Is it fair to compare Power Sound XV15 and HSU 15h? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 29 Old 09-23-2012, 11:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi guys,
What do you think are they comparable? I currently own Lfm 1ex. It sounds great in my 14 x 15 x 9 sealed area but you all know how it is... I am not very technical with graphs, measurements and all. Honest opinions work best for me. XV15 is shipped $800.00 and 15h is about a $1000.00. I will try and sell my 1ex locally for $500.00. That should help out with the budget. Some of you might ask why not get a second lfm? I only have enough space for one sub.
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post #2 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 01:32 AM
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Personally, I think the XV15 will perform better than the 15h. The XV15 has both a better driver and a stronger amp. What you would be giving up is tuning flexibility.
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post #3 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 05:11 AM
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The only possible advantage I see for the HSU would be overall cabinet volume and port area. Otherwise I agree with Mojomike. The price of the PSA also makes it more attractive if you don't care about the tuning options of the HSU.
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post #4 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 10:55 AM - Thread Starter
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I am currently using the LFM 1ex max output mode. And I didn't try to tinker with different options. I guess Xv 15 does look like the better option for my taste. I wish there were little bit more user reviews of the XV15.
Thank you Folks.
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post #5 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 11:51 AM
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I'd think there is a lot more to it than that. Has either of you heard the XV15?
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post #6 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 11:53 AM - Thread Starter
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I haven"t heard either one:) That's why it is difficult to understand the difference.
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post #7 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 11:56 AM
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We really don't know what if any the performance difference is.
500 watts vs 350 watts is only about a 1.5 db difference on paper. Can you hear it? a big maybe.

While the 15H driver is not a brute to look at, it does perform in spades. The XV15 will likely be a decent sub based on past history of the guys putting it out. However based on driver looks and a 150 watt difference isn't enough to make any kind of informed choice.

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post #8 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
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True. The price difference is kinda in favor of XV15.
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post #9 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sputter1 View Post

We really don't know what if any the performance difference is.
500 watts vs 350 watts is only about a 1.5 db difference on paper.

Where'd you get that number, 1.5db?

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post #10 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaviorMachine View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by sputter1 View Post

We really don't know what if any the performance difference is.
500 watts vs 350 watts is only about a 1.5 db difference on paper.

Where'd you get that number, 1.5db?

Double the wattage is 3db. Since the difference is only 150 watts it would make it 1.5db (approx).
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post #11 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaviorMachine View Post

Where'd you get that number, 1.5db?

Doubling of power is 3 db...

However if HSU has larger cabinet and more sensitive driver it is a moot point. Not enough comparisons yet available between the two. I do think the HSU is a better looking subwoofer. But although it is early and not much available on the PSA the performance to $ appears to be there. A choice between these two subwoofers is a win win in my book!
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post #12 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke Kamp View Post

Doubling of power is 3 db...
However if HSU has larger cabinet and more sensitive driver it is a moot point. Not enough comparisons yet available between the two. I do think the HSU is a better looking subwoofer. But although it is early and not much available on the PSA the performance to $ appears to be there. A choice between these two subwoofers is a win win in my book!

Yeah, that's what I figured, that it's an "all other things equal" comparison, which of course this really, really isn't. Thanks.

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post #13 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 04:04 PM
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I just looked at the XV15 on their website and it looks as though it only has a single 4" port? I dont know man, if I were you I would spend the extra money and go with the HSU since there is a lot of feedback on it and it is a great performer. I would worry about port noise on the PSA, but then again I dont build subwoofers so I could be wrong. cool.gif

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post #14 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 06:46 PM
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You have an Outlaw EX now? IMO, I'd go with the HSU. I think you'll miss the extension of the EX if you go with XV15. There is no alternate tuning, so that's all you get.

 

The XV15 may get louder, but the HSU will dig deeper and extend as low or lower than the EX. In that size room, you should have good gain, so I'd choose the sub that extends lower.

