BIC-12 vs RW-12D - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
To give a littlebackground..
Room Dimension: 16x22 with vaulted ceilings about 20 ft high at the peak.
Distance from sub: 8 ft on left corner of the room.
Satellites+Center channel: Athena S.5
Receiver: OnkyoSR608
Was using Def-tech pro sub 600.

The problem I was having earlier was, no matter how well I tune my sub, It was boomy, and muddled. I spent a couple of years trying to tune it and finally gave up and sold it. I was listening to it with -10db on receiver with a LFE of 120hz. and crossover on the sub at 80 to make it bearable.

Now I have narrowed it down to BIC F 12 and RW-12D (Klispch).

I want to know your opinions. One is $199 on amazon, while Klipsch is $299 (OOS right now with a ETA of 11/29) on newegg.
My budget is $300 tops.
hardrock_121 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 03:07 PM
AVS Special Member
 
eljaycanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,555
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Liked: 587
Of the two you listed, I'd go with the RW-12d. But if there's any way you can squeeze another $99 out of your budget, I suggest you consider the Epik Legend ($399, shipped - add to cart to see the updated price).
eljaycanuck is offline  
post #3 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 05:45 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I was seriously considering it , but after reading the amp blown issues and customer service issues.. I decided against it.


Also for the room I have ... a more power ful sub will be a overkill ?? Is it?
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #4 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 05:48 PM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Also, consider buying your subs in pairs so as to help fill in the sound voids the room acoustics cause.

Another vote for the Klipsch, RW-12d.'

Keep an eye on Newegg as they're suppose to get more Klipsch, RW-12d's in on Friday and they've been selling them for $300.00.
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #5 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 06:16 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Also, consider buying your subs in pairs so as to help fill in the sound voids the room acoustics cause.
Another vote for the Klipsch, RW-12d.'
Keep an eye on Newegg as they're suppose to get more Klipsch, RW-12d's in on Friday and they've been selling them for $300.00.


Thats what my hope is.. I am eagerly waiting for 29th .. but in the mean time BIC is $100 cheaper and seems to have great reviews too.

Epik seems very good but with all the issues I dont think I will risk it.. sending them back is a big deal if at all it fails.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #6 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 06:27 PM
Senior Member
 
kcnitro07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 303
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
They still had some of those jamo 650s on amazon for 220 shipped earlier today. I'd check and see if they still have them smile.gif

kcnitro07 is offline  
post #7 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 06:28 PM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardrock_121 View Post

Thats what my hope is.. I am eagerly waiting for 29th .. but in the mean time BIC is $100 cheaper and seems to have great reviews too.
Epik seems very good but with all the issues I dont think I will risk it.. sending them back is a big deal if at all it fails.

The Klipsch subs have better extension at both ends of the frequency spectrum and check out the differences in the output of the subs amplifiers. BIC uses an amplifier that's 150w RMS with a peak of 475w where-as the Klipsch, RW-12d subs use an amplifier that is rated 350w RMS with peaks of 825w. It's your choice which sub amplifier you want in your system. Are you about a hundred bucks or are you about twice as much power for a hundred bucks?

......................(whistling emoticon goes here)..........................
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #8 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 06:39 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

The Klipsch subs have better extension at both ends of the frequency spectrum and check out the differences in the output of the subs amplifiers. BIC uses an amplifier that's 150w RMS with a peak of 475w where-as the Klipsch, RW-12d subs use an amplifier that is rated 350w RMS with peaks of 825w. It's your choice which sub amplifier you want in your system. Are you about a hundred bucks or are you about twice as much power for a hundred bucks?
......................(whistling emoticon goes here)..........................


haha.. thats the never ending question.. I feel (or so does my wife) that $400 is a bit too much for my system .. $300 is the sweet spot. I might ..( i say might) for $400 if I am getting really good value for it.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #9 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 06:51 PM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardrock_121 View Post

haha.. thats the never ending question.. I feel (or so does my wife) that $400 is a bit too much for my system .. $300 is the sweet spot. I might ..( i say might) for $400 if I am getting really good value for it.

If Newegg comes through on the 29th, you'll get a delivered killer deal for $300.00 and you can then spend the extra hundred on your lady. Wives are pretty easy like that.
hardrock_121 likes this.
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #10 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 06:59 PM
Advanced Member
 
vardo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: down by the river in a van in kalifornia
Posts: 683
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Go with the Klipsch. With vaulted ceilings, then your room 16 X 26, is large.
The Klipsch used to go for $550 plus. 350W amp.....12" nice driver, oh c'mon $100 more is
OK (isn't it?) biggrin.gif Bic puts out a lot of sound but you're back to boomy, again.

vardo
hardrock_121 likes this.
vardo is offline  
post #11 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 09:45 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by vardo View Post

