Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 628 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #18811 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 10:47 AM
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Had the S1500 delivered yesterday. I ran Audyssey this morning and it came back at –14.5. All knobs are set at 12 o’clock and all speakers are set to small. I’m not getting the “thump” I’m used to. I go back and forth between my old sub and the S1500 and the old has more “thump.” I will say that the S1500 sounds much “smoother,” and maybe that is the way its supposed to sound, but in order the get the thump I have to turn the gain to 3 o’clock. CDs sound very quiet at 12 o’clock. This just may be a listening adjustment going from a 100W, 16-year-old sub to the PSA, but I want to make sure I’m not missing something. It could also be one is ported and the other isn't.
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post #18812 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Aliens View Post
Had the S1500 delivered yesterday. I ran Audyssey this morning and it came back at –14.5. All knobs are set at 12 o’clock and all speakers are set to small. I’m not getting the “thump” I’m used to. I go back and forth between my old sub and the S1500 and the old has more “thump.” I will say that the S1500 sounds much “smoother,” and maybe that is the way its supposed to sound, but in order the get the thump I have to turn the gain to 3 o’clock. CDs sound very quiet at 12 o’clock. This just may be a listening adjustment going from a 100W, 16-year-old sub to the PSA, but I want to make sure I’m not missing something. It could also be one is ported and the other isn't.
After running Audysey, turn up the sub trim in your AVR 3-6 dB(between -11.5 and -8.5). Don't touch the gain knob after Audysey as you don't know if you are turning the sub up 2, 5, 10, or 20 dB. This 3-6 dB increase in output post Audysey should give you what you are looking for.

Also, if there is a crossover setting, it should not be randomly set to 12:00. Max it out...might be labeled as 150 when turned to full. Otherwise, you will be adding a crossover slope to your sub on top of the crossover slope that your AVR already applied.
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post #18813 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
After running Audysey, turn up the sub trim in your AVR 3-6 dB(between -11.5 and -8.5). Don't touch the gain knob after Audysey as you don't know if you are turning the sub up 2, 5, 10, or 20 dB. This 3-6 dB increase in output post Audysey should give you what you are looking for.

Also, if there is a crossover setting, it should not be randomly set to 12:00. Max it out...might be labeled as 150 when turned to full.
Good advice. With my XV15, I'm running 6.0db hot (from Audyssey's calibration) with Audyssey's Dynamic EQ OFF and I couldn't be happier.

Samsung UN60D6420 ~ DirecTV HR-44 ~ Sony S5100 BD ~ Roku 3 ~ Denon AVR-X3200W ~ SVS Prime Bookshelf L/R ~ SVS Prime Satellite Surrounds ~ MultEQ XT L/R Bypass ~ Power Sound Audio XV15
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post #18814 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
After running Audysey, turn up the sub trim in your AVR 3-6 dB(between -11.5 and -8.5). Don't touch the gain knob after Audysey as you don't know if you are turning the sub up 2, 5, 10, or 20 dB. This 3-6 dB increase in output post Audysey should give you what you are looking for.

Also, if there is a crossover setting, it should not be randomly set to 12:00. Max it out...might be labeled as 150 when turned to full. Otherwise, you will be adding a crossover slope to your sub on top of the crossover slope that your AVR already applied.
I went with the 6 and that did it. Thanks. I had the crossover set at 80; in the interest of saving space I used the 12 as approximate for all knobs.
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post #18815 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 01:02 PM
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I went with the 6 and that did it. Thanks. I had the crossover set at 80; in the interest of saving space I used the 12 as approximate for all knobs.
Yeah, don't set the crossover to 80 on the sub. If you are setting it to 80 in your AVR, you need to turn the sub crossover to 150. Otherwise you are applying a double slope and will hurt your FR.

Glad the bump fixed your output! Enjoy
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post #18816 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 02:15 PM
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I suppose the benefit of the anti-mode is that it is a stand alone unit that you can keep as you(or anyone) endlessly upgrade your AVR over time as we tend to do. On the other hand, if you upgrade to a high quality AVR with XT32 and SUB EQ HT as you mention, which does independently set up dual subs, it does eliminate most of the need or benefit of a stand alone eq unit. Of course, the flexibility you get from external eq, imo, is adding in custom FR curves, such as house curves for below reference listening. Some people even program in strong house curves for reference level listening if they have enough output capability.

