Pick up the Ken Kreisel MX-5000 MK III Subwoofer in Hong Kong Hometheater Showroom - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 51 Old 01-08-2012, 08:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Just pick up the Ken Kreisel MX-5000 MK III Subwoofer at Hong Kong Hometheater Showroom (www.hometheater.hk), and too tired now.

Post the photo first
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post #2 of 51 Old 01-08-2012, 08:31 AM
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I read a report that claims this sub has a lot to offer below 20Hz.
I guess we'll find out pretty soon
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post #3 of 51 Old 01-08-2012, 08:51 AM
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Can't wait to hear what you think about it
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post #4 of 51 Old 01-10-2012, 09:28 PM
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What do you think of the new 5000? Really facinated to see if the bottom end has improved.
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post #5 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 12:22 PM
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What exactly is "High Velocity Deep Bass" ?

I guess everyone else is making Low Velocity deep bass...
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post #6 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 12:50 PM
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How is the pricing?
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post #7 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmrowe View Post

How is the pricing?

MSRP is $3,000 but some discounting is likely. Ken K seems to be struggling to sell the MX 5000 MK3. Not surprising considering the competition at the $2,000 and up price point. The Seaton Submersive HP and JTR powered Captivator are proven monster performers with well deserved reputations that are under $2,500.

With its 800 watts being shared by two 12 inch drivers, the MX-5000 MK3 seems to be at a disadvantage right from the start.
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post #8 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

MSRP is $3,000 but some discounting is likely. Ken K seems to be struggling to sell the MX 5000 MK3. Not surprising considering the competition at the $2,000 and up price point. The Seaton Submersive HP and JTR powered Captivator are proven monster performers with well deserved reputations that are under $2,500.

With its 800 watts being shared by two 12 inch drivers, the MX-5000 MK3 seems to be at a disadvantage right from the start.

Is he struggling to sell it already? How long has this sub been out in the states? Its not out in the uk yet.

Twin 15s with a few thousand watts would have been more interesting but bare in mind...kens subs have never been about all out depth

21inch hitachi
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post #9 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 02:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billybobjimbob View Post

Twin 15s with a few thousand watts would have been more interesting but bare in mind...kens subs have never been about all out depth

Agreed. M&K's philosophy was sound quality first, and if you needed more SPL, get more subs.

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post #10 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

Agreed. M&K's philosophy was sound quality first, and if you needed more SPL, get more subs.

Yes sir, and they did sound great, even for todays standards. I think output was 100 dbs at 20hz for the original 5000.
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post #11 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cschang View Post

Agreed. M&K's philosophy was sound quality first, and if you needed more SPL, get more subs.

OK, sign me up for dual M&K MX-5000 MK3.

Seriously, does anyone expect the MK3 to have better sound quality than the Submersive?

Curtis, would you choose a MK3 over a pair of Rythmik F15 HP's ?

M&K has always been overpriced for what you get. I have Don Keele's lengthy review of the original M&K S5000 system. Excellent dynamics and clarity from the mains. The original MX 5000 subs were quite powerful for a dual 12 inch with 400 watts but were quite expensive. Other subs like the Paradigm Servo 15 and the 18 inch Velodyne Servo subs of the day made for interesting comparisons.
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post #12 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 03:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Yes sir, and they did sound great, even for todays standards. I think output was 100 dbs at 20hz for the original 5000.

Umm, with all due respect, how long has it been since you stopped using your MK 5000 subs?
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post #13 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 04:59 PM
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As much a fan i am of Kens speakers.... I dont think i'll be selling my Paradigm Statement Sub2 just yet. I like the sound of the old m&k subs but the Paradigm beast has the upper bass covered as well as digging deep and all this whilst looking quite cool! Nevertheless, i look forward to hearing these bass babies

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post #14 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

MSRP is $3,000 but some discounting is likely. Ken K seems to be struggling to sell the MX 5000 MK3. Not surprising considering the competition at the $2,000 and up price point. The Seaton Submersive HP and JTR powered Captivator are proven monster performers with well deserved reputations that are under $2,500.

With its 800 watts being shared by two 12 inch drivers, the MX-5000 MK3 seems to be at a disadvantage right from the start.

Thanks for the numbers. I am curious to see what the OP paid.
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post #15 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

Curtis, would you choose a MK3 over a pair of Rythmik F15 HP's ?

Don't know...never heard them. I was just stating their philosophy.