 

My ultimate choice for you though, would be the Rythmik FV15HP. About $1400 shipped or so though...

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post #15 of 29 Old 09-24-2012, 06:57 PM
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Quite honestly in that size sealed room you may be experiencing some modal issues. Getting another ex and trying opposite corners... might be the way to go. You say you are not real technical with measurements and all, but getting familiar with them and the response in your room for optimal setup is key to success. REW or omnimic... are highly advised.smile.gif
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post #16 of 29 Old 09-25-2012, 05:43 AM
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HSU is tuned lower. Isn't the xv15 tuned to about 25hz?


As Luke Kamp says...it's not all about watts. If one driver is just a couple dB more sensitive than the other the spl advantage can easily change.

I personally would buy the HSU sub at this time, at least until the PSA sub is vetted by some knowledgeable members or a solid review site. One of the PSA subs is expected to bein attendance at the October 20 subwoofer shootout in PA at gorilla83's house. That meet should provide some solid feedback on the PSA subs when compared to other ID alternatives.

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post #17 of 29 Old 09-25-2012, 08:45 AM
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If you aren't in a rush, I'd wait until audioholics measures it before making any sort of decision. Then we can have a meaningful discussion which sub might be better

What is it about the current sub that doesn't do it for you?

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post #18 of 29 Old 09-25-2012, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

One of the PSA subs is expected to bein attendance at the October 20 subwoofer shootout in PA at gorilla83's house. That meet should provide some solid feedback on the PSA subs when compared to other ID alternatives.

Just to clarify, for those not familiar with that particular GTG... it's the XS15 I'll be bringing with me, not the XV15. But at least everyone in attendance will get to see/hear a PSA sub.

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post #19 of 29 Old 09-25-2012, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you all very much for sharing the knowledge and piece of mind. As some of you stated it is better to hold the purchase little bit longer. I will wait until there is more reviews available. Well, highlight of the day is I bought Avengers on blu-ray and that should give the LFM 1ex serious workout. Cheers.
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post #20 of 29 Old 09-25-2012, 12:39 PM
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Before you drop a big pile of money on a new sub, I would recommend understanding how to take measurements and determine placement of your sub in your room. If you are looking for more, I would start with what you have now and make sure you have it placed and configured optimally. In terms of your room, where is your main seating with regards to the center of the room? Where is your sub placed? Are you using EQ?
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post #21 of 29 Old 09-25-2012, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

HSU is tuned lower. Isn't the xv15 tuned to about 25hz?
As Luke Kamp says...it's not all about watts. If one driver is just a couple dB more sensitive than the other the spl advantage can easily change.
I personally would buy the HSU sub at this time, at least until the PSA sub is vetted by some knowledgeable members or a solid review site. One of the PSA subs is expected to bein attendance at the October 20 subwoofer shootout in PA at gorilla83's house. That meet should provide some solid feedback on the PSA subs when compared to other ID alternatives.

I think it is tuned to around 21 hz

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post #22 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 06:16 AM
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hmmmm

Independent Sound and Vision HSU VTF-15H measurement in the deepst and flattest measurement they captured for the vtf-15h.
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article/test-report-hsu-research-vtf-15h-subwoofer



vs

Independent Audioholics HSU VTF-15H measurement
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/speakers/subwoofers/hsu-vtf-15h-supplemental




vs.

In house HSU Research's website provided frequency response measurement
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-15h.html




vs.


In house PSA's website provided frequency response measurement of the xv15
http://www.powersoundaudio.com/collections/power-x/products/xv15







Until the PSA sub is reviewed independently - their provided frequency response measurement (the last graphic) should be taken with a grain of salt.