I used the miniDSP to put in about a 5 dB house curve when I was running my dual XV15se's. So in reality, when I was watching movies at my normal level of -15, the bass was only 5 below reference(5 dB hot plus a 5 dD house curve). This has the advantage of not muddying up the bass in the mid an upper bass levels. Ten hot over the entire FR would sound pretty bad.
Hey Bear I have a miniDSP so if I get an XT32 SUB EQ receiver I can do what you just said, adding a house curve. Is this difficult to do (adding a house curve), this is done with the mini and REW or no? In other words I can add a house curve (5dB) with miniDSP regardless of what AVR I have, correct? I just don't understand at what frequencies the 5dB house curve would effect? TIA
@Hop thanks Bro.
Cheers Jeff
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post #18817 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 02:26 PM
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You can setup the house curve however you want. I will attach a graph to illustrate the house curve I used. If I remember, I started mine around 40 Hz and increased output as the frequency descended down to 20 Hz or so, by 5 dB. So in other words, the low end stuff for movies was louder without turning up the AVR trim, but it sounded correct with music. You can select what frequency you want the house curve to start, how many dB you want to increase, and how far down you want it to extend. Not sure if I still have the miniDSP software...I'll check.

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post #18818 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 02:40 PM
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Ok here is how I did it. Open REW. Use the sweep that you want to set your house curve on. When you select EQ, there is a menu on the right hand side in which you select the equalizer type, which would be miniDSP. Under target settings, set speaker type to none.
LF Rise Start = 50
LF Rise End = 20
LF Rise slope = 4

These settings caused REW to put in the house curve shown in the previous graph and sets your PEQ filters appropriately.
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post #18819 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by sinisanav View Post
It does more, it can separately EQ two subs ( true stereo subs), also has the screen where you can see the response graphs and it has more options for more detailed tweaking. it is also 3 times the price. But has excellent reviews
HEY SIN, is the 2.0 more or less a XT32 SUB EQ HT and miniDSP unit all in one case. I'm just trying to figure out a couple of options.

HAVE: REW + UMIK-1, miniDSP and XT AVR.

OPTIONS: 1 Get a XT32 receiver and separate Antimode 8033-SII

OPTION: 2 Get a XT32 SUB EQ HT Receiver and use (REW + UMIK-1 and miniDSP that I have)

Option: # Get a Dual Core 2.0 and use my XT Receiver with UMIK-1 and miniDSP

Any suggestions really appreciated..............TIA

Cheers Jeffrey
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post #18820 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 02:54 PM
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Ok here is how I did it. Open REW. Use the sweep that you want to set your house curve on. When you select EQ, there is a menu on the right hand side in which you select the equalizer type, which would be miniDSP. Under target settings, set speaker type to none.
LF Rise Start = 50
LF Rise End = 20
LF Rise slope = 4

These settings caused REW to put in the house curve shown in the previous graph and sets your PEQ filters appropriately.
This is great Bear, now I have to figure out how to put the miniDSP into the chain and use the downloaded plug-in...........still in the box

Then I have to get a sweep that looks like yours correct or does that not matter?
Jeffrey
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post #18821 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 04:01 PM
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HEY SIN, is the 2.0 more or less a XT32 SUB EQ HT and miniDSP unit all in one case. I'm just trying to figure out a couple of options.

HAVE: REW + UMIK-1, miniDSP and XT AVR.

OPTIONS: 1 Get a XT32 receiver and separate Antimode 8033-SII

OPTION: 2 Get a XT32 SUB EQ HT Receiver and use (REW + UMIK-1 and miniDSP that I have)

Option: # Get a Dual Core 2.0 and use my XT Receiver with UMIK-1 and miniDSP

Any suggestions really appreciated..............TIA

Cheers Jeffrey
Jeffrey,

If I were in your shoes, and you have the budget for a good AVR, I would get an XT32 receiver with sub EQ HT, use REW to get your response as good as you can prior to Audysey, and then just let Audysey do its thing. More than likely, this is going to get you a very good in room FR. At that point, do some listening. Kick back and enjoy your system. Watch a bunch of movies. If, after a couple of months, you feel like you are missing something, then investigate which option (i.e. miniDSP, anti-mode etc), would be best for putting in a house curve if desired.

