Official Power Sound Audio Thread - Page 406 - AVS Forum
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post #12151 of 13080 Old 06-09-2014, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by climber07 View Post


I reset the sub gain to 84 and then the AVR adjusted to -12 dB. I bumped them up to -7 dB. So they are around 80dB now. It's always better to set the output of the AVR sub pre-out a little lower if you plan to bump it up. I'm very close to the 1:00 setting on the sub amp gain knob. It sounds good. I really don't think these new "se" drivers have the same gain issue I had with the old ones.

The overall sound should sound better now, running the LFE channel too hot will ruin the overall sound presentation.

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post #12152 of 13080 Old 06-09-2014, 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by climber07 View Post


I reset the sub gain to 84 and then the AVR adjusted to -12 dB. I bumped them up to -7 dB. So they are around 80dB now. It's always better to set the output of the AVR sub pre-out a little lower if you plan to bump it up. I'm very close to the 1:00 setting on the sub amp gain knob. It sounds good. I really don't think these new "se" drivers have the same gain issue I had with the old ones.

What was the gain issue?
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post #12153 of 13080 Old 06-09-2014, 09:40 PM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post

What was the gain issue?

On my non SE version I had to turn the gain knob up during the initial calibration or else the overal output was lacking, even if I ran it a few dB's hot. I then tried turning the gain up higher and then let Audyssey bring it back down to 75dB's, for me it made a big difference, not sure if that's what climber is talking about though.



Once I upgraded to the SE version I notice the output difference in the initial calibration set-up, that's saying something about these new drivers. There is another thing that I noticed, when pushed the non SE version seemed to run out of steam on certain scenes and it would make a hollow / echo sound, with the new drivers that's gone.

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post #12154 of 13080 Old 06-09-2014, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post

What was the gain issue?

I had the old driver set to 75 dB (about 11:00 on the dial) but was getting driver noise that sounded like the limiter.

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post #12155 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by climber07 View Post

I had the old driver set to 75 dB (about 11:00 on the dial) but was getting driver noise that sounded like the limiter.

Sounds like a amp issue...I ran the gains the same(2:00) on the old setup vs new and never had any issues. No bad noises or limiter triggering and that was with my spl meter reading up past 125db playing music.
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post #12156 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 06:40 AM
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Boy...some of you talk like the non SE version is very inferior to the SE version. I am beginning to think that it's "night vs day" or this is simply a slight case of placebo effect?

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post #12157 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 06:51 AM
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It will be nice once we can finally see some numbers to reinforce all the ranting and raving. wink.gif

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post #12158 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 06:54 AM
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Gov: My thoughts exactly. The XS30se version seems to have made a significant step forward in its clarity and control, which bodes well for music (my only minor complaint on the original). That being said, I have no intentions of upgrading my XS30. After almost a year, I find it is more beastly today than at any other time. If I were to use this sub for music, then I would no doubt upgrade. But for movies? I see no need to slam the walls any harder. YMMV.
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post #12159 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gov View Post

Boy...some of you talk like the non SE version is very inferior to the SE version. I am beginning to think that it's "night vs day" or this is simply a slight case of placebo effect?


Edit. My guess. Most people would never be able to tell the difference. But we're not most people.

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post #12160 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 07:24 AM
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Does anyone know what the xmax is of the new SE drivers?

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post #12161 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post

It will be nice once we can finally see some numbers to reinforce all the ranting and raving. wink.gif

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Originally Posted by dsrussell View Post

Gov: My thoughts exactly. The XS30se version seems to have made a significant step forward in its clarity and control, which bodes well for music (my only minor complaint on the original). That being said, I have no intentions of upgrading my XS30. After almost a year, I find it is more beastly today than at any other time. If I were to use this sub for music, then I would no doubt upgrade. But for movies? I see no need to slam the walls any harder. YMMV.

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Lol. It's like the non SE version was crap which we know is not the case. My guess is it's hard to tell. Everytime I re eq my sub it sounds great. Greater then before. Sometimes Ya. sometimes who knows. Why. Cause it always sounds great.....

I agree te non SE was still fantastic. However yes the SE model is a significant upgrade, but I can not say anything bad about my prior setup. I find it odd that some claimed the non SE was so great initially, but then they upgraded and now we are hearing about them making wierd noises and what not. I can say I ran my old drivers as hard as anybody in this thread being I am not afraid to play with sine wave test tones and sweeps at reference + levels. I never heard them make a bad noise. The only time I heard audible distortion when I was playing with too much eq boost (minindsp)down low which triggered the limiter. Both versions are good, but SE excels with music no doubt. They also work better with higher cross over settings then the old driver, which might be a perk for those with small mains. I find 120hz to work great with the SE but could not stand it before. To touch up on the steeper roll off, the more I listen with movies at louder levels the better I think the SE dsp is. Either way I could be satisfied with both versions for movie content, but again music really seperates the two. I am really looking forward to Ricci's testing
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post #12162 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 07:49 AM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post

Does anyone know what the xmax is of the new SE drivers?

