BIC F-12? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 09:38 PM - Thread Starter
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About to jump the gun on Amazon for $200...any final words of wisdom or hidden deals I should consider?

Denon AVR 3312ci--Samsung pn51e7000--Klipsch RC-62 II--2 Klipsch RF-82 II--Polk fxi-a4 surrounds--Panasonic DMP-BDT300--Xbox 360--PS3--Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC with TWC--2 Dayton sub 1200's
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post #2 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 09:50 PM
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More options:
Dayton Sub 1200: cheaper and probably close in performance.
Bic Venturi cheaper and probably very close performance.
Nxg subs Little more expensive maybe slightly better.
Premier Acoustics subs Pa 10 Compact, stylish likely similar performance and same price.

No bad choices here that I know of.
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post #3 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 09:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mik James View Post

More options:
Dayton Sub 1200: cheaper and probably close in performance.
Bic Venturi cheaper and probably very close performance.
Nxg subs Little more expensive maybe slightly better.
Premier Acoustics subs Pa 10 Compact, stylish likely similar performance and same price.

No bad choices here that I know of.

Thanks a lot. Compared to what I have I think it would be hard to go wrong. I really wanted the rw-12d but I missed out on the newegg deal.

Denon AVR 3312ci--Samsung pn51e7000--Klipsch RC-62 II--2 Klipsch RF-82 II--Polk fxi-a4 surrounds--Panasonic DMP-BDT300--Xbox 360--PS3--Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC with TWC--2 Dayton sub 1200's
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post #4 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 09:57 PM
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If you have 300$ (I think that's around the newegg deal price for the Klipsch) you might consider the Bic PL-200 and the Premier Acoustic Pa-120 to get close to that level of performance.
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post #5 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 10:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mik James View Post

If you have 300$ (I think that's around the newegg deal price for the Klipsch) you might consider the Bic PL-200 and the Premier Acoustic Pa-120 to get close to that level of performance.

I was considering the PL-200 as well. I was concerned that the RMS on the F-12 was a little low, but heard it was better than higher wattage counterparts such as the the polk 505 and JBL es250.

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post #6 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 10:18 PM
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For the F12 vs the Psw505 it seems to depend on who you ask: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1372356/bic-f12-or-psw505

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1459548/polk-psw505-vs-bic-f12-spl-and-clarity-below-30hz

As far as wattage goes 100 watts difference between the f12 and pl-200 is somewhere between 2-3db louder all things being equal. Unfortunately things aren't usually equal and the efficiency spec is more of a tell of overall volume. A few decibels difference on the efficiency spec is a few decibels more spl where as it takes 2x the wattage to add 3db and 10x the wattage to double the volume.
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post #7 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 10:27 PM
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If you are located at ny area I am selling my klipsch rw12d for local pick up only. I'm buying another Dayton 1200.

Panasonic 60VT60
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post #8 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 10:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah the 505 is 229.99 and I really have to make a choice. I have a polk currently and agree that mine follows the "underpowered" polk stereotype. I can't argue what some have said about the 505 being clear though. I am primarily a gamer/HT/TV user (music is of little concern to me) and I would rather see the performance matter in an HT setting.

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post #9 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 10:33 PM - Thread Starter
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I moved out of theNY area very recently....darn. I am interested if you decide to change your mind and ship. Thanks.

Denon AVR 3312ci--Samsung pn51e7000--Klipsch RC-62 II--2 Klipsch RF-82 II--Polk fxi-a4 surrounds--Panasonic DMP-BDT300--Xbox 360--PS3--Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC with TWC--2 Dayton sub 1200's
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post #10 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 11:05 PM
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2 Dayton Sub 1000's or even Sub 1200's would be another option for you.

200$ for a pair of 1000's and 260$ for a pair of 1200's, unfortunately they don't get mentioned much by the budget sub reviewers on avs so it would be hard to say exactly how well they stack up to the Bics.
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post #11 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 11:10 PM
 
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Heard the BIC and own the 1200 (sister owns actually wink.gif ) and dollar for dollar, the 1200 bests the BIC with its BS claims of 'Peak' power quadruple what the RMS is...rolleyes.gif
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post #12 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 11:10 PM
 
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Quadruple distortion is what it really is.
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post #13 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 11:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mik James View Post

2 Dayton Sub 1000's or even Sub 1200's would be another option for you.

200$ for a pair of 1000's and 260$ for a pair of 1200's, unfortunately they don't get mentioned much by the budget sub reviewers on avs so it would be hard to say exactly how well they stack up to the Bics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

Heard the BIC and own the 1200 (sister owns actually wink.gif ) and dollar for dollar, the 1200 bests the BIC with its BS claims of 'Peak' power quadruple what the RMS is...rolleyes.gif

Interesting. I mean I don't have the room for 2 to set-up perfectly, but that doesn't mean I cant get 2 now and wait it out. I want to make a choice I won't be regretting while watching some more action packed blu-rays. I also know that with my budget I can't go crazy, and even if I spend 250 now and save I can still enjoy a sub (or pair) for this money.

