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post #1 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 06:29 AM - Thread Starter
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I am having trouble deciding which is better.,im looking to use it for 70/30 movies/music. Which one has more bass and power? My budet is in the 500-800 dollar range.
And what is the difference?

My choice si far..

Svs pb--12

Super cube 2000

Super cube 4000

Also if you have any really good recommendations that,would be great
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post #2 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by harchetface9 View Post

Which one has more bass and power?
Neither. When a sub is properly designed it ends up sealed if the driver used gives better results in a sealed cab, it ends up vented if the driver used gives better results in a vented cab. Conversely, if the designer decides to make the cab sealed he would properly choose a driver that works best sealed, if he decides to make it vented he would properly choose a driver that works best vented. Both can give very good results, both can give very bad results. Users who express a preference for one or the other usually do so because they heard a bad vented sub or a bad sealed sub and assumed the issue was the alignment, when it was actually just a bad sub. OTOH if it sounds good, it is good.

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post #3 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 07:38 AM - Thread Starter
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What do you think of the svs pb--12?
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post #4 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 07:41 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harchetface9 View Post

I am having trouble deciding which is better.,im looking to use it for 70/30 movies/music. Which one has more bass and power? My budet is in the 500-800 dollar range.
And what is the difference?
My choice si far..
Svs pb--12
Super cube 2000
Super cube 4000
Also if you have any really good recommendations that,would be great

If you're going 70% movies you should get a ported PB 12.

Personally, I always go for a sub that's better for music, so I always chose sealed.
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post #5 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by harchetface9 View Post

What do you think of the svs pb--12?
Do you mean the PB 12 NSD? I have no personal experience with it, but it's a well regarded brand and the specs on it are excellent.

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post #6 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 08:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Do you mean the PB 12 NSD? I have no personal experience with it, but it's a well regarded brand and the specs on it are excellent


Yes. The pb-12 nsd. it does have some really great specs!
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post #7 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 09:19 AM
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does ported sub give more punch??
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post #8 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by jeremymak View Post

does ported sub give more punch??

Comparing similar driver and watts the ported will give more output around the tuning frequency. Some interpret this as more punch as a majority of your LFE is recorded around this tune; generally 20ish hz, give or take.

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post #9 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 09:59 AM
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could u pls kindly tell me what is 20ish Hz??
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post #10 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 10:11 AM
 
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I'd like to see that one explained also as what a subwoofer is tuned at is a designer choice as opposed to a reining standard and the LFE channel is mixed to THX reference but a sound track can have content well below 20Hz. So besides the lower octaves being somewhere around 20Hz (20ish) and subwoofers being tuned somewhere around 20Hz (20ish) what's with the lack of any coherent standard regarding the lower octaves......somewhere around 20ish Hz? tongue.gif

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post #11 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by jeremymak View Post

could u pls kindly tell me what is 20ish Hz??

20 Hz is a audio frequency and "ish" is slang and used in conjunction with another word to imply a small range, similar to the use of "plus or minus" (+/-).

In general humans can hear tones in the frequency range from 20 Hz to 20,000 Hz, it depends on the individual. So relating to subwoofers 20 Hz is that lowest frequency many can hear, anything lower will be felt as pressure (shaking walls/pictures).
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post #12 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 10:55 AM
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So yes it will have more punch, sound a little boomier, be a bit less accurate.

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post #13 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bass addict View Post

Comparing similar driver and watts the ported will give more output around the tuning frequency. Some interpret this as more punch as a majority of your LFE is recorded around this tune; generally 20ish hz, give or take.

The ported sub usually tends to be considerably larger as well. There are no free lunches. I spent considerably time modeling ported and sealed subs and there is no question that ported subs using the same driver had more output in the 20-30hz range or so, but this came at the expense of needing a much larger box (like almost twice the size vs sealed).

I had the choice of either building two larger ported enclosures or four sealed enclosures that were smaller. Output wise, when I modeled the four smaller sealed boxes against the larger ported ones, I was not giving up much at all and clearly I get a boost with having four sources in my big ass room vs only two sources.

So there are a variety of factors to consider, but if you have the space and WAF factor is not a concern, I say go ported. If you are dealing with WAF and space issues, sealed is often easier to place and you may end up being able to place more smaller sealed enclosures which opens up some options vs one or two large ported boxes.
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post #14 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Kamikaze13 View Post

So yes it will have more punch, sound a little boomier, be a bit less accurate.

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post #15 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13 View Post

So yes it will have more punch, sound a little boomier, be a bit less accurate.

