The New Master List of BASS in Movies with Frequency Charts - Page 574 - AVS Forum
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post #17191 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 01:13 PM
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post

It's the Speaker Power sp1-4000. Which JTR uses on the S2 and OS. I got 4 of em.

How many circuits are you running them on? dedicated for each?
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post #17192 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 01:17 PM
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How many circuits are you running them on? dedicated for each?

Yes each.. Except for 1 which shares it with a AVR atm.
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post #17193 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 01:23 PM
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Are you running hot? How big is your room again?
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post #17194 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by nube View Post

It's the duration that's popping your breakers. You have four amps each trying to pull more current than your breakers can do, and for almost a full minute. As mentioned before, you really need 30A runs to have those S2 live up to their potential on scenes that demand it.

I REALLY thought 20amps would've been enough 2 years ago. But, I never anticipated ever running that much power. Or that much subs. Or that size drivers. I actually thought I was going to run up to 4 Def Tech SC reference. Which I still have my dual SC Refs in my storage room collecting dust. Damn, I hate poor planning. Now more money to be spent. Oh well live and learn. Anyway Thanks guys for your help..
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post #17195 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post

I REALLY thought 20amps would've been enough 2 years ago. But, I never anticipated ever running that much power. Or that much subs. Or that size drivers. I actually thought I was going to run up to 4 Def Tech SC reference. Which I still have my dual SC Refs in my storage room collecting dust. Damn, I hate poor planning. Now more money to be spent. Oh well live and learn. Anyway Thanks guys for your help..

It's a few dollars and a few mins to swap breakers... unless you're redoing the wiring too.. then yeah, spending more.
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post #17196 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 05:04 PM
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Don't run a 30 amp breaker on 12 gauge wire. It's a fire waiting to happen. 80% of house fires are electrical related and insurance inspectors are trained to look for things like that. You'd hate to have your claim denied...

Hear me now, Listen to me later....
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post #17197 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 05:08 PM
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The server scene in the movie Pulse.

Haha !! biggrin.gif
I'm telling you that is one bad a** scene and one of my favorites for demo !!

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post #17198 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Grooms View Post

Don't run a 30 amp breaker on 12 gauge wire. It's a fire waiting to happen. 80% of house fires are electrical related and insurance inspectors are trained to look for things like that. You'd hate to have your claim denied...
This, you will overload the wire. Not worth the risk to yourself or family.

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post #17199 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 06:59 PM
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Rofl, it's not code, but that's a bit too much doom and gloom going around here. It's not like hes going to be pulling constant current through the thing.
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post #17200 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by nube View Post

Most such requests are already fulfilled at Data-Bass, if people would just check. smile.gif Here's yours:

http://data-bass.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/213-lone-survivor-execution-and-recommendation-poll/

Well after viewing the graphs I don't get the 6hz stuff as I drop right at 8hz. I did get 110db down to 8hz on a sweep once but that was intense and I didn't go any higher. But just like the Irene scene I don't get the 6hz action. I don't expect to either. I get pretty good performance from two SubM's...
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post #17201 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

Rofl, it's not code, but that's a bit too much doom and gloom going around here. It's not like hes going to be pulling constant current through the thing.

Yea it's not like they are Bitcoin miners!
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post #17202 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 08:12 PM
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Are you running hot? How big is your room again?

I'm not running my subs hot no more since I put a house curve through the antimode 2.0. But, the second time around I popped the breaker, I disabled the house curve. It did play longer. Then it popped again. My room is 3300 sq ft. I left a message with my electrician. But he's on vacation right now. So guess I'll have to chill out for now with that scene. Or don't go pass -15.. Lol
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post #17203 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 09:54 PM
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if you're popping 20a breakers at -15, something seems wrong... like multiple amps on a circuit wrong...
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post #17204 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 10:09 PM
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Maybe and maybe not. 20A breakers aren't all equal, and I think it's reasonable to assume that, with a house curve on those S2s, you're asking for a sustained 2400W+ per breaker at -15MV. They could conceivably blow at that level over this scene's duration due to heat buildup, as they're meant to. Upgrading to 10awg wire and 30A breakers sounds like it'll mostly handle the scene.