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post #16 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 06:58 PM
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Hey Spyboy, how's the Seaton or JTR distribution chain over in China doing? Since your so adept at giving sound advice on what people should spend their money on you can do the OP a "solid" and ship a Submersive or Captivator over to him in Hong Kong. Wonder if the ID companies would be such a great deal then? Seems like you really like getting into a thread and either try to make the OP feel bad about their purchase or put a damper on the enthusiasm the thread has built. WEAK If you want to bum people out about everything other than ID, start another thread, don't hijack this one (or others) please.
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post #17 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 07:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kgb540 View Post

Hey Spyboy, how's the Seaton or JTR distribution chain over in China doing? Since your so adept at giving sound advice on what people should spend their money on you can do the OP a "solid" and ship a Submersive or Captivator over to him in Hong Kong. Wonder if the ID companies would be such a great deal then? Seems like you really like getting into a thread and either try to make the OP feel bad about their purchase or put a damper on the enthusiasm the thread has built. WEAK If you want to bum people out about everything other than ID, start another thread, don't hijack this one (or others) please.

On a site dedicated to people pursuing excellence in home theater, you are always going to have people stating that you can get more performance with X product. And he is right, ID has a huge advantage in terms of producing high end products with relatively small margins when compared to retail offerings.

Have you worked with Jeff or Mark? I bet they can get their subs out to Hong Kong pretty easily. I shipped an MFW-15 across the country for $40 through our work UPS account. I can't imagine shipping to Hong Kong being more than 4-5 times that.

Either way, you bring up a good point, we should keep the thread discussions to the topic at hand. If we want to compare an MK sub to some ID offering, lets make a thread for that.

Edit:

My in-laws have an old (2001) MK sub. It seems to put out some serious bass for its size. I've never measured it, but it definitely puts out more than they need for their typical programs (ESPN, CSI, etc).
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post #18 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 08:40 PM
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My first real sub way back when was an older THX rated M&K sub (I forget the model number). I have very fond memories of that sub and wish I never traded it for a THX rated B&W sub. Worst audio trade down of my life and I am still not sure what I was thinking, other than i liked the idea of having the sub brand match my N804s.

My current sub is a Submersive HP. Its an awesome sub as well and while I probably wouldn't trade it for the sub in this thread, but I would be very surprised indeed if the Ken Kreisel offering wasn't an excellent performer as well. My unscientific guess is that anyone who purchases one will be very pleased with it and that we are dealing with very fine degrees of relative awesomeness.
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post #19 of 51 Old 01-11-2012, 09:17 PM
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Spyboy, I don't remember how long it has been. I was just stating my opinion of the 5000 mk1. Great sounding sub. My current subs can hit 112 DBS at 20 hz and I have 4 of them. It would take 4 of the 5000's to equal my one sub and my one sub cost $700 minus amp or $950 with 2100 watts. I would never go back because of the value and performance of the subs.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Spyboy, I don't remember how long it has been. I was just stating my opinion of the 5000 mk1. Great sounding sub. My current subs can hit 112 DBS at 20 hz and I have 4 of them. It would take 4 of the 5000's to equal my one sub and my one sub cost $700 minus amp or $950 with 2100 watts. I would never go back because of the value and performance of the subs.



MKtheater do you have any picture of your latest subs!
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post #21 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

MSRP is $3,000 but some discounting is likely. Ken K seems to be struggling to sell the MX 5000 MK3. Not surprising considering the competition at the $2,000 and up price point. The Seaton Submersive HP and JTR powered Captivator are proven monster performers with well deserved reputations that are under $2,500.

With its 800 watts being shared by two 12 inch drivers, the MX-5000 MK3 seems to be at a disadvantage right from the start.

Spyboy, do you work for the United States government? You're making non factual statements which are mis leading and could well lead people astray-i think you have what it takes to be the new secretary of defence!!

1) You didnt answer the question if the mx5000mk3 is available in the USA yet-as far as i know it isnt yet.

2) if its only released in the east, how can you guage he's struggling to sell it? The chinese home enthusiasts are in general huge m&k fans and Kens been over to China for the release with most pre-orders sold out-not the sign of a struggling sub. Also it cant be struggling that much if you change your mind within the space of 2 posts and say you'll have 2!

3) although figures about amp size, and driver size help, there is no way you can
compare the functioning going off figures. A decent comparison can only take place by physically being in the presence of the subs and having a listen.

4) im not sure where you get the m&k systems were overpriced. Remember, this is the man that created the sub, the tripole, the push pull system and helped set the thx standard. With all that in mind, we have to appreciate the original m&k products were innovative products, and like anything innovative, there is a small premium. I personally dont think they were over priced.

