Help decide between STF-2, VTF-1 & VTF2 MK3 !!! - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Ave,

I just bought the Yamaha RX-A2000 receiver and am slowly getting speakers to go with it. Budget is of utmost importance - I don't want to pay even $40 for something that don't need or can do without!

Initially I was looking at the VTF-2 MK-3 after getting strong recommendations for it, but the $509 price tag is just something that is killing my budget beyond recognition!! I'd like to spend less then that.

Although this may not be the final resting place of the Sub, the current room I'm putting it in is 13'-2" X 20'-4". I practically "NEVER" use the setup for Music ... it's all Movies & Videos (And Gaming) but the primary use & all that I want to focus on is Movies.

I must mention: I do have plans to get 1 sub now and add a 2nd sub at some point in the future - when I'm willing to spend - to have 2 subs working for a 7.2 configuration. But right now I'm only looking to buy one.

The pricing on both STF-2 & VTF-1 is very inviting and quite honestly, STF-2 fits my budget like a Glove! I know that these 2 subs have been discussed & compared before ... from what I gather ... the main difference (Aside from Aesthetics which does not matter to me) between the two is Variable Tuning, which is more geared towards "Music". If that is the only real difference between the two... there is no reason for me to buy the VTF-1 for I don't care about Variable Tuning and it's definitely not worth $100 more, which is the price difference between the two.

The price difference between the STF-2 & VTF-2 MK3 is $160. I'm sure the VTF-2 is far superior then STF-2 ... but is it really worth it for me?? I'm not an audiophile ... this is my first Receiver - and my first real powered Sub ... I've only used HTiB's before.

So what do you guys suggest? How is the wisest that I can spend my money between these 3 subs?

Thanks!!

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post #2 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 09:36 AM
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For me personally, it would be a no brainer - since you have at least 2000 cf of volume assuming an 8' ceiling, I would get the cheapest 12" in the mix which would be a VTF-2. You don't buy this stuff everyday and I'd hate to regret buying anything smaller than a 12" sub for that kind of room and HT usage.

Good luck with whatever you purchase

P.S. You just missed an Outlaw EX sale (that sort of ended 30 mins ago), the sub is bigger than VTF-2 and costs a few bucks less, and designed by the same folks that sell Hsu subs.
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post #3 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey79 View Post

Ave,

I just bought the Yamaha RX-A2000 receiver and am slowly getting speakers to go with it. Budget is of utmost importance - I don't want to pay even $40 for something that don't need or can do without!

Initially I was looking at the VTF-2 MK-3 after getting strong recommendations for it, but the $509 price tag is just something that is killing my budget beyond recognition!! I'd like to spend less then that.

Although this may not be the final resting place of the Sub, the current room I'm putting it in is 13'-2" X 20'-4". I practically "NEVER" use the setup for Music ... it's all Movies & Videos (And Gaming) but the primary use & all that I want to focus on is Movies.

I must mention: I do have plans to get 1 sub now and add a 2nd sub at some point in the future - when I'm willing to spend - to have 2 subs working for a 7.2 configuration. But right now I'm only looking to buy one.

The pricing on both STF-2 & VTF-1 is very inviting and quite honestly, STF-2 fits my budget like a Glove! I know that these 2 subs have been discussed & compared before ... from what I gather ... the main difference (Aside from Aesthetics which does not matter to me) between the two is Variable Tuning, which is more geared towards "Music". If that is the only real difference between the two... there is no reason for me to buy the VTF-1 for I don't care about Variable Tuning and it's definitely not worth $100 more, which is the price difference between the two.

The price difference between the STF-2 & VTF-2 MK3 is $160. I'm sure the VTF-2 is far superior then STF-2 ... but is it really worth it for me?? I'm not an audiophile ... this is my first Receiver - and my first real powered Sub ... I've only used HTiB's before.

So what do you guys suggest? How is the wisest that I can spend my money between these 3 subs?

Thanks!!

Who wants to spend even $5 on something they don't need or choose to do without?

The 12 inch VTF-2 MK3 is really in another league from the smaller 10 inch HSU subs and as such, costs more. If it is really over your budget, you might want to change the wording of your thread. As you said, you got strong recommendations for the VTF-2 MK3, because it is a very good sub designed for decent size rooms and the demands of HT use.
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post #4 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse99 View Post

For me personally, it would be a no brainer - since you have at least 2000 cf of volume assuming an 8' ceiling, I would get the cheapest 12" in the mix which would be a VTF-2. You don't buy this stuff everyday and I'd hate to regret buying anything smaller than a 12" sub for that kind of room and HT usage.

