Klipsch RW-12d on sale for $299 at Newegg.com again today! - Page 31 - AVS Forum
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post #901 of 2776 Old 03-01-2013, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Set the crossover in your avr (to crossover between your speakers and the sub) at 80hz. If you have a dedicated .1 subwoofer pre-out from your avr, set the low pass on the sub itself to 120hz as that is the range of LFE signals in movies...
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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

I forgot about that setting! Yes, I have an RW12d in my bedroom.

Ok thanks.. I checked out the Denxon XX13 thread and printed out some setup options for new Denon receivers. Maybe something in there also will help me set it up correctly. I will also try the sub crawl this weekend because like some posts have said the movie response is right on but for music lacks dep bass. Like I said I only had it a few hours to play with and hopefully get it dialed in this weekend.

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post #902 of 2776 Old 03-01-2013, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by bumprunlogan View Post

Ok thanks.. I checked out the Denxon XX13 thread and printed out some setup options for new Denon receivers. Maybe something in there also will help me set it up correctly. I will also try the sub crawl this weekend because like some posts have said the movie response is right on but for music lacks dep bass. Like I said I only had it a few hours to play with and hopefully get it dialed in this weekend.

You're getting deep bass (movies); you're not getting mid-bass (music). Movies have lots of LFE effects and "stuff" added at the low end for effect. The lowest note on a piano is 32.7Hz, a bass guitar is 41.3Hz, a cello is 65.4Hz. So if you're focusing (or, worse, emphasizing) the 20Hz - 30Hz range, you won't be impressed with your music.

That's why most people recommend, at the very least, an SPL meter. If you want to get involved in a whole new hobby, look up "Room EQ Wizard."

And remember that your new sub has presets, for this very reason.

Have fun.

And don't let anyone see you doing "the crawl."

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post #903 of 2776 Old 03-01-2013, 06:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bumprunlogan View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Set the crossover in your avr (to crossover between your speakers and the sub) at 80hz. If you have a dedicated .1 subwoofer pre-out from your avr, set the low pass on the sub itself to 120hz as that is the range of LFE signals in movies...
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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

I forgot about that setting! Yes, I have an RW12d in my bedroom.

Ok thanks.. I checked out the Denxon XX13 thread and printed out some setup options for new Denon receivers. Maybe something in there also will help me set it up correctly. I will also try the sub crawl this weekend because like some posts have said the movie response is right on but for music lacks dep bass. Like I said I only had it a few hours to play with and hopefully get it dialed in this weekend.

And my reco is just a starting point, doesn't mean that's the best crossover setting for your avr, just a general starting point. It will depend on your particular speakers and if your avr can adjust the crossover individually (or sometimes pairs) or just all at once. Music does lack deep bass in many recordings. Try finding recordings that definitely have some deep bass before you judge. Like was said, more likely the influence of your room and the nulls/modes that exist. If your avr has Audyssey run that as an easy starting point, not familiar with Denon model ranges, hopefully you have a version that can apply some eq filters to your sub.

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post #904 of 2776 Old 03-01-2013, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Try finding recordings that definitely have some deep bass before you judge. 

From Archaea's Kansas City shootouts:

 

http://kiwi6.com/file/28ub13rh6w

 

http://kiwi6.com/file/vo80ks3b34

 

Search AVS forum for "Archaea's Kansas City shootouts" for playlists (and rankings of some VERY high end subs!).

Links are also in his sig.


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post #905 of 2776 Old 03-01-2013, 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Do you have a way of matching the output level of your avr for speakers and sub? What avr are you using? What setting do you have the RW12D at now?

I have a Denon 1612. I had the sub on deep but switched it to flat as it was getting a little too loud on movies. I am going to try to tinker with it a little more tomorrow and will eventually get Audyssey to set it up when the rears are installed.
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post #906 of 2776 Old 03-01-2013, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Do you have a way of matching the output level of your avr for speakers and sub? What avr are you using? What setting do you have the RW12D at now?

I have a Denon 1612. I had the sub on deep but switched it to flat as it was getting a little too loud on movies. I am going to try to tinker with it a little more tomorrow and will eventually get Audyssey to set it up when the rears are installed.

I meant what output level on the sub, not which eq mode. Turn the sub level down if it's too loud...use the Audyssey MultEQ setup in your avr, it'll help set speaker and sub levels.

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post #907 of 2776 Old 03-02-2013, 06:52 AM
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Wow, back up to $649, what's up with that...?