I'll reserve judgement on the new sub till ive heard it with my own ears. As far as pricing goes, lots of retailers will offer a little discount, especially to early adopters

21inch hitachi
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post #22 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 11:08 AM
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The K Kreisal web site has next to nothing on it about his 2 new products, the MX-5000MK3 and the MX-700MK3. All we know is that the MSRP is listed as $3,000 for the MX-5000 MK3, and $2,000 for the MX-700 MK3. Oh, we also know that Ken is promoting the 5000 MK3 with the term "High Velocity Deep Bass". So, everyone else has "Low Velocity Deep Bass"?
Please explain "High Velocity" deep bass to me.

Based on the fact that the prices shown on the web site are in US dollars, I expect the MX5000 MK3 to become avaiable in the US, in which case it will face fierce competition from the likes of the Seaton Submersive HP and JTR powered Captivator. If the MX5000 MK3 is not going to be available in the US, I have little interest as I simply don't follow subwoofers that are almost exclusively available in Europe, Asia, and the Middle East.

So, we have to wait and see if Ken decides to sell in the US and what kind of distribution chain he can come up with. I stand by my statment that M&K products were expensive for what you got.

In December 1995 Tom Nousaine tested 11 subwoofers for Video magazine. The top performing sub was the HSU HRSW12V at $850, the second highest performing sub was the Cerwin-Vega HT-12 PWR at MSRP $900, and the M&K MX-125, MSRP $995 ranked 5th in performance.

I was able to pick up a brand new Cerwin-Vega HT-12 PWR for $378 and it was not only a great performer, it cost a little more than 35% of the cost of the M&K MX-125.

I am not discussing design philosophy, only measured performance and personal experience.

I eagerly await the MX-5000 MK3 becoming available in the US and seeing how it compares to subs like the Seaton Submersive HP and the JTR powered Captivator.
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post #23 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

The K Kreisal web site has next to nothing on it about his 2 new products, the MX-5000MK3 and the MX-700MK3. All we know is that the MSRP is listed as $3,000 for the MX-5000 MK3, and $2,000 for the MX-700 MK3. Oh, we also know that Ken is promoting the 5000 MK3 with the term "High Velocity Deep Bass". So, everyone else has "Low Velocity Deep Bass"?
Please explain "High Velocity" deep bass to me.

Based on the fact that the prices shown on the web site are in US dollars, I expect the MX5000 MK3 to become avaiable in the US, in which case it will face fierce competition from the likes of the Seaton Submersive HP and JTR powered Captivator. If the MX5000 MK3 is not going to be available in the US, I have little interest as I simply don't follow subwoofers that are almost exclusively available in Europe, Asia, and the Middle East.

So, we have to wait and see if Ken decides to sell in the US and what kind of distribution chain he can come up with. I stand by my statment that M&K products were expensive for what you got.

In December 1995 Tom Nousaine tested 11 subwoofers for Video magazine. The top performing sub was the HSU HRSW12V at $850, the second highest performing sub was the Cerwin-Vega HT-12 PWR at MSRP $900, and the M&K MX-125, MSRP $995 ranked 5th in performance.

I was able to pick up a brand new Cerwin-Vega HT-12 PWR for $378 and it was not only a great performer, it cost a little more than 35% of the cost of the M&K MX-125.

I am not discussing design philosophy, only measured performance and personal experience.

I eagerly await the MX-5000 MK3 becoming available in the US and seeing how it compares to subs like the Seaton Submersive HP and the JTR powered Captivator.

Hang on a second padre, you've clearly stated that Ken is struggling to sell the mx5000 mk3. Please can you tell me how you come to this conclusion? The subwoofer hasnt even been released in the states so clearly with this statement you havnt a clue what you're talking about as now you're saying you expect it to be released in the States!!! Make your mind up!!

Secondly, there are no rules that state that new products have to be launched in the USA first. The sub has just been launched in China, its made there, ken kreisel & m&k were popular there so its logical to launch there first.

You've just said you're not discussing design philisophies, so why are you asking me What push pulsar is? Maybe its simething to do with 2 billygoats and a hillbilly? Or maybe its a play on the push pull config of the drivers?