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post #23 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 07:38 AM
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I would be careful comparing all these measurements from various sites:
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/blog/2011/09/05/cea-2010-good-baseline-bass?page=0,0

I was hoping Ricci would measure the Hsu sub for reasons that won't be discussed here again. There is a lot of background on all these measurements in the Hsu threads but I believe the Audioholics measurements to be off (low) by 3dB....
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post #24 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

I would be careful comparing all these measurements from various sites:
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/blog/2011/09/05/cea-2010-good-baseline-bass?page=0,0
I was hoping Ricci would measure the Hsu sub for reasons that won't be discussed here again. There is a lot of background on all these measurements in the Hsu threads but I believe the Audioholics measurements to be off (low) by 3dB....

Agreed on all counts.

For example, take a look at the max output tests of the PB12-NSD on AH and S+V. Big differences.

Frequency / AH / S+V / difference
20hz / 103.2 dB / 110.2 dB / +7 dB
25hz / 105 dB / 110.8 dB / +5.8 dB
31.5 hz / 105.9 dB / 112.1 dB / +6.2 dB
40 hz / 106.5 dB / 119.0 dB / +12.5 dB
50 hz / 107.3 dB / 120.3 dB / +13 dB
63 hz / 108 dB / 115.1 dB / +7.1 dB

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post #25 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by its phillip View Post

Agreed on all counts.
For example, take a look at the max output tests of the PB12-NSD on AH and S+V. Big differences.
Frequency / AH / S+V / difference
20hz / 103.2 dB / 110.2 dB / +7 dB
25hz / 105 dB / 110.8 dB / +5.8 dB
31.5 hz / 105.9 dB / 112.1 dB / +6.2 dB
40 hz / 106.5 dB / 119.0 dB / +12.5 dB
50 hz / 107.3 dB / 120.3 dB / +13 dB
63 hz / 108 dB / 115.1 dB / +7.1 dB

I believe that S&V measurement is using 1M vs 2M. So you need to subtract 6db from S&V, buy then they are pretty off...
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post #26 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 07:59 AM
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Yeah, if the numbers were a straight 6dB or 9dB off that would be easy to explain...but they're not smile.gif

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post #27 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 08:07 AM
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Not this again, guys, different mics, locations, and setup which can not be compared to each other. Either use one tester for all subs or don't compare. I like Ricci's but I can't compare his to others if he has not measured a specific sub.
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post #28 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post

Not this again, guys, different mics, locations, and setup which can not be compared to each other. Either use one tester for all subs or don't compare. I like Ricci's but I can't compare his to others if he has not measured a specific sub.

+1 no comparisons can be made between these two subs at this time period.

Archaea take a look at the HSU 25hz tune measurements at q.7 vs the audioholics 25hz tune measurements with q.7. Now add 9db to audioholics measurements to take it to 1 meter peak. Their numbers are fairly close this way and this is two different testers with different equipment, a no no in my book for comparable measurements. My problem with the audioholics was not the measurements, the embarrassing write up.

Guys the PSA sub has electronic filtering in place above its port tune so real world port noise during movies is probably not something to worry about as the amp will be used up on the higher level bass. Unless you are boosting the low end or there is no other bass besides low bass in the movie scene, very rare. Archaea think setting your subs up for pennynike to play with.smile.gif

Anyways I stick to my point that at this time these subs are really not comparable on a level playing field. But I will guarantee they are both fantastic performers and haven't even heard the psa sub yet, the owners speak for themselves.
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post #29 of 29 Old 09-26-2012, 01:17 PM
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as far as manufacturer specs, SVS's own measurements correlate well with Ricci's, but it's not known how well PSA's do yet. Since the PSA sub will eventually get reviewed/measured by Audioholics, we'll know for sure how it stacks up....until then it's a guessing game.

It's really nickpicking to debate a dB here or there, both sub choices are going to be excellent choices. It's like arguing whether to choise a car does 12.5 or 12.7 seconds in the quarter mile, you can't wrong with either.

I do like the finishes of the Hsu's more, and that might be enough to sway my decision one way or another

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