Enough that it is going to make for a good challenge against your beloved FV15HP's...smile.giftongue.gif

Seriously tho, Eminence only rates the Lab15 around 12mm, but further tests have shown it to be around 20mm. Xmax is a tricky rating, similar to sensitivity in relation to how manufacturers rate it.
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post #12163 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 08:06 AM
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Enough that it is going to make for a good challenge against your beloved FV15HP's...smile.giftongue.gif

That's what I'm waiting to see. If it's anywhere close, then for $900 bucks it's kind of a no brainer. The FV15HP does have an advantage in a few areas though. Useable output down to 12hz, servo technology, variable tuning, better looking (at least to me). In single port mode I would think they might be close, but that's yet to be determined. With both ports open do you think the Rythmik pulls away?

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post #12164 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 08:12 AM
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Whatever the numbers end of being for the XV15se it's still a solid subwoofer and PSA makes great products. All I ever see are satisfied customers on here......
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post #12165 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post

Whatever the numbers end of being for the XV15se it's still a solid subwoofer and PSA makes great products. All I ever see are satisfied customers on here......

The only fault I can tell so far is that the XV15SE causes one to open their pocket books and spend more money on more subs, I have four now, I have one still in the box and the other is not delivered yet, contemplating do I really need four eek.gif I need new speakers more than I need more subs, but everybody keeps saying you can never have too many subs.biggrin.gif

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post #12166 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post

That's what I'm waiting to see. If it's anywhere close, then for $900 bucks it's kind of a no brainer. The FV15HP does have an advantage in a few areas though. Useable output down to 12hz, servo technology, variable tuning, better looking (at least to me). In single port mode I would think they might be close, but that's yet to be determined. With both ports open do you think the Rythmik pulls away?

In two port it looks to be within 1.5-2db from 20hz on up. One port would probably be really close. I agree you get 12hz extension, the only issue I see is that it suffers from high amounts of thd from 20hz and lower. The FV15 is pegging 40% 3rd order by 20hz. With a pair you cut that in half, so I still think the FV15 is a better sub no doubt, but the XV15se closed the gap some. smile.gif
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post #12167 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:05 AM
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The only fault I can tell so far is that the XV15SE causes one to open their pocket books and spend more money on more subs, I have four now, I have one still in the box and the other is not delivered yet, contemplating do I really need four eek.gif

You need help! tongue.gif
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post #12168 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:24 AM
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I agree te non SE was still fantastic. However yes the SE model is a significant upgrade, but I can not say anything bad about my prior setup. I find it odd that some claimed the non SE was so great initially, but then they upgraded and now we are hearing about them making wierd noises and what not. I can say I ran my old drivers as hard as anybody in this thread being I am not afraid to play with sine wave test tones and sweeps at reference + levels. I never heard them make a bad noise. The only time I heard audible distortion when I was playing with too much eq boost (minindsp)down low which triggered the limiter. Both versions are good, but SE excels with music no doubt. They also work better with higher cross over settings then the old driver, which might be a perk for those with small mains. I find 120hz to work great with the SE but could not stand it before. To touch up on the steeper roll off, the more I listen with movies at louder levels the better I think the SE dsp is. Either way I could be satisfied with both versions for movie content, but again music really seperates the two. I am really looking forward to Ricci's testing

Yes, I loved the original XS30 and I could of lived with it regardless of the hollow noise I heard on certain scenes, just thought it was the signature sound of the sub. The non SE version is still a great sub but once you upgrade there is NO going back, I reported that on day ONE and now you see everyone else chiming in, these new drivers do make a difference.
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post #12169 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by ahblaza View Post


The only fault I can tell so far is that the XV15SE causes one to open their pocket books and spend more money on more subs, I have four now, I have one still in the box and the other is not delivered yet, contemplating do I really need four eek.gif I need new speakers more than I need more subs, but everybody keeps saying you can never have too many subs.biggrin.gif

Need is not really a word most of us should use around here. I am jealous however, I would like to have four XV15se. 

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post #12170 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:31 AM
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Yes, I loved the original XS30 and I could of lived with it regardless of the hollow noise I heard on certain scenes, just thought it was the signature sound of the sub. The non SE version is still a great sub but once you upgrade there is NO going back, I reported that on day ONE and now you see everyone else chiming in, these new drivers do make a difference.

