My upgrade to the Ken Kreisel MX-5000 Mk3 subs - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 208 Old 05-31-2012, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
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#################################################
# This thread will cronical my upgrade to the Ken Kreisel MX-5000 Mk3 #
#################################################

To begin:

- I don't want this to end up off topic like the other thread. Haters, go some where else.
- I am starting this thread to provide INFORMATION and share MY experience - not start flame wars

That said, what I really ordered are two KEN KREISEL PROFESSION SOUND DXD-12012's the professional version of his new MX-5000 Mk3 sub. From what I have been told by Chris at KKPS only the pro version of this sub will be available in the USA at this time.

## I've also been told that the new website with product data, ordering information etc will be up in 2 or 3 weeks.


Thats all I know for now. I'll post more once the gear arrives or I learn something new.

There is a lively and informative thread over on AVForums that may interest you.

Also, as dlfromcanada rightly pointed out I may have been better off waiting till the gear is in house to start this thread.

To set expectations:
- I likely will not have any pictures or such to post till mid month nor will I have any quality listening time till the end of the month due to my travel schedule.
- I do not have any testing equipment so I will not be posting graphs and stats. I do invite any member to visit my home and listen for themselves once I've set things up. If you live in the upper mid-west PM me.

 

06/15 update -

- As mentioned the KKSS site is now live with new content slowly being added. 

- My DXD-12012's are hand signed by Ken and ready to ship but, due to my travel schedule the order is being held to ensure that I'm back in town when they are delivered. Thus, no "hands-on" reporting till the end of the month.

- There are some unboxing pics on AVF.

- Please keep this thread civil. It's not meant to be an empirical analysis of Ken's new subs VS any other products. Just my thoughts on how the new gear integrates into my room/system with some subjective comparisons to my existing MK MX-125.

 

* my system is: Boston Acoustics E100's R/L, Boston E70 Center, Boston E60 surrounds and a single Boston Micro130x rear. The L/R/C are run off an Emotiva XPA-3, the rest from my Onkyo TX-SR805.

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post #2 of 208 Old 05-31-2012, 10:24 PM
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There is another thread already on this sub. Just saying.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1385765
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post #3 of 208 Old 05-31-2012, 11:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Reefdvr27 View Post

There is another thread already on this sub. Just saying.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1385765

I know, it's the "other thread" I mention in my post. IMHO that thread has been hijaked and there is only one post from the OP with no updates. I will be updating this thread with new information as I get it.
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post #4 of 208 Old 06-01-2012, 06:24 PM
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Good luck with the new kit. It will be very interesting to hear your views.
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post #5 of 208 Old 06-01-2012, 08:29 PM
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It's not like the comments on the other thread are without merit You seem to want our validation of your purchase.
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post #6 of 208 Old 06-02-2012, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zora View Post

You seem to want our validation of your purchase.

I think this sentence sums up his intentions for this thread (underlining added):
Quote:
Originally Posted by image1 View Post

I am starting this thread to provide INFORMATION and share MY experience ...

OP, congrats on your purchase. I hope you enjoy your news subs, and I look forward to reading your thoughts about them.
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post #7 of 208 Old 06-02-2012, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zora View Post

You seem to want our validation of your purchase.

HUH? Where did you get that idea from what the OP wrote? What's with this "our" business? Are you part of that mythical band of internet thread ruiners who jump in from thread to thread, derail topics, tell everyone why they made a bad purchase, and then justify your actions by some graphs made in your basement with some Radio Shack SPL meter and an Omni-mic? LOL!! Let the poor OP do his thing!! I for one am looking forward to reading about the new M&K (and hopefully pics too).
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post #8 of 208 Old 06-02-2012, 08:15 AM
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very interested in hearing about this sub...however

for the OP,

you may have been better off waiting a little on this one...as it stands, these products are somewhat vaporware..ish
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post #9 of 208 Old 06-02-2012, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlfromcanada View Post

very interested in hearing about this sub...however

for the OP,

you may have been better off waiting a little on this one...as it stands, these products are somewhat vaporware..ish

Apparently the USA is no longer part of the world, given the fact that on his Facebook page, Ken K said that "the official worldwide shipping date for the MX5000 MK3 and MX700 MK3 is set for March 15 2012."
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post #10 of 208 Old 06-02-2012, 09:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlfromcanada View Post

very interested in hearing about this sub...however

for the OP,

you may have been better off waiting a little on this one...as it stands, these products are somewhat vaporware..ish

Yes, it may have been better to hold off till I have them in-house, I'm just excited.