Good luck with whatever you purchase

P.S. You just missed an Outlaw EX sale (that sort of ended 30 mins ago), the sub is bigger than VTF-2 and costs a few bucks less, and designed by the same folks that sell Hsu subs.

Hmm ... I didn't actually look at the fact that the other were 10" Subs and VTF-2 is 12". I do agree that you don't buy this everyday ... which is why VTF-2 is still an option and i want make sure I don't make a mistake saving $100. At the same time - I'm also trying to make sure spending almost $200 more is worth every penny, and is something i should do.

7.1: Polk RTi12 Fronts, RTi8 Surrounds, Monitor70 Surround Backs, CSi A6 Center + Outlaw LFM-1 EX Subwoofer.
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post #5 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 10:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

Who wants to spend even $5 on something they don't need or choose to do without?

Haha - Plenty over here - I assure you. I was reading a STF-2 vs VTF-1 thread right here at AVS where somebody wanted to spend the extra $40 for the Variable Tuning even though they absolutely didn't need it & care :P

Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

The 12 inch VTF-2 MK3 is really in another league from the smaller 10 inch HSU subs and as such, costs more. If it is really over your budget, you might want to change the wording of your thread. As you said, you got strong recommendations for the VTF-2 MK3, because it is a very good sub designed for decent size rooms and the demands of HT use.

I do agree with you; I have no doubts it's in another league ... and considering that VTF-1 isn't all that different from STF-1 ... I think my main question here is ... should I spend the $200 extra on the VTF-2 or save $200 and get STF-1.


Let me ask a stupid question ... if you're watching a movie and let's say you don't have the volume up too high, but rather somewhat in the low to mid range ... can you hear or feel the difference between a Sub like STF-1 & the VTF-2 MK3 ?? I guess what I'm trying to get at is that we never play the movies way too loud or anything - most of the time it's a nominal low to mid volume; is there still a performance difference between these subs on a lower volume?

Thanks Guys!!

7.1: Polk RTi12 Fronts, RTi8 Surrounds, Monitor70 Surround Backs, CSi A6 Center + Outlaw LFM-1 EX Subwoofer.
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post #6 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 11:33 AM
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1 VTF-2 MK3 feels as powerful as about two VTF-1.
The VTF-1 is more powerful than STF-2 anyway.

Cacimar Hernandez
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post #7 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 11:34 AM
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I own a STF-2 and I really enjoy it. I was on a limited budget so that's what I could afford at the time via a used model.

One thing I later realized though is that the STF-2 only gets down to 25hz (same with the VTF-1 in ME mode, I believe), so that is a factor to consider, especially for movie watching.

The VTF-2 gets much lower so I would imagine there would be improved movie watching experience with the subsonic frequencies. If I had the money at the time, I would have bought the VTF-2.

Anyway, I put the STF-2 in my bedroom system which is primarily music (although I do watch movies there, too), and just bought a bigger sub for the HT room, an Outlaw LFM-1 EX, which is comparable to the VTF-3.

It was advised to me from posters and by Hsu to buy the biggest sub that you can afford at the time, and I fully understand that now. STF-2 is a very nice sub, better than my previous. I don't think you'd go wrong with the STF-2/VTF-1 as movie watching is still fun, but you may be missing out a bit on the experience with a sub that can go a little lower, as you'll start feeling the low frequencies more, and from what I understand, really enhances the movie-going experience. It's the main reason why I upgraded my subwoofer. I don't play that loud either. Hopefully my new subwoofer will arrive soon, so I can know for sure, but based on what others have posted, from going from a 10 inch sub to one that can play lower frequencies with more ouput, the difference should be significant.

One thing you can consider is buying an eD A2-300, which provide a lot of low-end bang for the buck. I think you lose some articulation for music as compared to the Hsu/Outlaw, but you get comparable to low-end slam to the VTF-2 I think. I don't know how long they take to fulfill orders though as sometimes the wait on the eD could be long, so that is factor to consider. Hsu, on the other hand, is known to ship very fast.

If you can afford it, I suggest going with the VTF-2, especially with your room size and if you plan to get another sub.
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post #8 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 11:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingturtle View Post

I own a STF-2 and I really enjoy it. I was on a limited budget so that's what I could afford at the time via a used model.

One thing I later realized though is that the STF-2 only gets down to 25hz (same with the VTF-1 in ME mode, I believe), so that is a factor to consider, especially for movie watching.

The VTF-2 gets much lower so I would imagine there would be improved movie watching experience with the subsonic frequencies. If I had the money at the time, I would have bought the VTF-2.

Anyway, I put the STF-2 in my bedroom system which is primarily music (although I do watch movies there, too), and just bought a bigger sub for the HT room, an Outlaw LFM-1 EX, which is comparable to the VTF-3.