Agreed...thanks for clarifying. smile.gif
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post #12171 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by dsrussell View Post

Gov: My thoughts exactly. The XS30se version seems to have made a significant step forward in its clarity and control, which bodes well for music (my only minor complaint on the original). That being said, I have no intentions of upgrading my XS30. After almost a year, I find it is more beastly today than at any other time. If I were to use this sub for music, then I would no doubt upgrade. But for movies? I see no need to slam the walls any harder. YMMV.

You will notice a difference with BOTH music and movies, trust me!!!!!

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post #12172 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:35 AM
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Agreed...thanks for clarifying. smile.gif


Now the wait of ordering another XS30es is KILLING me!!!!!!

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post #12173 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 09:44 AM
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Yes, I loved the original XS30 and I could of lived with it regardless of the hollow noise I heard on certain scenes, just thought it was the signature sound of the sub. The non SE version is still a great sub but once you upgrade there is NO going back, I reported that on day ONE and now you see everyone else chiming in, these new drivers do make a difference.

I still have one of each version and there is a difference but I agree with what basshead said, I don't pick up much difference (if any) when playing movies at the levels I usually watch them at. But the SE version does seem to be better for music and that's saying something because I think the original plays music very well.

 

In the end I most likely will upgrade my non SE XV15 because it's a good deal at $275 and I would like my duals to be a matched pair, but I'm still very happy with the original XV15 and have never heard it make any funny noises no matter what I've thrown at it. So I agree the new drivers make a difference but I'm not sold on the idea that there is such a night and day difference between them, they're both very good. And I've compared them right next to one another playing the same material at the same settings. I still still maintain what I said a month ago, you will notice the difference on movies if you push them but if you listen at low to moderate levels you may not notice the upgrade.

 

In the end I still agree with what Tom has said, this upgrade may not be something that will benefit everyone based on their listening preferences. 

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post #12174 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post

I still have one of each version and there is a difference but I agree with what basshead said, I don't pick up much difference (if any) when playing movies at the levels I usually watch them at. But the SE version does seem to be better for music and that's saying something because I think the original plays music very well.

In the end I most likely will upgrade my non SE XV15 because it's a good deal at $275 and I would like my duals to be a matched pair, but I'm still very happy with the original XV15 and have never heard it make any funny noises no matter what I've thrown at it. So I agree the new drivers make a difference but I'm not sold on the idea that there is such a night and day difference between them, they're both very good. And I've compared them right next to one another playing the same material at the same settings. I still still maintain what I said a month ago, you will notice the difference on movies if you push them but if you listen at low to moderate levels you may not notice the upgrade.

In the end I still agree with what Tom has said, this upgrade may not be something that will benefit everyone based on their listening preferences. 

Very well said....smile.gif
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post #12175 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 10:38 AM
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Now the wait of ordering another XS30es is KILLING me!!!!!!

I can feel your pain my friend, seriously, I took a chance with PSA when they first hit the ID market, didn't know anything about Tom or Jim and their back ground experience. I starting sending emails to PSA and I wasn't done sending the message and I got a response from them, I thought wow what CS this company must have. My previous experiences with ID sub companies up to this point was very disappointing, not before the sell but particularly after. It took months to get a reply from the last sub company, I will mention the name as they are no longer in business EPIK eek.gif So in other words I purchased my first sub from PSA just on my conversations with Tom and Jim, I bought an XV15 and then another a month later, I think this during the pre-order time. A month later I get an email that PSA is coming out with a new sealed sub the XS30, so I traded the XV15s in on dual XS30s. This whole time I loved these subs, I had the XS30 about two months and I get an email saying that we (PSA) have a new flagship model coming out, the Triax, so naturally I said OK and traded in my XS30s and was subless for 3 months until I received my Cordovan Triax. The insanity didn't stop here, I never experienced a sub with the pedigree of the Triax, unfortunately the way my room is setup I could not get rid of a nasty null at 40-80Hz at the MLP, the solution was to get another Triax and I couldn't see spending another $3500 for another Cordovan so I sold it to a fellow forum member who is as crazy (I think more so) as I am. So I've had every sub except the XV30F in my home. It just so happened at this time I emailed Jim and asked what I should do, he reco'd the new SE XV15, so I ordered two and then I couldn't help myself tongue.gif I ordered two more. I don't know what the point is with this post except to say I am a PSA fan boy, there I said it. smile.gif Now if they would only hurry and get the speakers online I will be set and DONE draining my bank account biggrin.gif Thanks for listening.
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post #12176 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 11:38 AM
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Is this the same driver that everyone else has in the XV-15 (non-se version)? I thought the original XV-15 driver was a triple stacked magnet.