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post #908 of 2776 Old 03-02-2013, 08:46 AM
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Wow, back up to $649, what's up with that...?

That is the off sale price. I think these go on sale so often that people forget that it really isn't a $300 subwoofer...
It's still <$400 on Amazon.

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post #909 of 2776 Old 03-02-2013, 09:01 AM
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Wow, back up to $649, what's up with that...?

Because the MSRP is 699? Who knows, maybe they get a few people who see Klipsch and buy without any research.

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post #910 of 2776 Old 03-02-2013, 09:15 AM
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That is the off sale price. I think these go on sale so often that people forget that it really isn't a $300 subwoofer...
It's still <$400 on Amazon.
Point taken. Just for the record Amazon has it for $380 and free shipping.

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post #911 of 2776 Old 03-02-2013, 09:35 AM
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Just checked: one left at Amazon.

I was actually looking up the list price, since I knew newegg says it's $999.99; Amazon has list at $699. Klipsch just lists it as discontinued.

Love mine for $300.

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post #912 of 2776 Old 03-02-2013, 10:18 PM
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My cousin bought a klipsch rw-12d from newegg. His port was loose and rattled around. He's going to fix it, as it seems an easy fix, but rack up another issue. He just got his this last week. It was perfectly undamaged in any other way that I could tell - so I think their quality control is lacking. You could put your hand up the port and feel the tube was just swinging around loose in there. Still sounds good when you hold it - so I know that's what it was.

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post #913 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Archaea View Post

My cousin bought a klipsch rw-12d from newegg. His port was loose and rattled around. He's going to fix it, as it seems an easy fix, but rack up another issue. He just got his this last week. It was perfectly undamaged in any other way that I could tell - so I think their quality control is lacking. You could put your hand up the port and feel the tube was just swinging around loose in there. Still sounds good when you hold it - so I know that's what it was.

 

That little problem is fixed with glue . . . one of the annoyances of getting a great bargain price on a NIB still comes with a Klipsch warranty discontinued sub.  But I have found it worth it to me . . . and a good solution rather than to send my new one back and waiting for a replacement that might have the same easy to remedy problem.

 

The occasional port tube loosening seems to be the only widespread and common manufacturing complaint to the under $300 sub . . . (Yes, there are other complaints, some things people do not like about it, or easily damaged in shipping before Klipsch changed the shipping container, and some who just did not like the sub, but no other widespread manufacturing deficiencies for the $300 price point.)

 

Still, IMHO, the most thump for the buck budget sub out there, while they last in newegg stock, when on sale anyway.

 

As with many others, I have not had the port tube loosen on me.  But, I have some glue on hand in case it ever does.  Even with that potential fault, I am thinking about getting a second one on the next sale, because I have been so pleased on the first one I got at $299 from newegg last summer.

 

Sorry your cousin had the problem. 

 

Quality control is no longer an issue since they have discontinued manufacturing.  Obviously limited sales at the original price point ($649) and annoying loosening port tubes contributed to its demise.  But, NIB at $300 with a full Klipsch warranty, I am happy with mine; so much so, there may be a second one in my future.


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post #914 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 08:58 AM
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Wish I'd got 1, or, rather 2, @ that price!

just 1 more pair of KLIPSCH Classic speakers...
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post #915 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 09:14 AM
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Wish I'd got 1, or, rather 2, @ that price!

Just wait a week or so...I'm pretty sure there some more going to go for 299 delivered for a bit. Especially since someone not too far back (might be the other RW12d thread), saw someone post an indication of mfr date of 10/12 (not sure where he got that from, though)

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Originally Posted by lovinthehd View Post

Just wait a week or so...I'm pretty sure there some more going to go for 299 delivered for a bit. Especially since someone not too far back (might be the other RW12d thread), saw someone post an indication of mfr date of 10/12 (not sure where he got that from, though)

From personal experience with many newer and older Klipsch products, inside the driver box are quality control stickers with the dated initials of the person doing the quality control check.
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post #917 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 10:08 AM
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I'm new to this forum and purchased two of these from Newegg last weekend for $279 a piece. Recieved them Thursday and needless to say spent the entire night setting them up and dialing them in.

I'm very happy with these subs, my mains went down to the 40Hz range and these added the extra umph that I needed.

Neither of the subs came with loose port tubes, however I bought a hot glue gun just in case. Outer boxes had a few punched through places, but the inter boxes were in perfect shape.

