Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 625 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #18721 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
1)You'll definitely notice the difference going from ONE XS30se to DUAL S3000i. That was the context when we were discussing <30hz capabilities with action oriented films at louder levels. .

2)Going from one XS30se to one S3000i will be more subtle but still noticeable at louder levels assuming the XS30se is approaching its output limits.

3)The biggest differences are not below 25hz in terms of headroom between the two models. HOWEVER, in most cases the XS30se will bump into its output limits <30hz in real world scenarios(in room, with action oriented DVDs). So this is where the differences between the two models may be most audible.

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Thanks Tom, I certainly didn't want to misquote you. Obviously going from a single XS30se to DUAL S3000i's would be HUGE! I was trying to say that you mentioned the S3000i is better at below 25hz than the XS30SE.
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post #18722 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by gbreda View Post
It really can be and endless issue that just keeps costing more money, especially in this hobby. As difficult as it is, once you are "satisfied", the best thing to do is stay off the forums. Many years ago, I canceled all of my magazine subscriptions for this reason but now its way to easy too pop in here and get pulled right back in especially when now you just sit on the couch with a laptop instead of a dedicated area with a desktop computer-how easy is that !

For me, it's personally justified in the fact that it's my only real vice-my more negative youthful vices have been left behind but I still love music and I no longer feel the need to go to a theater. At Imax or even regular theater prices, IMHO this money is well spent. Oh and when the dog or cat is looking and wondering where the hell that helicopter flying around the room or some animal is; that's just priceless
I couldn't agree with you more! I'm afraid if I don't stay away from these forums, I may end up divorced!
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post #18723 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by gbreda View Post
It really can be and endless issue that just keeps costing more money, especially in this hobby. As difficult as it is, once you are "satisfied", the best thing to do is stay off the forums. Many years ago, I canceled all of my magazine subscriptions for this reason but now its way to easy too pop in here and get pulled right back in especially when now you just sit on the couch with a laptop instead of a dedicated area with a desktop computer-how easy is that !

For me, it's personally justified in the fact that it's my only real vice-my more negative youthful vices have been left behind but I still love music and I no longer feel the need to go to a theater. At Imax or even regular theater prices, IMHO this money is well spent. Oh and when the dog or cat is looking and wondering where the hell that helicopter flying around the room or some animal is; that's just priceless
It really can be a rabbit hole of sorts.

I love the S1500 but what about the XS30se for a little more. I love the XS30se but what about the S3000i for a little more? I love the S3000i but I know the T-18 would be incredible...

Some of this simply comes down to individual personalities. If you're the type that will always let that little "guy" on your shoulder whisper....but what would "XYZ" have sounded like with that movie. You might be best just upgrading and eliminating the little guy.. On the other hand, we have all heard the phrase..."get 90% of the performance for half the cost(or whatever) too.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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post #18724 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Aliens View Post
Is that the reason for the, "we recently improved several aspects of the new ICE amplifier control set," that I received in the email?
What's this?

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post #18725 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by mnc View Post
What's this?
We've been working with Brian at Speaker Power for the past few weeks on optimizing a few variables in his preamp stage. The gain structure and auto-on circuit have been the two primary targets.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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post #18726 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
We've been working with Brian at Speaker Power for the past few weeks on optimizing a few variables in his preamp stage. The gain structure and auto-on circuit have been the two primary targets.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Is this something that has been implemented already or not?

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post #18727 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
It really can be a rabbit hole of sorts.

I love the S1500 but what about the XS30se for a little more. I love the XS30se but what about the S3000i for a little more? I love the S3000i but I know the T-18 would be incredible...

Some of this simply comes down to individual personalities. If you're the type that will always let that little "guy" on your shoulder whisper....but what would "XYZ" have sounded like with that movie. You might be best just upgrading and eliminating the little guy.. On the other hand, we have all heard the phrase..."get 90% of the performance for half the cost(or whatever) too.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
I suppose I need to decide where to draw the line.

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post #18728 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by mnc View Post
Is this something that has been implemented already or not?


This is like a chat session..

All new ICE powered orders will have the revised preamp stage.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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post #18729 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 12:14 PM
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I have an onkyo 828 , can one run audyssey just for the sub or do I have to keep doing the whole thing every time I move the sub?
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post #18730 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
This is like a chat session..

All new ICE powered orders will have the revised preamp stage.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Is this a programming change, hardware change, or something else? You can imagine why I'm curious about this one!

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post #18731 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
It really can be a rabbit hole of sorts.

I love the S1500 but what about the XS30se for a little more. I love the XS30se but what about the S3000i for a little more? I love the S3000i but I know the T-18 would be incredible...

