Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 628 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!


Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #18811 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 10:16 AM
AVS Special Member
 
FattyMcButterPants's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,177
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 715 Post(s)
Liked: 515
Those are very good points guys, I agree with all of them. The upgrade one in particular is a tough one for me. Right now I love my xv15se's and I know I don't listen loud enough to benefit much (if at all) from bigger subs, but when I see something like the prototype v3600 I can't help but want it lol.
ahblaza and majek 60 like this.
FattyMcButterPants is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #18812 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 11:16 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ahblaza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Pittsburgh Steeler Country
Posts: 1,573
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 853 Post(s)
Liked: 771
@Hop & @Bass ,
Thank you guys so much for the kind and encouraging words, you really don't know what it meant to me to hear this. I actually have been losing sleep over all this REW measurement stuff. I haven't watched a movie or played a tune since I started measuring. My room is a mess with speakers and subs and long extension (power) cords and sub cables all over the place. I spent two hours last night optimizing my left speaker location to get it as flat as possible without any EQ... I had to prove to myself it wasn't the speaker so I used a couple of the other (5) non PSA speakers I have laying around and it's not the speaker (PSA). I ended up with some really good techniques and learning curves with using REW which prior to this waS SO INTIMIDATING.

Today I feel like I have a new lease on life just hearing from you guys, it means so much to me, seriously. I'm going to make this work and it's going to happen soon. I'm going to find the best location for my front stage in relation to my MLP and also with one sub at a time and then run my RC software which is only XT. What puzzles me is how good it did with my subs, I didn't think it worked well with that, who knows. So thanks again my friends for the words of encouragement, I was under the assumption that I had to have ruler flat FR across the entire FR. I feel so much better now because of my forum Family members.

Most Sincerely, Jeffrey Nordi
ahblaza is offline  
post #18813 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 12:13 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Hopinater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central VA
Posts: 2,844
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 726 Post(s)
Liked: 1856
Jeff, I have to say I'm happy to know that you are feeling a little less stressed now. I'm like bass, I haven't measured anything in months. In fact I'm still in the honeymoon phase with my 110s. I just love listening to them and I still have no idea what the graph for them looks like. I just know they sound good!
ahblaza likes this.
Hopinater is offline  
post #18814 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 12:49 PM
Member
 
sinisanav's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 178
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 88 Post(s)
Liked: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by ahblaza View Post
@Hop & @Bass ,
What puzzles me is how good it did with my subs, I didn't think it worked well with that, who knows. So thanks again my friends for the words of encouragement, I was under the assumption that I had to have ruler flat FR across the entire FR. I feel so much better now because of my forum Family members.

Most Sincerely, Jeffrey Nordi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post
Jeff, I have to say I'm happy to know that you are feeling a little less stressed now. I'm like bass, I haven't measured anything in months. In fact I'm still in the honeymoon phase with my 110s. I just love listening to them and I still have no idea what the graph for them looks like. I just know they sound good!
Guys, that is exactly why I am fighting the urge to buy a mic and start REWing. As I know that I would probably get hung up on the minute details instead of enjoying what I have.
XT does good with EQ, I new that in my first cavernous, odd shaped media room just by ear, listening to stuff with and then without Audyssey. I thought, shoudl I REW but then just decided to rely on my ears and enjoy. One thing I missed is the low end and tactile feel as built-in Supercube 1 in my towers could just not go deep or strong enough to fill in 5400 cubic ft of odd shaped space.
So, I continue to fight in the new space where I finally got acoustical treatments as well, which helped a lot with clarity of sound and seamlesness of the soundstage. Just again, measured with my ears.
Built in subs are doing better in my new 1500 cubic ft HT but I want to try to see how having real subs will change the 15-25 Hz range experience. So after looking out, reading, talking, emailing for last 2-3 months ( Rhytmik/SVS/HSU/DT) I think I narrowed it down to a trial of either XS15se or S1500 (hopefully duals).
I will hook them up , fire up Anti-mode 8033 ( which I spent again about 3 months researching online ) and let that little box EQ them nicely and then, listen and feel. No graphs.
ahblaza likes this.