Back to bass content, more people need to check out Trollhunter. It's a fun movie, if you can handle subtitles, and doesn't get the credit it deserves. smile.gif
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post #17205 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by nube View Post

Maybe and maybe not. 20A breakers aren't all equal, and I think it's reasonable to assume that, with a house curve on those S2s, you're asking for a sustained 2400W+ per breaker at -15MV. They could conceivably blow at that level over this scene's duration due to heat buildup, as they're meant to. Upgrading to 10awg wire and 30A breakers sounds like it'll mostly handle the scene.

Back to bass content, more people need to check out Trollhunter. It's a fun movie, if you can handle subtitles, and doesn't get the credit it deserves. smile.gif

I've been meaning to watch this for a long time but still haven't gotten to it =[
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post #17206 of 18598 Old 06-10-2014, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by notnyt View Post

if you're popping 20a breakers at -15, something seems wrong... like multiple amps on a circuit wrong...

Yea.. It's beginning to bug me. But I'll check everything tomorrow. Hookups, AVR and EQ settings tomorrow since I'm off of work.
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post #17207 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 03:10 AM
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Rofl, it's not code, but that's a bit too much doom and gloom going around here. It's not like hes going to be pulling constant current through the thing.

It is not doom and gloom, it is basic common sense. What is more expensive? A few hundred or so to have an electrician do it right? Or the potentially many thousands of dollars in fire claim that is denied because he didn't fork out the dough to do it properly.

Why risk it?

and thanks for the reminder on Troll Hunter. Got it on the list.
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post #17208 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 04:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nube View Post

Maybe and maybe not. 20A breakers aren't all equal, and I think it's reasonable to assume that, with a house curve on those S2s, you're asking for a sustained 2400W+ per breaker at -15MV. They could conceivably blow at that level over this scene's duration due to heat buildup, as they're meant to. Upgrading to 10awg wire and 30A breakers sounds like it'll mostly handle the scene.

Back to bass content, more people need to check out Trollhunter. It's a fun movie, if you can handle subtitles, and doesn't get the credit it deserves. smile.gif

Trollhunter is a great bass film as I remember. Have not watched it since it first came out on blu years ago.

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post #17209 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 05:21 AM
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post

I REALLY thought 20amps would've been enough 2 years ago. But, I never anticipated ever running that much power. Or that much subs. Or that size drivers. I actually thought I was going to run up to 4 Def Tech SC reference. Which I still have my dual SC Refs in my storage room collecting dust. Damn, I hate poor planning. Now more money to be spent. Oh well live and learn. Anyway Thanks guys for your help..
I am running the same amps on my Triax's and I have one of them on an overloaded circuit and the other on it own and all on 15amp breakers and neither have ever popped a breaker? Running them 6db hot through the AVR. I just ran 3 new circuits in my theater build last week, everything has its own 20 amp circuit with 12/2 wire. I did put a 30amp with 10/2 wire in for the new AC unit., maybe I should have done the whole thing 30 amp? I still have 150' of 10/2 wire, maybe I should run the subs on a 30amp and leave the 20 amp for the equipment rack.
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post #17210 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 05:37 AM
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When you run a house curve remember that the lower it goes the more power it demands so you have to have plenty of headroom down low. I turned my gain down 2 dBs and it was fine. Your load is 4 ohms with 2 drivers where mine is 8 ohms with 8 drivers on a 20 amp circuit. So my circuit sees less power needed with more sensitivity and 8 ohms.
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post #17211 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 09:35 PM
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if you're popping 20a breakers at -15, something seems wrong... like multiple amps on a circuit wrong...
So I found out what's wrong.. Lol.. So late morning I wanted to try the scene again. But this time I ran a extension cord on of the S2 that was sharing with my avr to the next room over. Which have 1 20 amp circuit. I figured maybe that would be the problem. So I played the LS heli scene again. This time it played the whole scene at -12 without popping. Was really excited about it. So I replayed it again. At the drop scene, not even 5 sec still at -12.. Pop! Wtf!! So ok.. Something's not right. And I'm also thinking, the bass is so intense that I'm looking at my drivers and looks like it's just going break and fly out of the cab. Kind of scary. Then I remember, about the clip lights on the plate amp. So I play the scene again only at -15. And the clip lights is coming on during that scene. I immediately pause it. Check my sub levels in the avr and still at -8. So I know I'm not hot. Then, I go grabu remote for the anti mode dual core. And check the volume. Guess what it was cranked up to +10! eek! Then I remember listening to two channel a few weeks ago. And when I listen to music I like to crank up the bass. Guess I forgot to turn it back down lol. So anyway I played the scene again still without the HC. Ang got all the way to -7.. Hehe. No popping. But didn't want to go more because now I'm to chicken sh!t! Plus, my speakers can't keep up at that level it's sounds awful distortion. Anyway, live and learn lol. I feel like a idiot.. But still that is one badass scene. Now I'm happy again