As for "vaporware..ish", the UK's exclusive dealer sold-out of their first shipment. I've been reading the AVForum Ken Kreisel Professional Sound Subwoofers thread. There is some good information there from members (one of whom is the UK dealer) who have directly contacted Ken:

- there are 3 different response curves to choose from.

- the Claridy Class D amplifier is really two mono-block amps, one for each driver with more like 420 watts each.

BTW - I'll be adding info to the first post as I get it. If your interested you might want to watch its "last modified" time.
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post #11 of 208 Old 06-12-2012, 04:38 PM
 
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Also, for those who haven't looked recently, Ken's store is now up and you can order online.

http://www.kksoundstore.com/
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post #12 of 208 Old 06-12-2012, 04:52 PM
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How deep does these subs go ?, cant seem to find any specs on the site
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post #13 of 208 Old 06-12-2012, 05:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by qguy View Post

How deep does these subs go ?, cant seem to find any specs on the site

The stated specs are very conservative. The pair I have are flat down to 10Hz in my room, but I don't have accurate enough equipment to measure below that.
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post #14 of 208 Old 06-12-2012, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

Also, for those who haven't looked recently, Ken's store is now up and you can order online.

http://www.kksoundstore.com/

Great to see that he's gotten the store going. I still love my MX-125II. But those prices!
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post #15 of 208 Old 06-13-2012, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

The stated specs are very conservative. The pair I have are flat down to 10Hz in my room, but I don't have accurate enough equipment to measure below that.

With all due respect, there are other subs that measure flat to 10Hz, the issue is at what volume? The threshold of audibility at 10 Hz is 100 db.

I have seen too many graphs of subs measuring flat at 10 hz or lower but the output level was 78 db.

As Kramer notes in post number 15, $3,000 is pretty steep with some awesome competition from companies like Seaton and JTR.

Don't get me wrong, the M&K is a very fine high performance sub but the market has changed since the top of the line model from M&K was first introduced as the MX-5000 THX back in ~ 1994.
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Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

With all due respect, there are other subs that measure flat to 10Hz, the issue is at what volume? The threshold of audibility at 10 Hz is 100 db.
I have seen too many graphs of subs measuring flat at 10 hz or lower but the output level was 78 db.
As Kramer notes in post number 15, $3,000 is pretty steep with some awesome competition from companies like Seaton and JTR.
Don't get me wrong, the M&K is a very fine high performance sub but the market has changed since the top of the line model from M&K was first introduced as the MX-5000 THX back in ~ 1994.

I never said that there weren't other Subs that measure flat to 10Hz, I was pointing out that the 20Hz stated on the specs is very conservative. Don't be fooled by the model number, the KK MX-5000 Mk3 is a huge improvement over the M&K MX-5000 MkII, it also improves on the M&K MX-5100.
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post #17 of 208 Old 06-13-2012, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

The stated specs are very conservative. The pair I have are flat down to 10Hz in my room, but I don't have accurate enough equipment to measure below that.
Can you post the graph and conditions? Also, I too can't seem to locate any published measurements and specifications by KK. If you've got the link for that, I'd appreciate it.

"I've found that when you want to know the truth about someone that someone is probably the last person you should ask." - Gregory House
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post #18 of 208 Old 06-13-2012, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

I never said that there weren't other Subs that measure flat to 10Hz, I was pointing out that the 20Hz stated on the specs is very conservative. Don't be fooled by the model number, the KK MX-5000 Mk3 is a huge improvement over the M&K MX-5000 MkII, it also improves on the M&K MX-5100.

The issue is how flat the frequency response is to 10Hz or lower and at what volume you measured 10Hz, and in what size room and if the room is sealed or open to other areas of the home.

Also, it is not so much about how much of an improvement the MK 3 is over previous iterations but rather how the MK 3 compares to other subs selling for $2,000 - $3,000 like the Seaton Submersive HP and the JTR Captivator, (among others).
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post #19 of 208 Old 06-13-2012, 02:19 PM
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I want to see the new speakers or better yet, the new 5000 speaker!

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If anyone wants to find out what the MX-5000 Mk3 can do, then go and buy one, measure it yourself and compare it to whatever you like. wink.gif
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post #21 of 208 Old 06-13-2012, 03:31 PM
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^^^

you made a claim... it's not out of line for people to ask you to back it up....

since you claim to have measurements, it shouldn't be that difficult for you to post them....

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 

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post #22 of 208 Old 06-13-2012, 03:46 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^
you made a claim... it's not out of line for people to ask you to back it up....
since you claim to have measurements, it shouldn't be that difficult for you to post them....