Change is the only constant.

My HT: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/19-ded...l#post32691273
sinisanav is offline  
post #18815 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 01:55 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Alan P's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 5,530
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2285 Post(s)
Liked: 1237
I understand how the REW rabbit hole can be a bit much for some, but I'm very glad I went through the ~6 months of measuring I did...if not, I never would have known what the problems in my room are and how to deal with them.

Quad XS15s....usually more than enough for most people; I just could not get them to work in my room...through the REW process I come to find out I have 2 subs with voice coils wired out of phase. I never would have found this out otherwise (well, at least without an SPL meter).

After that, I still couldn't get the subs to work in my room...at least with REW I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that I had exhausted all possible options before pulling the trigger on an upgrade.
Alan P is online now  
post #18816 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 02:23 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Aliens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Virginia
Posts: 7,861
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 782 Post(s)
Liked: 751
Quote:
Originally Posted by sinisanav View Post
So, I continue to fight in the new space where I finally got acoustical treatments as well, which helped a lot with clarity of sound and seamlesness of the soundstage.
Calling all experts...


I'm about to start my acoustic project. This is not the actual product, just for reference. The local building supply has the CertainTeed, R-11 Soundshield. Comes in 2'X8'X3 1/2" strips (16 total). Not referenced on Bob Golds site. Great price @ $87. I know to remove the backing; will this be acceptable for making panels? I'm trying to avoid the high shipping costs of other products.
Aliens is online now  
post #18817 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 03:06 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Hopinater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central VA
Posts: 2,844
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 726 Post(s)
Liked: 1856
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
I understand how the REW rabbit hole can be a bit much for some, but I'm very glad I went through the ~6 months of measuring I did...if not, I never would have known what the problems in my room are and how to deal with them.

Quad XS15s....usually more than enough for most people; I just could not get them to work in my room...through the REW process I come to find out I have 2 subs with voice coils wired out of phase. I never would have found this out otherwise (well, at least without an SPL meter).

After that, I still couldn't get the subs to work in my room...at least with REW I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt that I had exhausted all possible options before pulling the trigger on an upgrade.
You're right about the positives of REW. It certainly helped me with my system by finding the right position for the subs. REW really is a great tool and as I have said before, it makes little sense to pay thousands for sub equipment and then not find the best position for them by using REW.

I will add that if you are happy with how your system sounds and you know you are a person who chases perfection but don't have the budget or time to do it then it might be best to avoid REW all together and just continue to be happy with your system because you may not be able to handle what you find out.

But if you aren't happy with how your system sounds then you really owe it to yourself to get REW and start measuring. Just know…it may be a rabbit hole.

But no matter what, if REW steals the joy of this hobby then STOP using it and start enjoying yourself.
mnc, ahblaza, sinisanav and 1 others like this.
Hopinater is offline  
post #18818 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 05:28 PM
Advanced Member
 
nalthien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 330 Post(s)
Liked: 369
I think everyone knows that I've gone big on measuring over the past few weeks. I agree with everything that's been said here. It's really important to keep perspective: you are NOT going to get it perfect. You don't have a perfect room. Your position options are limited. Your budget is limited. You don't have treatments. I've personally found several really important insights from using REW:
  1. Sometimes, extremely minor adjustments make a huge difference! Honestly, I completely eliminated one particular deep null with about a 3" adjustment. It allowed me to make the best possible choices within my constraints.
  2. Uncovering random issues. I never would have found my gain issue without REW.
  3. Integrating multiple subwoofers. Honestly, the moment you go multiple, you need to measure. Even with Audyssey XT32, you can end up with some phase issues. REW will help you get this dialed in.

I'm not chasing perfection. REW is a tool--a tool that I've used to improve my overall system. I do believe that everyone can benefit from measuring and tweaking. I also believe that everyone can benefit from keeping perspective!
ahblaza likes this.

