Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 697 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #20881 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 12:19 PM
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Anyone interested in dual S3000i's, I just lowered price in the classified section.

Have to sell to offset cost of dual V3600i's😀
Holy Smokes!! … Dual V3600's!?

That's going to be FUN!
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post #20882 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 01:29 PM
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@bear123 , thanks for the reply! So basically, it's up to installing some thicker drywall for my place as my gear is already in the basement and brick really wouldn't go with the house, that I can see.
@bad1550 , what are your thoughts on the 2xV3600i vs 2xS3000i? Do you live on a farm with no neighbors within earshot?!?!

So here's a short little review on the V3600i that my neighbor purchased:

In one word: WOW! This thing is a monster. As you can see in the pictures, it takes up nearly the entire bed length of my F150 super crew. We actually picked it up from the local distribution center to save a day on delivery. (it is about a half mile away from work) The dock guys were pretty impressed and couldn't believe it was just one subwoofer and wanted a demo, but that wasn't going to happen right there.

For those wondering about shipping and handling, I don't have a picture of the pallet, but it's certainly a sturdy one made of some sort of MDF/plywood conglomerate and is sized just past the outer perimeter of the box and strapped down. I was happy to see it wasn't some generic pallet or poorly made that could allow it to slip and slide around during transport. There are also clear warnings for shipping companies to not stack anything on top of it - it gets its own ground on the truck, so there's no chance of it being squashed from the top.

We ended up unboxing it out in the garage and bringing it in through the slightly narrower door. It's not terribly difficult to move, but is certainly a two-person job. The plastic shipping bag is slippery against the surface of the box, so you'll want to heed caution or remove the plastic, as we did, to get the best grip. If you don't know already, FURNITURE MOVERS ARE YOUR BEST FRIEND when it comes to getting it in place and getting the amp tweaked, especially when maneuvering this behemoth.

Neither of us are used to ported subs, so this was quite a new venture. It was pretty crazy to see how loud something can be without there being much movement of the speaker! It really takes some cranking of the MV control before these drivers start moving. Once they do, hold on to your hat! Literally, it may blow away... I haven't setup REW yet through this sub, but he did setup an Anti-Mode 8033S-II in front of it to ensure smooth operation and calibration.

Succinctly, movie watching was supreme. There was no end in sight of output and I'm quite certain that our ears would cave before the output of the V3600i. Running it several dB hot shook the couch (~11ft away) viscerally and made the house ring and rattle like no tomorrow. Needless to say, he's got a lot of work to do to suppress the rattles! I believe War of the Worlds Pod Emergence Scene would reign as the #1 most impressive with this subwoofer. Throughout the playback, you could feel so much air; it was akin to having a fan on your feet for part of the movie! It was certainly difficult to watch the various ULF movie clips (Finding Nemo, WWZ, EoT, Tron, etc) without laughing! The output is purely insane for a mere 3000 cubic foot space. (That does lead to an open hallway and upstairs, so it may be considered A LOT more since nothing is sealed)

Music was also very impressive. Though I am only familiar with the boomy bass of ported car subs from other friends, the ported design the boys at PSA have come up with is incredible. Music certainly punches with authority across all ranges, leaving you satisfied. There's really nothing new to write here as most of us are familiar with the PSA sound by now, nearly 700 pages in.

With all the praises for the V3600i, after hearing a single S3000i (soon to be duals as I took delivery of my second this morning!) we much prefer the sound of the sealed S3000i. Both my neighbor and I felt there was more detail in sound for movies, but especially for music. The scene that sounded the most different was the aperture scene from Tron - I haven't measured it, but perhaps the output is simply below the tuning point of the sub? The next scene that was very different was the shuttle launch of Interstellar. While still a much louder and visceral experience, it lacked a certain detail to the sound. This was the scene we were anticipating the most because during my single S3000i demo at his house, my ears required equalization from the pressure, much like when flying in a plane.

At the end of the day, he's still very happy with his choice and will consider adding a sealed sub later for music. He's much more of a bass head than I am, so it's the perfect setup for him. Coming from a single sealed Ultimax 12", the V3600i is a ridiculous upgrade!

One thing neither of us had considered is the impact of these big boys on your TV. He has an LED-based Samsung 55" (see picture) and a 20Hz sine wave from either the S3000i or the V3600i will make the color distort quite a bit! I am not sure if something is defective or if there's anything he can do, but you don't notice it at all during movies with dynamic scenes, but if you have a static screen up, it's pretty blatant. Anyone else notice this or suggest a fix? Is there any reason to worry about cracking the screen? It does move a bit at higher levels, but nothing like you see windshields do with a Steve Meade 18".

One other thing to note is that on my neighbor's somewhat plush carpet, the V3600i can rock a bit when it's upright! During the EoT sweep, it moved back and forth probably 1/8" or more! It's not even close to worry about tipping over, but it is funny and also impressive to see what the 18" drivers can do!

Travis
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post #20883 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 02:48 PM
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@bear123 , thanks for the reply! So basically, it's up to installing some thicker drywall for my place as my gear is already in the basement and brick really wouldn't go with the house, that I can see.
@bad1550 , what are your thoughts on the 2xV3600i vs 2xS3000i? Do you live on a farm with no neighbors within earshot?!?!

So here's a short little review on the V3600i that my neighbor purchased:

In one word: WOW! This thing is a monster. As you can see in the pictures, it takes up nearly the entire bed length of my F150 super crew. We actually picked it up from the local distribution center to save a day on delivery. (it is about a half mile away from work) The dock guys were pretty impressed and couldn't believe it was just one subwoofer and wanted a demo, but that wasn't going to happen right there.

For those wondering about shipping and handling, I don't have a picture of the pallet, but it's certainly a sturdy one made of some sort of MDF/plywood conglomerate and is sized just past the outer perimeter of the box and strapped down. I was happy to see it wasn't some generic pallet or poorly made that could allow it to slip and slide around during transport. There are also clear warnings for shipping companies to not stack anything on top of it - it gets its own ground on the truck, so there's no chance of it being squashed from the top.

We ended up unboxing it out in the garage and bringing it in through the slightly narrower door. It's not terribly difficult to move, but is certainly a two-person job. The plastic shipping bag is slippery against the surface of the box, so you'll want to heed caution or remove the plastic, as we did, to get the best grip. If you don't know already, FURNITURE MOVERS ARE YOUR BEST FRIEND when it comes to getting it in place and getting the amp tweaked, especially when maneuvering this behemoth.

