SVS PB13-Ultra worth it? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 12:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi,

A few days ago I went to listen for a new sub. I listened to the JL Audio f113. I was looking for the deep bass and the feeling of soundtrack in my chest, I mean I want to feel my chest get pounded, and my shirt and pants to shake on me.
This is the feeling I got with the f113.

Now I am reading on the SVS PB13-Ultra and since I cannot hear it at any dealership (at least in Montreal, Canada), I'm left with your comments on this sub. Will I get the same feeling with the PB13?

Paul

P.S. My room is about 12*9*35 ft and mainly listening movies there.
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post #2 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 12:50 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdube View Post

Hi,

A few days ago I went to listen for a new sub. I listened to the JL Audio f113. I was looking for the deep bass and the feeling of soundtrack in my chest, I mean I want to feel my chest get pounded, and my shirt and pants to shake on me.
This is the feeling I got with the f113.

Now I am reading on the SVS PB13-Ultra and since I cannot hear it at any dealership (at least in Montreal, Canada), I'm left with your comments on this sub. Will I get the same feeling with the PB13?

Paul

P.S. My room is about 12*9*35 ft and mainly listening movies there.

http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/s...ofers/svs-pb13
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post #3 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 12:54 PM
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If you are willing to spend F113 money, just get this and be done with it:

http://www.funkywaves.net/catalog.cfm?item=fw_18_0



They are a Canadian company to boot.

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post #4 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matman1970 View Post

If you are willing to spend F113 money, just get this and be done with it:

http://www.funkywaves.net/catalog.cfm?item=fw_18_0



They are a Canadian company to boot.

I believe that Mark Seaton of Seaton Sound recently stated the LMS 5400 drivers were way back ordered. Maybe FunkyWaves has some available to them right now but then again, maybe not.
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post #5 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 12:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

I believe that Mark Seaton of Seaton Sound recently stated the the LMS 5400 drivers were way back ordered. Maybe FunkyWaves has them in stock but then again, maybe not.

I believe Nathan then stated he still had some in stock after Mark posted that.

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post #6 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:00 PM
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how much does a F113 go for these days in Canada? I'd almost imagine you could get 2 PB13 for the price.

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post #7 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matman1970 View Post

I believe Nathan then stated he still had some in stock after Mark posted that.

That's good.
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post #8 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:02 PM
 
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One of questions the OP was asking was, is the Ultra 13 capable of chest pounding bass. I haven't heard the sub, but based upon the review by Audioholics and looking at the measurements, and from what I've read around here is that chest pounding bass comes mostly in the lower to midrange bass area, I would say, yes it is capable of chest pounding bass.
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post #9 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warpdrive View Post

how much does a F113 go for these days in Canada? I'd almost imagine you could get 2 PB13 for the price.

Around 3-3.2K$ street price.
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post #10 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

One of questions the OP was asking was, is the Ultra 13 capable of chest pounding bass. I haven't heard the sub, but based upon the review by Audioholics and looking at the measurements, and from what I've read around here is that chest pounding bass comes mostly in the lower to midrange bass area, I would say, yes it is capable of chest pounding bass.

Yes, in fact I'd like to have an opinion of someone who actually experienced the two subs.
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post #11 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matman1970 View Post

If you are willing to spend F113 money, just get this and be done with it:

http://www.funkywaves.net/catalog.cfm?item=fw_18_0



They are a Canadian company to boot.

That's still pretty steep ($3120 powered) when you can an Ultra 13 for 2,000. However it does beat the JL F113 at $3700 and its bigger and more powerful.
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post #12 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdube View Post

Yes, in fact I'd like to have an opinion of someone who actually experienced the two subs.

I hear you on that. Just based logic and circumstancial evidence it would seem it would.

You know you could order a PB-13, SVS gives you 45 days to return it. Of course would have to eat the return shipping charges

Hopefully someone will respond who has actual expirence with both.
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post #13 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

That's still pretty steep ($3120 powered) when you can an Ultra 13 for 2,000. However it does beat the JL F113 at $3700 and its bigger and more powerful.

The OP said he can get the F113 for $3,000-$3,200 street price.
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post #14 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

The OP said he can get the F113 for $3,000-$3,200 street price.

OK. That he did. That makes it comparably priced to the Funky Waves. Both are priced significantly higher than the PB-13.

Does anyone have any real world performance measurement of the Funky Waves sub? Unfortunately, since many of these subs can only be purchased over the internet, we only have measurements and owner opinions to go off of.
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post #15 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

OK. That he did. That makes it comparably priced to the Funky Waves. Both are priced significantly higher than the PB-13.

Does anyone have any real world performance measurement of the Funky Waves sub? Unfortunately, since many of these subs can only be purchased over the internet, we only have measurements and owner opinions to go off of.

