an inkling. If not, of course there is probably no noticeable improvement.

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Ok so I have you one scenario you asked for and you can't accept it. What was the point of this exercise
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post #15304 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Come on, who was a going to go dual sub without at least some sort of correction software? I am assuming that the person who installs dual subs has at least an inkling. If not, of course there is probably no noticeable improvement.

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Ok so I have you one scenario you asked for and you can't accept it. What was the point of this exercise
I accept it Brian, but adding additional subs when you do not take the time to place one or the both properly is an expensive band aid which may or may not work.
I improperly assumed proper placement. My bad.

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post #15305 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 12:29 PM
 
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You'd be surprised lol
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post #15306 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kemiza View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

I am 100% sure that two or more subs will always sound better than one.
100 percent? I'll take that bet.

Please give me one scenario where it would not improve overall response

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Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

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Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

If they are setup improperly and phase cancels each other out. For one.
Come on, who was a going to go dual sub without at least some sort of correction software? I am assuming that the person who installs dual subs has at least an inkling. If not, of course there is probably no noticeable improvement.

It could be said that multiple subwoofers often improve the sound and response in room, and I would even go so far as to say "multiple subwoofers *can* be set up in rooms to perform better than a single." This is most certainly not an automatic conclusion.

Correction software cannot move subwoofers from less than ideal or non-complimentary locations. The qualification required is that measurements are taken in room. Without measurements, you're guessing and assuming. A great example is comparing 1 subwoofer in a front corner vs. two along the front wall, be it the corners or flanking the center or display. In most laterally symmetric rooms, the differences are rather small and at best make things symmetric left-to-right across a couch. While some get lucky, in most closed rooms the interaction with the length of the room is the trickiest to contend with and makes for the strongest variation in the response. Even going from 1 to 4 subwoofers has no change on this issue if they are all placed across the front of the room.

Talking with many enthusiasts and customers confirms this is not a widely understood reality, so be mindful of blanket statements about what is "always" better or worse. About the only real absolute in audio is that there are always exceptions. wink.gif

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post #15307 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 01:04 PM
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Enjoyed watching HomeFront and Out Of The Furnace last night. Entertaining movie with some awesome mid bass.

Also a note for those that are interested, Dredd 3D Blu-ray is on sale at Best Buy for $6.99
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post #15308 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by JChin View Post

Enjoyed watched HomeFront and Out Of The Furnace last night. Entertaining movie with some awesome mid bass.

Also a note for those that are interested, Dredd 3D Blu-ray is on sale at Best Buy for $6.99


Out of the furnace was a good movie.
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post #15309 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kemiza View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

I am 100% sure that two or more subs will always sound better than one.
100 percent? I'll take that bet.

Please give me one scenario where it would not improve overall response

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Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

If they are setup improperly and phase cancels each other out. For one.
Come on, who was a going to go dual sub without at least some sort of correction software? I am assuming that the person who installs dual subs has at least an inkling. If not, of course there is probably no noticeable improvement.

It could be said that multiple subwoofers often improve the sound and response in room, and I would even go so far as to say "multiple subwoofers *can* be set up in rooms to perform better than a single." This is most certainly not an automatic conclusion.

Correction software cannot move subwoofers from less than ideal or non-complimentary locations. The qualification required is that measurements are taken in room. Without measurements, you're guessing and assuming. A great example is comparing 1 subwoofer in a front corner vs. two along the front wall, be it the corners or flanking the center or display. In most laterally symmetric rooms, the differences are rather small and at best make things symmetric left-to-right across a couch. While some get lucky, in most closed rooms the interaction with the length of the room is the trickiest to contend with and makes for the strongest variation in the response. Even going from 1 to 4 subwoofers has no change on this issue if they are all placed across the front of the room.

Talking with many enthusiasts and customers confirms this is not a widely understood reality, so be mindful of blanket statements about what is "always" better or worse. About the only real absolute in audio is that there are always exceptions. wink.gif

Understood. Let us say, it is hard to believe that two or more properly placed subs would not outperform a Single properly or improperly placed sub.
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post #15310 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Are we talking 8 vs 4 here!? Four should be enough for most rooms.

Define better. Will 8x18" sealed subs sound better in a room than four? There are enough members here Who will say unequivocally yes. The graphs prove it too.
If you have never had or heard multiple subs then you cannot really participate in this conversation.
Who said I never had or heard a setup with multiple subs? I think you misunderstood how this conversation started.

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post #15311 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McStyvie View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

It could be said that multiple subwoofers often improve the sound and response in room, and I would even go so far as to say "multiple subwoofers *can* be set up in rooms to perform better than a single." This is most certainly not an automatic conclusion.

Correction software cannot move subwoofers from less than ideal or non-complimentary locations. The qualification required is that measurements are taken in room. Without measurements, you're guessing and assuming. A great example is comparing 1 subwoofer in a front corner vs. two along the front wall, be it the corners or flanking the center or display. In most laterally symmetric rooms, the differences are rather small and at best make things symmetric left-to-right across a couch. While some get lucky, in most closed rooms the interaction with the length of the room is the trickiest to contend with and makes for the strongest variation in the response. Even going from 1 to 4 subwoofers has no change on this issue if they are all placed across the front of the room.