I have nothing to post - anyone is free to accept or ignore my comments. I never said anyone was out of line either.
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post #23 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

I have nothing to post - anyone is free to accept or ignore my comments. I never said anyone was out of line either.

If you have nothing to post, what's your basis for claiming "flat to 10hz"?

What software and calibrated mic did you use to measure the claimed response?
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post #24 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

This is why I am tired of posting on forums. My basis is that I own two of them. I don't just sit at my computer making up things to post on forums just for the hell of it. I have better things to do with my life than bicker about graphs and measurements. Most of the claims on here are not backed up with any proof at all, many people post opinions on equipment they have never actually seen or heard. When it becomes a rule that everyone has to prove everything they post and everyone is conforming to that rule, I may take some time to do some more measurements and post them. Until then, I'll be enjoying my Subs.
Good luck with the thread image1, it seems you're going to need it. Enjoy the Subs, they really are amazing.

Let me guess: You actually have no measuring equipment and made it up based on what you think you're hearing rolleyes.gif

Otherwise, how hard would it be to simply post the name of the tools you use, even if you didn't save a graph? Since you claim a specific measurement, you must have something to measure with, no? Last time I checked, "owning two" isn't an accepted measurement technique.

You know what I think based on how you're responding? That you did just sit down in front of a computer and make up a "flat to 10hz" claim.
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post #25 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 10:45 AM
 
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Originally Posted by bfreedma View Post

Let me guess: You actually have no measuring equipment and made it up based on what you think you're hearing rolleyes.gif
Otherwise, how hard would it be to simply post the name of the tools you use, even if you didn't save a graph? Since you claim a specific measurement, you must have something to measure with, no? Last time I checked, "owning two" isn't an accepted measurement technique.
You know what I think based on how you're responding? That you did just sit down in front of a computer and make up a "flat to 10hz" claim.

You are wrong. Your attitude sucks. I have no time for you. Bye.
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post #26 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 10:51 AM
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You are wrong. Your attitude sucks. I have no time for you. Bye.

I've never heard of the measure tool named "your attitude sucks" rolleyes.gif

You made a specific claim
Simple questions were asked
You refused to answer - you won't even post the name of the tool used, let alone the measurements.

So now on to the typical path of one caught in this type of dilemma: accuse those asking reasonable questions of having an agenda or a bad attitude. Good luck with that.
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post #27 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 11:06 AM
 
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I've never heard of the measure tool named "your attitude sucks" rolleyes.gif
You made a specific claim
Simple questions were asked
You refused to answer - you won't even post the name of the tool used, let alone the measurements.
So now on to the typical path of one caught in this type of dilemma: accuse those asking reasonable questions of having an agenda or a bad attitude. Good luck with that.

I said "I have nothing to post - anyone is free to accept or ignore my comments." and I was leaving it at that, I thought that was pretty clear.

Seems to me like you were looking for a thread to troll on, saw my comments as an easy target and decided to make something of it. Why else would you blow everything out of proportion and continue to try and belittle me.

The fact is, I can choose to answer whatever I like. Your over-inflated ego and sarcastic accusations are completely wasted here.
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post #28 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by mjf_uk View Post

I said "I have nothing to post - anyone is free to accept or ignore my comments." and I was leaving it at that, I thought that was pretty clear.
Seems to me like you were looking for a thread to troll on, saw my comments as an easy target and decided to make something of it. Why else would you blow everything out of proportion and continue to try and belittle me.
The fact is, I can choose to answer whatever I like. Your over-inflated ego and sarcastic accusations are completely wasted here.

Seriously? You made a specific claim and a number of people asked how you arrived at that claim. Nothing blown out of proportion, just a simple request. Now you're trying your best to change the topic rather than post real information.

Something like this would suffice:

I used an Omnimic and my graph looks like this:
178

You are correct, you can choose to answer (or not) whatever you like. The more you whinge, the more doubt I have about your claims.
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post #29 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^
you made a claim... it's not out of line for people to ask you to back it up....
since you claim to have measurements, it shouldn't be that difficult for you to post them....

He speaks the truth. You know we here at avs love graphs:)

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post #30 of 208 Old 06-14-2012, 11:30 AM
 
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Originally Posted by bfreedma View Post

Seriously? You made a specific claim and a number of people asked how you arrived at that claim. Nothing blown out of proportion, just a simple request.

I agree that nothing was blown out of proportion, until your sarcastic comments started. There was no need for it.
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