It was advised to me from posters and by Hsu to buy the biggest sub that you can afford at the time, and I fully understand that now. STF-2 is a very nice sub, better than my previous. I don't think you'd go wrong with the STF-2/VTF-1 as movie watching is still fun, but you may be missing out a bit on the experience with a sub that can go a little lower, as you'll start feeling the low frequencies more, and from what I understand, really enhances the movie-going experience. It's the main reason why I upgraded my subwoofer. I don't play that loud either. Hopefully my new subwoofer will arrive soon, so I can know for sure, but based on what others have posted, from going from a 10 inch sub to one that can play lower frequencies with more ouput, the difference should be significant.

One thing you can consider is buying an eD A2-300, which provide a lot of low-end bang for the buck. I think you lose some articulation for music as compared to the Hsu/Outlaw, but you get comparable to low-end slam to the VTF-2 I think. I don't know how long they take to fulfill orders though as sometimes the wait on the eD could be long, so that is factor to consider. Hsu, on the other hand, is known to ship very fast.

If you can afford it, I suggest going with the VTF-2, especially with your room size and if you plan to get another sub.

Thanks for your very detailed reviews; that gave me some clarity.

All in all, I'm beginning to realize that $200 extra for the VTF-2 MK3 might be totally worth it! Between the 12" sub (as opposed to 10") and the lower Lows (18 as opposed to 25 I believe) ... the difference is looking justified. I might end up regretting not going with VTF-2 and that's not what I want.

Good thoughts!!

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post #9 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 12:51 PM
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VTF-2 mk3, do it. You're looking at a much stonger sub at ~$160 more.
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post #10 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 01:33 PM
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I currently have a very well respected 10" sealed sub in a similar sized room. I don't play anything very loud (usually -20 on the receiver)

If it helps, I am going to be upgrading to a 12" sub shortly because I can feel it strain for movies that go down low. Although I did get some pretty good usage out of my current sub, so it's par for the course.

As someone posted, you just missed a great deal on the Outlaw EX, but from past years experience it's quite likely they'll go on sale for Black Friday. If not keep your eyes peeled on their B stock page.

Outlaw subs are designed by Hsu, and from what I hear are very similar.
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post #11 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 02:16 PM
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If budget is a major issue, it may make sense for you to wait until you're comfortable getting it?
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post #12 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 03:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymouse99 View Post

If budget is a major issue, it may make sense for you to wait until you're comfortable getting it?

I agree with you; I'm not one of those who "needs to have it yesterday!" ... If I know that VT2 MK3 is what I need ... I will wait longer and make sure I get that one; I won't settle for lesser value in the interest of getting it sooner.

I'm also willing to wait & look at sales on Black Friday.

Thanks!

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post #13 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey79 View Post

Thanks for your very detailed reviews; that gave me some clarity.

All in all, I'm beginning to realize that $200 extra for the VTF-2 MK3 might be totally worth it! Between the 12" sub (as opposed to 10") and the lower Lows (18 as opposed to 25 I believe) ... the difference is looking justified. I might end up regretting not going with VTF-2 and that's not what I want.

Good thoughts!!

FYI the vtf2-3 will hit 16htz. I know because I went through the tuning disc which has 16htz tones on it...to find some rattles in my house and lock em down
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post #14 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 03:30 PM
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I was and am still slightly pondering over the exact same decision you are. Over the last week I have started to lean to the VTF2 MK3 though as I have gathered some info that has swayed me, as well as shifted some things in my budget. The main thing that got me was the fact that I have a PSW 505 that I can audition in the current space and compare its performance with what I want. According to some reviews by Ed Mullen around the web the 505 and STF2 put out roughly the same SPL in a given frequency, with the stf 2 having significantly more output in the lower range. In my auditions I was not satisfied with the output of the 505 for what I want my sub to do, it was decent but not what I wanted. While the two subs are vastly different I am comparing I determined that the STF2 wouldnt have enough output and have since decided to go with the VTF2. The only draw back is price. I wanted something that was going to satisfy me for a long time, its better to spend the money upfront then go cheap, realize you messed up and have to figure out what to do with the subpar unit you bought in the first place and then have to go through the entire process again and loose even more time researching what you should have bought in the first place. I also routed my budget a little different, by getting a slightly lower model TV without 3d, which I didnt really want anyhow, and essentionaly the same screen I can make up the difference in price from the stf2 to vtf2
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post #15 of 17 Old 10-17-2011, 06:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sprint_9 View Post