My only complaint is the placement of the IR sensor in the back of the sub. Limits the remote range some.

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I'm new to this forum and purchased two of these from Newegg last weekend for $279 a piece. Recieved them Thursday and needless to say spent the entire night setting them up and dialing them in.

I'm very happy with these subs, my mains went down to the 40Hz range and these added the extra umph that I needed.

Neither of the subs came with loose port tubes, however I bought a hot glue gun just in case. Outer boxes had a few punched through places, but the inter boxes were in perfect shape.

My only complaint is the placement of the IR sensor in the back of the sub. Limits the remote range some.

 Congrats on your new acquisitions!  Glad they arrived unharmed with no defects.

 

Yes, that rear placement of the IR window is annoying . . . One of these days I will have to figure it out to work with my Pioneer remote . . . See if it is possible.  For now I just walk over and change settings the old-fashioned way, manually!  Too many irons in the fire to take the time right now.  :-)

 

depending on your AVR, you might want to set the crossover on your mains to 80hz and your fronts to large and give that a listen.  iI do that in one of my setups, but not the other.

 

Again, congrats on getting two RW-12Ds!


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 Congrats on your new acquisitions!  Glad they arrived unharmed with no defects.

Yes, that rear placement of the IR window is annoying . . . One of these days I will have to figure it out to work with my Pioneer remote . . . See if it is possible.  For now I just walk over and change settings the old-fashioned way, manually!  Too many irons in the fire to take the time right now.  :-)

depending on your AVR, you might want to set the crossover on your mains to 80hz and your fronts to large and give that a listen.  iI do that in one of my setups, but not the other.

Again, congrats on getting two RW-12Ds!

For what ever reason, FYI, I find that setting the crossovers up from 60Hz to 80Hz, weakens the REW graph a bit.
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post #920 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 12:38 PM
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For what ever reason, FYI, I find that setting the crossovers up from 60Hz to 80Hz, weakens the REW graph a bit.

On all subs and all speakers, or just a setup with an RW-12D in it?


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post #921 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Rhetor View Post

 
depending on your AVR, you might want to set the crossover on your mains to 80hz and your fronts to large and give that a listen.  iI do that in one of my setups, but not the other.

Again, congrats on getting two RW-12Ds!

Thanks for the congrats. When I played around Thrusday evening I found 80 HZ to be just right for my taste and yes I set my fronts to large. Volume is set to -20db on both subs. Had to increase the distance after running the YPAO on my Yamaha RX-V673. There was a slight delay between the bass of the fronts and the subs and that increase aligned them.

Both music and movies have a nice lower range without being boomy

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On all subs and all speakers, or just a setup with an RW-12D in it?

Currently, I'm using a pair of eighteen year old Klipsch, SW-12 II's which recently I replaced the drivers and radiator. This time and the last time I pulled out REW and the measuring gear, I noticed that setting the crossovers to 80Hz, weakened the strength of the measurement over measurements taken when the crossover was set to 60Hz.

I also noticed that changing the subwoofer setting on the AVR (Maratz, SR5007 w/Audyssey, MultEQ XT) from LFE+Main to LFE weakened the measurement also.

Is this a universal situation? I don't know as I've only my personal experience to go by but the experience is sufficient to make personal note and public comment that anybody who has measuring gear should check how increasing or decreasing their crossover setting affects the strength of their room measurements.

As to the why, in my opinion, it all has to do with room interaction and reinforcement or cancellation and as one frequency is increased in intensity, which is what changing crossovers can do, there can be a corresponding cancellation which would explain the weakening of the reading.

Currently, I have on order, two different kinds of ground loop isolators to see if removing the, what I think to be, Comcast introduced, internet based, ground loop interference, impacts the room reading. One will isolate the Comcast connection to the modem and the other will isolate the RCA provided connection the signal is delivered on. The two isolators should be here on Tuesday.

-
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post #923 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 01:46 PM
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Is this a universal situation? I don't know as I've only my personal experience to go by but the experience is sufficient to make personal note and public comment that anybody who has measuring gear should check how increasing or decreasing their crossover setting affects the strength of their room measurements.

I think anyone with measuring gear (and certainly speaking for myself) would check any change to the system as a matter of course.

For those unfamiliar with such things, here's a good start:

http://www.hometheatershack.com/roomeq/


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post #924 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 03:21 PM
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Currently, I'm using a pair of eighteen year old Klipsch, SW-12 II's which recently I replaced the drivers and radiator. This time and the last time I pulled out REW and the measuring gear, I noticed that setting the crossovers to 80Hz, weakened the strength of the measurement over measurements taken when the crossover was set to 60Hz.