Neither of us are used to ported subs, so this was quite a new venture. It was pretty crazy to see how loud something can be without there being much movement of the speaker! It really takes some cranking of the MV control before these drivers start moving. Once they do, hold on to your hat! Literally, it may blow away... I haven't setup REW yet through this sub, but he did setup an Anti-Mode 8033S-II in front of it to ensure smooth operation and calibration.

Succinctly, movie watching was supreme. There was no end in sight of output and I'm quite certain that our ears would cave before the output of the V3600i. Running it several dB hot shook the couch (~11ft away) viscerally and made the house ring and rattle like no tomorrow. Needless to say, he's got a lot of work to do to suppress the rattles! I believe War of the Worlds Pod Emergence Scene would reign as the #1 most impressive with this subwoofer. Throughout the playback, you could feel so much air; it was akin to having a fan on your feet for part of the movie! It was certainly difficult to watch the various ULF movie clips (Finding Nemo, WWZ, EoT, Tron, etc) without laughing! The output is purely insane for a mere 3000 cubic foot space. (That does lead to an open hallway and upstairs, so it may be considered A LOT more since nothing is sealed)

Music was also very impressive. Though I am only familiar with the boomy bass of ported car subs from other friends, the ported design the boys at PSA have come up with is incredible. Music certainly punches with authority across all ranges, leaving you satisfied. There's really nothing new to write here as most of us are familiar with the PSA sound by now, nearly 700 pages in.

With all the praises for the V3600i, after hearing a single S3000i (soon to be duals as I took delivery of my second this morning!) we much prefer the sound of the sealed S3000i. Both my neighbor and I felt there was more detail in sound for movies, but especially for music. The scene that sounded the most different was the aperture scene from Tron - I haven't measured it, but perhaps the output is simply below the tuning point of the sub? The next scene that was very different was the shuttle launch of Interstellar. While still a much louder and visceral experience, it lacked a certain detail to the sound. This was the scene we were anticipating the most because during my single S3000i demo at his house, my ears required equalization from the pressure, much like when flying in a plane.

At the end of the day, he's still very happy with his choice and will consider adding a sealed sub later for music. He's much more of a bass head than I am, so it's the perfect setup for him. Coming from a single sealed Ultimax 12", the V3600i is a ridiculous upgrade!

One thing neither of us had considered is the impact of these big boys on your TV. He has an LED-based Samsung 55" (see picture) and a 20Hz sine wave from either the S3000i or the V3600i will make the color distort quite a bit! I am not sure if something is defective or if there's anything he can do, but you don't notice it at all during movies with dynamic scenes, but if you have a static screen up, it's pretty blatant. Anyone else notice this or suggest a fix? Is there any reason to worry about cracking the screen? It does move a bit at higher levels, but nothing like you see windshields do with a Steve Meade 18".

One other thing to note is that on my neighbor's somewhat plush carpet, the V3600i can rock a bit when it's upright! During the EoT sweep, it moved back and forth probably 1/8" or more! It's not even close to worry about tipping over, but it is funny and also impressive to see what the 18" drivers can do!

Travis
Sounds like you guys are having a lot of fun!!


I would suspect that the ripples you are seeing on the TV are caused by the power draw from the sub's amp...do the lights dim as well?
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post #20884 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 03:33 PM
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Break in

Hey guys,i am getting my XS15SE next week and i have a question for you.
When you receive your sub do you do a break in period before doing a calibration?
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post #20885 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 03:38 PM
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Hey guys,i am getting my XS15SE next week and i have a question for you.
When you receive your sub do you do a break in period before doing a calibration?
Heeeeelllll no. Just crank it up
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post #20886 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 03:48 PM
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Okay I just watched some quick bass demos now that I have things better dialed in. As promised here are the some time stamps for the guys asking for them.

WWZ Grenade scene…Ch 9 1:05.20.
Ender's Game Launch scene… Ch 2 12:10.
Incredible Hulk Abomination Fight scene…Ch 17 137:08 (I think, having trouble reading my writing).
Inception Outdoor Cafe scene… Ch 3 (or 4 wasn't paying attention) 27:40.

Here's a new one… I was watching the Incredible Hulk fight Abomination. I was at -15 running the subs a little hot. My wife came down stairs, asked me what I had the volume at and then told me when I turned on that scene the pressure changed upstairs and it hurt her ears. I thought she was joking but she wasn't. Then my daughter said the same thing.

Anybody ever hear of that happening? I've had it happen in the same room as the subwoofers but upstairs through closed doors?
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post #20887 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by skip61 View Post
Hey guys,i am getting my XS15SE next week and i have a question for you.
When you receive your sub do you do a break in period before doing a calibration?
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Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post
Heeeeelllll no. Just crank it up
What he said!
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post #20888 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 04:06 PM
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What he said!
LOL ok guys thanks.
I am coming from a Paradigm PDR8 to the PSA XS15SE.
I'll bet it will be an amazing difference
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post #20889 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 04:08 PM
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Okay I just watched some quick bass demos now that I have things better dialed in. As promised here are the some time stamps for the guys asking for them.

WWZ Grenade scene…Ch 9 1:05.20.
Ender's Game Launch scene… Ch 2 12:10.
Incredible Hulk Abomination Fight scene…Ch 17 137:08 (I think, having trouble reading my writing).
Inception Outdoor Cafe scene… Ch 3 (or 4 wasn't paying attention) 27:40.

Here's a new one… I was watching the Incredible Hulk fight Abomination. I was at -15 running the subs a little hot. My wife came down stairs, asked me what I had the volume at and then told me when I turned on that scene the pressure changed upstairs and it hurt her ears. I thought she was joking but she wasn't. Then my daughter said the same thing.

Anybody ever hear of that happening? I've had it happen in the same room as the subwoofers but upstairs through closed doors?
FYI the SECOND rocket launch in Enders game is better than he first!
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post #20890 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 04:59 PM
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@bear123 , thanks for the reply! So basically, it's up to installing some thicker drywall for my place as my gear is already in the basement and brick really wouldn't go with the house, that I can see.
@bad1550 , what are your thoughts on the 2xV3600i vs 2xS3000i? Do you live on a farm with no neighbors within earshot?!?!

So here's a short little review on the V3600i that my neighbor purchased:

In one word: WOW! This thing is a monster. As you can see in the pictures, it takes up nearly the entire bed length of my F150 super crew. We actually picked it up from the local distribution center to save a day on delivery. (it is about a half mile away from work) The dock guys were pretty impressed and couldn't believe it was just one subwoofer and wanted a demo, but that wasn't going to happen right there.