A: Marantz AV7702 | McIntosh C2300 | McIntosh MC452 | Martin Logan Theos | Martin Logan Motif X | PSA S3000i (x2)
V: Vizio P702UI-b3
S: VPI Traveler v2 | Ps3 | Roku 3 | Apple TV | Parasound Zdac
Best ID Subwoofers by Price and Vendor
nalthien is offline  
post #18819 of 22229 Old 04-24-2015, 06:04 PM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
I agree with everyone. At first I was pretty dissapointed with my REW results. I gave up for a couple weeks and then got over the fact that my room won't be perfect...however I decided if I can make small improvments here and there without spending a ton of money using REW then it's a good thing. This afternoon I set up an SVS AS EQ1 I bought from someone on this forum (thanks man I love it!). For the money I think this has been one of my better investments I have made so far. I still have some issues but this is just after one round and not doing any sub moving from where I had them. Black line is post EQ.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Pre and post EQ AS1.jpg
Views:	86
Size:	44.8 KB
ID:	684225  

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK

Last edited by Blaine Morrissey; 04-24-2015 at 07:11 PM.
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18820 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 07:56 AM
AVS Special Member
 
bear123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: PA
Posts: 3,865
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1061 Post(s)
Liked: 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaine Morrissey View Post
I agree with everyone. At first I was pretty dissapointed with my REW results. I gave up for a couple weeks and then got over the fact that my room won't be perfect...however I decided if I can make small improvments here and there without spending a ton of money using REW then it's a good thing. This afternoon I set up an SVS AS EQ1 I bought from someone on this forum (thanks man I love it!). For the money I think this has been one of my better investments I have made so far. I still have some issues but this is just after one round and not doing any sub moving from where I had them. Black line is post EQ.
If that graph is what you are using to get your in room FR dialed in, you are not getting a good picture of what you need to see. Without proper scaling, you will not be seeing an accurate or meaningful representation of your FR.

Rescale your dB axis to 45-105 dB, making sure that the graph is in 5 dB increments. Since what we want to achieve is typically +/- 3dB, having 20 dB increment masks peaks and dips too much. In other words, large 5 or 10 dB changes look minor. Applying eq to a graph that is basically unreadable may not improve anything.

Think of it this way to take things to extreme. If you scaled your graph from 0-500 dB, your FR would look flat as an arrow. The same response graphed 55-85 might look horribly uneven. A standard 45-105 gives more of a standard representation.
Alan P, nalthien and ahblaza like this.
bear123 is offline  
post #18821 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 08:01 AM
AVS Special Member
 
bear123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: PA
Posts: 3,865
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1061 Post(s)
Liked: 1601
Something I've been thinking about. PSA offers great quality speakers at reasonable prices, but they all require stands as they are not tall enough to be floor standing, even in the MTM-210. Some people prefer floor standers for aesthetic purposes. I wonder if it would be beneficial for PSA to offer an option with the MTM-210 to be available with a taller cab to be used as a floor standing setup with no stands. Even if it was a "false" bottom section so that it would not affect the design. Because I would think that they are losing sales with people that want a floor standing speaker without stands.

Last edited by bear123; 04-25-2015 at 06:29 PM.
bear123 is offline  
post #18822 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 08:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Brian Fineberg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,214
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2209 Post(s)
Liked: 1900
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Something I've been thinking about. PSA offers great quality speakers at reasonable prices, but they all require stands as they are not tall enough to be floor standing, even in the MTM-210. Some people prefer floorstanders for asthetic purposes. I wonder if it would be beneficial for PSA to offer an option with the MTM-210 to be available with a taller cab to be used as a floorstanding setup with no stands. Even if it was a "false" bottom section so that it would not affect the design. Because I would think that they are losing sales with people that want a floorstanding speaker without stands.
Errrr what you are describing are in essence stands lol. Either way the consumer is paying for stands or more cab. So I think if psa offered stands that would suffice for what you are describing
gbreda likes this.
Brian Fineberg is online now  
post #18823 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 08:39 AM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
If that graph is what you are using to get your in room FR dialed in, you are not getting a good picture of what you need to see. Without proper scaling, you will not be seeing an accurate or meaningful representation of your FR.

