Anyone upgrade from a SVS PB12 plus/2? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 01-19-2012, 06:09 AM - Thread Starter
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I've caught the upgrade bug and I'm looking for opinions from PB12 Plus/2 owners that have upgraded. I'd like to know how this older sub compares to the the newer SVS models and I'm open to other brands. Budget is flexible but I'm looking around $3500 for dual subs. Dedicated theater use so all movies. Sorry about the long post but I like to give as much info as possible.

I purchased one of the last PB12 plus/2's from SVS in 2008 and I just can't seem to get it right. At first it was in in an open family room with wood floors and tall ceilings and I figured that limited it's potential. It would rumble the house but wasn't that tight brutal bass I was looking for. It always sounded a bit boomy and I contributed it to room acoustics and placement. I recently completed a dedicated home theater that I thought would really make this thing shine but I'm still left wanting. The sub just falls off below 25 hz and it doesn't seem to matter if I use the 20hz or 16hz tune. It also sounds a bit boomy in the upper bass range around 80 hz. Crossing over at 80-100hz really muddies the sound so I'm currently crossing over at 60hz which sounds the best.

My room is 20' wide x 17' deep x 7' tall. It's sound proofed with double layer 5/8" drywall, Green Glue (3 tubes per sheet), Isolation clips and hangers, communicating doors and mufflered HVAC system. I've put in extensive room treatments but I'll admit I didn't follow science for that one as I made the front of the room as dead as possible and used bass traps and panels throughout but placement was a combination of aesthetics and performance. The panels pictured are all 4" thick mineral wool. The panels behind the screen and flanking the screen are 2" mineral wool.

I use a Denon 4311 and Emotiva XPA-3 amp to power 3 - Emotiva 6.3 LCR and 4 Emotiva ERD-1 surrounds. I've run audyssey following the guide and used a boom mike stand for all 8 positions. Checking the Audyssey equalization gives a fairly flat response on the speaker with nothing needing more then 6 db of adjustment but most are under 3db.

I did the sub crawl and found the best location for the 5 primary seats is directly behind the main listening position. Front Ccorner placement took all bass away from the 3 center seats. You can just make out the plus2 in the 3rd picture directly below the projector.

I'm thinking if I upgrade to two subs flanking each side of the screen I could eliminate some of the room nulls and get that tight bass I'm looking for. When I purchased the Plus2 the I listened to the ultra in the demo room and it was what I was looking for and should have bought it. SVS actually steered me towards the plus/2 for my particular room as it had more output suitable for a open family room. I should have did a back to back test in the room but I blew that one.
LL
LL
LL
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post #2 of 12 Old 01-19-2012, 06:51 AM
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First thing, nice looking setup. It could use some color.

The older generation of SVS subs typically had a 40Hz hump in the response that did tend to make them a little muddy/boomy in the mid-lower bass region unless you found a way to EQ out the hump. The new generation appears to have corrected this and show a much flatter curve over the entire FR. Of course, room acoustics may change the desirable flat response to something less that desirable without having proper EQ capabilities. BTW, I had one of the first of the last generation PB12-Plus/2 subs and throughly enjoyed it. But there are a lot of other contributors to good response besides the sub. This includes our own sensitivity to certain frequencies.

I haven't heard any of the latest SVS offerings, but I did get to demo a pair of the earlier PB13/U's with the current driver but the BASH amp. They demonstrated a much crisper, impactful, and fuller sound than the PB12+/2, but in a one-on-one match up, the +/2 could hold it's own in the output arena.

I don't make sub recommendations, but there is a lot of highly capable subs out there that can put a smile on your face, especially if you go the dual route. I would recommend you set aside some of your budget to get proper EQ capability and possibly have your system professionally tuned. I'd hate to see such a nice setup be a disappointment to you because of improper acoustics.

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post #3 of 12 Old 01-19-2012, 07:03 AM - Thread Starter
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The pictures were taken with a flash so in real life the room is really really dark. You can't distinguish the blue from the black cielings but that was the idea. No reflections.

I'm a little confused on sub equalization comment as the 4311 uses Audyssey XT which would equalize the sub as well or better then most stand alone products.
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post #4 of 12 Old 01-19-2012, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by npc2396 View Post

The pictures were taken with a flash so in real life the room is really really dark. You can't distinguish the blue from the black ceilings but that was the idea. No reflections.

Just kidding. I actually thought they were B&W photos.

Quote:
Originally Posted by npc2396 View Post

I'm a little confused on sub equalization comment as the 4311 uses Audyssey XT which would equalize the sub as well or better then most stand alone products.

Just commenting on your disappointment with the +/2. Mine hit hard and I was completely satisfied with it. I had mine in a very open, 8800CF space, but I did use near-field placement (6' from LP) to compensate for the room size. It's surprising how many have been disappointed with subs that are very capable of loud and clean output until they get it dialed in properly. Just thinking that, if the +/2 has problems in your room, other subs will too. If you've never been happy with the +/2, there may be an issue with it such as the two drivers wired out of phase.

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post #5 of 12 Old 01-19-2012, 08:10 AM
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I'll sell you my plus 2 and your problem will be solved Interested to hear what people recommend or suggest. Mine was purchased about the same time and has performed admirably. Did have to replace the amp about 4 months ago as it failed. Oh and if I was upgrading today I'd probably start with a single JTR cap.. then add a 2nd down the road.
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post #6 of 12 Old 01-19-2012, 09:50 AM - Thread Starter
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I was thinking about picking up another Plus2

I am near field as the sub is inches from my head so I don't think room placement is a factor at this point. Audyssey put the location at 4' which I think is accurate as the sub cable is very long (50') so there is some delay that needs accounted for.

Not sure how to test if the drivers are wired out of phase? I know they both move and I've never had any issues with the amp.

So, I'm sitting inches from the sub and have used Audyssey (multiple times with different tunes) to set up the sub. I've listened to it with Audyssey off and have played with different gains just to make sure it's not a calibration issue. The sub hits hard and has plenty of output but I think I may be expecting too much from a single sub.
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post #7 of 12 Old 01-25-2012, 06:07 PM
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If you decide you want to sell that plus2, I'd be interested in it!?!
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post #8 of 12 Old 03-06-2012, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by npc2396 View Post

I was thinking about picking up another Plus2

I am near field as the sub is inches from my head so I don't think room placement is a factor at this point. Audyssey put the location at 4' which I think is accurate as the sub cable is very long (50') so there is some delay that needs accounted for.

Not sure how to test if the drivers are wired out of phase? I know they both move and I've never had any issues with the amp.

So, I'm sitting inches from the sub and have used Audyssey (multiple times with different tunes) to set up the sub. I've listened to it with Audyssey off and have played with different gains just to make sure it's not a calibration issue. The sub hits hard and has plenty of output but I think I may be expecting too much from a single sub.



I have been looking for one of these subs. Let me know if you plan on selling this.

Ray
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post #9 of 12 Old 03-06-2012, 10:11 PM
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With that budget take a long hard look at a couple JTR Captivator units - passive - with the amp of your choice.

"Without subs it's just background music - with subs it's the main event!"
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post #10 of 12 Old 02-25-2014, 04:35 PM
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I'm looking for a plus 2
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post #11 of 12 Old 02-25-2014, 04:44 PM - Thread Starter
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i moved so mine is for sale!
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post #12 of 12 Old 02-25-2014, 04:46 PM
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How much and where are u located?
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