Why are my subs doing this? Clipping issue? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 04-27-2013, 05:23 PM - Thread Starter
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I am running 2 15 inch kickers and a crunch 1600 watt amp. I was running one 15 for a while and it sounded great. I recently added the second one and it ruined the system. I am not getting no where near the output i was getting from the one 15 i had because whenever the subs start to hit there is a loud buzzing noise, which i guess is clipping. I have swapped out all wires, constantly messing with the gain and settings (always keeping the bass booster off) and as soon as the subs start to hit, the noise starts. Any suggestions?
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post #2 of 24 Old 04-27-2013, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by littledeed View Post

Any suggestions?
Post your question on a car audio forum.

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post #3 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 07:29 AM
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Is the buzzing coming from the newly added sub? Disconnect one of the subs then the other one and see if the buzzing persists with either sub running alone.
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post #4 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Is the buzzing coming from the newly added sub? Disconnect one of the subs then the other one and see if the buzzing persists with either sub running alone.

I have ran each sub by their-self and it seems the problem only starts when i run them together. If it were the newly added sub, what do you think could be the problem?
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post #5 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 09:28 AM
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Make sure the subs are wired in phase. If it sounds louder with one playing versus 2, that's your culprit with your output issue, at least. Start with that.
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post #6 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littledeed View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe0Bloggs View Post

Is the buzzing coming from the newly added sub? Disconnect one of the subs then the other one and see if the buzzing persists with either sub running alone.

I have ran each sub by their-self and it seems the problem only starts when i run them together. If it were the newly added sub, what do you think could be the problem?

Your amp has 4 distinct amps inside of it. That gives you a number of options for hooking the speakers up. Which one are you using?
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post #7 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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On the back of each sub woofer I have 2 positives, and 2 negatives. I am running positive to positive, negative to negative. Then positive and negative out to the amp.
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post #8 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by littledeed View Post

On the back of each sub woofer I have 2 positives, and 2 negatives. I am running positive to positive, negative to negative. Then positive and negative out to the amp.

Aren't there 4 positives and 4 positives on the amp?
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post #9 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 10:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Aren't there 4 positives and 4 positives on the amp?
No, its a 2 channel amp. 2 positives and 2 negatives.
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post #10 of 24 Old 04-28-2013, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littledeed View Post

On the back of each sub woofer I have 2 positives, and 2 negatives. I am running positive to positive, negative to negative. Then positive and negative out to the amp.

This doesn't sound correct...

How were you wiring it with one sub only?

Edit: so you have a 2 channel (2 positive 2 negative) amp trying to drive two passive subs with stereo inputs?

Why a passive sub would have stereo inputs in the first place is beyond me though...
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post #11 of 24 Old 04-29-2013, 05:07 PM
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I would check the polarity first. If one speaker is internally in the opposite polarity, they're subtracting from each other. search for battery test.

Sounds like the drivers themselves have dual voice coils. If you're going parallell between the two coils on each driver and parallel between the two you might be presenting too low an impedance for the amp to drive well (one ohm, potentially)
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post #12 of 24 Old 04-29-2013, 06:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe0Bloggs View Post

This doesn't sound correct...

How were you wiring it with one sub only?

Edit: so you have a 2 channel (2 positive 2 negative) amp trying to drive two passive subs with stereo inputs?

Why a passive sub would have stereo inputs in the first place is beyond me though...
Correct, 2 channel amp and both of the subs are wired the same way, out to the amp.
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post #13 of 24 Old 04-29-2013, 06:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by JHAz View Post

I would check the polarity first. If one speaker is internally in the opposite polarity, they're subtracting from each other. search for battery test.

Sounds like the drivers themselves have dual voice coils. If you're going parallell between the two coils on each driver and parallel between the two you might be presenting too low an impedance for the amp to drive well (one ohm, potentially)
How could I wire the subs to a achieve a higher impedance?
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post #14 of 24 Old 04-30-2013, 01:32 AM
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You could wire the two drivers in each sub in series instead of in parallel, wire from the negative on one pair of terminals on the sub to the positive on the other pair. Then connect the remaining two positive and negative posts to the amp. Do not wire the positive posts or negative posts together anymore or there will be a short.
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post #15 of 24 Old 04-30-2013, 11:17 AM
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Yeah, sounds like those subs have dual voice coils, which can handle one amp each, or you can wire each voice coil in parellel or series, which will change the total impedance of the driver that the amp is trying to drive. This is very important because you can sizzle your amp if it can't handle low impedance levels.
You have to figure out how to use jumpers on each woofer AND how to wire both of them (in series or parellel) to your amp, and whether or not the amp will be bridged or not.
Sorry I can't answer your question because I have done this application myself, but at least you know WHAT you have to figure out and what questions to ask in a car audio forum.
Here is a LINK with some pictures of a DVC (Dual Voice Coil) sub with jumpers for parallel and series setups: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1408179/head-unit-2-amps-sub-wiring-help-needed

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post #16 of 24 Old 04-30-2013, 05:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by caper_1 View Post