Rescale your dB axis to 45-105 dB, making sure that the graph is in 5 dB increments. Since what we want to achieve is typically +/- 3dB, having 20 dB increment masks peaks and dips too much. In other words, large 5 or 10 dB changes look minor. Applying eq to a graph that is basically unreadable may not improve anything.

Think of it this way to take things to extreme. If you scaled your graph from 0-500 dB, your FR would look flat as an arrow. The same response graphed 55-85 might look horribly uneven. A standard 45-105 gives more of a standard representation.
Makes total sense bear i will do that after a bit.

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18824 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 08:48 AM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Something I've been thinking about. PSA offers great quality speakers at reasonable prices, but they all require stands as they are not tall enough to be floor standing, even in the MTM-210. Some people prefer floorstanders for asthetic purposes. I wonder if it would be beneficial for PSA to offer an option with the MTM-210 to be available with a taller cab to be used as a floorstanding setup with no stands. Even if it was a "false" bottom section so that it would not affect the design. Because I would think that they are losing sales with people that want a floorstanding speaker without stands.
I like the idea, with kids and dogs running around i prefer the stability. My daughter is older now so i would not be as concerned. I built the MTM's i have not only because they were supposed to sound good but are extremely sturdy when little ones are running around. Of course this was when they were in the living room and i did not have a dedicated theater. Now i would really like to try the 110's.
gbreda likes this.

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18825 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 08:56 AM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by sinisanav View Post
Guys, that is exactly why I am fighting the urge to buy a mic and start REWing. As I know that I would probably get hung up on the minute details instead of enjoying what I have.
XT does good with EQ, I new that in my first cavernous, odd shaped media room just by ear, listening to stuff with and then without Audyssey. I thought, shoudl I REW but then just decided to rely on my ears and enjoy. One thing I missed is the low end and tactile feel as built-in Supercube 1 in my towers could just not go deep or strong enough to fill in 5400 cubic ft of odd shaped space.
So, I continue to fight in the new space where I finally got acoustical treatments as well, which helped a lot with clarity of sound and seamlesness of the soundstage. Just again, measured with my ears.
Built in subs are doing better in my new 1500 cubic ft HT but I want to try to see how having real subs will change the 15-25 Hz range experience. So after looking out, reading, talking, emailing for last 2-3 months ( Rhytmik/SVS/HSU/DT) I think I narrowed it down to a trial of either XS15se or S1500 (hopefully duals).
I will hook them up , fire up Anti-mode 8033 ( which I spent again about 3 months researching online ) and let that little box EQ them nicely and then, listen and feel. No graphs.
I didn't think the 8033 did dual subs....does it do all the delay/phase adjusting for two? I thought you had to jump to the 2.0 to handle duals.

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18826 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 09:18 AM
Advanced Member
 
nalthien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 330 Post(s)
Liked: 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Some people prefer floorstanders for asthetic purposes.
I prefer floorstanders for both aesthetic and safety purposes. One of the great things about the current Martin Logan designs is that they are extremely bottom heavy. One of the original motivations for me to replace my Motion 40s was seeing my 3 year-old (at the time) push one over when he got mad. His sister (1) was only a couple of feet from having the speaker land on her. At that point, I knew I either had to go wall-mounted or with the ML ESL.

Since I'd always wanted ESLs anyway...

I have some old Boston Acoustic bookshelves that I was using upstairs in my office. I put them on stands at one point; but, since the speakers didn't attach to the stand, that was an even more dangerous proposition--I sold the stands and moved the speakers onto a dresser in my bedroom. Even with attached stands, being top-heavy is not a good feature in a home with kids.
Mike Butny, ahblaza and gbreda like this.