At that point, the other thing I would suggest you look into if you want to take your system to the next level would be to hire a competent audio calibrator to come in and treat the room.
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post #18822 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 04:53 PM
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Jeffrey,

If I were in your shoes, and you have the budget for a good AVR, I would get an XT32 receiver with sub EQ HT, use REW to get your response as good as you can prior to Audysey, and then just let Audysey do its thing. More than likely, this is going to get you a very good in room FR. At that point, do some listening. Kick back and enjoy your system. Watch a bunch of movies. If, after a couple of months, you feel like you are missing something, then investigate which option (i.e. miniDSP, anti-mode etc), would be best for putting in a house curve if desired.

At that point, the other thing I would suggest you look into if you want to take your system to the next level would be to hire a competent audio calibrator to come in and treat the room.
Hey Bear, I couldn't of asked for a better answer, thank you so much for that, I'm going to do exactly what you said and take a break from all of this and enjoy what I have. I may be perfectly happy doing just what you said and if I did want to take it to the next level I would hire someone to calibrate and treat the room. Again my friend thanks.
Cheers Jeff
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post #18823 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 04:59 PM
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Hey Bear, I couldn't of asked for a better answer, thank you so much for that, I'm going to do exactly what you said and take a break from all of this and enjoy what I have. I may be perfectly happy doing just what you said and if I did want to take it to the next level I would hire someone to calibrate and treat the room. Again my friend thanks.
Cheers Jeff
No problem bud...I've seen plenty of guys with dual subs and Sub EQ HT with amazing FR plots, so I really think getting rid of any nulls with REW and just letting ARC do its thing will have you good to go. Don't forget, with the quality of subs and speakers that you currently have, your system is probably more capable than 99% of those who are into home theater and audio.

It's easy to lose sight of how amazing our systems are compared to what the general public is aware of. I demo'd my single sealed sub for a buddy from work. Even though I had tried to explain to him the difference a good sub makes, he was absolutely dumbfounded when he heard my system.
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post #18824 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 05:07 PM
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HEY SIN, is the 2.0 more or less a XT32 SUB EQ HT and miniDSP unit all in one case. I'm just trying to figure out a couple of options.

HAVE: REW + UMIK-1, miniDSP and XT AVR.

OPTIONS: 1 Get a XT32 receiver and separate Antimode 8033-SII

OPTION: 2 Get a XT32 SUB EQ HT Receiver and use (REW + UMIK-1 and miniDSP that I have)

Option: # Get a Dual Core 2.0 and use my XT Receiver with UMIK-1 and miniDSP

Any suggestions really appreciated..............TIA

Cheers Jeffrey
Depends how happy you are with your present AVR ( or how many more years it has in it).

If your general plan is to upgrade the AVR in next year or so then go for AVR with XT32. Antimode 8033-SII will not help you any more then XT32 would do, from what I read on different forums etc because XT32 was made to do exactly what Antimode is for. You can then REW to fine tune if you chose so.

If you are staying with your XT AVR for next few years, then depends how detailed you want to be with equalizing your subs. If you want to get the last ounce out of them then its 1000$ for Dual Core 2.0 but then you probably don't need to bother extra with UMIK and miniDSP (dual Core has screen with graphs).
If you are like me, without sweating the graphs too much,and spending too much, then Antimode 8033-SII will be enough.

My pre-pro is Onkyo PR-SC 885 from 2007. It works great , has XT, and I will use it until it breaks. When it does I am more then certain that my next preamp will have XT32. at that time I will probably switch my Antimode to family room to help the little sub there.
Hope it helps Jeff.