Some of this simply comes down to individual personalities. If you're the type that will always let that little "guy" on your shoulder whisper....but what would "XYZ" have sounded like with that movie. You might be best just upgrading and eliminating the little guy.. On the other hand, we have all heard the phrase..."get 90% of the performance for half the cost(or whatever) too.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Waiting on the new amps and then my units will ship-my choice to wait. Hopefully I will see them by next weekend !

I generally tend to under estimate upgrades but with this one I fully expect to blow that little guy off my shoulder and into the next state.

I went through this 25 years ago looking for speakers. I finally settled on a pair that lasted me 25 years-that was the Klipsch Forte. I hope that this is going to be a similar change and be done with it for a long while.
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Last edited by gbreda; 04-19-2015 at 03:37 PM. Reason: updated correct quote
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post #18732 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 01:17 PM
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Is this a programming change, hardware change, or something else? You can imagine why I'm curious about this one!
I'd rather not get into specifics. We're already spending too much time helping the competition in this regard..

Email me and we can discuss it further. Thanks.

Tom V.
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post #18733 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
Email me and we can discuss it further. Thanks.
Fair enough, I'll give you a call later today.

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post #18734 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
It really can be a rabbit hole of sorts.

I love the S1500 but what about the XS30se for a little more. I love the XS30se but what about the S3000i for a little more? I love the S3000i but I know the T-18 would be incredible...

Some of this simply comes down to individual personalities. If you're the type that will always let that little "guy" on your shoulder whisper....but what would "XYZ" have sounded like with that movie. You might be best just upgrading and eliminating the little guy.. On the other hand, we have all heard the phrase..."get 90% of the performance for half the cost(or whatever) too.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Well Tom I tried what you said, sorta. I usually don't run my sub hot, just leave it where Audyssey sets it. So I bumped it up about 3dB. Played the Pod Emergence WOTW and Pod Race from Phantom Menace( I guess I was in a pod mood). WOW!
I learned two things. Why people run their sub hot, and I was no where near hitting the limits of my SINGLE XS30se! Holy crap it was SCARY! All this at a volume of -12.
I can confidently say that "just" adding a second XS30se instead of upgrading to S3000i's will be ALL I need! I'll be better off using the money saved to upgrade my surround speakers.
This XS30se is just AMAZING!
Thanks Tom!
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post #18735 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
It really can be a rabbit hole of sorts.

I love the S1500 but what about the XS30se for a little more. I love the XS30se but what about the S3000i for a little more? I love the S3000i but I know the T-18 would be incredible...

Some of this simply comes down to individual personalities. If you're the type that will always let that little "guy" on your shoulder whisper....

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Lol.....it's this line of reasoning that got me into trouble.

Btw, the Triax killed the little guy on my shoulder.
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post #18736 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 05:43 PM
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I just calculated that I can order my second XS30se in fifteen weeks!
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post #18737 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 06:45 PM
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I couldn't agree with you more! I'm afraid if I don't stay away from these forums, I may end up divorced!
LOL… These forums truly are dangerous. But without them I would never have discovered PSA and their great products and that would have been a shame.
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post #18738 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 06:57 PM
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I just calculated that I can order my second XS30se in fifteen weeks!
Better make it 16 and include the UMIK-1 mic. In the mean time study REW.
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post #18739 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 07:09 PM
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better make it 16 and include the umik-1 mic. In the mean time study rew.
lol!:d
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post #18740 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 07:17 PM
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Okay... I'm going to jump in on this topic just for fun:

MNC you need to get your UMIK and download REW. I understand the procrastination because I did it myself for almost a year and I wish I hadn't because REW really helped me dial in my subs. REW does have a learning curve but there are plenty of guys on this thread who will always be here to help you out. And once you look at the guide you will be able to figure things out pretty quickly. As NIKE says, Just Do It!
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post #18741 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 08:29 PM
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Can anyone confirm that the ICE amps do shut off when switching from auto to off? Or do you have to go from auto, over to on, then back to off for the amp to shut down?
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post #18742 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 08:37 PM
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Compression sweep

Please explain to me how to properly do a compression sweep on my dual XS30SEs with REW and the UMIK-1.
I did it today and got to -20MV and got really scared that I was going to blow something up. I'll post my three graphs in the morning. I need to know what settings on my AVR, I think LPF of LFE to bypass, I can't go higher than 120, Channel 4 in REW subs only, what should the output be when I start the sweep at -30 MV on AVR? I need to know the setting in REW as well. My UMIK-1 has a 18dB gain structure, does that matter or can I just turn down the volume in Windows Recording or do I need to change the gain inside the UMIK itself and then the Sens Factor.