Talking with many enthusiasts and customers confirms this is not a widely understood reality, so be mindful of blanket statements about what is "always" better or worse. About the only real absolute in audio is that there are always exceptions. wink.gif

Understood. Let us say, it is hard to believe that two or more properly placed subs would not outperform a Single properly or improperly placed sub.

Sure, but readers should understand that the "properly placed" qualifier requires actual measurements rather than the blind trust in an automagic EQ system.
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post #15312 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 05:43 PM
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post #15313 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 06:51 PM
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I didn't say nobody's system sounds good with multiple subs. There is a such thing called overkill. When the bass overpowers the mains it doesn't sound good.

That's why you calibrate. A calibrated system with multiple subs will not overpower the mains.

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post #15314 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 07:02 PM
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That's why you calibrate. A calibrated system with multiple subs will not overpower the mains.

Exactly...
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post #15315 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 07:21 PM
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Ok, help me out with some Blu Rays/scenes to test out my new sub.  I have an XS30 arriving this week, and specifically want to demo some material with plenty of 10-20 Hz stuff in it.  My old sub played fairly strong down to 16 Hz, so scenes that play lower than this are what I am looking for.  I currently have WotW for the pod scene, Cloverfield, all of the LotR movies.  I plan on grabbing OHF for the monument scene.  The Incredible Hulk has been mentioned so might grab that one too.

 

I know there is a huge list of four and five star just hoping for some specific suggestions for scenes that play especially low.

 

Thanks.

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post #15316 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 07:40 PM
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Pulse - server scene near the end, 20hz pulsating.

World War Z- grenade scene about halfway into the movie.


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post #15317 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 07:44 PM
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Pulse - server scene near the end, 20hz pulsating.

World War Z- grenade scene about halfway into the movie.

OOh I have WWZ..how low does that scene go?

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post #15318 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 07:46 PM
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OOh I have WWZ..how low does that scene go?

 

Its a sweep starting at 40hz then drops to 10hz.

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1333462/the-new-master-list-of-bass-in-movies-with-frequency-charts/10000_100#post_23695220


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post #15319 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 07:48 PM
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OOh that sounds perfect...thanks!!  I am not sure quite how low I will go, will probly do some REW sweeps to mess with phase before I use it, so I should be able to tell how low it goes.  Also going to experiment with closing my two sets of french doors to see if that changes anything.

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post #15320 of 26733 Old 03-09-2014, 08:39 PM
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Found this in the mail yesterday.



Lots of honest < 10Hz content in the USA Cut, and greater level, though 3dB less average dynamics. smile.gif

Don't let anybody tell you that the kung fu in this one is good. That sauce is pretty weak overall compared to your traditional KFC movies. Lots of high Chi melodrama.
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post #15321 of 26733 Old 03-10-2014, 01:15 AM
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Found this in the mail yesterday.



Lots of honest < 10Hz content in the USA Cut, and greater level, though 3dB less average dynamics. smile.gif

Don't let anybody tell you that the kung fu in this one is good. That sauce is pretty weak overall compared to your traditional KFC movies. Lots of high Chi melodrama.

Wow.. Well, no wonder! I just finished watching this a few hours ago. This movie has lots of scene that dig low. And at times my amps clipping lights was coming on. lol..
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post #15322 of 26733 Old 03-10-2014, 01:53 AM
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The "Grandmaster" was good stuff! I loved the way they filmed the fight scenes and the audio was top notch!

@ nube did you measure both the DTS MA & or the DD 5.1 tracks?
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Quote:
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That's why you calibrate. A calibrated system with multiple subs will not overpower the mains.
You missed the point sir.

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post #15324 of 26733 Old 03-10-2014, 08:12 AM
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You missed the point sir.

Would you be so kind to start a new thread so we can keep this on track? Thx
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For elf yes. But for bass presentation I enjoyed it for HG:CF

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I thought it was decent. However, my sub is right next to my couch so I am sure that helped. Running it Only 2.5 db hot.

Yes I enjoyed the movie and bass presentation, just was expecting more.....especially elf.

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Would you be so kind to start a new thread so we can keep this on track? Thx
Sure. Got any personal favorites I should demo? Thx.

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Any charts for Gravity or did I overlook them?
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Watched Thor tonight. I thought it was a fun, enjoyable movie mostly but would have liked it so much more if the bass had been done better. In some parts of the movie the slam/impact was almost there but in other parts the movie fell well short of matching what was going on screen. Disappointing in that regard I have to say. I did have preconceived ideas as I'd read reviews earlier on in this thread but the whole audio didn't seem harmonious or immersive. Is the Dark World better?
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post #15330 of 26733 Old 03-11-2014, 04:27 PM
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Watched Thor tonight. I thought it was a fun, enjoyable movie mostly but would have liked it so much more if the bass had been done better. In some parts of the movie the slam/impact was almost there but in other parts the movie fell well short of matching what was going on screen. Disappointing in that regard I have to say. I did have preconceived ideas as I'd read reviews earlier on in this thread but the whole audio didn't seem harmonious or immersive. Is the Dark World better?

Yes it is
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