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post #31 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 08:52 AM
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So....other than feet, what would the differences be between up firing and down firing subs.
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post #32 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 09:03 AM
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So....other than feet, what would the differences be between up firing and down firing subs.
Driver vulnerability to damage. If the cab was tall enough there would be floor bounce cancellations, but to occur at even the upper end of the sub passband at 100Hz the baffle would have to be 2.8 feet above the floor.

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post #33 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 10:07 AM
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You really haven't answered my question have you.
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post #34 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 11:28 AM
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You really haven't answered my question have you.
What else would you like me to say? If you have a legitimate question spit it out. If you're trolling I'm not biting.

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post #35 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Fluid Dynamics.
Not everybody is into bandpass enclosure design. Not knocking it, just saying, bandpass enclosure design lacks aesthetic appeal over that of a direct radiating design and fluid dynamics demands that enclosure energy will be transferred. Where am I going wrong?
-

It doesn't have to be a bandpass design to have a pass band. Your receiver has a passband, as do all speakers. Defined as the high and low frequency -X dB (maybe 6 maybe 10, I think we get to decide where to put the limits for ourselves whenver we want to define the pass band of any device) points, AFAIK. Most receivers actually roll off intentionally somewhere just above 20 KHz, and many roll off in the bass somewhere below 20Hz. Bosso, IIRC, struggled to find amps that were flat down to 5 Hz or below.
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post #36 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 12:18 PM
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What else would you like me to say? If you have a legitimate question spit it out. If you're trolling I'm not biting.
. Not trolling here. You claim being an expert with this thread and mention an up firing sub being the exception. With down firing being popular I was wondering what the difference would be. You said woofer vulnerability. Trivial really, but you being an expert I was hoping for a different answer. A better explanation.
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post #37 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 12:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by JHAz View Post

It doesn't have to be a bandpass design to have a pass band. Your receiver has a passband, as do all speakers. Defined as the high and low frequency -X dB (maybe 6 maybe 10, I think we get to decide where to put the limits for ourselves whenver we want to define the pass band of any device) points, AFAIK. Most receivers actually roll off intentionally somewhere just above 20 KHz, and many roll off in the bass somewhere below 20Hz. Bosso, IIRC, struggled to find amps that were flat down to 5 Hz or below.

The comment directly related to subwoofer enclosure design and isolating the subwoofer enclosure energy from the floor.

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post #38 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigsky HiFi View Post

. Not trolling here. You claim being an expert with this thread and mention an up firing sub being the exception. With down firing being popular I was wondering what the difference would be. You said woofer vulnerability. Trivial really, but you being an expert I was hoping for a different answer. A better explanation.
I don't know what you want explained. A down firing woofer is at the bottom of the cabinet, facing down, an up firing woofer is at the top of the cab, facing up. BTW, the example at bossobass is a dual opposed, using two drivers, one up firing, one down firing.

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post #39 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 01:29 PM
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Well Bill I was hoping you could elaborate on a comment you made. I had no idea it would be so hard for you. Thanks for the one faces up and one faces down though. Like others, I come here to have a good time reading about this hobbie and maybe even learn something new. In this case with you I did indeed learn something.
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post #40 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigsky HiFi View Post

Well Bill I was hoping you could elaborate on a comment you made. I had no idea it would be so hard for you. Thanks for the one faces up and one faces down though. Like others, I come here to have a good time reading about this hobbie and maybe even learn something new. In this case with you I did indeed learn something.
And I still don't know what you want explained. It seems that you don't either, so I'll leave it at that.

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post #41 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

This points out the fallacy of the isolation theory. For the sub to transfer energy to the floor the sub cabinet would have to be vibrating in its passband so badly as to make it totally defective. Well made subs do not vibrate in the subwoofer passband. Whatever panel vibration that is present lies in the midrange, and midrange doesn't cause the floor or anything else to vibrate. The only exception would be where the forces generated by the motion of the cone push and pull the cabinet into and away from the floor, ie., an up-firing driver, which AFAIK no one uses.

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Is a down firing sub that much different than an up firing sub?
. Really Bill....
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post #42 of 50 Old 12-12-2012, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigsky HiFi View Post

. Really Bill....

Next you should show off by trying to make a fool of Bobl Lee from QSC. These guys who do this stuff for a living know nothing and, to boot, cannot read minds worth a darn, so they keep answering the question that was asked instead of the one the asker thought he was asking.