Some one tell me in laymen's terms, THANK YOU..TIA...........
Cheers Jeff
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post #18743 of 22064 Old 04-19-2015, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mnc View Post
Well Tom I tried what you said, sorta. I usually don't run my sub hot, just leave it where Audyssey sets it. So I bumped it up about 3dB. Played the Pod Emergence WOTW and Pod Race from Phantom Menace( I guess I was in a pod mood). WOW!
I learned two things. Why people run their sub hot, and I was no where near hitting the limits of my SINGLE XS30se! Holy crap it was SCARY! All this at a volume of -12.
I can confidently say that "just" adding a second XS30se instead of upgrading to S3000i's will be ALL I need! I'll be better off using the money saved to upgrade my surround speakers.
This XS30se is just AMAZING!
Thanks Tom!
MNC: When I had a single XS30SE, I ran it 4 db's hot then I added a second XS30SE and I run them each 5 db's hot and the bass sounds so smooth and effortless. I get great tactile feel and output in my completely sealed room. Have you thought about dual XV30SE in your room? Dual XV30SE should have a 3db advantage over the S3000I in the 16-30ish hz range, I know this item has been discontinued/sold out but I'm sure Tom would be willing to work something out with you

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Last edited by Mike Butny; 04-19-2015 at 11:27 PM.
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post #18744 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post
Okay... I'm going to jump in on this topic just for fun:

MNC you need to get your UMIK and download REW. I understand the procrastination because I did it myself for almost a year and I wish I hadn't because REW really helped me dial in my subs. REW does have a learning curve but there are plenty of guys on this thread who will always be here to help you out. And once you look at the guide you will be able to figure things out pretty quickly. As NIKE says, Just Do It!
Trust me guys, I want to do REW and I plan on doing it. If it were just a matter of downloading REW and buying the UMIK, I would have already done it. Unfortunately I also need to buy a computer from this decade!
I will get around to it though.

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post #18745 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 08:23 AM
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I have an onkyo 828 , can one run audyssey just for the sub or do I have to keep doing the whole thing every time I move the sub?
No, you cannot just run Audyssey for the sub. You can however just do a 3 point Aud cal and get it "good enough" to decide whether or not it made a difference.
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post #18746 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 08:26 AM
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Guys quick REW question, I use the camera (caption) to save my graphs into documents, how do you save your graphs in REW, when I hit the save icon it becomes a mdat file and wants to put it in documents. Is there a folder in REW to save your graphs so you can go back to them and compare and overlay other FR sweeps? Thanks and sorry for the simple questions.
Cheers Jeff

Jeff, you can save the MDAT file anywhere on your computer you want to, just navigate to a folder before saving.

If you want to compare a new measurement with an older one and overlay the two, you have to do File>Open in REW. If you just open the old MDAT from your hard disk, it will open another instance of REW and you will be unable to overlay.
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post #18747 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 10:04 AM
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No, you cannot just run Audyssey for the sub. You can however just do a 3 point Aud cal and get it "good enough" to decide whether or not it made a difference.
Thanks Alan, also I know I've seen it before but can't find it in the rew guide but the which is which for outputs In rew when using hdmi?
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post #18748 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 10:10 AM
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Can anyone confirm that the ICE amps do shut off when switching from auto to off? Or do you have to go from auto, over to on, then back to off for the amp to shut down?
You need to start from ON then goto OFF. This is a quirk we are revising with the new amps.

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post #18749 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Butny View Post
MNC: When I had a single XS30SE, I ran it 4 db's hot then I added a second XS30SE and I run them each 5 db's hot and the bass sounds so smooth and effortless. I get great tactile feel and output in my completely sealed room. Have you thought about dual XV30SE in your room? Dual XV30SE should have a 3db advantage over the S3000I in the 16-30ish hz range, I know this item has been discontinued/sold out but I'm sure Tom would be willing to work something out with you
We need to order all cabinets in minimums so we couldn't schedule an entire production run around 2 orders. And with the new V3600 coming sooner rather than later...there really won't be much reason to spend $1499 on a XV30Fse when for 15(ish)% more you'll enjoy a significant performance increase. I'll be surprised if we aren't double or more averaged from 20-100hz compared to the XV30Fse..

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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Last edited by Tom Vodhanel; 04-20-2015 at 01:32 PM.
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post #18750 of 22064 Old 04-20-2015, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pony9134 View Post
thanks alan, also i know i've seen it before but can't find it in the rew guide but the which is which for outputs in rew when using hdmi?
ch1 = fl
ch2 = fr
ch3 = cc
ch4 = lfe
ch5 = sl
ch6 = sr
ch7 = sbl
ch8 = sbr


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