Video - Is this bottoming out, clipping, what is it? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 07:46 AM - Thread Starter
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At around 28 seconds, the sub makes what I think is a bottoming out noise. Can anyone here confirm? I am going to purchase an Fmod and maybe a BFD to hopefully get rid of this problem. But if its amp clipping or something else then I have a problem.

Anyone tried running an FMOD to stop botoming out?

Sub is an ED A2-300 and it sounds great, just sometimes at high volumes I get this noise.

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post #2 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 09:20 AM
 
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Why would it be bottoming out if you are playing it within its limits?
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post #3 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Why would it be bottoming out if you are playing it within its limits?

Perhaps the OP is pushing it past its limits...
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post #4 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 10:44 AM
 
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Originally Posted by eljaycanuck View Post

Perhaps the OP is pushing it past its limits...

Well he shouldn't be doing that, that's foolish thing to do.
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post #5 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Well he shouldn't be doing that, that's foolish thing to do.

Perhaps he was doing it inadvertently because he did not know what the sub's limits are. If someone were to confirm for the OP that the amp is indeed clipping or the driver is bottoming out, he will then know what those limits are, and will be able to avoid driving the sub past them.
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post #6 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 01:16 PM
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If you turn it down a little, does it still make that noise?

"For deep bass, the listener is not really listening to the speaker, but rather, is listening to the room as it is being played by the speaker."
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post #7 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 01:41 PM
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I'm wondering if he can do the demo without the other speakers playing?
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post #8 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 02:25 PM - Thread Starter
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I leveled the sub at 75db with the other speakers. If I turn the sub down to around 60db the noise stops. It seems to only happen during certain scenes, I can go through multiple movies with wall shaking bass no problem, but one little scene can cause the sub to make this noise.

Someone mentioned my SPL meter (iphone 4 spl app) is probably just not leveling the lfe properly and that could definitely be the case. Someone also mentioned trying to plug the port and I did that, problem seems to have gone away with the port blocked.

Still thinking about ordering an 20hz FMOD just to try that. But running test tones under 20hz I dont get this noise, but I am definitely not pushing the sub with test tones.
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post #9 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 03:01 PM
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The EDA2-300 is a 200 watt RMS amplifier driving a 12" driver capable of 15.1mm of cone excursion.
I doubt you have an amp or driver problem.
How much voltage are you putting into the ED amplifier?
What's the signal source?
It would be rare IMO for the ED driver to bottom or the amp to clip on "normal" material coming from an AVR source as an example.
Do you play the ED with the "level control" in the full on position?
Do you have the unit on spikes or is it sitting on the floor?
Has something rolled under the unit and making contact with the cone?
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post #10 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 03:03 PM
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My next thought is... how are you EQing? If you are attempting to boost a null then this could be the result.

"For deep bass, the listener is not really listening to the speaker, but rather, is listening to the room as it is being played by the speaker."
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post #11 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 03:06 PM
 
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same story for me. Sucks when you are showing off your system and this thing all the sudden sound like dog poo. I dont belive the sub is "overdrivin" when us that have had this happen have no eq down low and are in the negative on the reciever. This sub does very well but when it hits a qiuck low slam it sound like s--t. ed said they didnt want to cut its nuts off too high so the filter is very gradual at like 17hz. i think if it had a steeper slope all would be golden. Mine also passes the test tones but they are not a qiuck slam like in a movie. It would be great if you did the f mod to see how it does. if so please keep us posted. thanks
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post #12 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 03:31 PM
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The OP posted this over on blu-ray.

"A2-300 is at 11-12 o'clock. AVR sub level is at +6db"

I suspect its being pushed harder than it should be. You can't just "crank it" and have it remain stable. lol Every sub has limits, some hit that wall sooner than others.

Use it the way it's intended and all will be ok, or buy a more capable sub. It's not a power house sub nor is it designed to be. It might help in a different spot but if you're overdriving nothing is going to help.
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post #13 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 03:34 PM
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Why do you have the avr sub set at +6???
have you tried shutting off Dynamic eq?
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post #14 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 04:11 PM
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That does sound like bottoming out, from what I could tell from the video, but it wasn't to clear. If you keep letting that happen it could destroy your driver. ED can't be held liable either, even though their limiter should be able to prevent this, but with an sub level set at +6 with a high noon gain, that is running your sub pretty hard.
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post #15 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 05:54 PM
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I couldn't find video.
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post #16 of 26 Old 02-20-2012, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hemogoblin View Post

I leveled the sub at 75db with the other speakers. If I turn the sub down to around 60db the noise stops. It seems to only happen during certain scenes, I can go through multiple movies with wall shaking bass no problem, but one little scene can cause the sub to make this noise.