For those wondering about shipping and handling, I don't have a picture of the pallet, but it's certainly a sturdy one made of some sort of MDF/plywood conglomerate and is sized just past the outer perimeter of the box and strapped down. I was happy to see it wasn't some generic pallet or poorly made that could allow it to slip and slide around during transport. There are also clear warnings for shipping companies to not stack anything on top of it - it gets its own ground on the truck, so there's no chance of it being squashed from the top.

We ended up unboxing it out in the garage and bringing it in through the slightly narrower door. It's not terribly difficult to move, but is certainly a two-person job. The plastic shipping bag is slippery against the surface of the box, so you'll want to heed caution or remove the plastic, as we did, to get the best grip. If you don't know already, FURNITURE MOVERS ARE YOUR BEST FRIEND when it comes to getting it in place and getting the amp tweaked, especially when maneuvering this behemoth.

Neither of us are used to ported subs, so this was quite a new venture. It was pretty crazy to see how loud something can be without there being much movement of the speaker! It really takes some cranking of the MV control before these drivers start moving. Once they do, hold on to your hat! Literally, it may blow away... I haven't setup REW yet through this sub, but he did setup an Anti-Mode 8033S-II in front of it to ensure smooth operation and calibration.

Succinctly, movie watching was supreme. There was no end in sight of output and I'm quite certain that our ears would cave before the output of the V3600i. Running it several dB hot shook the couch (~11ft away) viscerally and made the house ring and rattle like no tomorrow. Needless to say, he's got a lot of work to do to suppress the rattles! I believe War of the Worlds Pod Emergence Scene would reign as the #1 most impressive with this subwoofer. Throughout the playback, you could feel so much air; it was akin to having a fan on your feet for part of the movie! It was certainly difficult to watch the various ULF movie clips (Finding Nemo, WWZ, EoT, Tron, etc) without laughing! The output is purely insane for a mere 3000 cubic foot space. (That does lead to an open hallway and upstairs, so it may be considered A LOT more since nothing is sealed)

Music was also very impressive. Though I am only familiar with the boomy bass of ported car subs from other friends, the ported design the boys at PSA have come up with is incredible. Music certainly punches with authority across all ranges, leaving you satisfied. There's really nothing new to write here as most of us are familiar with the PSA sound by now, nearly 700 pages in.

With all the praises for the V3600i, after hearing a single S3000i (soon to be duals as I took delivery of my second this morning!) we much prefer the sound of the sealed S3000i. Both my neighbor and I felt there was more detail in sound for movies, but especially for music. The scene that sounded the most different was the aperture scene from Tron - I haven't measured it, but perhaps the output is simply below the tuning point of the sub? The next scene that was very different was the shuttle launch of Interstellar. While still a much louder and visceral experience, it lacked a certain detail to the sound. This was the scene we were anticipating the most because during my single S3000i demo at his house, my ears required equalization from the pressure, much like when flying in a plane.

At the end of the day, he's still very happy with his choice and will consider adding a sealed sub later for music. He's much more of a bass head than I am, so it's the perfect setup for him. Coming from a single sealed Ultimax 12", the V3600i is a ridiculous upgrade!

One thing neither of us had considered is the impact of these big boys on your TV. He has an LED-based Samsung 55" (see picture) and a 20Hz sine wave from either the S3000i or the V3600i will make the color distort quite a bit! I am not sure if something is defective or if there's anything he can do, but you don't notice it at all during movies with dynamic scenes, but if you have a static screen up, it's pretty blatant. Anyone else notice this or suggest a fix? Is there any reason to worry about cracking the screen? It does move a bit at higher levels, but nothing like you see windshields do with a Steve Meade 18".

One other thing to note is that on my neighbor's somewhat plush carpet, the V3600i can rock a bit when it's upright! During the EoT sweep, it moved back and forth probably 1/8" or more! It's not even close to worry about tipping over, but it is funny and also impressive to see what the 18" drivers can do!

Travis

Does music at least sound as good as other ported PSA subs? I'm hoping the 3600 does as well with music as my PB13s or at bare minimum as good as the 11 year old 12/2 ultra its replacing!

JVC 3D: Been there, done that, bought a DLP
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post #20891 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 05:01 PM
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Okay I just watched some quick bass demos now that I have things better dialed in. As promised here are the some time stamps for the guys asking for them.

WWZ Grenade scene…Ch 9 1:05.20.
Ender's Game Launch scene… Ch 2 12:10.
Incredible Hulk Abomination Fight scene…Ch 17 137:08 (I think, having trouble reading my writing).
Inception Outdoor Cafe scene… Ch 3 (or 4 wasn't paying attention) 27:40.

Here's a new one… I was watching the Incredible Hulk fight Abomination. I was at -15 running the subs a little hot. My wife came down stairs, asked me what I had the volume at and then told me when I turned on that scene the pressure changed upstairs and it hurt her ears. I thought she was joking but she wasn't. Then my daughter said the same thing.

Anybody ever hear of that happening? I've had it happen in the same room as the subwoofers but upstairs through closed doors?
Wave lengths
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post #20892 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 05:04 PM
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Does music at least sound as good as other ported PSA subs? I'm hoping the 3600 does as well with music as my PB13s or at bare minimum as good as the 11 year old 12/2 ultra its replacing!
Level matched and eq'd the same, folks would be unable to pick out the sealed sub in blind testing. Knowing which ones are playing, it is impossible, as a human, for bias to not affect what one perceives they hear. Strong, lifelong, clearly audible preference for sealed/ported/horn/expensive amps/etc. always disappear in blind testing.
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post #20893 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 05:42 PM
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Level matched and eq'd the same, folks would be unable to pick out the sealed sub in blind testing. Knowing which ones are playing, it is impossible, as a human, for bias to not affect what one perceives they hear. Strong, lifelong, clearly audible preference for sealed/ported/horn/expensive amps/etc. always disappear in blind testing.
In bear123's world at least
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post #20894 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 05:58 PM
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FYI the SECOND rocket launch in Enders game is better than he first!
Thanks Brian, I will definitely check that out.
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post #20895 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 06:02 PM
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In bear123's world at least
No, just every account of blind testing I have ever read, by many enthusiasts. Many an AVS'er has been so convinced of the superior sound quality of expensive amps....the ones that do blind testing with them compared to cheaper amps sell them and buy stuff that makes a difference. And remember, before the blind testing, they were convinced enough that there was a difference that they spent thousands on amps. Same goes for subs. Not all subs are created equal of course, but when multiple high quality subs are level matched and eq'd, surprisingly, die hard sealed sub fans pick ported subs as the clear winner on musical sound quality, and no one can reliably tell which sub they are listening to, be it sealed, ported, or horn. And these are enthusiasts who are passionate about the hobby and have owned many many subs from starter subs to ID subs to the best subs made in the world, to the best quality DIY units.