Denon AVR 3312ci--Samsung pn51e7000--Klipsch RC-62 II--2 Klipsch RF-82 II--Polk fxi-a4 surrounds--Panasonic DMP-BDT300--Xbox 360--PS3--Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC with TWC--2 Dayton sub 1200's
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post #14 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

Heard the BIC and own the 1200 (sister owns actually wink.gif ) and dollar for dollar, the 1200 bests the BIC with its BS claims of 'Peak' power quadruple what the RMS is...rolleyes.gif

Um rolleyes.gif the rms power of 120 watts is published on the page and I see no sign of this Peak power figure you mention: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-629

And no other company ever publishes specs like that biggrin.gif
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-15h.html
Power rating for the HSU Vtf15h as seen at the bottom of the product page in the link above.
"Amplifier Power (RMS) 1400 W Short Term, 350 W Continuous"

Hmmm what's 350x4, my math is a little fuzzy wink.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

Quadruple distortion is what it really is.

Now, if you want to talk about this distortion in more detail, describing the respective output of each subwoofer before distortion, the depth/extension that each achieves, and the general quality of sound i'm sure that would be more helpful information.

EDIT: Unless of course I read your post wrong and you we're actually talking about the Bics "Peak" power, in which case I would owe you an apology tongue.gif

In any case the Bics peak is only listed as 475 with an rms of 150 clearly listed in the specs as is common practice among speaker manufacturers. If they only listed peak power then that would certianly make them dishonest, but that's not the case.
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post #15 of 19 Old 05-27-2013, 11:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mik James View Post

Um rolleyes.gif the rms power of 120 watts is published on the page and I see no sign of this Peak power figure you mention: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=300-629

And no other company ever publishes specs like that biggrin.gif
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-15h.html
Power rating for the HSU Vtf15h as seen at the bottom of the product page in the link above.
"Amplifier Power (RMS) 1400 W Short Term, 350 W Continuous"

Hmmm what's 350x4, my math is a little fuzzy wink.gif
Now, if you want to talk about this distortion in more detail, describing the respective output of each subwoofer before distortion, the depth/extension that each achieves, and the general quality of sound i'm sure that would be more helpful information.

EDIT: Unless of course I read your post wrong and you we're actually talking about the Bics "Peak" power, in which case I would owe you an apology tongue.gif

In any case the Bics peak is only listed as 475 with an rms of 150 clearly listed in the specs as is common practice among speaker manufacturers. If they only listed peak power then that would certianly make them dishonest, but that's not the case.

I am having a hard time find the peak for the Dayton sub-1200...but right now I am probably going to get 2 1200's and just make some space for the both of them.

Denon AVR 3312ci--Samsung pn51e7000--Klipsch RC-62 II--2 Klipsch RF-82 II--Polk fxi-a4 surrounds--Panasonic DMP-BDT300--Xbox 360--PS3--Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC with TWC--2 Dayton sub 1200's
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post #16 of 19 Old 05-28-2013, 08:45 AM
 
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The ONLY reason to post peak specs for an amp is to give it the illusion of being more capable than it really is...
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post #17 of 19 Old 05-28-2013, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avthokie View Post

I am having a hard time find the peak for the Dayton sub-1200...but right now I am probably going to get 2 1200's and just make some space for the both of them.

A very cost effective choice in my opinion, as long as you don't care about aesthetics and space 2 1200's should walk all over 1 Bic f 12 for only 25% more money.

And don't worry about power ratings so much, they are only 30 watts apart if they we're both measured exactly the same (unlikely) and one of them could be at least a few decibels more efficient than the other.
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post #18 of 19 Old 05-28-2013, 07:00 PM - Thread Starter
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A very cost effective choice in my opinion, as long as you don't care about aesthetics and space 2 1200's should walk all over 1 Bic f 12 for only 25% more money.

And don't worry about power ratings so much, they are only 30 watts apart if they we're both measured exactly the same (unlikely) and one of them could be at least a few decibels more efficient than the other.

I appreciate the help! I am excited about the set-up now. I have heard very good things from the small amount of reviews out there are on the Daytons. They most likely will be hidden from direct sight so i am not too worried about aesthetics, and my speakers are all similar color so it will go together. Again, thanks a lot. I will post some final pics when I am done.

Denon AVR 3312ci--Samsung pn51e7000--Klipsch RC-62 II--2 Klipsch RF-82 II--Polk fxi-a4 surrounds--Panasonic DMP-BDT300--Xbox 360--PS3--Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HDC with TWC--2 Dayton sub 1200's
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post #19 of 19 Old 05-29-2013, 07:59 AM
 
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The looks of the 1200 are nice. Rounded corners...folks just are not used to the round grill (saves costs on materials) is all. They are indeed VERY nice looking! cool.gif
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