I mean no offence spyboy, my point is merely the fact youve made a few baseless, foundationless and conflicting statements. It would be a lot wiser if you refrained from this until the sub has been released, and you've had a listen. It may well not sell, it may sell like hotcakes, it maybe rubbish, it maybe awsome..i suggest a bit of patience and we'll all know soon enough

21inch hitachi
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post #24 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billybobjimbob View Post

Hang on a second padre, you've clearly stated that Ken is struggling to sell the mx5000 mk3. Please can you tell me how you come to this conclusion? The subwoofer hasnt even been released in the states so clearly with this statement you havnt a clue what you're talking about as now you're saying you expect it to be released in the States!!! Make your mind up!!

Secondly, there are no rules that state that new products have to be launched in the USA first. The sub has just been launched in China, its made there, ken kreisel & m&k were popular there so its logical to launch there first.

You've just said you're not discussing design philisophies, so why are you asking me What push pulsar is? Maybe its simething to do with 2 billygoats and a hillbilly? Or maybe its a play on the push pull config of the drivers?

I mean no offence spyboy, my point is merely the fact youve made a few baseless, foundationless and conflicting statements. It would be a lot wiser if you refrained from this until the sub has been released, and you've had a listen. It may well not sell, it may sell like hotcakes, it maybe rubbish, it maybe awsome..i suggest a bit of patience and we'll all know soon enough

You can be the steward of the overpriced MX-5000 MK3. When it has had a review from someone like Josh Ricci, send me a Private Message. Launched in China because its made there? Please. And, please explain what "High Velocity" deep bass is.

Best Regards
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post #25 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

You can be the steward of the overpriced MX-5000 MK3. When it has had a review from someone like Josh Ricci, send me a Private Message. Launched in China because its made there? Please.

Best Regards

You've still not given an explanation as to how you came to the conclusion the mx5000mk3 is struggling to sell, when its not even been released in the USA. Complete nonsense which you've just made up!

Unfortunately after reading that statement, its very difficult to take any further statements and comments from yourself seriously.

All im saying is let the sub be released, have a demo and then draw your own conclusion.

Im not a fanboy for the mx5000mk3, i own a Paradigm Sub2 which im quite happy with (you can ask Josh Ricci-whoever he is-what he thinks of this sub!) its just damn annoying when people dont give a product a fair shot by making misleading statements. I bid you good day sir

21inch hitachi
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post #26 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

MSRP is $3,000 but some discounting is likely. Ken K seems to be struggling to sell the MX 5000 MK3.

Pure unsubstantiated rubbish.............again
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post #27 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 01:51 PM
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We know of exactly one purchase of the MX-5000 MK3 from the Original Poster of this thread. If anyone can substantiate any other sales of this sub, please do so.
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post #28 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billybobjimbob View Post

You've still not given an explanation as to how you came to the conclusion the mx5000mk3 is struggling to sell, when its not even been released in the USA. Complete nonsense which you've just made up!

Unfortunately after reading that statement, its very difficult to take any further statements and comments from yourself seriously.

All im saying is let the sub be released, have a demo and then draw your own conclusion.

Im not a fanboy for the mx5000mk3, i own a Paradigm Sub2 which im quite happy with (you can ask Josh Ricci-whoever he is-what he thinks of this sub!) its just damn annoying when people dont give a product a fair shot by making misleading statements. I bid you good day sir

I encourage you to put me on your ignore list.
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post #29 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

We know of exactly one purchase of the MX-5000 MK3 from the Original Poster of this thread. If anyone can substantiate any other sales of this sub, please do so.

Hey, I'm not trying to engage you in a pissing match here but you made the statement above. The OP purchased it in Hong Kong, it is not even available for sale in the US yet.
So based on those facts, how can you make a fact based post that it is "probably discounted", or that "sales are struggling"?

I mean in all of your posts on this item, you took a negative tone, comparing it with well known US champions of the industry, yet it isn't even for sale in the USA yet? Nor have you heard one perform.

Do you have some secret insight? Perhaps a crystal ball? Do you travel to Hong Kong frequently?

I'm done here.
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post #30 of 51 Old 01-12-2012, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by polizzio View Post

Hey, I'm not trying to engage you in a pissing match here but you made the statement above. The OP purchased it in Hong Kong, it is not even available for sale in the US yet.
So based on those facts, how can you make a fact based post that it is "probably discounted", or that "sales are struggling"?

I mean in all of your posts on this item, you took a negative tone, comparing it with well known US champions of the industry, yet it isn't even for sale in the USA yet? Nor have you heard one perform.

Do you have some secret insight? Perhaps a crystal ball? Do you travel to Hong Kong frequently?

I'm done here.

Instead of keeping your focus on me, why don't you post something of substance? If the 5000 Mk3 won't be sold at at a discount that will another factor limiting sales....
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