Go with the Klipsch. With vaulted ceilings, then your room 16 X 26, is large.
The Klipsch used to go for $550 plus. 350W amp.....12" nice driver, oh c'mon $100 more is
OK (isn't it?) biggrin.gif Bic puts out a lot of sound but you're back to boomy, again.
vardo

Yea I am ok with $300 for RW-12ds .. was just thinking if I get 90% of performance from BIC then I can live with it and save 100 but doesnt look like it. I will go with klipsch now only hope is newegg should still sell it at 299.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #12 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 09:46 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

If Newegg comes through on the 29th, you'll get a delivered killer deal for $300.00 and you can then spend the extra hundred on your lady. Wives are pretty easy like that.
That will please the wifey more.. so lets hope so.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #13 of 61 Old 11-26-2012, 10:11 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Bond 007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 12,459
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 422 Post(s)
Liked: 882
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardrock_121 View Post

Yea I am ok with $300 for RW-12ds .. was just thinking if I get 90% of performance from BIC then I can live with it and save 100 but doesnt look like it. I will go with klipsch now only hope is newegg should still sell it at 299.
I have both the F12 and RW12. I like them both but the Klipsch is worth the extra $100.

No, Mr. Bond. I expect you to die!
Bond 007 is offline  
post #14 of 61 Old 11-27-2012, 01:08 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Thanks.. and this sub should be able to take in one RCA as LFE input , since I have only one RCA wired in the wall back to the receiver's pre out.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #15 of 61 Old 11-27-2012, 01:14 PM
AVS Special Member
 
eljaycanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Posts: 5,555
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 204 Post(s)
Liked: 587
Quote:
... this sub should be able to take in one RCA as LFE input ...
Yes. According to the owner's manual (PDF):
Quote:
RW-10d / RW-12d / RSW-10d
“LINE IN” - ... Connect to the “RIGHT” and/or “LEFT/LFE” inputs on the subwoofer’s rear panel ...
hardrock_121 likes this.
eljaycanuck is offline  
post #16 of 61 Old 12-01-2012, 09:41 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
crap /.. its in store now... but at $500 nt $300 ..now what.. what other options do I have in $300 budget which doesnt have major quality issues. I am tempted with epik fir $400 but with the issues people have mentioned. I am a litte skeptical about that.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #17 of 61 Old 12-01-2012, 09:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
XStanleyX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 4,701
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 1262
They "usually" go on sale on the weekend. Maybe it will be next weekend, maybe not.

Denon AVR-4520CI
Carver Amazing Originals/ Carver Amazing Silvers
(2) Sonotube Subs with 18" Stereo Integrity D4 Drivers
Projector: BenQ W1070
Some audio history:
https://onedrive.live.com/?cid=222FF...3449%21138&v=3
XStanleyX is offline  
post #18 of 61 Old 12-01-2012, 10:10 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Bond 007's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 12,459
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 422 Post(s)
Liked: 882
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardrock_121 View Post

crap /.. its in store now... but at $500 nt $300 ..now what.. what other options do I have in $300 budget which doesnt have major quality issues. I am tempted with epik fir $400 but with the issues people have mentioned. I am a litte skeptical about that.
Nearly guaranteed on sale before Christmas. You can wait. You will be glad you did.

No, Mr. Bond. I expect you to die!
Bond 007 is offline  
post #19 of 61 Old 12-02-2012, 02:39 PM
 
Ruben Z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 128
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
It's on sale now
Ruben Z is offline  
post #20 of 61 Old 12-04-2012, 10:24 AM
Member
 
haargerman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 31
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Just ordered an RW-12D smile.gif

I could use some help setting it up - what do you set the LFE, Crossover, and Volume to on the AVR & Sub? Should I run Audyssey first or after I've changed my mains to small?

Im sure someone has already answered this, if anyone could forward me any links that would helpful!
haargerman is offline  
post #21 of 61 Old 12-04-2012, 11:30 AM
Advanced Member
 
UGAd13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 562
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
Liked: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by haargerman View Post

Just ordered an RW-12D smile.gif
I could use some help setting it up - what do you set the LFE, Crossover, and Volume to on the AVR & Sub? Should I run Audyssey first or after I've changed my mains to small?
Im sure someone has already answered this, if anyone could forward me any links that would helpful!

http://www.avsforum.com/t/795421/official-audyssey-thread-faq-in-post-1

UGAd13 is offline  
post #22 of 61 Old 12-04-2012, 11:34 AM
Advanced Member
 
coolcat4843's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 780
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 56 Post(s)
Liked: 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by haargerman View Post

Just ordered an RW-12D smile.gif
I could use some help setting it up - what do you set the LFE, Crossover, and Volume to on the AVR & Sub? Should I run Audyssey first or after I've changed my mains to small?
Im sure someone has already answered this, if anyone could forward me any links that would helpful!