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post #18825 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 05:07 PM
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No problem bud...I've seen plenty of guys with dual subs and Sub EQ HT with amazing FR plots, so I really think getting rid of any nulls with REW and just letting ARC do its thing will have you good to go. Don't forget, with the quality of subs and speakers that you currently have, your system is probably more capable than 99% of those who are into home theater and audio.
Man you just really made me feel so good when I was feeling so low. I forgot to mention how proud I am of you as I read your whole DIY sub thread and was absolutely amazed what you took on as a 1st timer, great job bud, I really mean that.

Hey Bear what is your take on this, the author of REW.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...-new-post.html

Should I install this version or leave well enough alone, you know I value your opinion.
Cheers Jeff
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post #18826 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 05:16 PM
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Man you just really made me feel so good when I was feeling so low. I forgot to mention how proud I am of you as I read your whole DIY sub thread and was absolutely amazed what you took on as a 1st timer, great job bud, I really mean that.

Hey Bear what is your take on this, the author of REW.

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...-new-post.html

Should I install this version or leave well enough alone, you know I value your opinion.
Cheers Jeff
Jeff,


Have you thought about trying out the demo Dirac that you can download and try out for free? The more I read it sounds like MiniDSP's DDRC-88A with Dirac is pretty awesome at room correction, maybe that might be something to take a look into?
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post #18827 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 05:36 PM
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Jeff,


Have you thought about trying out the demo Dirac that you can download and try out for free? The more I read it sounds like MiniDSP's DDRC-88A with Dirac is pretty awesome at room correction, maybe that might be something to take a look into?
I'm looking for plug and play options after using REW to get the best FR graphs. like XT32 SUB EQ HT in the next week or so, either Denon 4520, Onkyo 1010 or Integra 60.5, I'm getting one of those three. Selling off my amps to fund these purchases and save up for a couple of V3600s when available
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post #18828 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 06:08 PM
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I'm looking for plug and play options after using REW to get the best FR graphs. like XT32 SUB EQ HT in the next week or so, either Denon 4520, Onkyo 1010 or Integra 60.5, I'm getting one of those three. Selling off my amps to fund these purchases and save up for a couple of V3600s when available
I was just thinking you were due for new subs
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post #18829 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 07:39 PM
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I was just thinking you were due for new subs
Yeah Randy, I had these dual XS30SEs for about six months, time to move on or get two more, one in each corner problem solved
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post #18830 of 31459 Old 04-26-2015, 10:00 PM
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Grab two more I say! If I was a cabinet maker I'd patent a recliner with built in subs (underneath) for shear bearish impact... No bass shakers required then! Oh and it would have a fridge in one arm rest also!!!
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post #18831 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 01:13 AM
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Red face

S1500 size comparison to the SB12 NSD. Have a SB13U coming in next week will be doing a performance comparison between the two. Will be keeping only one of the two after the comparison.

EDIT : s1500 not s3000
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post #18832 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 04:45 AM
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S3000 size comparison to the SB12 NSD. Have a SB13U coming in next week will be doing a performance comparison between the two. Will be keeping only one of the two after the comparison.
Enjoy the S3000 then!
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post #18833 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 08:43 AM
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Calling all experts...


I'm about to start my acoustic project. This is not the actual product, just for reference. The local building supply has the CertainTeed, R-11 Soundshield. Comes in 2'X8'X3 1/2" strips (16 total). Not referenced on Bob Golds site. Great price @ $87. I know to remove the backing; will this be acceptable for making panels? I'm trying to avoid the high shipping costs of other products.
read this site, it has quite a bit of info about DIY ( and in general) acoustical treatments, quite educational.
http://ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

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post #18834 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 08:55 AM
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S3000 size comparison to the SB12 NSD. Have a SB13U coming in next week will be doing a performance comparison between the two. Will be keeping only one of the two after the comparison.


Looking forward to reading your thoughts....I have a tiny inkling the S3000i will be staying... Seeing that it ( 3000i) digs even deeper & has better extension vs. my XS30se... I am fairly confident you'll love the 3000i.


See sig....not entirely sure on the dimensions of the new 3000i but you can see how the SB13U sits nicely atop my xs30 se.