Last edited by rhed; 06-11-2014 at 09:38 PM.
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post #17212 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 09:58 PM
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This scene isn't that hot, and is only at a few frequencies (not full-bandwidth), so it's not actually asking your equipment to pump out that much unless you're running ridiculously hot.

Point is, you still need to replace the breakers and wiring with more durable stuff, because no matter what, you don't want any scene to be tripping the breakers - and your amps will ask for more than your current wiring/breakers can handle if the scene demands it. I'd imagine you're close when not running hot on the Washington Monument scene from OHF as well, cuz it's much hotter and fuller bandwidth, albeit for less duration.
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post #17213 of 18598 Old 06-11-2014, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post
So I found out what's wrong.. Lol.. So late morning I wanted to try the scene again. But this time I ran a extension cord on of the S2 that was sharing with my avr to the next room over. Which have 1 20 amp circuit. I figured maybe that would be the problem. So I played the LS heli scene again. This time it played the whole scene at -12 without popping. Was really excited about it. So I replayed it again. At the drop scene, not even 5 sec still at -12.. Pop! Wtf!! So ok.. Something's not right. And I'm also thinking, the bass is so intense that I'm looking at my drivers and looks like it's just going break and fly out of the cab. Kind of scary. Then I remember, about the clip lights on the plate amp. So I play the scene again only at -15. And the clip lights is coming on during that scene. I immediately pause it. Check my sub levels in the avr and still at -8. So I know I'm not hot. Then, I go grabu remote for the anti mode dual core. And check the volume. Guess what it was cranked up to +10! eek! Then I remember listening to two channel a few weeks ago. And when I listen to music I like to crank up the bass. Guess I forgot to turn it back down lol. So anyway I played the scene again still without the HC. Ang got all the way to -7.. Hehe. No popping. But didn't want to go more because now I'm to chicken sh!t! Plus, my speakers can't keep up at that level it's sounds awful distortion. Anyway, live and learn lol. I feel like a idiot.. But still that is one badass scene. Now I'm happy again
I think we have all done it at some point. Just get used to double checking subs trim all the time.
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post #17214 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 12:30 AM
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I think we have all done it at some point. Just get used to double checking subs trim all the time.
Think I'm getting to the point where it's not even worth it no more for me chasing those low frequencies bro. It's either create structural damages or electrical damages. I haven't even fixed the crack on the ceiling yet. I've already put a 10hz filter through the dual core. JP, when my speakers arrive, I'm just gonna set them up and aim for a mor balanced sound. No more running hot or house curves. I just wanna enjoy. You know?
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post #17215 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 12:34 AM
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This scene isn't that hot, and is only at a few frequencies (not full-bandwidth), so it's not actually asking your equipment to pump out that much unless you're running ridiculously hot.