Interestingly, when sighted tests are done in audio, i.e. people can tell which expensive or shiny or fancy amp or sub they are listening to, there are usually clear preferences for the shiny, expensive, or preferred product. Mysteriously, when the same products are tested by the same listeners in a blind fashion, the results end up totally different.

Our ears fool us into hearing what we want to hear. Unless you are not human, this bias cannot be avoided. So in the end, did you hear a difference? Absolutely. But I believe it is important to understand why. I do not believe ignorance is bliss.
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post #20896 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 06:04 PM
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Well Ladies and Gentlemen, the comparison of the between the SVS PC2000 and the PSA S1500 came to a swift and a little surprising end today. My friend has boxed the SVS to be returned and is now trying to figure out which PSA he wants. My little S1500 bested the SVS in every category sound quality, output, bang for the buck and most definitely WAF. I was really expecting more output from the PC2000 than we got in my 2600 cubic foot room. My friend had purchased the SVS for his much smaller 1300 cubic foot room but isn't even going to give it a shot because of its performance in my room. I am wondering if the PC2000 might not have some sort of issues, sadly I don't have the equipment to perform tests and give you guys graphs. I will say when my wife who really isn't into speakers comments about how much more bass and how much better the PSA was I knew it was very noticeable.
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post #20897 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 06:15 PM
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Does music at least sound as good as other ported PSA subs? I'm hoping the 3600 does as well with music as my PB13s or at bare minimum as good as the 11 year old 12/2 ultra its replacing!
Toe, I really think you will be happy with the SQ of the V3600 for music and movie soundtracks. In fact I'm heading down stairs to listen to music right after I post this.

I don't have the 3000i to compare it to but I do have the XV15se and to my ears the SQ is the same so that may answer your question regarding whether it's equal to other PSA ported subs.

I'm also in the same camp as Bear on the ported vs sealed sub debate. I've had both sealed and ported and I have found that to my ear the SQ has more to do with the quality of the sub's design and build than the type of the sub. But that's just my opinion and I know there are a lot of guys who think differently and that's fine too. I just happen to disagree with them.
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Last edited by Hopinater; 07-10-2015 at 06:19 PM.
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post #20898 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 06:56 PM
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First impressions and fun and games … ugh . Unboxing isn’t too big of a deal since I’ve done it enough times (thank goodness for furniture sliders), but setting up and testing is tedious, and I absolutely hate stuffing the sub back into the box. BTW, I received the S3000i on Tuesday, July 7th. The box was in good condition with no battle scars (same with the sub), and I have been testing it ever since. I also want to thank Tom for putting my sub through its paces for several hours (per my request) before boxing it up and shipping it out.

Disclaimer #1 : I listen to music and movies at loud levels, but not reference levels. Mid 80 dB peaks to upper 80 dB peaks for music (A - weighting, with the subwoofer hitting as much as the high 80s to mid 90s dB peaks … C - weighting). For movies, the sub can hit up to the high 90 dB peaks on occasion, so yes, I play some movies a bit closer to reference. Because I don’t listen at reference, my remarks may have little meaning to those that listen at or above reference. My normal settings are between -15 to -12 on the Denon X2000 AVR, which to me are nebulous numbers, but it’s a nice reference guide. The reason I say nebulous, is that movie and music CD, SACD, DVD and Blu-ray volumes vary, and sometimes by a lot. I use an SPL meter at the listening position to record actual sound pressure levels.

Disclaimer #2 : My room is rather open, but not as open as many. It is around 3,400 cu. ft. (considered a large room) with a 6-foot opening (right angle) into the kitchen and two 4-foot openings (hallway and living room), but that still leaves plenty of wall space for reflections. My music area where my SB13-Ultra resides, is a little larger and a little more open room. Those with smaller or more sealed off rooms will have different results. Those with larger or more open rooms will also have different results. And even if your room volume is similar to mine, expect different results. These differences could be minor or major (as has been reported by fellow AVS members). And their points are just as valid as mine. I don’t think I can stress that enough. The performance of any sub is dependent upon the environment and setup (improper or proper), and I’m not 100% convinced that I set everything up properly yet. Maybe I should hire Mark Seaton .

Disclaimer #3 : I test with music first. I’m far more demanding as far as music reproduction is concerned. Plus, I can detect minor differences far more readily from music than I can from a blockbuster LFE movie. And please note, this is not a sealed vs ported debate. All the subs I own (except for the BIC subs early on) and those I have auditioned are all sealed designs.

Disclaimer #4 : The terms, “night and day”, “obliterate”, “annihilate”, “crush”, “kill” (and any other adjective one might use) has little meaning to me and I feel are over exaggerations, so you won’t see those terms here. Even the four Gothams and the 24-inch Mariana did not merit those adjectives compared to my XS30 or SB13-Ultra. Were they better? Yes, in several ways they were. Did they impress? Absolutely. Annihilate? Not hardly.

The S3000i’s gain control is far more sensitive than my XS30. After two years, I ended up at the 1:00 o’clock setting on the XS30 (it began at the 2:30 position). That means that the XS30 is performing just as well today with a lower gain setting, than it did when it was new at a higher gain setting. And no, I don’t have a clue as to why, except performance from a speaker will loosen up and change over time. I’m around the 8:30 o’clock position for the S3000i. While dialing up the gain (per PSA instructions) to get a feel of the S3000i’s output, I found the 9:00 o’clock position a bit too heavy handed, but since Audyssey recommends a 12:00 o’clock setting before testing (uh, no way), I decided to use the 9:00 o’clock position. Audyssey showed -11 trim level when I set the gain at 9:00 o’clock (+/- 12 is the limit of my receiver). That wasn’t going to work too well since one strives for between -3.5 and + 3.5 (per Audyssey 101 setup guide here on AVS), so I turned down the gain to 8:30 and ran Audyssey again. Audyssey then showed a more normal -2.5 trim level reading. As a side note, the 12:00 o’clock position on my XS30 gave me a +6 trim level reading (if memory serves me), so I dialed the gain up to the 1:00 o’clock position and got a trim level reading of -2.5 (the AVS Audyssey 101 setup guide indicated that this is a proper way to proceed). I’m not at all sure why Audyssey wants one to turn the gain to the 12:00 o’clock position, since the sensitivity of the gain control varies widely from sub to sub and manufacturer to manufacturer. So if any of you Audyssey experts could explain why they don’t mention this variance, I’d appreciate it.

