Sub under $400 to fill my space - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 45 Old 11-27-2012, 02:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi everyone, I've been reading the sub forums obessively lately. I was close to pulling the trigger on a sub and then thought about the space! My living room measurements are 13x15x11 ceiling. The problem is my lr isnt exactly ideal for ht since I have an opening to my dining room, kitchen, hallway, and entryway. Im a noob so I know that almost anything will sound better to me as I currently have an 8 year old htib yamaha setup and I probably wouldnt be able to truly appreciate a sub over $400. I got the tv, now I'm trying to piece together the audio side slowly. I was leaning towards the cheaper HSU's, a pl-200, maybe a bic h-100. Truthfully I'd love to spend under 300.00 Ive heard good things about SVS and ed but I now know ed is going outta business. One of my main concerns is being able to feel the bass as you guys say. I dont want the sound to be swallowed up in my lack of walls and high-ish ceilings. I'd be willing to buy used if its in good shape and not too old. I know a lot of this is solely opinons but I feel like I need to consult the forums to be sure about my decision! Hopefully the pics will show EXACTLY what im working with. (excuse the mess) IMG_20121127_145141[2].jpg 1707k .jpg file IMG_20121127_145128[1].jpg 1781k .jpg file IMG_20121127_145103[1].jpg 1975k .jpg file IMG_20121127_145003[1].jpg 1846k .jpg file
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post #2 of 45 Old 11-27-2012, 02:52 PM
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I recommend the Epik legend for the sale price of $400 shipped throughout the 1st, if you're looking at new. If you place it nearfield, next to your couch say, you increase both SPL and tactile feeling, that is punch and rumble, "feeling" the sub as you say.

It would make a nice base for your future upgrades, and when the time comes you might even could add a second. wink.gif
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post #3 of 45 Old 11-27-2012, 05:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I've noticed that on sale but correct me if I'm wrong, haven't people had issues with the amp overheating on that model?
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post #4 of 45 Old 11-27-2012, 07:57 PM
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So I've heard. If you're concerned, I would hit up the Epik owners thread and see what the consensus is. I'm sure they work with any problems presented to them, but I suppose you can't be too careful these days.

Other than the amp scare, it really is a great unit for the money. The Outlaw lfm-1 plus for $500 sale is ending today, those two are the best bang for buck deals going right now.
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post #5 of 45 Old 11-27-2012, 11:03 PM - Thread Starter
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How would the lower end hsu's compare? Again I'm a noob so do the watts play a huge part? Becuase man the stf 2 is only 200 and its a 10" and I see a bic h-100 thats 500 and is 100 dollars cheaper. I know theres more variable that just that but thoughts?
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post #6 of 45 Old 11-28-2012, 03:09 AM
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Originally Posted by theben07 View Post

How would the lower end hsu's compare? Again I'm a noob so do the watts play a huge part? Becuase man the stf 2 is only 200 and its a 10" and I see a bic h-100 thats 500 and is 100 dollars cheaper. I know theres more variable that just that but thoughts?
Better check those model #s and prices again. Or are you talking used? stf2 will not satisfy your wanting bass "that you feel".

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post #7 of 45 Old 11-28-2012, 05:26 AM
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Your listening area (because of adjoining rooms) may approach 6000 cubic feet and be at least 4000 cubic feet.

Individuals in the BIC forums have stated that the PL-200 is better than the F12 and that the Hsu STF-2 is better than the PL-200 (in relatively small listening areas).

Four STF-2s would not fill your area. Consider two Hsu VTF-15Hs.

You may need to set your sights lower initially. Buy one decent subwoofer and gradually upgrade with additional or better subwoofers.
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post #8 of 45 Old 11-28-2012, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wwinkler View Post

Your listening area (because of adjoining rooms) may approach 6000 cubic feet and be at least 4000 cubic feet.
Individuals in the BIC forums have stated that the PL-200 is better than the F12 and that the Hsu STF-2 is better than the PL-200 (in relatively small listening areas).
Four STF-2s would not fill your area. Consider two Hsu VTF-15Hs.
You may need to set your sights lower initially. Buy one decent subwoofer and gradually upgrade with additional or better subwoofers.

damn. Well it sounds like the epik legend will fill my space best in my price range? For that price I might just build my own home theater. the wife is already on me about this maybe I should just go with a PL 200. It doesn't sound like I'll be feeling the sound anytime soon
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post #9 of 45 Old 11-28-2012, 06:59 AM - Thread Starter
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do you guys also see a lot of good sales more towards Christmas? It seems to me that Amazon had " Black Friday sales" but after further research they were pretty much full price lol
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post #10 of 45 Old 12-04-2012, 09:50 PM - Thread Starter
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So after hearing all the issues with the epik legend amps, I decided to pass on that BF sale. HSU is running a sale for the stf-2. I dont quite understand all the specs to be considered. But it sounds like this sub wont have as much output as a legend but tighter and lower bass. This is 200 watts rms legend is 300. Any one have any thoughts on this sub? It seems like a smoking deal at 330.00 Would like to spend under 400 still. Something that concerns me is this is only a 10" maybe thats inexperience speaking but compared to the legends two 12s?! Idk! Begging for your guy's help. I know this is probably a type of thread everyones tired of and there are a million but Im looking for advice based on MY space. Thanks so much
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post #11 of 45 Old 12-04-2012, 09:55 PM - Thread Starter
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I see new egg selling a Klipsch RW-12d for 300 on and off. Right now its 500. Seems spec wise like a smokin deal!! Dont hear much talk about Klipsch subs though.
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post #12 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 04:00 AM
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I see new egg selling a Klipsch RW-12d for 300 on and off. Right now its 500. Seems spec wise like a smokin deal!! Dont hear much talk about Klipsch subs though.
You wont even hear the stf-2 in that space unless you are sitting right next to it and then you will be the only one. What good is tighter and lower bass if you have to put it in your lap to hear it. The RW-12 would be much better but still wont work any miracles.

