Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 748 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #22411 of 33800 Old 09-18-2015, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by lizrussspike View Post
Thanks for your help Bass. I was wondering about that. I would need a 8033 to accomplish that? I see that I can do a 2.2, but I guess I need to read up on how to connect that sequence, as the mains are running off an amplifier. I have 9 speakers, but would like to integrate the mains. Did you use the AMDC to do both the mains and multiple subs?
No Audyssey should take care of that. The AMDC goal here is to get both subs playing nice together, then audyssey should blend the mains with the subs.

You can use REW to take a combined measurement to verify the response or if it sounds good then leave it as is.
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post #22412 of 33800 Old 09-18-2015, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
No Audyssey should take care of that. The AMDC goal here is to get both subs playing nice together, then audyssey should blend the mains with the subs.

You can use REW to take a combined measurement to verify the response or if it sounds good then leave it as is.
Got it Bass. I ran the storm scene from MMFR and was not let down. I am happy with the current sound. I will demo more tomorrow when the girls are gone, maybe throw down some Tron or FotP!
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post #22413 of 33800 Old 09-18-2015, 06:33 PM
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There you go!! Try switching the AMDC from active to bypass on those scenes so you can hear the difference.
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post #22414 of 33800 Old 09-18-2015, 07:32 PM
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starting my calibration now
Marantz SR6010
2 PSA XSse30's
Room is 26x24.
set AVR to 80hz
Anti-Mode 8033

I had subs in almost opposite corners. The response kept getting better the closer I moved them. Now they are about 8ft apart. Controls face the back wall and grills face each other.

Running REW with no smoothing I get no bass below 28hz with AM in bypass mode... IT doesn't get above 80db until about 48Hz. Then it stays above... hmmmmm


after calibrating with AM I get a couple bigger nulls and some smoothing. 35db lift looks best but it still looks better with AM in Bypass.

Still learning

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post #22415 of 33800 Old 09-18-2015, 08:45 PM
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The base anti-mode is not designed for dual subs. So unless you have them placed equidistant from the LP then it is probably not doing to do a very good job. If you have them equidistant then it will eq them as one just like audyssey does.
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post #22416 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 05:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
The base anti-mode is not designed for dual subs. So unless you have them placed equidistant from the LP then it is probably not doing to do a very good job. If you have them equidistant then it will eq them as one just like audyssey does.
That's odd. Il have to talk to Tom. He sold me the complete package. I don't recall him saying they had to be equidistant. But my memory could be bad

Any reason I have almost no bass below 28hz? Even after moving subs 20+ times. These things are heavy

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post #22417 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoepup View Post
starting my calibration now
Marantz SR6010
2 PSA XSse30's
Room is 26x24.
set AVR to 80hz
Anti-Mode 8033

I had subs in almost opposite corners. The response kept getting better the closer I moved them. Now they are about 8ft apart. Controls face the back wall and grills face each other.

Running REW with no smoothing I get no bass below 28hz with AM in bypass mode... IT doesn't get above 80db until about 48Hz. Then it stays above... hmmmmm


after calibrating with AM I get a couple bigger nulls and some smoothing. 35db lift looks best but it still looks better with AM in Bypass.

Still learning
Start by integrating one sub with the system. Once you have that nailed it is usually easy to get the second dialed in. Also, an easy way to sanity check the measurement rig is to place the mic a few inches from one cone on one of the subs. You should see a FR pretty smooth down to the 12-15hz range.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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post #22418 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 06:41 AM
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Originally Posted by zoepup View Post
That's odd. Il have to talk to Tom. He sold me the complete package. I don't recall him saying they had to be equidistant. But my memory could be bad

Any reason I have almost no bass below 28hz? Even after moving subs 20+ times. These things are heavy
They don't have to be equidistant. That is a nice to have for sure but with home audio there will always be compromises in place. Would spending much more on the dual core be of benefit? Possibly. But I bet once you have the 8033 dialed in the differences would be subtle.

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Power Sound Audio
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post #22419 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by zoepup View Post
That's odd. Il have to talk to Tom. He sold me the complete package. I don't recall him saying they had to be equidistant. But my memory could be bad

Any reason I have almost no bass below 28hz? Even after moving subs 20+ times. These things are heavy
The base anti-mode does not set individual delays for each sub. So if they are not equidistant then most likely you will have a phase issue at some frequencies. The nice thing with the ICE amp is you can adjust the time delay on one sub to get both subs in alignment. REW would be really helpful for verifying the changes.
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post #22420 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 07:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
They don't have to be equidistant. That is a nice to have for sure but with home audio there will always be compromises in place. Would spending much more on the dual core be of benefit? Possibly. But I bet once you have the 8033 dialed in the differences would be subtle.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Oh, I thought you told me they needed to be equidistant when we discussed which Anti-mode to go with?

PS I sent you a email and never got a reply.
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post #22421 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 11:27 AM
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Just out of curiousity..has anyone here had or owned a def tech trinity sub that could compare a psa sub to????

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The DT(and GE) subs seem to prioritize tiny enclosures over performance for the most part. I've seen the measurements for a bunch of DT stuff(4000,6000,8000 and a couple others) and one or two GE subs published and they all performed poorly. You could probably take the 8000 data and 2x it to get an idea of what the trinity would do?

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post #22422 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
Oh, I thought you told me they needed to be equidistant when we discussed which Anti-mode to go with?

PS I sent you a email and never got a reply.
Equidistant is ideal. But you can compensate for that with the time delay/phase setting on one sub too. It is just a matter of how much time is available for tweaking. Also, the dual core is significantly more powerful and flexible. I just try to steer folks to the least expensive option that I feel will provide the best value.

My bad on that email. Been one of those weeks...I'll circle back now.