I also noticed that changing the subwoofer setting on the AVR (Maratz, SR5007 w/Audyssey, MultEQ XT) from LFE+Main to LFE weakened the measurement also.

Is this a universal situation? I don't know as I've only my personal experience to go by but the experience is sufficient to make personal note and public comment that anybody who has measuring gear should check how increasing or decreasing their crossover setting affects the strength of their room measurements.

As to the why, in my opinion, it all has to do with room interaction and reinforcement or cancellation and as one frequency is increased in intensity, which is what changing crossovers can do, there can be a corresponding cancellation which would explain the weakening of the reading.

Currently, I have on order, two different kinds of ground loop isolators to see if removing the, what I think to be, Comcast introduced, internet based, ground loop interference, impacts the room reading. One will isolate the Comcast connection to the modem and the other will isolate the RCA provided connection the signal is delivered on. The two isolators should be here on Tuesday.

-

 

Think I will just settle for the mic and built in MCACC on my Pio and some recommended settings to listen to my $300 sub in the setup it is in . . . Anything else is beyond my current budgeted time allotment for hobbies and certainly well beyond my relative realm of interest.  I guess I just have no interest in REW software coupled with anything beyond an inexpensive SPL meter.  I simply plug in recommended settings (best practices) and tweak for my liking by ear.

 

Knowing then that you are not running a RW-12D (the purchasing of which is what the thread is about) I will simply re-recommend to the OP with two new RW-12Ds to set his crossover for fronts to small and to 80hz instead of 40hz and give a listen . . . He might like it.  But if not, he can just go back to 40hz for his fronts . . . Just a quick listen . . . Maybe two minutes . . . A lot less time spent than downloading the REW software, understanding the nuances, locating (and/or puchasing) measuring gear, etc.

 

Just my 2 cents.


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Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post

I think anyone with measuring gear (and certainly speaking for myself) would check any change to the system as a matter of course.

For those unfamiliar with such things, here's a good start:

http://www.hometheatershack.com/roomeq/

 

Appreciate both the brevity and simplicity of your post and flagging us to that thread.  Looked at it and gave it a quick read . . . Very interesting for when I ever have time for more definitive eq experience.  And, looks like about anybody with a computer can learn how to use the REW software.  

 

Nice pointer for a starting point, LastButNotLeast.  A genuine thanks to you!


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.

I also noticed that changing the subwoofer setting on the AVR (Maratz, SR5007 w/Audyssey, MultEQ XT) from LFE+Main to LFE weakened the measurement also.

-

 

Of course it would, now you have lower hz coming from both the fronts and the sub . . . moving from effectively from double bass.  So increasing the crossover on the fronts from 40 hz or 60 hz to 80 would decrease the frequencies below 80hz since the fronts would no longer be pushing anything below 80hz, thus less bass in the room.

 

But since the OP was running two RW-12ds, I was encouraging him to listen to those two subs without anything below 80hz coming out of the fronts . . . Two active subs and some bass added from the 2 front speakers too may result a some displeasing bass multipliers in the room . . . Ergo, my recommendation to try listening in his setup to just the subs below 80hz to see if it might enhance his listening, even though he is already enthused with one day of results while listening in his setup to two RW-12Ds with his fronts set to cross at 40hz.


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post #928 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 04:15 PM
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I thinking about getting a second sub. I already own a RW-12D, and I am wondering if I should get another one or a different sub?

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post #929 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 04:24 PM
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I thinking about getting a second sub. I already own a RW-12D, and I am wondering if I should get another one or a different sub?
More info. Why do you want another sub? Whats your budget? Likely another rw would be best but its hard to say now.

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post #930 of 2776 Old 03-03-2013, 04:41 PM
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More info. Why do you want another sub? Whats your budget? Likely another rw would be best but its hard to say now.

I think I can get away with $600 dollar as long as the wife doesn't know it cost that much lol. My current set up is as follows:

Front Left / Right
Monitor 70's towers

Center
Polk Audio 25c

Surround Left / Right
Jamo s426 towers

Sub
RW-12D

AVR Pioneer SC-1222-K

I think the main reason why I want another sub is to put it on the right side of my tv stand so both sides are equal. There is an empty space on the side where there is not sub lol biggrin.gif

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