A: Marantz AV7702 | McIntosh C2300 | McIntosh MC452 | Martin Logan Theos | Martin Logan Motif X | PSA S3000i (x2)
V: Vizio P702UI-b3
S: VPI Traveler v2 | Ps3 | Roku 3 | Apple TV | Parasound Zdac
Best ID Subwoofers by Price and Vendor
nalthien is offline  
post #18827 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 09:19 AM
Senior Member
 
gbreda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 461
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 243 Post(s)
Liked: 304
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Something I've been thinking about. PSA offers great quality speakers at reasonable prices, but they all require stands as they are not tall enough to be floor standing, even in the MTM-210. Some people prefer floorstanders for asthetic purposes. I wonder if it would be beneficial for PSA to offer an option with the MTM-210 to be available with a taller cab to be used as a floorstanding setup with no stands. Even if it was a "false" bottom section so that it would not affect the design. Because I would think that they are losing sales with people that want a floorstanding speaker without stands.
I mentioned this to Tom back when I got my 210's. At the time he wasnt sure abut offering floor standing speakers or maybe some kind of stand for the current line. Now that we see all the new subs released and still working on a V3600 it looks like those probably took priority. Is it possible that they wanted to see what speakers sales would be like before devoting more time to that area? I dont know but it makes sense to me.
gbreda is offline  
post #18828 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 09:26 AM
Senior Member
 
gbreda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 461
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 243 Post(s)
Liked: 304
Quote:
Originally Posted by nalthien View Post
I prefer floorstanders for both aesthetic and safety purposes. One of the great things about the current Martin Logan designs is that they are extremely bottom heavy. One of the original motivations for me to replace my Motion 40s was seeing my 3 year-old (at the time) push one over when he got mad. His sister (1) was only a couple of feet from having the speaker land on her. At that point, I knew I either had to go wall-mounted or with the ML ESL.

Since I'd always wanted ESLs anyway...

I have some old Boston Acoustic bookshelves that I was using upstairs in my office. I put them on stands at one point; but, since the speakers didn't attach to the stand, that was an even more dangerous proposition--I sold the stands and moved the speakers onto a dresser in my bedroom. Even with attached stands, being top-heavy is not a good feature in a home with kids.
These are the same thoughts I have about putting the 210's on any stands I have seen. Right now each one is on 2 pieces of the packing material and then a piece of plywood for stability with the whole thing covered in heavy black fabric. It actually works well and looks pretty good-no complaints from my better half. This is temporary until I either make black stands similar to this (but a little taller) or see if 2 subs will work as stands and give good performance.

Last edited by gbreda; 04-25-2015 at 09:37 AM.
gbreda is offline  
post #18829 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 10:21 AM
Senior Member
 
majek 60's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 210
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 76 Post(s)
Liked: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Something I've been thinking about. PSA offers great quality speakers at reasonable prices, but they all require stands as they are not tall enough to be floor standing, even in the MTM-210. Some people prefer floorstanders for asthetic purposes. I wonder if it would be beneficial for PSA to offer an option with the MTM-210 to be available with a taller cab to be used as a floorstanding setup with no stands. Even if it was a "false" bottom section so that it would not affect the design. Because I would think that they are losing sales with people that want a floorstanding speaker without stands.
Even though my purchase and decision went smooth, the stand situation.................well (I ended up DIY, and I am happy with the results) could have been much easier if they were floor standing, your suggestion bear, would have made my set-up a whole lot easier, and the extra cost would have been a no brainer.

majek 60 is offline  
post #18830 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 10:53 AM
AVS Special Member
 
jbrown15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Vancouver B.C.
Posts: 8,106
Mentioned: 22 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2255 Post(s)
Liked: 1701
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Something I've been thinking about. PSA offers great quality speakers at reasonable prices, but they all require stands as they are not tall enough to be floor standing, even in the MTM-210. Some people prefer floorstanders for asthetic purposes. I wonder if it would be beneficial for PSA to offer an option with the MTM-210 to be available with a taller cab to be used as a floorstanding setup with no stands. Even if it was a "false" bottom section so that it would not affect the design. Because I would think that they are losing sales with people that want a floorstanding speaker without stands.