Ummm, you say we have measurements but first you ask if there are real world performance measurements.

Do you mean we have measurements as presented by funkywaves, but nothing independent?
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post #16 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

Ummm, you say we have measurements but first you ask if there are real world performance measurements.

Do you mean we have measurements as presented by funkywaves, but nothing independent?

Yes. I meant something on the order of what Audioholics did with the PB-13. I like their approach, subjective listening test followed by and supported with objective test measurement results.
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post #17 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Yes. I meant something on the order of what Audioholics did with the PB-13. I like their approach, subjective listening test followed by and supported with objective test measurement results.

Too bad no one here has forked over the money to get one of these subs and test it. Ricci would be great.
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post #18 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdube View Post

Yes, in fact I'd like to have an opinion of someone who actually experienced the two subs.

I've had both in the same room at the same time. They are very comparable in output, with the SVS digging a bit deeper and the F113 (to me), being slightly better for music reproduction and perhaps having a bit more oomph above 50hz. I doubt most could tell the difference in a blind test outside of a few low notes in some movies.

Bottom line, if you have the space, go for the SVS and save the money. If space is your primary purchasing driver as it was for me, go for the F113.

Two very good subs - you won't be disappointed with either.
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post #19 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by bfreedma View Post

I've had both in the same room at the same time. They are very comparable in output, with the SVS digging a bit deeper and the F113 (to me), being slightly better for music reproduction and perhaps having a bit more oomph above 50hz. I doubt most could tell the difference in a blind test outside of a few low notes in some movies.

Bottom line, if you have the space, go for the SVS and save the money. If space is your primary purchasing driver as it was for me, go for the F113.

Two very good subs - you won't be disappointed with either.

What about chest pounding bass from the PB-13?
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post #20 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:21 PM
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I, too, heard both (older BASH amped PB13) as duels in a side-by-side comparison. Unfortunately, it was too long ago and that particular thread is gone. I found them to be very close with the SVS a little better in output and the JLA a little better in SQ. At that time, there was a bigger price difference than there is now. So, I agree with what BFREEDMA says above. Also, if you want the best aesthetics, get the Fathom. The SVS is no slouch in the looks department, but the JLA is just gorgeous. But to get the best of it's appearance, you have to leave the grill off. With the grill on, it more or less looks like any small, gloss black sub. To me, the SVS looks better with the grill on.

And both will give you the CPB you're looking for with the SVS having a little better low end.

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post #21 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:21 PM
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I have heard both at different times in different rooms, so I won't attempt to make a direct comparison, but yeah, the PB13 will definitely provide a good pounding.

Keep in mind that your room is fairly big (35' x 12'), and whether or not you get a PB13 or JL, you might eventually want to add another sub for serious pressurization of the room. Not sure if you'd be willing to spend another $3K for a second JL

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post #22 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

What about chest pounding bass from the PB-13?

Yes, both the F113 and PB-13 have "chest pounding bass" assuming your room permits.

Expecting either sub to provide tactile response in a large room is unrealistic unless you go for multiples.
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post #23 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:36 PM
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I would think the Ported PB13 Ultra would be the clear choice due to the large room and movie usage. The Ported SVS subs are also very good with music which is icing in the cake. Take the money you save on the JL, and put it towards a second sub later on.
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post #24 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

Too bad no one here has forked over the money to get one of these subs and test it. Ricci would be great.

Ilkka tested all of these subs. He did not do any subjective listening, but his results should be comparable to Ricci's.

This is a list of all Ilkka's tests.
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...rer-model.html

The JL
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...thom-f113.html

The SVS
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...0-hz-tune.html

This should be very similar to the funkywaves 18.0.
http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...aled-100l.html

The measurements back up what bfreedma experienced between the svs and jl. The JL has more output above 40 and the SVS in the ported configurations has more output below 40hz. The TC Sounds does measure the best. It will give the most output just about everywhere, can handle the most EQ at low frequencies to match its output to the room and has the least distortion.

The size difference between the SVS and JL is pretty significant, so first I would decide if you have any size restrictions and what type of finish you want. This alone may make your decision for you.

Personally, this is how I would sum up these choices.

If you don't need the most output at low frequencies, but want a small sub and are uncomfortable buying a sub without seeing it or listening to it, go for the JL.
If you want to save some money or possibly get dual subs, gain some output down low over the JL and lose some output above 40hz and don't mind a larger sub go for the SVS.
If you want the most output, can handle a box larger than the JL and are willing to pay the most, go for the Funkywave 18.0.

To make things more complicated, two other top choices to look into would be the JTR Captivator and the Seaton Submersive HP.

I would suggest calling each company (SVS, Funk Audio, JTR and Seaton) and explain your situation and goals. A good conversation can sometimes help you figure out what sub best fits what you want.
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post #25 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 02:48 PM
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SVS PB13-Ultra worth it?