Point is, you still need to replace the breakers and wiring with more durable stuff, because no matter what, you don't want any scene to be tripping the breakers - and your amps will ask for more than your current wiring/breakers can handle if the scene demands it. I'd imagine you're close when not running hot on the Washington Monument scene from OHF as well, cuz it's much hotter and fuller bandwidth, albeit for less duration.
Yes, I'll replace the breakers. My electrician told me that he'll only replace it with 30 amp if I'll change out the wiring. Which I'm not about to spend more on. Just gonna stick with 20 amps since the wiring is only 12 awg. I'll just ease down on sub setting now.
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post #17216 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 06:05 AM
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It's not that much money to pull 10awg wire through, and you're going to continue to have this problem in the future if you stick with 12awg & 20a. It's that, at their peak, your amps each can pull almost double what your breaker can handle. This is a recipe for fail.

I do applaud running flat and not hot, though!
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post #17217 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 07:05 AM
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My electrician told me that he'll only replace it with 30 amp if I'll change out the wiring.


+1
No doom and gloom, but obviously he's right. That's perhaps the single most important tenet of the electrical trade, ... the wiring must meet code for the overcurrent protection.


That said, I've seen breakers become more apt to trip over time, ... especially those subject to nuisance tripping on occasion. So some freshly installed new breakers certainly wouldn't hurt.


Good luck

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post #17218 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 07:28 AM
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It's not that much money to pull 10awg wire through, and you're going to continue to have this problem in the future if you stick with 12awg & 20a. It's that, at their peak, your amps each can pull almost double what your breaker can handle. This is a recipe for fail.

I do applaud running flat and not hot, though!
I have a question for you. I just installed 3 new circuits. I installed one 20 amp 12/2 wire and 2 receptacles for my two Triax's and another for my rack. I also installed a 10/2 wire and 30 amp breaker for my mini split AC unit. So you are saying that a 20 amp will not be enough for my 2 Triax's. I mean it is not two late. I still have a 150' of 10/2 wire. I could re run another wire and fix it.
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post #17219 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 08:03 AM
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I have a question for you. I just installed 3 new circuits. I installed one 20 amp 12/2 wire and 2 receptacles for my two Triax's and another for my rack. I also installed a 10/2 wire and 30 amp breaker for my mini split AC unit. So you are saying that a 20 amp will not be enough for my 2 Triax's. I mean it is not two late. I still have a 150' of 10/2 wire. I could re run another wire and fix it.
I'm not an electrician, but my stepdad is, and here's my 2 pence.

Each Triax has a Speakerpower 4000W amp. Those things can produce that much wattage for a sustained period of time. A single 120v 20a breaker can handle sustained 2400W (120v * 20a) throughput.

Since you have it on hand now, run 10/2 wire and a 30A (120v * 30a = 3600W) breaker + receptacle for each Triax sub, and you'll likely never ever have to worry about it. Yes, you'll be overdoing it for 99.9% of all content, but you don't want to be rockin it and have a rogue scene (like the OHF Washington Monument) or demo for friends pop the 20a breakers.

On another note, most people's signal chain rolloff will probably be down 5-10dB by 5Hz, so the point usually becomes moot, but as equipment improves over time as it has in just the last 10-15 years, more of the deepest content will get fed to your subs. Might as well prepare now!

Last edited by nube; 06-12-2014 at 08:06 AM.
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post #17220 of 18598 Old 06-12-2014, 08:17 AM
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I'm not an electrician, but my stepdad is, and here's my 2 pence.

Each Triax has a Speakerpower 4000W amp. Those things can produce that much wattage for a sustained period of time. A single 120v 20a breaker can handle sustained 2400W (120v * 20a) throughput.

Since you have it on hand now, run 10/2 wire and a 30A (120v * 30a = 3600W) breaker + receptacle for each Triax sub, and you'll likely never ever have to worry about it. Yes, you'll be overdoing it for 99.9% of all content, but you don't want to be rockin it and have a rogue scene (like the OHF Washington Monument) or demo for friends pop the 20a breakers.

On another note, most people's signal chain rolloff will probably be down 5-10dB by 5Hz, so the point usually becomes moot, but as equipment improves over time as it has in just the last 10-15 years, more of the deepest content will get fed to your subs. Might as well prepare now!
Funny thing is now I have them on 2 different circuits both 15 amp 14/2 line and I have never popped either one of them ever !

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