I have the S3000i up front to the left of the left front speaker about 4 inches from the wall. Orientation is with one of the speakers facing outward because of insufficient room to place it normally (amplifier facing the wall), while the XS30 is placed normally and diagonal on the right side of the room about 3-1/2 inches from that wall and almost inline with the seating area. Both areas are excellent for good clean bass response at my listening position. As I stated, the Audyssey setup for both subwoofers were almost identical, a true trim level match of -2.5, but based upon the gain setting I used, which was NOT 12:00 o’clock. The only difference was the distance (or time delay) setting. The S3000i was 11.3 feet, while the XS30 was 11.8 feet. The speakers showed almost identical distance and trim levels for both tests.

As far as music is concerned, the S3000i pretty much met my expectations. I ran the sub 2.5 dB hot (0 trim level reading) and it flew through my test discs, and many other very demanding discs with relative ease, and with the slam and precision I felt was appropriate. As I’ve stated before on this website, music wasn’t the XS30’s strong suit. Not that it was bad, because it wasn’t. It beat another well-known sealed sub I tested in my home that many said was ideal for music. Like that other sub, the XS30 just wasn’t as clean as I hoped and failed several music tests. With the S3000i, I could hear/feel cycle separation (less smear than the XS30) in many of the extremely low pieces of music using pipe organs and synthesizers. And it slammed the walls on the Mike Oldfield Shabda track where the other subs failed to reproduce these measures at all. So for music, the S3000i is a solid improvement. It is noticeably cleaner and more precise than the XS30, which is exactly what I was looking for. Against the Ultra it did surprisingly well, but not quite as succinct or powerful on the Shabda track, and not quite as distinct on cycle separation, but I was still very pleased with its performance. However, the Ultra is still the winner in music (or I should say, “my” music) and isn’t going anywhere any time soon. The Ultra is a sub that doesn’t get a lot of attention because its output is not what most people are looking for with movies (and I can agree). But for the music I listen to, I’ve failed to hear a more clear and precise sub. But obviously, I’ve only auditioned a handful of subs with music (two JL Audio F212 Fathoms, a Paradigm Sub 1, the DSS 24 Mariana, a Hsu ULS-15 and the two PSA subs … plus the Ultra, obviously). I did hear the JL Audio G213 Gotham (4 of ‘em) and their newest smaller sub (don’t remember the name) at the audio show, but that doesn’t count since I couldn’t audition them with my music.

As far as movies are concerned, I ran the S3000i (and the XS30) 5 dB hot (+2.5 trim level reading). To put it bluntly, the S3000i didn’t meet my expectations. But this was simply because Audyssey level matched almost exactly to the XS30 I had set up months ago. So in essence, I (or Audyssey or both) may have handcuffed the S3000i to play at the XS30’s level. This is great for integrating both subs, but not so great when trying to hear distinct differences. Still, the S3000i was able to shake things up fiercely in my room, including my seat, and this is in a room with laminate flooring over a concrete slab. Since the sound wave vibrations became quite intense, I feel absolutely no need for butt kickers and wouldn’t use them anyway. As good as the S3000i is, so is the XS30 in that department. Both are powerful LFE subs and difficult to tell apart when I A-B tested them. Have I heard more tactile subs? Yes, but neither the S3000i or XS30 are all that far off from the biggest and baddest that I’ve heard (different environments, room volumes and different media), so I’d say the S3000i is a very capable all-around subwoofer and I consider it a very solid value, as is the XS30. I’ve actually come to respect the XS30’s LFE capabilities more after these listening tests.

Is the S3000i capable of more? Oh yes, as I’m sure the XS30 has more capability. I discovered this by accident on the S3000i. Before I ran Audyssey, I set it up with an SPL meter, but forgot to move the crossover dial to 80 Hz, so it was sitting at 150 Hz. It felt like it was trying to tear my house down . I was not only getting the extreme deep vibrations and low frequency slam, I was also getting mid and upper bass slam to shocking levels. It actually worried me! No wonder my CFL bulbs throughout the room were flickering. I realized something was wrong fairly quickly. Some of that bass was localized, and that’s when I discovered my mistake. Once I ran Audyssey, it tamed much of the localization problems (crossovers at 80 Hz and LPF at 100 Hz). But alas, it also tamed the S3000i to a greater degree than I anticipated or wanted. I now suspect Audyssey did the same for my XS30.

Next on my list was to incorporate both subs. This turned out to be surprisingly easy. I was expecting a tough time of it, worrying about standing wave peaks and cancellation nulls, and worrying about phase issues. I didn’t bother running Audyssey again because the two subs were already perfectly level-matched at their positions. Sometimes one lucks out in subwoofer life, and I guess I did. With two subs running, the output advantage was quickly apparent. And while my listening position received excellent response with either sub playing alone, adding in the second sub gave a bit more of an encompassing feel. Big difference? Again, no. It was more of a subtle difference, but nice. With greater output and a more encompassing feel, it was an overall noticeable improvement that I was very happy to have experienced. I’m sure people who run a single sub and have poor response at their listening position, may have had more of a profound experience with a second sub than I.

I’m not completely sure if I will keep the S3000i, and I’m thinking that the XS30se might have been a smarter purchase. However, I have a lot more testing and setup tweaks to perform in the coming weeks, including gain, LPF and crossover settings, before I can come to any concrete conclusion. I haven’t even messed with the room volume setting on the S3000i. But as things stand right now, for the money I spent it is looking to be only a marginal improvement for movie LFE (although with a capability of more performance). Is the money spent worth it? Probably not. However, it did allow me to realize a decent improvement in a dual sub configuration mode, but not nearly as big of an improvement as many get. The big plus is the performance in its music capability and that may be enough to sway me to keep it (I would expect the same results had I purchased the XS30se).
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Movie area: EMP Tek R5Bi, PSA XS30, Denon X2000, Oppo BDP 83.
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post #20899 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 07:23 PM
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^ Great review! Thanks for taking the time to write it up @dsrussell . I thoroughly enjoyed reading it! Thank you for being clear about your listening levels and preferences, it really helped put things in perspective as I have heard some of the same subwoofers but felt differently about them. Very cool.
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Last edited by FattyMcButterPants; 07-10-2015 at 07:33 PM.
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post #20900 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
No, just every account of blind testing I have ever read, by many enthusiasts. Many an AVS'er has been so convinced of the superior sound quality of expensive amps....the ones that do blind testing with them compared to cheaper amps sell them and buy stuff that makes a difference. And remember, before the blind testing, they were convinced enough that there was a difference that they spent thousands on amps. Same goes for subs. Not all subs are created equal of course, but when multiple high quality subs are level matched and eq'd, surprisingly, die hard sealed sub fans pick ported subs as the clear winner on musical sound quality, and no one can reliably tell which sub they are listening to, be it sealed, ported, or horn. And these are enthusiasts who are passionate about the hobby and have owned many many subs from starter subs to ID subs to the best subs made in the world, to the best quality DIY units.