Sez the guy who the estimable Mr. Lee put into his place a time or two early in his wanderings on this site. I find that endeavoring to understand what the experts say, even when it doesn't match one's preconceived notions, is surprisingly valuable.
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post #43 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 03:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Wow I never thought my little question would create 5 pages. Thank you for some of the inputs. Some of you though are straight up bickering.

My sub is side firing, its a HSU VTF3 MK4. If your familiar with this sub you know it comes with a CD with frequencies top test the sub. I found out on track 13 it recreates the certain frequency that causes the base boards to rattle. And yes the driver is facing the base board.

Also I put in the base boards myself. This is how I routed all my speaker wires instead of going through the attic. I said all this on page one.

I will try some of the techniques that some of you have suggested. But if your getting into a pissing contest, please stop and take it somewhere else.

Happy Holidays

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
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post #44 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 03:42 AM
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All you pissers have been formally dismissed by the man who owns this thread. Move on.wink.gif

No, Mr. Bond. I expect you to die!
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post #45 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 06:02 AM
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I found out on track 13 it recreates the certain frequency that causes the base boards to rattle. And yes the driver is facing the base board.
That shouldn't matter, as the radiation pattern of a subwoofer is omni-directional. Chances are you'll find one screw will end the problem. If that single screw is driven in the middle of the span of the vibrating portion of the baseboard the resonance frequency will go up by a full octave, and if that places it outside the subwoofer passband it won't vibrate,

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post #46 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 06:14 AM
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Originally Posted by destiny 21 View Post

hi i have a klipsh rw12 sub on a hardwood floor in a room 22x12 8 ft cielings. when watching a bluray or tv movie a lot of things in the room rattle.have the setting on the sub to-15 and -3 in the reciever. if i was to get some sort of padding for under the sub should it be the same size as the sub or farer out on the front and sides of the sub.

First obtain some test recordings with slow sweeps, and isolate the buzz or rattle so that you can recreate it at will in about 10 seconds with almost no effort. You now or soon will know exactly where the trouble is.

Then find some sorbothane sheet or pads, mortite, polyurethane glue, and wood screws, pilot drill and screw driver. Application of one or more of them will resolve the problem unless it is internal to the sub.
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post #47 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 06:32 AM
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Or...If you dont have the test equipment or the know how to use it or the tools or the money and time to find the materials you could just remove EVERYTHING from the room.tongue.gif

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post #48 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 06:50 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

....you could just remove EVERYTHING from the room.tongue.gif

....................eek.gif

I'm old, I rattle and just how exactly am I going be able to listen if I remove myself from the room?

....................tongue.gif
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post #49 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 06:52 AM
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Or...If you dont have the test equipment or the know how to use it or the tools or the money and time to find the materials you could just remove EVERYTHING from the room.tongue.gif
It's not hard to track down vibration. First off, small objects don't vibrate. The wavelengths from a sub run from about ten to forty feet long, and anything that's less than a quarter-wavelength or so in dimension won't be vibrated, as the wave simply goes around it (see principles of diffraction). So what vibrates are large surfaces: floors, walls, ceilings. You don't notice them vibrating, or hear them vibrating. What you do hear vibrating are objects connected to them, pictures, shelves, etc., and other objects sitting on said shelves. In the OPs case the baseboard itself isn't the issue, the wall behind it is. He doesn't hear the wall vibrating, he hears the baseboard vibrating in response to the wall vibration.
If you have objects vibrating the cure isn't to isolate the sub, as that doesn't stop those ten to forty foot long wavelengths from vibrating the floor and walls. It's to either secure or isolate the objects. Shelves full of brick-a-brack in a HT aren't a good idea, but if you must have them get self-stick felt pads to put under them.

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post #50 of 50 Old 12-13-2012, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

This points out the fallacy of the isolation theory. For the sub to transfer energy to the floor the sub cabinet would have to be vibrating in its passband so badly as to make it totally defective. Well made subs do not vibrate in the subwoofer passband. Whatever panel vibration that is present lies in the midrange, and midrange doesn't cause the floor or anything else to vibrate. The only exception would be where the forces generated by the motion of the cone push and pull the cabinet into and away from the floor, ie., an up-firing driver, which AFAIK no one uses.

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Originally Posted by Bigsky HiFi View Post

Is a down firing sub that much different than an up firing sub?
. Really Bill....

Aren't you a argumentative cuss. rolleyes.gif
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