Yes and yes...
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post #26 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

I believe that Mark Seaton of Seaton Sound recently stated the LMS 5400 drivers were way back ordered.

I think it also depends on who you are getting them from.

I know Parts Express has some in stock. We had to pick up a pair for a custom project earlier this week. They shipped today.
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post #27 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 04:14 PM
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I hope I'm not stepping on any toes here (just my opinion), but I've heard dual PB13's in the same room as a single Submersive and a single Captivator.

Even if they cost the same I'd take 1 Sub or Cap over 2 Ultras.
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post #28 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

I hope I'm not stepping on any toes here (just my opinion), but I've heard dual PB13's in the same room as a single Submersive and a single Captivator.

Even if they cost the same I'd take 1 Sub or Cap over 2 Ultras.

I'm the room carp's heard this comparison in, during and following the KC meet...

and I agree...

I owned two SVS PB13 Ultras (with the older bash 750 watt amp but the newest/current driver) for a single month after the KC subwoofer meet, at which time I decided I wanted to buy a single Captivator instead -- but ended up purchasing two. I'd never revert back willingly. 115dB clean from the listening position with dual SVsound PB13 Ultras double stacked in the left corner. 125dB clean from the same listening position on the JTR Captivator passive pair powered by a single Behringer EP4000 amp for both subs - The JTRs were/are NOT co-located, and not stacked in the corner during these measurements...they were/are actually placed as you see in the picture of my theater room in my signature. To address the OP's actual desire - he should visit the JTR Captivator thread. Bass you can feel? -in spades! Your room is huge and I don't think either the SVS or JL will provide that tactile response that blurs your vision and shakes your clothes in a room that large. They didn't in mine, and my room isn't as big as yours.

As far as SVS vs. JL - - they are generally speaking -- in the same class of sub. As other's have said the JL has a bit more umpf out of the lowest registers, the SVS a bit more umpf in the lowest registers. A single Captivator is preferable to dual subs in my room --- which says an awful lot because I've always prefered dual subs over single subs before...If you heard the JL in a small room -- what a difference the size of room makes. carp and I have a friend that has dual HSU VTF-15H's in small room (1500 cubic foot) those HSU subs have some of the most tactile bass I've ever felt, he brought over a VTF-15H to my room for the sub meet and I didn't feel anything in my room from a single VTF-15H sub. The SVS PB12+ provided more feel for me in my room than the VTF-15H did on the movie clips we watched during the KC meet. Same sub - - - completely different experiences in two different rooms.

I'd take one passive captivator over two SVS PB13 Ultra subs without blinking twice. SVS are nice subs, proven subs in fact, but a 13" high excursion driver isn't competitive against a 18" higher excursion driver. period. I've not heard the LMS5400 driver or a funky waves setup, but they are supposed to be comparable output to a Captivator. One of the guys in the Captivator thread has both and he says they have very similar output and compliment each other well. The sealed LMS5400 he has is potentially more ultra low frequency focused-- where the ported Captivator fills in a bit louder a bit higher. SVS has a great name for a sound reason - they make bulletproof solid preforming subwoofers that will last nearly forever. They aren't the biggest player in town on the max spl front, nor price to preformance leader any longer. What you get with SVS is a very well recognized sub (slightly overpriced up front) with a very nice resale value because of their well earned reputation should you decide to go a different route.

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post #29 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 04:38 PM
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I think so much more can be accomplished with 2k...lms ultras like others have said or multiple 15's will most certainly dominate a single ultra.
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post #30 of 86 Old 10-19-2011, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdube View Post

Hi,

A few days ago I went to listen for a new sub. I listened to the JL Audio f113. I was looking for the deep bass and the feeling of soundtrack in my chest, I mean I want to feel my chest get pounded, and my shirt and pants to shake on me.
This is the feeling I got with the f113.

Now I am reading on the SVS PB13-Ultra and since I cannot hear it at any dealership (at least in Montreal, Canada), I'm left with your comments on this sub. Will I get the same feeling with the PB13?

Paul

P.S. My room is about 12*9*35 ft and mainly listening movies there.

I've heard both in my family room (at the same time) as well as a 4,000 cubic foot treated home theater room (again, both at the same time). The second test was blind, and it was extremely difficult to ascertain differences between the two when blind. But just about everyone at the meet felt the PB13 offered more output for HT and went lower with the F113 being a tad better for music.

The F113 is an engineering marvel for what it can do in such a small box. But if you don't require a small box, save the extra $1k or so and get the PB13.


Having said that, will you feel what you felt at the place you demo'd the F113? Hard to say, your room is certainly not small, and at the limits if not beyond what either sub can handle. If you listened to the F113 in a smaller room, you may not get the same "feeling" in your room.

 

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