Interestingly, when sighted tests are done in audio, i.e. people can tell which expensive or shiny or fancy amp or sub they are listening to, there are usually clear preferences for the shiny, expensive, or preferred product. Mysteriously, when the same products are tested by the same listeners in a blind fashion, the results end up totally different.

Our ears fool us into hearing what we want to hear. Unless you are not human, this bias cannot be avoided. So in the end, did you hear a difference? Absolutely. But I believe it is important to understand why. I do not believe ignorance is bliss.
You and I will be old men and one day (hopefully) watching the young enthusiast hash this same subject out!

Till then I'm not going to soil this dedicated thread with a non related topic
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post #20901 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by dsrussell View Post
First impressions and fun and games … ugh . Unboxing isn’t too big of a deal since I’ve done it enough times (thank goodness for furniture sliders), but setting up and testing is tedious, and I absolutely hate stuffing the sub back into the box. BTW, I received the S3000i on Tuesday, July 7th. The box was in good condition with no battle scars (same with the sub), and I have been testing it ever since. I also want to thank Tom for putting my sub through its paces for several hours (per my request) before boxing it up and shipping it out.

Disclaimer #1 : I listen to music and movies at loud levels, but not reference levels. Mid 80 dB peaks to upper 80 dB peaks for music (A - weighting, with the subwoofer hitting as much as the high 80s to mid 90s dB peaks … C - weighting). For movies, the sub can hit up to the high 90 dB peaks on occasion, so yes, I play some movies a bit closer to reference. Because I don’t listen at reference, my remarks may have little meaning to those that listen at or above reference. My normal settings are between -15 to -12 on the Denon X2000 AVR, which to me are nebulous numbers, but it’s a nice reference guide. The reason I say nebulous, is that movie and music CD, SACD, DVD and Blu-ray volumes vary, and sometimes by a lot. I use an SPL meter at the listening position to record actual sound pressure levels.

Disclaimer #2 : My room is rather open, but not as open as many. It is around 3,400 cu. ft. (considered a large room) with a 6-foot opening (right angle) into the kitchen and two 4-foot openings (hallway and living room), but that still leaves plenty of wall space for reflections. My music area where my SB13-Ultra resides, is a little larger and a little more open room. Those with smaller or more sealed off rooms will have different results. Those with larger or more open rooms will also have different results. And even if your room volume is similar to mine, expect different results. These differences could be minor or major (as has been reported by fellow AVS members). And their points are just as valid as mine. I don’t think I can stress that enough. The performance of any sub is dependent upon the environment and setup (improper or proper), and I’m not 100% convinced that I set everything up properly yet. Maybe I should hire Mark Seaton .

Disclaimer #3 : I test with music first. I’m far more demanding as far as music reproduction is concerned. Plus, I can detect minor differences far more readily from music than I can from a blockbuster LFE movie. And please note, this is not a sealed vs ported debate. All the subs I own (except for the BIC subs early on) and those I have auditioned are all sealed designs.

Disclaimer #4 : The terms, “night and day”, “obliterate”, “annihilate”, “crush”, “kill” (and any other adjective one might use) has little meaning to me and I feel are over exaggerations, so you won’t see those terms here. Even the four Gothams and the 24-inch Mariana did not merit those adjectives compared to my XS30 or SB13-Ultra. Were they better? Yes, in several ways they were. Did they impress? Absolutely. Annihilate? Not hardly.

The S3000i’s gain control is far more sensitive than my XS30. After two years, I ended up at the 1:00 o’clock setting on the XS30 (it began at the 2:30 position). That means that the XS30 is performing just as well today with a lower gain setting, than it did when it was new at a higher gain setting. And no, I don’t have a clue as to why, except performance from a speaker will loosen up and change over time. I’m around the 8:30 o’clock position for the S3000i. While dialing up the gain (per PSA instructions) to get a feel of the S3000i’s output, I found the 9:00 o’clock position a bit too heavy handed, but since Audyssey recommends a 12:00 o’clock setting before testing (uh, no way), I decided to use the 9:00 o’clock position. Audyssey showed -11 trim level when I set the gain at 9:00 o’clock (+/- 12 is the limit of my receiver). That wasn’t going to work too well since one strives for between -3.5 and + 3.5 (per Audyssey 101 setup guide here on AVS), so I turned down the gain to 8:30 and ran Audyssey again. Audyssey then showed a more normal -2.5 trim level reading. As a side note, the 12:00 o’clock position on my XS30 gave me a +6 trim level reading (if memory serves me), so I dialed the gain up to the 1:00 o’clock position and got a trim level reading of -2.5 (the AVS Audyssey 101 setup guide indicated that this is a proper way to proceed). I’m not at all sure why Audyssey wants one to turn the gain to the 12:00 o’clock position, since the sensitivity of the gain control varies widely from sub to sub and manufacturer to manufacturer. So if any of you Audyssey experts could explain why they don’t mention this variance, I’d appreciate it.

I have the S3000i up front to the left of the left front speaker about 4 inches from the wall. Orientation is with one of the speakers facing outward because of insufficient room to place it normally (amplifier facing the wall), while the XS30 is placed normally and diagonal on the right side of the room about 3-1/2 inches from that wall and almost inline with the seating area. Both areas are excellent for good clean bass response at my listening position. As I stated, the Audyssey setup for both subwoofers were almost identical, a true trim level match of -2.5, but based upon the gain setting I used, which was NOT 12:00 o’clock. The only difference was the distance (or time delay) setting. The S3000i was 11.3 feet, while the XS30 was 11.8 feet. The speakers showed almost identical distance and trim levels for both tests.