I don't agree that ported = more boomier and less accurate. Look through the GTG threads. In blind testing hardly anyone could distinguish ported vs sealed builds.
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post #16 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremymak View Post

does ported sub give more punch??
Impossible to say, as there's no strict definition to what 'punch' is.
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Comparing similar driver and watts the ported will give more output around the tuning frequency.
Not necessarily. This is one of the abundant myths about sealed versus ported floating about. One can design sealed and ported enclosures that are indistinguishable from each other in their measured response and cannot be distinguished from each other in blind listening tests.
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So yes it will have more punch, sound a little boomier, be a bit less accurate.
Also myth. There's nothing inherent about vented cabs that makes them either boomy or inaccurate, and nothing inherent about sealed cabs that makes them less boomy or more accurate. One can design both vented and sealed cabs that are boomy and inaccurate, and one can design both vented and sealed cabs that are not boomy and are very accurate.

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post #17 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:22 AM
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Another case of a simple question gets turned into a mathematical equation.

I'm pretty sure he doesn't care about the numbers but simply wants to know what will give him the best bang (boom) for the buck.

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post #18 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:26 AM
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OP, how large is your room and what are your placement options?
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post #19 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13 View Post

Another case of a simple question gets turned into a mathematical equation.
I'm pretty sure he doesn't care about the numbers but simply wants to know what will give him the best bang (boom) for the buck.

How would you determine that without "the numbers"?
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post #20 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:53 AM
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The general consensus would be that for typical setups, for movie watching ported is the way to go and tends to be more boomy/have more output/more punch and for music sealed is preferred.

Spewing technical data just confuses the matter.

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post #21 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:57 AM
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I don't see how having correct information (vs. incorrect generalizations) confuses anything.
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post #22 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13 View Post

The general consensus would be that for typical setups, for movie watching ported is the way to go and tends to be more boomy/have more output/more punch and for music sealed is preferred.
Spewing technical data just confuses the matter.

You are making generalizations about sealed and ported subs which on a case by case basis are not always correct. Subwoofers need to be discussed based on the specific units involved, not categorically.

Your comment actually confuses the matter - technical specs are of great use when comparing subwoofers.
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post #23 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Impossible to say, as there's no strict definition to what 'punch' is.
Not necessarily. This is one of the abundant myths about sealed versus ported floating about. One can design sealed and ported enclosures that are indistinguishable from each other in their measured response and cannot be distinguished from each other in blind listening tests.

OK, let me rephrase. Every model I have put through isd has shown a significant advantage going to the ported setup around the tune area. I'm not saying you can't build an equally tuned sealed, but the general rule is all things being equal, the ported with exhibit greater output per given frequency than sealed.

That being said, I changed out from a dual ported cab to a multiple driver sealed setup.

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post #24 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:06 PM
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I agree general specs are definitely important and someone has to do the math somewhere but for someone who doesn't know what those even mean, going into waves and graphs can be mind boggling and confuse the situation even more. The guy wants to know which sub is best for his application not how it's made.

Anyways this is not what this thread is about and I guess I shouldn't have opened this can of worms so I'll bow out here.

Sorry if I offended anyone.

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post #25 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:13 PM
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A good can of worms if you ask me. The more info out there, the better.

Anyway, I'd add the PSA XV15 and XS15 to the list OP. Now, how big is that room?
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post #26 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by bass addict View Post

has shown a significant advantage going to the ported setup around the tune area.
.

But is that at the expense of frequencies NOT at the targeted port frequencies?

Anyone that used to own a highly tuned 2 stroke motorbike knows what I mean.

Oh my god, I just had an idea. A port tune with a veritable diameter port!
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post #27 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:27 PM - Thread Starter
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A good can of worms if you ask me. The more info out there, the better.
Anyway, I'd add the PSA XV15 and XS15 to the list OP. Now, how big is that room?

Room size is 16x11 with ft celing.
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post #28 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Room size is 16x11 with 8ft celing.
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post #29 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by harchetface9 View Post

Room size is 16x11 with 8 ft celing.

PB-12 NSD or an XV15 would likely do the trick quite well. Is this an open floor plan, or is the room sealed?
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post #30 of 35 Old 01-08-2013, 12:46 PM
 
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Originally Posted by leninGHOLA View Post

I don't see how having correct information (vs. incorrect generalizations) confuses anything.

Apparently you just don't understand. tongue.gif

The average IQ is 100, which means, some people don't or can't comprehend complex series of numbers nor do they have the time or inclination to educate themselves on every subject they're not up to speed on. If it were easy, they wouldn't need you. Soooooo, in order for it all to work, one has to do the thinking for them and then give them an answer they can intellectually digest; expert vs layperson.

And then again, some people are unable to live in the world of generalities where the layperson lives. It's all relative. Sometime, ya just have to dumb it down in order to be understood.

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