Whats your opinion of this dual sub placement? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 04:35 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Whats your opinion of this dual sub placement?

I just got another 15" sub and have placed them in the front soundstage instead of one in the front and one in the rear, what are your opionins on this. I have heard with 2 subs place at the same distance on the front wall and the other on the rear wall would be best....my questions are:

1. I have a laminate floor behind MLP, I know this will effect the bass but how bad?

2. I can not put a sub directly in the middle on the front wall, I can on the rear. I am using isolation pads just incase anyone asks.

3. Is the sound quality going to be that noticable.....I have to run a 30-40ft cable to do this and hope it is worth it LOL!!


Room Measurements: 25 ft wide and 27 ft deep and ceilings are 6.9"

Accoustics:(Figured I would list this in case it helps on a decision)

Bass traps: GIK Tri-traps fromm floor to ceiling in all 4 corners
Rear wall: 3 X 7.5" "monster bass trap and QRD diffussers
All other reflection points Ceiling, side walls done with 242 accoustic panels.

Pics of Room:

Current location:




I am standing where the other sub is basically so you can see the space I have behind MLP:


Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 04:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
kgveteran's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rochester NY
Posts: 5,674
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked: 38
Perfect time to get some measurement gear, Dayton OmniMic or a less expensive measuring system. With a setup like that you dont want to be guessing. Great room BTW. The pics make it look HUGE !!!!!

What kind of subs are they ?
kgveteran is online now  
post #3 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 04:44 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

Perfect time to get some measurement gear, Dayton OmniMic or a less expensive measuring system. With a setup like that you dont want to be guessing. Great room BTW. The pics make it look HUGE !!!!!

What kind of subs are they ?

I do need measurement equipment LOL!! The subs are 15" Elemental design A5-350 and both have the O-audio 500 watt Bash amp. Room is pretty good size, It sounds good with the subs in the front....I just keep thinking that with a sub in the back and the front it would spound better....but I could be wrong LOL!

Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
post #4 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 05:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
kgveteran's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rochester NY
Posts: 5,674
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 18 Post(s)
Liked: 38
Here is some reading material for you on multiple subwoofer placement. I proved in my thread in my Sig that its where its at !!!

I cant wait to get mine dialed in, in that room four subs would really sound sweet !!!

http://www.aes.org/tmpFiles/elib/20120313/13680.pdf
kgveteran is online now  
post #5 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 05:43 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by kgveteran View Post

in that room four subs would really sound sweet !!!

WOW!!! I would be scared I think...I had 1 sub in here and my throat starting ticking really bad among other things......

Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
post #6 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 05:49 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
craig john's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Lancaster, PA
Posts: 10,244
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
Liked: 283
Quote:
Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

WOW!!! I would be scared I think...I had 1 sub in here and my throat starting ticking really bad among other things......

Rob,

More subs doesn't mean more bass, or more low frequency SPL. If you calibrate the *system* properly, it means smoother frequency response across more seats. It also means lower bass distortion by allowing each individual sub to be set lower. Finally, it means more overall system headroom.

These advantages are worth pursuing, even if you don't end up with more output at any given setting of the MVC.

Craig

Lombardi said it:
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

My System

craig john is offline  
post #7 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 05:57 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post

Rob,

More subs doesn't mean more bass, or more low frequency SPL. If you calibrate the *system* properly, it means smoother frequency response across more seats. It also means lower bass distortion by allowing each individual sub to be set lower. Finally, it means more overall system headroom.

These advantages are worth pursuing, even if you don't end up with more output at any given setting of the MVC.

Craig

True, I was just thinking of what it could do lol! My subs now are at about 20% and -10 via audyssey.

Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
post #8 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 06:21 PM
Senior Member
 
kevinzoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: ON, Canada
Posts: 236
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
I second the importance of an acoustical measurement tool, like the OmniMic, XTZ, or REW. Without that you will be spending a vast amount of time (read: wasting time) trying too many positional combinations. The tool will also be useful for measuring and optimizing the location of your main speakers and listening location(s), so it's a solid investment. You may find that the same tool shows too much or too little reverb time . . .

Not withstanding the absence of a measurement tool, have you tried locating each sub on opposing side walls at the 50% mark of the room's length, or by each row of seats?
kevinzoe is offline  
post #9 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 07:36 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinzoe View Post

have you tried locating each sub on opposing side walls at the 50% mark of the room's length, or by each row of seats?