I was and am still slightly pondering over the exact same decision you are. Over the last week I have started to lean to the VTF2 MK3 though as I have gathered some info that has swayed me, as well as shifted some things in my budget. The main thing that got me was the fact that I have a PSW 505 that I can audition in the current space and compare its performance with what I want. According to some reviews by Ed Mullen around the web the 505 and STF2 put out roughly the same SPL in a given frequency, with the stf 2 having significantly more output in the lower range. In my auditions I was not satisfied with the output of the 505 for what I want my sub to do, it was decent but not what I wanted. While the two subs are vastly different I am comparing I determined that the STF2 wouldnt have enough output and have since decided to go with the VTF2. The only draw back is price. I wanted something that was going to satisfy me for a long time, its better to spend the money upfront then go cheap, realize you messed up and have to figure out what to do with the subpar unit you bought in the first place and then have to go through the entire process again and loose even more time researching what you should have bought in the first place. I also routed my budget a little different, by getting a slightly lower model TV without 3d, which I didnt really want anyhow, and essentionaly the same screen I can make up the difference in price from the stf2 to vtf2

Yeah - the VTF-2 MK3 is really a no-brainer to be quite honest; but for the price tag!! The reality is that in the "Grand" scheme of things, the roughly $180 difference between STF2 & VTF2 isn't all that much ... considering the whole setup. But sometimes things are just overkill for a given situation; and sometimes the performance difference doesn't justify the cost difference. That may not be the case here ... but I did want to make sure. The cost difference between 1 VTF2 & 1 STF2 is the same as the cost difference between 1 VTF2 & 2 STF2's ... just the other way around!! That gave me something to think about.

Also - solely financially speaking - I have to go in stages to get all my speakers. I can't get them all together. In that scenario - it does make a difference how much each & every single speaker costs; it means the difference between getting 2 together or 4 together.

But all arguments aside, it's appearing pretty static that VTF2 is worth it! I might end up saving & waiting and just grabbing VTF2.

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post #16 of 17 Old 01-19-2012, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey79 View Post

Haha - Plenty over here - I assure you. I was reading a STF-2 vs VTF-1 thread right here at AVS where somebody wanted to spend the extra $40 for the Variable Tuning even though they absolutely didn't need it & care :P



I do agree with you; I have no doubts it's in another league ... and considering that VTF-1 isn't all that different from STF-1 ... I think my main question here is ... should I spend the $200 extra on the VTF-2 or save $200 and get STF-1.


Let me ask a stupid question ... if you're watching a movie and let's say you don't have the volume up too high, but rather somewhat in the low to mid range ... can you hear or feel the difference between a Sub like STF-1 & the VTF-2 MK3 ?? I guess what I'm trying to get at is that we never play the movies way too loud or anything - most of the time it's a nominal low to mid volume; is there still a performance difference between these subs on a lower volume?

Thanks Guys!!

So what did you go with. Im in this same predicament and I'm leaning towards the stf-1. I mean there is always something better . I started out wanting a cheap sub. then moved up cause all the forum topics said to get another one that was 50 bucks more. I searched that one and it said to get the stf-2. now i reading this and I'm starting to second guess my stf decision.

I like you don't listen watch movies loud. sometimes i like to listen to music loud though. talk me out of the stf-2...
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post #17 of 17 Old 01-19-2012, 07:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickey79 View Post

Yeah - the VTF-2 MK3 is really a no-brainer to be quite honest; but for the price tag!! The reality is that in the "Grand" scheme of things, the roughly $180 difference between STF2 & VTF2 isn't all that much ... considering the whole setup. But sometimes things are just overkill for a given situation; and sometimes the performance difference doesn't justify the cost difference. That may not be the case here ... but I did want to make sure. The cost difference between 1 VTF2 & 1 STF2 is the same as the cost difference between 1 VTF2 & 2 STF2's ... just the other way around!! That gave me something to think about.

Also - solely financially speaking - I have to go in stages to get all my speakers. I can't get them all together. In that scenario - it does make a difference how much each & every single speaker costs; it means the difference between getting 2 together or 4 together.

But all arguments aside, it's appearing pretty static that VTF2 is worth it! I might end up saving & waiting and just grabbing VTF2.


I used to think that too..I was originally in the market for a Lava LSP12 than I moved up to the Bic PL-200 than I set my eyes on the STF 2. Went to HSU in Anaheim and left thinking damn the VTF 15 is gonna be mine.... or the ULS-15 quad drive hahah.

I honestly think theres a BIG difference between the STF2 and the VTF2.4/3.4 that you will enjoy for years to come.

BTW I ended up getting an EX from outlaw....The HSU Xmas sales weren't enough to change my mind lol

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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