Sub for City loft, 4000 cubic ft, HSU, SVS, Seaton, JTR, Polk? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 08:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Hello, I have been lurking on this forum for a while doing research. I appreciate all of the expertise here, much of it beyond my current understanding of HT systems.

I am looking to either buy a replacement amp for my sub or a new sub and could use some guidance. I have a Polk PSW1200 and it doesn’t seem to want to power up, Polk doesn’t have parts anymore, so if anyone has an extra amp hit me up…otherwise I am looking for guidance on a new sub.

The room – 18 ft by 19 ft with 11.5 ft high ceilings ~ 4000 cubic feet. My wife and I live in a 1Br condo in the city so this is actually our family room, living room, office, and kitchen. As such, it is pretty cluttered with furniture and dual subs are not an option. I have stood firm on speaker placement over time and have an entire corner of the room (front left) dedicated to the Polk PSW1200 but with logistics as they are that is it. I wont be able to mess with different placements outside of this corner.

System – I have Polk RTi A front bookshelf, center, and rear speakers.

Me – To do this right it looks like I would need to calibrate my system extensively. Honestly, I probably wont spend a lot of time to do this, I work close to 100 hours a week and just don’t have the time or the patience. I bought an Onkyo receiver that has this: Audyssey MultEQ® XT Advanced Room-correction and Speaker Calibration. I am willing to use that but probably not much more.

Use - 80% HT and 20% music (Progressive Trance), but we really do love our music.

Goal - To get as good of sound as I had with the Polk PSW1200 or better.

Hopefully that background helps. I am looking at two “classes” of subs below, what should I do?

Class 1) Don’t drop a ton of cash, get it to the bass I am used to.
--Polk DSW microPRO 4000 (looking at this because Polk offered a discount since my PSW1200 gave out)
--HSU VTF-15H
--SVS PB12-PLUS

Class 2) Have serious buyer remorse but do it right.
--SVS PB13-Ultra (based on research I think this is the laggard behind the next two)
--JTR Captivator
--Seaton SubMersive (HP or non-HP)

Thanks in advance for any guidance, again, I cant really mess with placement outside of the one corner and I may not do too much with calibration.
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post #2 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 09:15 AM
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What is the discount polk gave you? For your room size the 4000 will do more than fine. The Polk is rathe small compare to others, but others will have more output for sure.
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post #3 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 09:50 AM
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You might want to read this thread from a couple of days ago.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post21504324
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post #4 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the fast response. Polk hasnt given me the discount amount yet, so i dont know for sure.
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post #5 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 09:55 AM
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This is a big purchase and most on this forum advocate stepping up to as high a level of performance as possible so you won't have upgrade for a while (or ever!)
Therefore I'd recommend the Submersive or Captivator 1a and 1b, followed by the SVS PB13 Ultra as #2.
With your choice of music you will realize how much was there that you were missing with the Polk. Same for movies.
No knock against Polk but the ID companies like Hsu, SVS, Seaton, JTR, etc. give so much more performance in absolute terms as well as as per dollar.
The Submersive and Ultra come in beautiful veneers but none of the above subs are unattractive.
If you really have a size restriction a Sealed Cap is pretty small.
Good luck.
Tim
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post #6 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, so Polk has left the race...

I agree with the philosophy of buy the best once rather than buy multiple iterations and slowly get there. Considering my restrictions on placement and calibration is there a point of diminishing returns as you go up the spectrum of subs? If I bought the Seaton would i be buying a Ferrari to drive on a 25mph speed limit road?
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post #7 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTSHEP1 View Post

Thanks, so Polk has left the race...

I agree with the philosophy of buy the best once rather than buy multiple iterations and slowly get there. Considering my restrictions on placement and calibration is there a point of diminishing returns as you go up the spectrum of subs? If I bought the Seaton would i be buying a Ferrari to drive on a 25mph speed limit road?

You certainly would be buying a "Ferrari". What roads you choose to drive down are up to you. One thing is for certain, your system will not be restricted by your LFE channel. If placement and EQ are a big concern, I HIGHLY recommend the Antimode 8033. I ran my SubM HP with and without it and it made a noticeable improvement. It's also just about as close to plug-n-play as it gets. This combination yields the grace of a ballerina and the brute force of an NFL linebacker. You WILL NOT be disappointed.

John
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post #8 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 04:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks I think I will eventually need something like that.

Seems like a toss-up between the submersive and the captivator. I will go with whichever one comes back with the best price/fastest response.

Thanks for the help all.
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post #9 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 04:24 PM
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I can't speak to the Captivator, but I'm sure its a great choice based on what I have read. I can say that my wife was afraid that the Submersive HP would be too much sub for us and would just drive us out of the room based on its physical appearance and the size of the box it came in. After setting it up, level balancing, and running MultEQ XT32, my wife was shocked at how smooth and integrated the sub was and just how much better it was overall then my B&W SW750 it replaced (which is a pretty nice sub). The SubM is just so smooth and tight I love it. It only kicks you in the teeth when the source material calls for it--the rest of the time it just blends in wonderfully with my speakers. This is one of my favorite audio purchases of all time, and I have had a lot of them over the years.
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post #10 of 30 Old 01-21-2012, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjackkrash View Post

I can't speak to the Captivator, but I'm sure its a great choice based on what I have read. I can say that my wife was afraid that the Submersive HP would be too much sub for us and would just drive us out of the room based on its physical appearance and the size of the box it came in. After setting it up, level balancing, and running MultEQ XT32, my wife was shocked at how smooth and integrated the sub was and just how much better it was overall then my B&W SW750 it replaced (which is a pretty nice sub). The SubM is just so smooth and tight I love it. It only kicks you in the teeth when the source material calls for it--the rest of the time it just blends in wonderfully with my speakers. This is one of my favorite audio purchases of all time, and I have had a lot of them over the years.