As far as music is concerned, the S3000i pretty much met my expectations. I ran the sub 2.5 dB hot (0 trim level reading) and it flew through my test discs, and many other very demanding discs with relative ease, and with the slam and precision I felt was appropriate. As I’ve stated before on this website, music wasn’t the XS30’s strong suit. Not that it was bad, because it wasn’t. It beat another well-known sealed sub I tested in my home that many said was ideal for music. Like that other sub, the XS30 just wasn’t as clean as I hoped and failed several music tests. With the S3000i, I could hear/feel cycle separation (less smear than the XS30) in many of the extremely low pieces of music using pipe organs and synthesizers. And it slammed the walls on the Mike Oldfield Shabda track where the other subs failed to reproduce these measures at all. So for music, the S3000i is a solid improvement. It is noticeably cleaner and more precise than the XS30, which is exactly what I was looking for. Against the Ultra it did surprisingly well, but not quite as succinct or powerful on the Shabda track, and not quite as distinct on cycle separation, but I was still very pleased with its performance. However, the Ultra is still the winner in music (or I should say, “my” music) and isn’t going anywhere any time soon. The Ultra is a sub that doesn’t get a lot of attention because its output is not what most people are looking for with movies (and I can agree). But for the music I listen to, I’ve failed to hear a more clear and precise sub. But obviously, I’ve only auditioned a handful of subs with music (two JL Audio F212 Fathoms, a Paradigm Sub 1, the DSS 24 Mariana, a Hsu ULS-15 and the two PSA subs … plus the Ultra, obviously). I did hear the JL Audio G213 Gotham (4 of ‘em) and their newest smaller sub (don’t remember the name) at the audio show, but that doesn’t count since I couldn’t audition them with my music.

As far as movies are concerned, I ran the S3000i (and the XS30) 5 dB hot (+2.5 trim level reading). To put it bluntly, the S3000i didn’t meet my expectations. But this was simply because Audyssey level matched almost exactly to the XS30 I had set up months ago. So in essence, I (or Audyssey or both) may have handcuffed the S3000i to play at the XS30’s level. This is great for integrating both subs, but not so great when trying to hear distinct differences. Still, the S3000i was able to shake things up fiercely in my room, including my seat, and this is in a room with laminate flooring over a concrete slab. Since the sound wave vibrations became quite intense, I feel absolutely no need for butt kickers and wouldn’t use them anyway. As good as the S3000i is, so is the XS30 in that department. Both are powerful LFE subs and difficult to tell apart when I A-B tested them. Have I heard more tactile subs? Yes, but neither the S3000i or XS30 are all that far off from the biggest and baddest that I’ve heard (different environments, room volumes and different media), so I’d say the S3000i is a very capable all-around subwoofer and I consider it a very solid value, as is the XS30. I’ve actually come to respect the XS30’s LFE capabilities more after these listening tests.

Is the S3000i capable of more? Oh yes, as I’m sure the XS30 has more capability. I discovered this by accident on the S3000i. Before I ran Audyssey, I set it up with an SPL meter, but forgot to move the crossover dial to 80 Hz, so it was sitting at 150 Hz. It felt like it was trying to tear my house down . I was not only getting the extreme deep vibrations and low frequency slam, I was also getting mid and upper bass slam to shocking levels. It actually worried me! No wonder my CFL bulbs throughout the room were flickering. I realized something was wrong fairly quickly. Some of that bass was localized, and that’s when I discovered my mistake. Once I ran Audyssey, it tamed much of the localization problems (crossovers at 80 Hz and LPF at 100 Hz). But alas, it also tamed the S3000i to a greater degree than I anticipated or wanted. I now suspect Audyssey did the same for my XS30.

Next on my list was to incorporate both subs. This turned out to be surprisingly easy. I was expecting a tough time of it, worrying about standing wave peaks and cancellation nulls, and worrying about phase issues. I didn’t bother running Audyssey again because the two subs were already perfectly level-matched at their positions. Sometimes one lucks out in subwoofer life, and I guess I did. With two subs running, the output advantage was quickly apparent. And while my listening position received excellent response with either sub playing alone, adding in the second sub gave a bit more of an encompassing feel. Big difference? Again, no. It was more of a subtle difference, but nice. With greater output and a more encompassing feel, it was an overall noticeable improvement that I was very happy to have experienced. I’m sure people who run a single sub and have poor response at their listening position, may have had more of a profound experience with a second sub than I.

I’m not completely sure if I will keep the S3000i, and I’m thinking that the XS30se might have been a smarter purchase. However, I have a lot more testing and setup tweaks to perform in the coming weeks, including gain, LPF and crossover settings, before I can come to any concrete conclusion. I haven’t even messed with the room volume setting on the S3000i. But as things stand right now, for the money I spent it is looking to be only a marginal improvement for movie LFE (although with a capability of more performance). Is the money spent worth it? Probably not. However, it did allow me to realize a decent improvement in a dual sub configuration mode, but not nearly as big of an improvement as many get. The big plus is the performance in its music capability and that may be enough to sway me to keep it (I would expect the same results had I purchased the XS30se).
When setting up the S3000I with Audyssey I would try to hit 81-82 dbs ( first step ) and then let Audyssey do its thing. I would disregard with the whole trying to end up between -3.5 to +3.5. You will get more output out of your subs trying to hit 81-82db in the first step regardless if you are going to run the subs or not.


When Audyssey runs, the first step is to set the subs to 75 dB. It is perfectly OK to ignore that suggestion, and in fact it is recommended that you do so, if you wish to run your subs 'hot' for preference. Instead, set them at around 83 to 85 dB. This will yield a -10dB or so subwoofer trim setting after Audyssey. This provides 10 db of headroom before you even get to 0dB on the trim scale, and completely eliminates the possibility of overdriving the sub amp inputs. This method is recommended by Mark Seaton, founder of Seaton Sound, the makers of the legendary Seaton Submersive subwoofers.
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Equipment List: Benq W6000, Darbee DVP-5000 Video Processor, JKP Affinity 100 inch 16x9 .9 gain reference screen, Onkyo 818 receiver, 3-Marantz Ma700 and 2-Ma6100 mono blocks, 9.2 set-up, B&W Nautilus 805 front speakers, B&W Nautilus HTM2 center speaker, Infinity ( soon to be replaced by B&W ) bookshelf Height Speakers, Mirage HDT-R side speakers, Jamo THX surround one rear speakers, Dual PSA XS30se subs, Richard Grey, Monster Power, and Panamax powerline conditioning/surge protection.