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1416127/any-special-considerations-for-hooking-up-the-klipsch-reference-rw-12d-12-powered-subwoofer

Benq W1080ST DLP 3D Projector
Sony BDP-S5200 3D Blu-ray Player
Denon X4000 Receiver
Pioneer SP-FS52 Tower Speaker x 4
Pioneer SP-C22 Center Channel Speaker
PSA XS15se Subwoofer x 2
coolcat4843 is offline  
post #23 of 61 Old 12-04-2012, 01:52 PM
Member
 
haargerman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 31
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thank you both!
haargerman is offline  
post #24 of 61 Old 12-06-2012, 05:45 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I jumped on it...got it today. I must say I am not yet overwhelmed by the performance. It's probably just me and e default settings. But damn, this is huge.
Unfortunately I can't run audessy since my receiver is in the basement. My mains seems pretty bright I.e. sub over powering the bass leaving mains sound bright.
Here are my settings
Receiver
Lpf on lLFE 120hz
Mains 100hz
Center 120hz
Sub:
Vol -2db
LPF on Lfe: off
Eq: punch.
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #25 of 61 Old 12-07-2012, 07:35 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ack_bk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Maple Grove, MN
Posts: 8,841
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 106
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardrock_121 View Post

I jumped on it...got it today. I must say I am not yet overwhelmed by the performance. It's probably just me and e default settings. But damn, this is huge.
Unfortunately I can't run audessy since my receiver is in the basement. My mains seems pretty bright I.e. sub over powering the bass leaving mains sound bright.
Here are my settings
Receiver
Lpf on lLFE 120hz
Mains 100hz
Center 120hz
Sub:
Vol -2db
LPF on Lfe: off
Eq: punch.

Your mains are rated to 80hz. Perhaps try setting your crossover to 80hz for your mains and see if you like it better.

Room placement is key as well, have you tried the subwoofer crawl? Also note if you are sitting in the center of the room, you are sitting in a bass null. A $1000 sub won't sound great either if you have bad placement or are sitting in a null.
ack_bk is offline  
post #26 of 61 Old 12-07-2012, 07:41 AM
 
BeeMan458's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Magalia, CA
Posts: 8,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by hardrock_121 View Post

Unfortunately I can't run audessy since my receiver is in the basement.

You know you have to fix that. tongue.gif

Stating the obvious, with your speaker system upstairs, sitting in the basement, Audyssey ain't gonna do your system any good. confused.gif
BeeMan458 is offline  
post #27 of 61 Old 12-07-2012, 08:21 AM
Advanced Member
 
mgrotel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 653
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 57 Post(s)
Liked: 32
use depth mode for movies and content that produces the very low stuff. punch mode for music that doesnt go too low in the frequency spectrum
also give it a chance go get broke in
mgrotel is offline  
post #28 of 61 Old 12-07-2012, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
hardrock_121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by ack_bk View Post

Your mains are rated to 80hz. Perhaps try setting your crossover to 80hz for your mains and see if you like it better.
Room placement is key as well, have you tried the subwoofer crawl? Also note if you are sitting in the center of the room, you are sitting in a bass null. A $1000 sub won't sound great either if you have bad placement or are sitting in a null.

I tried that with my old sub and didnt like the result .. i will try again and see how it works now.
I am in the horizontal center with sub and back speakers 6-7 ft diagonally from me.. while the front mains are 10ft from me and center is about 6ft. Its a perfectly rectangle room.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

You know you have to fix that. tongue.gif
Stating the obvious, with your speaker system upstairs, sitting in the basement, Audyssey ain't gonna do your system any good. confused.gif
I cant fix that.. its all wired. THats why ihavent even opened it yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrotel View Post

use depth mode for movies and content that produces the very low stuff. punch mode for music that doesnt go too low in the frequency spectrum
also give it a chance go get broke in

Do you guys change it on demand? Did u program your remotes to do that?
hardrock_121 is offline  
post #29 of 61 Old 12-07-2012, 08:42 PM
Senior Member
 
psycholis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 225
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 21
I set my RW-12 on flat for everything but maybe that's just me.

Marantz SR-5007
Klipsch WF-35, WC-24, WB-14
SVS PB-2000
LG 55LN5600
Sony PS3, Xbox 360, Wii U
psycholis is offline  
post #30 of 61 Old 12-07-2012, 10:40 PM
Advanced Member
 
mgrotel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 653
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 57 Post(s)
Liked: 32
FYI, there are frequency response graphs on here somewhere that show depth mode stays flatter lower in the frequency range, making it a good option for movies and music with the really low stuff. Punch mode has more output at higher frequencies making it better for normal music listening. Flat mode is the worse of both worlds, it falls off sooner than depth and has less output than punch higher in the frequency range. But do as you desire.
mgrotel is offline  
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Tags
Klipsch Rw 12d 12 Subwoofer Each

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off