I can put them in front of the seat wich is about 1/3, if I go 50% they ill be at the starir well.


Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
post #10 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 08:52 PM
Advanced Member
 
Crabalocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 19
What you really need is a ............163" 2.35:1 acoustically transparent screen and a nice projector!
Crabalocker is offline  
post #11 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 09:08 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

What you really need is a ............163" 2.35:1 acoustically transparent screen and a nice projector!

That would be awesome, I do like my 64" though...can't imagine a 163" lol!!

Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
post #12 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 09:27 PM
Advanced Member
 
Crabalocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 19
seriously though.........you've got a lot of nice gear and looks like you've spent some descent coin down there. For 5 grand you could have a nice retractable screen http://seymourav.com/store.asp and a really good projector ie: an Epson 5010 or a Panasonic PT-AE7000.

You could spend under 3 grand and still get a really nice set-up.

For me, in my room, my projector and screen are......by far.....my favorite all time upgrade! I like it even better than my SubMersive and if you heard me speak about my SubMersive.....then that is saying a lot!

I still smile every time I watch something........just a thought.

Nice room BTW, I bet it sounds pretty killer down there!
Crabalocker is offline  
post #13 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 10:08 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
robc1976's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 885
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

seriously though.........you've got a lot of nice gear and looks like you've spent some descent coin down there. For 5 grand you could have a nice retractable screen http://seymourav.com/store.asp and a really good projector ie: an Epson 5010 or a Panasonic PT-AE7000.

You could spend under 3 grand and still get a really nice set-up.

For me, in my room, my projector and screen are......by far.....my favorite all time upgrade! I like it even better than my SubMersive and if you heard me speak about my SubMersive.....then that is saying a lot!

I still smile every time I watch something........just a thought.

Nice room BTW, I bet it sounds pretty killer down there!

You have earned the right to brag!! My question about the projectors is this...I like to calibrate my TV and love my TV for the black levels ECT....can a projector gave sane pic quality as a plasma? I mean a high end plasma like a PN64D8000?? I am assuming yes, it makes me just wonder because my plasma was around $6,000 and a protector 1/2 as much will have a better picture? I don't judge things on price but I just want to be sure! If it has a great picture I will do this this week, take the TV downstairs and replace my 58" upstairs and my son can then have the 58" he would die to have lol!

Klipsch RF82II Fronts & Wides
Klipsch RC64II Center
Klipsch RB61II Heights & Surrounds
2X Elemental design 15" subs W/ O-audio amps
Denon 4311ci
2X Emotiva XPA-5
Samsung D8000 64"
Denon 3313 UBD
Full GIK treatments

New theater under construction!
robc1976 is offline  
post #14 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 10:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
pokekevin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
Posts: 5,063
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

You have earned the right to brag!! My question about the projectors is this...I like to calibrate my TV and love my TV for the black levels ECT....can a projector gave sane pic quality as a plasma? I mean a high end plasma like a PN64D8000?? I am assuming yes, it makes me just wonder because my plasma was around $6,000 and a protector 1/2 as much will have a better picture? I don't judge things on price but I just want to be sure! If it has a great picture I will do this this week, take the TV downstairs and replace my 58" upstairs and my son can then have the 58" he would die to have lol!

I love hte black levels of my plasma ...but after seeing some projector set ups I think I can give up the black levels for the increased immersion! JVC's I believe have good black levels for projectors

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
pokekevin is offline  
post #15 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 10:33 PM
Advanced Member
 
Crabalocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 19
As you can tell I love mine. I have an Epson 8500Ub easily lighting up a 153" Seymour AV A/T screen and it looks great. As good as your $6000 plasma????? apples and oranges.........A 130+" screen is pretty impressive in a home, very close to a theater experience.

Have you seen any of the newer projectors? setup properly in a home, not a box store? If you haven't, they will surprise you I'm sure.

You could always keep your plasma down there and have a huge A/T retractable screen come down in front of it???

The JVC model line produces really great blacks I'm told. More expensive but I'm not sure if they are light canons like the Epson or Panasonic. The Epson's have great blacks for the price and have plenty of lumens to light a large screen.