+1 with the bolded comment... in fact, in my case it's +3.

Craig

Lombardi said it:
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

My System

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post #11 of 30 Old 01-23-2012, 12:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks again, Seaton Submersive is now on the way...

What do you reccomend I look at next? Get an Antimode 8033? New front, center, and surround (currently Polk RTi A)? Amp? Something else?
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post #12 of 30 Old 01-23-2012, 12:53 PM
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100 hours a week? Yikes, you're hardly going to have any time to hear it!! When you do find the time, you're going to love it. Great decision.
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post #13 of 30 Old 01-23-2012, 04:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTSHEP1 View Post

Thanks again, Seaton Submersive is now on the way...

What do you reccomend I look at next? Get an Antimode 8033? New front, center, and surround (currently Polk RTi A)? Amp? Something else?

Congrats, the Submersive is an amazing piece of equipment. They are my all time favorite HT purchase. My sub search for my main HT is done for good. The only thing that could change would be adding another pair if I ever change to a much larger HT.
If you plan on keeping your Onkyo with XT for a while an Antimode would be a good purchase.
Let us know how it goes when you get it set up.
Tim
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post #14 of 30 Old 01-23-2012, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTSHEP1 View Post

Thanks again, Seaton Submersive is now on the way...

What do you reccomend I look at next? Get an Antimode 8033? New front, center, and surround (currently Polk RTi A)? Amp? Something else?

For less than $1k, I would strongly consider the Antimode 8033 and the Buttkicker LFE kit, especially if your seats are on a concrete slab. The Antimode will help the SubM sound cleaner and the Buttkicker will provide the tactile feedback that no sub could (that is, if you are in fact on a slab).

Are acoustic panels an option in this room? While not the sexiest purchase, panels will make EVERYTHING sound better. GIK is one reputable company.

New speakers and amp could make an improvement, but IMO won't get you nearly the bang for your buck these options will.

John
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post #15 of 30 Old 01-23-2012, 07:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the advice, I can sense that I am now kicking this into the expensive hobby range

I am on a concrete slab but there is thin wood floor and a small carpet on top of that. I will look at the Antimode for sure and research the buttkicker. I think paneling will be pushing it with the wife. Then again, her triathelon bike is lounging around in this room all the time...

Also, if anyone wants a finicky Polk PSW1200 for free, let me know. Pickup only, Jersey City, NJ.
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post #16 of 30 Old 01-23-2012, 07:49 PM
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Another big benefit of the Buttkicker (especially for those in attached units) is that it allows much of the "bass effect" while listening at significantly lower volumes, such as late at night or when you just don't wanna piss off the neighbors.

On a side note, what remote(s) control your system? A good universal remote (the Harmony 880 comes immediately to mind) can be a great and economical addition to your system, making things easier to use. And keep on mind, its one of those upgrades anyone can use EVERY TIME the system is used.
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post #17 of 30 Old 01-27-2012, 07:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Got it, hooked it up today, holy $#%*!
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post #18 of 30 Old 01-27-2012, 07:52 PM
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post #19 of 30 Old 01-27-2012, 08:59 PM
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yeah just 1 of them is something to behold- let alone multiples.
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post #20 of 30 Old 01-27-2012, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vtshep1 View Post

got it, hooked it up today, holy $#%*!


Quote:
Originally Posted by taoggniklat View Post

^^^quote of the day right there!

+1
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post #21 of 30 Old 01-28-2012, 10:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VTSHEP1 View Post

Got it, hooked it up today, holy $#%*!

Am I safe in concluding from this comment that your espresso cherry SubMersive HP arrived safely and is performing as intended?

Mark Seaton
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"Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood..." Daniel H. Burnham
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post #22 of 30 Old 01-28-2012, 11:36 AM
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This thread is totally worthless without pics!
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post #23 of 30 Old 01-28-2012, 02:53 PM
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Yeah we want some explicit...I mean espresso pictures
Even though I love my Rosenut HP's which look fantastic with my other speakers I still can't get enough of the Espresso.
I could look at the pics on Mark's forum all day.
Tim
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post #24 of 30 Old 01-28-2012, 03:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

Am I safe in concluding from this comment that your espresso cherry SubMersive HP arrived safely and is performing as intended?

Hi Mark, yes it arrived safe and performs amazingly, thanks! Next I need to determine how to vibrate/rattle-proof a few of our condo fixtures.

I had to leave town early this AM so a pic will have to come later.
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post #25 of 30 Old 02-11-2012, 11:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Photo, cellphone grab so excuse the noise.
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post #26 of 30 Old 02-11-2012, 03:01 PM
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Very nice. The Submersive HP does both music and movies incredibly well.
Enjoy!
Tim
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post #27 of 30 Old 02-11-2012, 03:04 PM
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Oh man, that scratching post next to it makes me nervous!
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post #28 of 30 Old 02-11-2012, 03:36 PM
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Indeed! That submersive cone wouldn't stand a chance.
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post #29 of 30 Old 02-11-2012, 04:14 PM
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I think the exposed cone is better than the fabric grill which could be enticing to scratch. Maybe just move the scratching post unless your cat is trained very well.
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post #30 of 30 Old 02-11-2012, 05:38 PM
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fwiw, my cats leave my exposed subm drivers alone...

one of them used to climb the bass traps though... stupid cat would claw his way up to the top one and hang there...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

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