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post #13 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 06:43 AM - Thread Starter
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I don't see how that's true. I can hear my htib sub. 8 " whatever it is. Its pathetic but I can hear it
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post #14 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 07:14 AM
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With your room size and a budget of 3 bills the best you going to get is the RW-12 when it's on sale. like Bond 007 said, don't expect any miracles.
If you can do a sub crawl and get it in the right spot it will do you good.

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post #15 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 07:21 AM
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My living room measurements are 13x15x11 ceiling. ... I have an opening to my dining room, kitchen, hallway, and entryway. ... Im a noob so I know that almost anything will sound better to me as I currently have an 8 year old htib yamaha setup and I probably wouldnt be able to truly appreciate a sub over $400.
Yes, you most definitely would. cool.gif
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Truthfully I'd love to spend under 300.00 ... I dont want the sound to be swallowed up in my lack of walls and high-ish ceilings.
+1 to the RW-12d...although, as others have noted, don't expect miracles in a space that is as large overall as yours.
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I'd be willing to buy used if its in good shape and not too old.
A couple of 100% functional, gently-used options - if you're lucky enough to stumble upon them - would be:
- an SVS PB10-NSD; or
- a pair of Energy S10.3s.
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post #16 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by theben07 View Post

I don't see how that's true. I can hear my htib sub. 8 " whatever it is. Its pathetic but I can hear it
Then the stf-2 will be an improvement and the RW12 will be a bigger improvement for $100 less.

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post #17 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 12:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Pl-200 anybody? I'd go up to 4 just was saying less is always nice
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post #18 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 12:59 PM
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Pl-200 anybody? I'd go up to 4 just was saying less is always nice

I would take the PA-150 anyday over the Pl-200. Should be able to find one for $300-350 shipped.

http://www.data-bass.com/systems

You can see how it compares to the BIC. You would have to buy 2-3 PL-200's to get the output of the PA-150 in the 30-80hz region where most bass is.
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post #19 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 12:59 PM - Thread Starter
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post #20 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 05:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is a great review. Seems like people love the pa-150 in its price range. I didnt know it even existed until your post ack_bk so thanks because i definitely have my finger on the trigger now.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1350647/premier-acoustic-pa-150-data-bass-test-results
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post #21 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by theben07 View Post

Here is a great review. Seems like people love the pa-150 in its price range. I didnt know it even existed until your post ack_bk so thanks because i definitely have my finger on the trigger now.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1350647/premier-acoustic-pa-150-data-bass-test-results

I own one and own subs that cost 2-3 times the price and the PA-150 can actually hang until about 35hz or so and then it drops off. Most bass in movies is above 20hz and the PA-150 will certainly fill a large room for the price. In the sub $400 price range you really cannot go wrong with it, and it looks very nice too.

Good luck!
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post #22 of 45 Old 12-05-2012, 10:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Wow that's good to hear. Got it $349 shipped. Hopefully it won't take forever. What exactly do you mean it "drops off"? Just not as powerful at lower hz?
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post #23 of 45 Old 12-06-2012, 01:45 PM
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Wow that's good to hear. Got it $349 shipped. Hopefully it won't take forever. What exactly do you mean it "drops off"? Just not as powerful at lower hz?

Correct. Cant reach the same SPL at the lower frequency compared to 35-40hz+

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post #24 of 45 Old 12-06-2012, 05:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you guys so much for all your help. These forums are great and there is so much to be learned here. I get the sub Monday so I'll give my impressions later in the week. FWIW. :-)
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post #25 of 45 Old 12-07-2012, 05:53 AM
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Wow that's good to hear. Got it $349 shipped. Hopefully it won't take forever. What exactly do you mean it "drops off"? Just not as powerful at lower hz?

There are trade offs with budget subs. The PA-150 is designed to rolloff before 20hz, but the benefit is that it plays extremely strong in the 40-80hz range and can actually hang with, or be superior to, subs that cost considerably more in those frequency ranges. A cool as it is to say your subwoofer can play flat to 15hz or lower, the truth of the matter is that most bass is happening well above 20hz.
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post #26 of 45 Old 12-09-2012, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
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I see what you mean clan and ack. I dont think i know what 20hz even sounds like. This has become addictive.
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post #27 of 45 Old 12-09-2012, 09:20 AM
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I see what you mean clan and ack. I dont think i know what 20hz even sounds like. This has become addictive.

Sub 20hz, there is no sound. You actually "feel" the bass smile.gif

If you have the budget, there is nothing wrong with chasing strong bass 20hz and below. I would be a hypocrite for telling you not to since that is what I am doing, but with a limited budget, it is best to be informed of the trade-offs and then buying a sub that fits what you want the best. I have come full circle and am going DIY now as you can just get so much more for your money, and I enjoy projects smile.gif
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post #28 of 45 Old 12-09-2012, 10:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Yeah. Thanks so much for your help dude. You're still chasing even with that hsu?!
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post #29 of 45 Old 12-09-2012, 10:36 AM
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Yeah. Thanks so much for your help dude. You're still chasing even with that hsu?!

Haha, yes. 6500 cu sq ft room and the Hsu is awesome. I am like 80% there but I really want to dable in DIY...
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post #30 of 45 Old 12-10-2012, 11:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Got it today! Thought I'd post a couple of pics. Are there any suggestions for breaking it in? If that's necessary? It is a very good looking sub IMO and it is huge to me, but you can see what I had before. Right now its 80hz crossover, phase 0, and 6 volume. Hopefully my cheap receiver will let me calibrate a little from there.
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