I wonder if they'd be interested in doing something like what Ascend Acoustics does with the stands that they offer for the 340 LCR speakers. Which is basically a matching base that the speakers sits in making the speaker look like a tower speakers. They could have their cabinet shop build them and spray them to match the finish of the speakers.

The Ascend 340 speakers attach to the stand with a bracket too, just a thought.
jbrown15 is online now  
post #18831 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 10:58 AM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
If that graph is what you are using to get your in room FR dialed in, you are not getting a good picture of what you need to see. Without proper scaling, you will not be seeing an accurate or meaningful representation of your FR.

Rescale your dB axis to 45-105 dB, making sure that the graph is in 5 dB increments. Since what we want to achieve is typically +/- 3dB, having 20 dB increment masks peaks and dips too much. In other words, large 5 or 10 dB changes look minor. Applying eq to a graph that is basically unreadable may not improve anything.

Think of it this way to take things to extreme. If you scaled your graph from 0-500 dB, your FR would look flat as an arrow. The same response graphed 55-85 might look horribly uneven. A standard 45-105 gives more of a standard representation.
Where do I change it to get the 5db increments? I see the limits where I can adjust to the range you specify but it shows in 10 db increments not 5 still.

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18832 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 11:03 AM
Advanced Member
 
nalthien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 330 Post(s)
Liked: 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaine Morrissey View Post
Where do I change it to get the 5db increments? I see the limits where I can adjust to the range you specify but it shows in 10 db increments not 5 still.
You'll need to make the window larger and / or load less measurements simultaneously so the legend takes up less space.

A: Marantz AV7702 | McIntosh C2300 | McIntosh MC452 | Martin Logan Theos | Martin Logan Motif X | PSA S3000i (x2)
V: Vizio P702UI-b3
S: VPI Traveler v2 | Ps3 | Roku 3 | Apple TV | Parasound Zdac
Best ID Subwoofers by Price and Vendor
nalthien is offline  
post #18833 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 11:09 AM
Member
 
sinisanav's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 178
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 88 Post(s)
Liked: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaine Morrissey View Post
I didn't think the 8033 did dual subs....does it do all the delay/phase adjusting for two? I thought you had to jump to the 2.0 to handle duals.
8033 will handle two, or even 4 subs, that are basically all going from LFE output with Y splitter, so receiving same signal.
If you want stereo subs with line level feed L and R then one needs to upgrade to 2.0.

Nice thing about 8033 is that after the fact I have option boosting 20 or 25 or 30HZ or leave all flat, depending on the material and/or preference.

Change is the only constant.

My HT: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/19-ded...l#post32691273
sinisanav is offline  
post #18834 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 11:11 AM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaine Morrissey View Post
Where do I change it to get the 5db increments? I see the limits where I can adjust to the range you specify but it shows in 10 db increments not 5 still.
Nevermind I got it. Had to go up a little from 45 to get it to switch to 5db increments.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Pre and post EQ AS1 (2).jpg
Views:	56
Size:	64.1 KB
ID:	685689  

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18835 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 11:19 AM
Member
 
Blaine Morrissey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pleasant Hill, Iowa
Posts: 115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 61 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by sinisanav View Post
8033 will handle two, or even 4 subs, that are basically all going from LFE output with Y splitter, so receiving same signal.
If you want stereo subs with line level feed L and R then one needs to upgrade to 2.0.

Nice thing about 8033 is that after the fact I have option boosting 20 or 25 or 30HZ or leave all flat, depending on the material and/or preference.
I don't think it does much for phase/distance or whatever it is adjustments though. I looked through the manual and it says to let your AVR do that so it won't get the best combination of the two if your AVR doesn't have separate dual outs. Looking at the specs you just have 2 outputs one is a 180 phase adjustment from the other. It would be nice if it would adjust that independently between the two to find the best combination. I think that's where the 2.0 comes in.