Someone mentioned my SPL meter (iphone 4 spl app) is probably just not leveling the lfe properly and that could definitely be the case. Someone also mentioned trying to plug the port and I did that, problem seems to have gone away with the port blocked.

Still thinking about ordering an 20hz FMOD just to try that. But running test tones under 20hz I dont get this noise, but I am definitely not pushing the sub with test tones.

These iphone apps are terrible for measuring bass and are not accurate whatsoever for a system setup. You are running the subwoofer too hot. If your receiver has a setup program such as audyssey... you should run it and use its level settings. Otherwise you might look to pick up a different spl meter.
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post #17 of 26 Old 02-22-2012, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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You guys were right. I was totally running it too hot. I moved the sub into many different spots and found a better spot that has a wider 'sweet spot' for most of the room. Just finished watching Cloverfield and got no distortion/bottoming out while being very clean and shaking walls.

Maybe off topic but out of my four chairs/spots for viewing, one of them (and it happens to be my favorite spot) has a slightly lower drop in power. Will EQ fix this? I am about to pickup a BFD for $40 and try my luck.
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post #18 of 26 Old 02-22-2012, 11:20 AM - Thread Starter
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I should also add, i see why most people run a dual sub setup. If I had two subs, the response would be so nice and even.

I never understood that before, but simply moving the sub around showed me how placement changes everything.
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post #19 of 26 Old 02-22-2012, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hemogoblin View Post

You guys were right. I was totally running it too hot. I moved the sub into many different spots and found a better spot that has a wider 'sweet spot' for most of the room. Just finished watching Cloverfield and got no distortion/bottoming out while being very clean and shaking walls.

Maybe off topic but out of my four chairs/spots for viewing, one of them (and it happens to be my favorite spot) has a slightly lower drop in power. Will EQ fix this? I am about to pickup a BFD for $40 and try my luck.

Grats on solving it.
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post #20 of 26 Old 02-22-2012, 09:45 PM
 
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So in your room where was It and where did you move it to achive good results.
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post #21 of 26 Old 02-22-2012, 09:54 PM
 
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Also what is your room size.and seating position in the room
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post #22 of 26 Old 02-23-2012, 11:50 AM
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yeah, that is heavy bottoming in that quick 20-30hz pulse spiderman 2 scene.
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post #23 of 26 Old 02-23-2012, 02:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qx56 View Post

So in your room where was It and where did you move it to achive good results.

I had it in one corner of the room but it was under a desk and had furniture in front of it. I then moved it to the other corner and got better results. Even moving the port to face toward me, face the tv and face the wall got very different results. I ended up moving it in front by my tv, so in the middle of the main viewing wall. At this spot, I get a good LFE in three out of my four chairs. The spot that is not as powerful as the other three, is still much more powerful than before.

I realize if I had dual subs, one in each corner would yield a very even field. Depending on which corner the sub was in, one seat in the house would suffer. With two subs, all seats would be filled with bass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qx56 View Post

Also what is your room size.and seating position in the room

Room size is 19x18x12. Seating position is 12ft back from the wall.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lfe man View Post

yeah, that is heavy bottoming in that quick 20-30hz pulse spiderman 2 scene.

I just realized, if you click the video and watch the 720 or 1080 version of the clip, audio is much much clearer. The thud should be much easier heard.
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post #24 of 26 Old 02-23-2012, 02:51 PM - Thread Starter
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I also ended up getting a BFD for $40. I am mostly planning on using it with my DIY JL Audio build. But I do plan on trying it on the A2-300 to see if I can even out the room some more.
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post #25 of 26 Old 03-04-2012, 07:57 PM
 
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So has bottomed it since you moved it around and what levels are you at now.
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post #26 of 26 Old 03-05-2012, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qx56 View Post

So has bottomed it since you moved it around and what levels are you at now.

No I have not bottomed out since moving the sub. I have done a few things since moving it, the biggest thing was buying a radio shack spl meter. I was using the iphone before and it was completely off for the subwoofer level almost 10db off, when using the radio shack spl meter its a bit more accurate. I am still running it between 4-6db hot, but have gotten no bottoming out or distortion. I also bought an auralex gramma, which helped a bit.

I will be trying the polyfill thing within the next week to see if that helps any. I think I have gotten the most out of the a2-300 and will be adding a second sub in the next few months to help room response. Moving the subwoofer around let me learn a whole lot about placement. The a2-300 is a great sub but my room is a little large and either a second sub or a single bigger sub should help.

If you can move your sub around I would definitely recommend it. There was a specific area where I could have placed the sub that got my all of main seats in the sweet spot while running even with the other speakers. That spot is being used for storage and the storage cannot be moved, so once I put the boxes back it affected the sweet spot. Even changing a few inches of placement or direction the port is facing altered the sweet spot greatly.
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