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post #22423 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 12:00 PM
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Yea the ICE amp offers a lot of flexibility with the Time Delay feature. I agree he should be able to get things dialed in pretty good with the base anti-mode since both subs have independent time delays. I am still stuck in the past with Bash components.
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post #22424 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
Yea the ICE amp offers a lot of flexibility with the Time Delay feature. I agree he should be able to get things dialed in pretty good with the base anti-mode since both subs have independent time delays. I am still stuck in the past with Bash components.
You should trade your subs in for 3 V1800's. I know you're reference right now in the mid to high teens but more output and headroom never hurt anyone . If you ever build a dedicated room you can always add another or use them as a trade in. Just a thought.

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post #22425 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 12:55 PM
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Dang it...stop feeding my brain such temptation!! Logging off now...bye.
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post #22426 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
The DT(and GE) subs seem to prioritize tiny enclosures over performance for the most part. I've seen the measurements for a bunch of DT stuff(4000,6000,8000 and a couple others) and one or two GE subs published and they all performed poorly. You could probably take the 8000 data and 2x it to get an idea of what the trinity would do?

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
Yes there subs did and do kinda lack.the trinity and the supercube reference are the only good ones they ever made.

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post #22427 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 04:48 PM
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FYI,

We're doing another production run for the XS15se and XV15se in a few weeks. We should have the website updated tonight so anyone can place their orders. If anyone has been waiting(and I must have gotten 50! inquires about these recently......PLEASE don't hesitate to order. There is going to be a 3-4 week lead time but once this production run is sold out it may be a LONG time before we can fit another one into the cabinet schedule.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
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post #22428 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
FYI,

We're doing another production run for the XS15se and XV15se in a few weeks. We should have the website updated tonight so anyone can place their orders. If anyone has been waiting(and I must have gotten 50! inquires about these recently......PLEASE don't hesitate to order. There is going to be a 3-4 week lead time but once this production run is sold out it may be a LONG time before we can fit another one into the cabinet schedule.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio

Hi Tom, this is great news. I was told in the chat that there's also a chance the XV/XS will show up in the outlet, is that still the case?
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post #22429 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 06:42 PM
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You should trade your subs in for 3 V1800's. I know you're reference right now in the mid to high teens but more output and headroom never hurt anyone . If you ever build a dedicated room you can always add another or use them as a trade in. Just a thought.
I sent a email to Tom just to see what I would be looking at to trade. After a few emails it was determined that the upgrade would not be worth the cost. The V1800 is only 1.4db up on a XV15se in the 16-25hz range, but has 4-5db more above 30hz. The V1500 actually has a tad more output then the 1800 in the 16-25hz.

IMO it would only be worth upgrading to gain a bit more output down in the lowest bass. I already have more then enough upper bass for my room.

Tom confirmed that the AMDC was a better investment because I can boost the low end on my current setup and net some deeper extension.

Here is the new comparison charts.

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post #22430 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 06:45 PM
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I sent a email to Tom just to see what I would be looking at to trade. After a few emails it was determined that the upgrade would not be worth the cost. The V1800 is only 1.4db up on a XV15se in the 16-25hz range, but has 4-5db more above 30hz. The V1500 actually has a tad more output then the 1800 in the 16-25hz.

IMO it would only be worth upgrading to gain a bit more output down in the lowest bass. I already have more then enough upper bass for my room.

Tom confirmed that the AMDC was a better investment because I can boost the low end on my current setup and net some deeper extension.

Here is the new comparison charts.

Holy crap.i did not expect those numbers from the s3600.i knew it would be good. I figured 2 to 3 dbs over the s3000i...deal sealed. I have to go s3600.holy balls

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post #22431 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 07:15 PM
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post #22432 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 07:15 PM
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Bass: It looks like you need to trade 2 of your xv15se in for 1 v3600i and after the Wife gets over the shock (6-9 months) you trade in the last xv15se for another V3600i and enjoy the next 10 years not worring about bass :grinning:
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Bass: It looks like you need to trade 2 of your xv15se in for 1 v3600i and after the Wife gets over the shock (6-9 months) you trade in the last xv15se for another V3600i and enjoy the next 10 years not worring about bass :grinning:
LOL...The V3600 makes a nice addition to any family. Just set it in place and suddenly you have a new best friend.
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post #22434 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 08:03 PM
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Bass: It looks like you need to trade 2 of your xv15se in for 1 v3600i and after the Wife gets over the shock (6-9 months) you trade in the last xv15se for another V3600i and enjoy the next 10 years not worring about bass :grinning:
I must admit a pair of V3600's would be the end of the road for bass. I could not imagine another 6-10db of headroom across the board. Be reference capable down into the 12hz range.
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post #22435 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 08:33 PM
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Yes the V3600 is a BEAST!!
I missread.thought that was the s3600i.sorry

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post #22436 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 08:35 PM - Thread Starter
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I missread.thought that was the s3600i.sorry

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The S3600I still kicks ass.



Taken from

http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/s3600i
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I did expect the 16 to 25hz to be at least 3dbs more than the 3000..either way. I know I'm obsessed with numbers.i think the v3600 would leave me doubtless.but the 3000 would prolly be enough. So I'll stay middle ground I think and stick with the s3600i decision unless tom thinks otherwise

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post #22438 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
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I forgot to add. The obligatory T-18 needs an upgrade more power, bigger drivers and so on. But at this point to get more would likely require bigger drivers.

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post #22439 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 10:12 PM
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post #22440 of 33800 Old 09-19-2015, 10:18 PM
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I forgot to add. The obligatory T-18 needs an upgrade more power, bigger drivers and so on. But at this point to get more would likely require bigger drivers.
A T-24 would be killer.
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