Pioneer Elite SC-63 | OPPO BDP-103D | PSA v1500 | SVS PB 12 NSD/v | SVS AS-EQ1 | GR Research A/V-3 | VOLT 10LX Edition (build in progress) | Onix Rocket ELT DPA | Epson 3020 | Dragonfly 120 Screen | APC H15BLK

Last edited by Blaine Morrissey; 04-25-2015 at 11:28 AM.
Blaine Morrissey is offline  
post #18836 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 02:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
bear123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: PA
Posts: 3,865
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1061 Post(s)
Liked: 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post
Errrr what you are describing are in essence stands lol. Either way the consumer is paying for stands or more cab. So I think if psa offered stands that would suffice for what you are describing
From a functional standpoint of getting the speakers up off the floor to the correct height, yes it is the same thing as stands. However, from an aesthetic standpoint of people that want a floor standing tower speaker without stands, this might make them a more appealing option to more people. Even if there was say, a $100 up charge per speaker. Include a wider base for stability, eliminating the cost of stands. So it wouldn't even be that big of a cost difference to the user.
ahblaza likes this.

Last edited by bear123; 04-25-2015 at 06:28 PM.
bear123 is offline  
post #18837 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 03:39 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Brian Fineberg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,214
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2209 Post(s)
Liked: 1900
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
From a functional standpoint of getting the speakers up off the floor to the correct height, yes it is the same thing as stands. However, from an asthetic standpoint of people that want a floorstanding tower speaker without stands, this might make them a more appealing option to more people. Even if there was say, a $100 upcharge per speaker. Include a wider base for stability, eliminating the cost of stands. So it wouldn't even be that big of a cost difference to the user.
I hear what your saying. But then again. Let's be honest. These aren't aesthetically appealing no matter how you look at it
Brian Fineberg is online now  
post #18838 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 06:11 PM
AVS Special Member
 
bear123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: PA
Posts: 3,865
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1061 Post(s)
Liked: 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post
I hear what your saying. But then again. Let's be honest. These aren't aesthetically appealing no matter how you look at it
Haha I suppose that is true....more of a home theater/subwoofer/turn the lights out kind of finish. Is it the same finish as the subs(which I really like for the subs)?
bear123 is offline  
post #18839 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 06:16 PM
Advanced Member
 
nalthien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 777
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 330 Post(s)
Liked: 369
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
Haha I suppose that is true....more of a home theater/subwoofer/turn the lights out kind of finish. Is it the same finish as the subs(which I really like for the subs)?
I like it for the subs too. My wife took one look at it when the V1500 arrived and said, "You're not putting that front and center in my living room!"

A: Marantz AV7702 | McIntosh C2300 | McIntosh MC452 | Martin Logan Theos | Martin Logan Motif X | PSA S3000i (x2)
V: Vizio P702UI-b3
S: VPI Traveler v2 | Ps3 | Roku 3 | Apple TV | Parasound Zdac
Best ID Subwoofers by Price and Vendor
nalthien is offline  
post #18840 of 22229 Old 04-25-2015, 06:50 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Hopinater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Central VA
Posts: 2,844
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 726 Post(s)
Liked: 1856
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post
I hear what your saying. But then again. Let's be honest. These aren't aesthetically appealing no matter how you look at it
WHAT??? You don't think these speakers are aesthetically appealing?

Yeah they are a little utilitarian in looks but for some reason I really like the finish on them. I don't know why but there's something about it that I like. Having said that, I have them in a darker room and I doubt my wife would want them in the living room (but I wouldn't mind).

Bear, to answer your question it is the same finish as the subwoofers.
Hopinater is offline  
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Tags
Xs30 , Velodyne Sms 1 In Room Bass Correction Kit With Included Microphone , Denon Avr 3313ci Receiver , Denon Avr 4520ci Receiver , Power Sound Audio , Xv15 , Power Sound Audio Triax , Room Equilizer Wizard Rew , Denon Avr X4000 7 2 Channel Home Theater Receiver
Gear in this thread

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off