Here's the new and old driver for coil and magnet comparison:


Onkyo TX-NR3009 - Emotiva XPA-2 300 WPC - Polk Audio RTiA9 Mains - CSiA6 Center - F/XiA6 Surrounds - Dual PSA XV-15se Subwoofers - Samsung UN55C8000 3D LED TV - Samsung BD-F5900 3D Bluray - WDTV Live HD Media Player with 6TB External Storage - Nintendo Wii - XBox 360 - Logitech Harmony One...
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post #12177 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 11:52 AM
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Interesting...perhaps an alternate driver when they were having supply issues?


AVR:       Yamaha RXV-375

Display:  Panasonic  TH-50PC77U

LCR:       Hsu HB1.2  HC1.2

Sub:       (2) PSA XV15se

Blu Ray:  Sony BDP-S5100

Apple TV

Harmony 650

miniDSP

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post #12178 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 12:05 PM
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Hi all,

we spent a good part of 2013 redesigning the Power-X drivers. I believe the new * single stack* drivers started shipping in 4th quarter, 2013. The new driver had *very* similar performance to the original "triple stack Power-X driver so we never offered them as an upgrade. The only real performance improvement of note was *slightly* higher output in the 60-100hz range. By the time we got all the new photos and information ready to update the website for the new version....it had become clear to us we were very likely moving to a custom Lab15 variant. So we just skipped the "single stack" update and concentrated on the Lab15 variant information. The "triple stack" and "single stack" drivers are so close in overall performance that you could use one of each in a XS30 or XV30F with no problems for example.

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post #12179 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 12:05 PM
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I didn't know you can trade subs in for upgrades like svs. Or do I am reading this to literal and you sold off one then upgraded? Thats awsome if one day I want to trade xv15se's for a triax.
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Originally Posted by ahblaza View Post

I can feel your pain my friend, seriously, I took a chance with PSA when they first hit the ID market, didn't know anything about Tom or Jim and their back ground experience. I starting sending emails to PSA and I wasn't done sending the message and I got a response from them, I thought wow what CS this company must have. My previous experiences with ID sub companies up to this point was very disappointing, not before the sell but particularly after. It took months to get a reply from the last sub company, I will mention the name as they are no longer in business EPIK eek.gif So in other words I purchased my first sub from PSA just on my conversations with Tom and Jim, I bought an XV15 and then another a month later, I think this during the pre-order time. A month later I get an email that PSA is coming out with a new sealed sub the XS30, so I traded the XV15s in on dual XS30s. This whole time I loved these subs, I had the XS30 about two months and I get an email saying that we (PSA) have a new flagship model coming out, the Triax, so naturally I said OK and traded in my XS30s and was subless for 3 months until I received my Cordovan Triax. The insanity didn't stop here, I never experienced a sub with the pedigree of the Triax, unfortunately the way my room is setup I could not get rid of a nasty null at 40-80Hz at the MLP, the solution was to get another Triax and I couldn't see spending another $3500 for another Cordovan so I sold it to a fellow forum member who is as crazy (I think more so) as I am. So I've had every sub except the XV30F in my home. It just so happened at this time I emailed Jim and asked what I should do, he reco'd the new SE XV15, so I ordered two and then I couldn't help myself tongue.gif I ordered two more. I don't know what the point is with this post except to say I am a PSA fan boy, there I said it. smile.gif Now if they would only hurry and get the speakers online I will be set and DONE draining my bank account biggrin.gif Thanks for listening.
Cheers Jeff

Onkyo tx nr3010 Polk rti12's fronts Polk CSI A6 center Polk RTI6 front hights 4 Polk FXIA6 surrounds, and surround backs 3 power sound audio xv15se Subwoofers Oppo bd103,Mitsubishi WD-65638 65-Inch,Panasonic 50" TC-P50ST60,
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post #12180 of 13080 Old 06-10-2014, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post

Hi all,

we spent a good part of 2013 redesigning the Power-X drivers. I believe the new * single stack* drivers started shipping in 4th quarter, 2013. The new driver had *very* similar performance to the original "triple stack Power-X driver so we never offered them as an upgrade. The only real performance improvement of note was *slightly* higher output in the 60-100hz range. By the time we got all the new photos and information ready to update the website for the new version....it had become clear to us we were very likely moving to a custom Lab15 variant. So we just skipped the "single stack" update and concentrated on the Lab15 variant information. The "triple stack" and "single stack" drivers are so close in overall performance that you could use one of each in a XS30 or XV30F with no problems for example.

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio

You sneaky devil! smile.gif
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Xs30 , Velodyne Sms 1 In Room Bass Correction Kit With Included Microphone , Denon Avr 3313ci Receiver , Denon Avr 4520ci Receiver , Power Sound Audio , Xv15 , Power Sound Audio Triax , Room Equilizer Wizard Rew , Denon Avr X4000 7 2 Channel Home Theater Receiver
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