Just my 2 cents...
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post #18835 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 10:05 AM
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I'm looking for plug and play options after using REW to get the best FR graphs. like XT32 SUB EQ HT in the next week or so, either Denon 4520, Onkyo 1010 or Integra 60.5, I'm getting one of those three. Selling off my amps to fund these purchases and save up for a couple of V3600s when available
We should have the Anti-Mode products available before too long on the website too. They are about as "plug and play" as you can get..

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post #18836 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 10:13 AM
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eagerly awaiting....
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Looking forward to reading your thoughts....I have a tiny inkling the S3000i will be staying... Seeing that it ( 3000i) digs even deeper & has better extension vs. my XS30se... I am fairly confident you'll love the 3000i.


See sig....not entirely sure on the dimensions of the new 3000i but you can see how the SB13U sits nicely atop my xs30 se.


Just my 2 cents...
Sorry for the typo I have an s1500 not 3000.

I will do do my best to provide as much information as possible. Right now I am running the s1500 in a not so ideal location with some very small speakers crossed over at 150hz.

Next week I will have the ultra and s1500 paired with larger bookshelfs ( svs ultra 5.0 ). Tip my hat off to PSA the s1500 is a high quality product, the driver and amp are top notch. I was able to get a good deal on the svs ultra which made it make sense to buy and compare to the 1500 and keep the one I feel is best for my situation. Now the svs overall design might already gives it an edge because I will be running duals and aesthetics is an important component of my decision. With that said the PSA is a heck of lot easier to keep clean and maintain and personally I like the look, wife feels differently tho.
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post #18838 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
We should have the Anti-Mode products available before too long on the website too. They are about as "plug and play" as you can get..

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Tom can you elaborate a little about how you tested these and what the results were?

Do you think they are a fit in all applications, or just some small rooms, single sub vs. multi subs?
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post #18839 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 02:11 PM
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Originally Posted by majek 60 View Post
Tom can you elaborate a little about how you tested these and what the results were?

Do you think they are a fit in all applications, or just some small rooms, single sub vs. multi subs?
I've spent a good bit of time with both the 8033 models. I've done a mix of single sub, single seat and single sub, multiple seats. I hope to have some time soon to try dual subs/single seat and dual subs/multiple seats soon with both 8033s.

The dual core is a different beast altogether. Much more flexible than I thought. It can EQ dual subs in a 5.2 system(or 7.2 or 9.2), or a 2.0, 2.1 or 2.2 system. The dual core 2.0 will also highpass the mains in this scenario too. So it will provide DAC, highpass, and EQ the speakers and the subs. Pretty sweet little box.

http://www.dspeaker.com/en/technolog...examples.shtml

I can already envision some 2.0 MT110 and MTM210 package deals.

Based on my experience so far I'd say these products will provide audible benefits to just about any room environment. We'll do the normal 30 day audition too so our customers can all try them out and make their own decision.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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post #18840 of 31459 Old 04-27-2015, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by deepat04 View Post
Sorry for the typo I have an s1500 not 3000.

I will do do my best to provide as much information as possible. Right now I am running the s1500 in a not so ideal location with some very small speakers crossed over at 150hz.

Next week I will have the ultra and s1500 paired with larger bookshelfs ( svs ultra 5.0 ). Tip my hat off to PSA the s1500 is a high quality product, the driver and amp are top notch. I was able to get a good deal on the svs ultra which made it make sense to buy and compare to the 1500 and keep the one I feel is best for my situation. Now the svs overall design might already gives it an edge because I will be running duals and aesthetics is an important component of my decision. With that said the PSA is a heck of lot easier to keep clean and maintain and personally I like the look, wife feels differently tho.
Ah...that will make for a much fairer comparison...dimensions are about the same for both...fit and finish is a personal choice. I've seen the black texture used on the PSA, its very nice & appears maintenance free. Not a big fan of PB gloss as they're dust magnets the alternate finish used by Svs is more my style...one reason why I chose PSA was the veneer options available for that wife approval factor.

Good luck and report back your finding...I really enjoyed the SB13U...by all accounts the S1500 should be very bit its equal or more...it will be a tough call...flip of the coin, that's for sure.

Bill...
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Last edited by Billy p; 04-27-2015 at 02:48 PM.
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