Last edited by Mike Butny; 07-10-2015 at 07:52 PM.
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post #20902 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 08:23 PM
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Dsrussel, Your X2000 Avr only sees both subs as one sub and sets their combined level to 75db at MLP. If you didn't use an spl meter or REW to make sure each sub produce the same spl then one of your sub might work harder than the other. To assure both subs are contributing equally to produce reference level, I suggest you place each sub (one at the time) in the middle of your room to minimize boundary, use an spl meter or REW and adjust the gain knob till achieving about 80-81db closed mic. I would place the spl meter or usb mic on a tripod and have it half way between the two drivers directly in front of your sub (spl meter on the side of your sub where the amp is mounted or on the opposite side of the amp). Try to place your spl meter death center there (since it is dual opposed sub). Put the other sub exactly where the first one was (you can use masking tape to mark 1st sub location). Do the same thing for the other sub to achieve 80-81db without moving the spl meter or usb mic. Now place them back to where they are supposed to be and run Aud. You might need to adjust one of your sub phase to get them in phase.
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post #20903 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Butny View Post
When setting up the S3000I with Audyssey I would try to hit 81-82 dbs ( first step ) and then let Audyssey do its thing. I would disregard with the whole trying to end up between -3.5 to +3.5. You will get more output out of your subs trying to hit 81-82db in the first step regardless if you are going to run the subs or not.

When Audyssey runs, the first step is to set the subs to 75 dB. It is perfectly OK to ignore that suggestion, and in fact it is recommended that you do so, if you wish to run your subs 'hot' for preference. Instead, set them at around 83 to 85 dB. This will yield a -10dB or so subwoofer trim setting after Audyssey. This provides 10 db of headroom before you even get to 0dB on the trim scale, and completely eliminates the possibility of overdriving the sub amp inputs. This method is recommended by Mark Seaton, founder of Seaton Sound, the makers of the legendary Seaton Submersive subwoofers.
Thanks for the suggestion, Mike. Much appreciated. I’ll be trying this out next week (figure I need to just sit back, take a break from tedium and enjoy the fruits of my labor this weekend).
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post #20904 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 08:36 PM
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Thanks for the suggestion, Mike. Much appreciated. I’ll be trying this out next week (figure I need to just sit back, take a break from tedium and enjoy the fruits of my labor this weekend).
Great write up and review. Excellent detail and it was enjoyable to read.

I know what you mean about the all the work involved in dialing things in. I like playing with subs and running REW but I hate running and re-running Audyssey. I spent most of yesterday doing all that…as well as moving the sub around the room.

But….Oh how it all pays off! Tonight I've been doing exactly what you said, I've been enjoying the fruits of yesterday's labor and I've been smiling all night.

So I agree and encourage you do take the rest of the weekend and enjoy your setup. You've earned it!
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post #20905 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 08:47 PM
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Thanks for the suggestion, Mike. Much appreciated. I’ll be trying this out next week (figure I need to just sit back, take a break from tedium and enjoy the fruits of my labor this weekend).
NP, I remember when setting up my subs to hit the 75-76db mark ( first step ) and after running calibration my subs sounded very thin, lacking major output. I then re-ran the set-up and I dialed the subs to hit 80-82db and then let Audyssey do it thing and WOW what a difference. I will warn you as if I run the subs any higher than 82dbs (first step ) the final results sound boomy, too strong for my liking. I find 81-82 during the first step sounds the best to my ears, I then run them 4-5db hot after Audyssey is finished. Please report back and let us know if it helped.
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post #20906 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 09:03 PM
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Great write up and review. Excellent detail and it was enjoyable to read.

I know what you mean about the all the work involved in dialing things in. I like playing with subs and running REW but I hate running and re-running Audyssey. I spent most of yesterday doing all that…as well as moving the sub around the room.

But….Oh how it all pays off! Tonight I've been doing exactly what you said, I've been enjoying the fruits of yesterday's labor and I've been smiling all night.

So I agree and encourage you do take the rest of the weekend and enjoy your setup. You've earned it!
Isn’t THAT the truth! How many times can I hear those Audyssey burps and not go insane? Luckily, I have a 3.1 system going right now, but will expand that to 5.1 probably before year’s end. So those burps will increase from 40/mic position (320 total) to 60/mic position (480 total). That does not include the times I reran a test because of noise outside the house. Gee, I can hardly wait . Wonder how people with 7.x to 11.x survive...

And enjoy your relax time! Please let us know how everything is turning out, Hop.
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post #20907 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 09:06 PM
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Forgive my ignorance, I have a receiver with SUB EQ and I have to set each sub separately prior to running XT32, is there a way to know the combined output of both subs before running calibration....TIA

Cheers Jeffrey
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post #20908 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 09:08 PM
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Dsrussel, Your X2000 Avr only sees both subs as one sub and sets their combined level to 75db at MLP. If you didn't use an spl meter or REW to make sure each sub produce the same spl then one of your sub might work harder than the other. To assure both subs are contributing equally to produce reference level, I suggest you place each sub (one at the time) in the middle of your room to minimize boundary, use an spl meter or REW and adjust the gain knob till achieving about 80-81db closed mic. I would place the spl meter or usb mic on a tripod and have it half way between the two drivers directly in front of your sub (spl meter on the side of your sub where the amp is mounted or on the opposite side of the amp). Try to place your spl meter death center there (since it is dual opposed sub). Put the other sub exactly where the first one was (you can use masking tape to mark 1st sub location). Do the same thing for the other sub to achieve 80-81db without moving the spl meter or usb mic. Now place them back to where they are supposed to be and run Aud. You might need to adjust one of your sub phase to get them in phase.
No, I don’t have REW. Because the X2000 isn’t capable of managing more than one sub is the reason I did not bother to run Audyssey after I already ran Audyssey for each sub separately. I used a Type 2 SPL meter to check out the sound pressure levels produced by each sub at their locations. I did this several times and was within a dB each time.

However, I really like your idea and it makes a lot sense. I have a tripod, so it will be an interesting experiment. Much more interesting than running Audyssey for the umpteenth time .

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post #20909 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 09:18 PM
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Forgive my ignorance, I have a receiver with SUB EQ and I have to set each sub separately prior to running XT32, is there a way to know the combined output of both subs before running calibration....TIA

Cheers Jeffrey
Jeff: After you set both your subs ( first step) to lets say 75dbs. I would then combine both subs on a Y splitter together and re-run the first step, Audyssey will display the combined output. The easiest way would to just break out your SPL meter, and calibrate each sub to 75db then measure both together.
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post #20910 of 21443 Old 07-10-2015, 09:26 PM
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Guys: I came across this band, Future Island yesterday. I find their music very unique and wanted to share them with everyone:
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