Yeah, sounds like those subs have dual voice coils, which can handle one amp each, or you can wire each voice coil in parellel or series, which will change the total impedance of the driver that the amp is trying to drive. This is very important because you can sizzle your amp if it can't handle low impedance levels.
You have to figure out how to use jumpers on each woofer AND how to wire both of them (in series or parellel) to your amp, and whether or not the amp will be bridged or not.
Sorry I can't answer your question because I have done this application myself, but at least you know WHAT you have to figure out and what questions to ask in a car audio forum.
Here is a LINK with some pictures of a DVC (Dual Voice Coil) sub with jumpers for parallel and series setups: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1408179/head-unit-2-amps-sub-wiring-help-needed
They are dual voice coil sub woofers. Would parallel or series be a better set up? Could you provide a diagram of the final wiring? I am very new to this, and am not a visual person. Thanks for the link, checking it out now.
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post #17 of 24 Old 04-30-2013, 05:21 PM - Thread Starter
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This is how crutch field is saying how to wire them. Would this be series or parallel wiring? http://a248.e.akamai.net/pix.crutchfield.com/ca/learningcenter/car/subwoofer_wiring/2DVC_4-ohm_2ch-br.jpg
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post #18 of 24 Old 05-01-2013, 07:40 AM
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I told that I didn't know, (I really don't have time to find out either, that is your job wink.gif )
Sorry I can't help more. All I can tell you is what you need to find out (my previous post). Try some car audio forums, and ask those guys.
As for that diagram:
Each sub has 2 voice coils, which are wired in series
The sub's themselves are wired to the amp in parallel
The amplifier is in bridged mode (both amps are combined into a single [mono] output)

***The "bridged" wire, is simply a "jumper cable". Bridged is a poor term used in this application

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post #19 of 24 Old 05-01-2013, 08:13 AM
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This is the circuit diagram that you posted:
16jkf2u.jpg
Assuming 4 ohm voice coils, when in series, we add resitance: Rt = R1 + R2
So Rt for Sub 1 & 2 = 4 +4 = 8
Sub 1 = 8 ohms
Sub 2 = 8 ohms

The resistance of the whole circuit, which is wired in parellel, is:
1/Rt = 1/R1 + 1/R2
So
1/Rt = 1/Rsub1 + 1/Rsub2 = 1/8 + 1/8 = 2/8 = 1/4
If 1/Rt = 1/4, then Rt = 4 ohms.
The total resistance of the circuit would be 4 ohms, IF each voice coil is 4 ohms, when wired in this fashion. That is what the amp will see.
Therefore, you require an amp that can handle this load.

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post #20 of 24 Old 05-01-2013, 09:53 AM
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Series connection would amp positive output to coil 1 positve; coil 1 negative to coil 2 positive; coil 2 negative to amp negative.
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post #21 of 24 Old 05-01-2013, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by littledeed View Post

This is how crutch field is saying how to wire them. Would this be series or parallel wiring? http://a248.e.akamai.net/pix.crutchfield.com/ca/learningcenter/car/subwoofer_wiring/2DVC_4-ohm_2ch-br.jpg

It would be the two voice coils in each sub wired in series, then the two subs wired in parallel to the amp. Like the diagram caper posted. The amp would see the same resistance as one of the voice coils.

Remember to set your amp to bridged mode first.
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post #22 of 24 Old 05-02-2013, 05:41 AM
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In my circuit diagram, the results would hold true if you wired each sub with a jumper (The center 2 posts are "jumpered". The 2 black wires on the outside terminals go to the positive and negative on the amp, and are both black because I ran out of red cable, so technically, one should be red, but color doesnt matter if you know what you are doing!) like this:

dc32a559_vbattach245447.jpeg

So, say the current flows from the amp, on the very right wire, to the right-most terminal(red). Then it flows inside the driver to the first voice coil, then returns on the next terminal to the left(black) Then, it would go across the jumper, to the 3rd terminal from the right(red) to the second voice coil and return out on the last terminal (leftmost, black) back to the amp. This is "series" because the current has only one path and goes to each "item" in sequence or 'series'. Hope this help with what is going on.

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post #23 of 24 Old 05-02-2013, 06:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the replies and suggestions everyone. My problem seemed to be in the wiring. I rewired it following the diagram I posted from crutchfield and it sounds great now.
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post #24 of 24 Old 05-07-2013, 12:34 PM
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sweet. Glad to hear it worked out. Now ENJOY some sweet BASS !! I still have to register my car and change the oil before I can take it out now that winter is finally gone for good and it is starting to warm up around here.

HT: Yamaha RX-V565 | 3 X Energy Take FPS, 2 X VS Surround, 2 X Take LCR | DIY Subs: SDX12 APR15 & TRIO12 Dual APR 12's | 47" LCD

Music: Yamaha RX-V863 | 2 X Energy RC-70 | MA RXw12 Sub

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Car: Sony Xplod HU, Xplod 6X9s, Kenwood 4"s, Alpine 12" Type-S, Rockford Amp,...

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