Worth looking into IMHO.

Here's a screen shot from mine,


and for size comparison, I'm 6'4" and weigh 270lb



I could take a few more shots with a very dark scene so you can get a better idea if you like? but won't be able to that till tomorrow.

Let me know.
Crabalocker is offline  
post #16 of 21 Old 03-14-2012, 05:29 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
ccotenj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: the toxic waste dumps of new jersey
Posts: 21,915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by robc1976 View Post

You have earned the right to brag!! My question about the projectors is this...I like to calibrate my TV and love my TV for the black levels ECT....can a projector gave sane pic quality as a plasma? I mean a high end plasma like a PN64D8000?? I am assuming yes, it makes me just wonder because my plasma was around $6,000 and a protector 1/2 as much will have a better picture? I don't judge things on price but I just want to be sure! If it has a great picture I will do this this week, take the TV downstairs and replace my 58" upstairs and my son can then have the 58" he would die to have lol!

ime...

when i got my first pj, i hung a pull down screen in front of my kuro (calibrated by umr) thinking i wouldn't want to give up the pq of it...

that lasted about two days... the overwhelming size advantage killed any thoughts of using the kuro... it now lives in my bedroom... you can see the progression of my room in the link in my sig...

in this case, there truly is no replacement for displacement...

ymmv...

i second (third?) the measuring tools suggestion... i've used both xtz and omnimic, and have a small prefernce for the omnimic unit...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1332917/ccotenj-finally-gets-a-projector

ccotenj is offline  
post #17 of 21 Old 03-14-2012, 05:59 AM
AVS Special Member
 
carp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,962
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 184 Post(s)
Liked: 419
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crabalocker View Post

seriously though.........you've got a lot of nice gear and looks like you've spent some descent coin down there. For 5 grand you could have a nice retractable screen http://seymourav.com/store.asp and a really good projector ie: an Epson 5010 or a Panasonic PT-AE7000.

You could spend under 3 grand and still get a really nice set-up.

For me, in my room, my projector and screen are......by far.....my favorite all time upgrade! I like it even better than my SubMersive and if you heard me speak about my SubMersive.....then that is saying a lot!

I still smile every time I watch something........just a thought.

Nice room BTW, I bet it sounds pretty killer down there!

I agree. Seeing Crabalocker's room was a big part of my motivation for going to front projection. So glad I did, best upgrade to date.

My screen is 158 inches diagonal in 2:35:1.



With masking panels in - 124 inches in 16:9

All lights on full, bulb 600 hours.



Lights off, old picture. I need to take some more in 2:35:1 with lights off.

carp is offline  
post #18 of 21 Old 03-14-2012, 06:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
flickhtguru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Lebanon, PA
Posts: 2,458
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 105
robc1976........ BEAUTIFUL ROOM & SETUP I am completely jealous. I agree time for a projector tho.

Shawn
flickhtguru is offline  
post #19 of 21 Old 03-14-2012, 06:15 AM
AVS Special Member
 
flickhtguru's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Lebanon, PA
Posts: 2,458
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 105
Crabalocker...... You also have a killer setup... The only thing for me the reflection off your wood floor would annoy me. Does that reflection bug you at all?

Shawn
flickhtguru is offline  
post #20 of 21 Old 03-14-2012, 06:51 AM
Member
 
jsgrise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 143
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Erin Burnett is scortching hot

HT Setup

PSN: le_gros_thon
jsgrise is offline  
post #21 of 21 Old 03-14-2012, 08:41 AM
Advanced Member
 
Crabalocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 729
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by flickhtguru View Post

Crabalocker...... You also have a killer setup... The only thing for me the reflection off your wood floor would annoy me. Does that reflection bug you at all?

Thanks, I do love my projector.

I thought I would hate the reflection and that it would drive me bananas but to be honest, I don't really notice it while watching. The wife says we're not putting anything in front so I do not want to experiment with carpet or cloth to see the benefits of ridding the reflection because then I'm sure to notice it and would have to battle for a fix. My gut says the wife will give no quarter!

Yea I agree, Erin Burnett is hot.

Sorry for getting off topic from the OP but man that room is perfect for a projector, something like carp's setup would look awesome in his room.
Crabalocker is offline  
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off