PSA XV30f or SVS PC13 Ultra or Rythmik FV15HP? - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 07:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Mini-Wheat View Post

I keep hearing how low the FV15HP will go. I am not one for fiddling around with the ports in any sub and would leave them all open always with the basic recommended settings. I am lazy and just want to hook it up and enjoy. With that being said, Will the FV15HP now outperform the XV30F or dual XV15's? If not, then the PSA American built sub looks even better.
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Yes, it will definitely outperform the XV30F. Dual XV15's would be a close one. They would definitely hang I think in output 20hz and above, but will not have the extension or output of the Rythmik below that point. Just my 2 cents.......

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Infinity P363's, PC351, P153's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #62 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post

Yes, it will definitely outperform the XV30F. Dual XV15's would be a close one. They would definitely hang I think in output 20hz and above, but will not have the extension or output of the Rythmik below that point. Just my 2 cents.......

True if you are putting the FV15HP in 1 port, but then you are trying to force massive amounts of air thru a 3.5" port. Physics show that at some point port compression will be a issue. Several have stated Port noise is not a issue and its probably not for most because they do not run the sub up near its limits or have more then 1 FV15. However at the last few db the FV15 puts out, more then likely there is a significant amount of port noise along with it in 1port mode.

That being said I would go with the Rythmik if one has a eye on purchasing a second down the road. If that is not the case then get dual XV15's for the benifit of smoothing the bass response.
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post #63 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 08:24 AM
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I myself would get two XV15's over a single FV15HP, but if planning to get a second FV15HP down the road then it's a no brainer.

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Infinity P363's, PC351, P153's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #64 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 08:32 AM
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Man, you are making this hard for me(thanks). So two good subs is better than one great sub. Just prior to your last post I pretty much decided to just go with the PB13ULTRA and be done with it. I have till summer to make a final decision since I am overseas anyway.

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post #65 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 08:41 AM
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Any particular reason why you are leaning more towards the ultra over the rythmik? Just asking because it comes with a pretty hefty increase in price, but yet the rythmik can hang with it and best it in some areas. Both are fantastic subs don't get me wrong.

Receiver - Denon 4311CI
Speakers - Infinity P363's, PC351, P153's
Subs - Rythmik FV15HP's
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post #66 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 08:57 AM
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I've seen PB13 ultras go for 1600-1700 in the outlet store. As a matter of fact, I just picked up a panio black PB13ultra in that range to be delivered tomorrow. I considered duals and may upgrade in the future. The problem with getting two subs "good" subs is that I need room in my life to long/want for something else. In this case, another PB13 Ultra. Anything less and I would feel like I shorted myself. This may not make sense to anyone but me, but it works out in my head.

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post #67 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 12:23 PM
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I am under the impression that distortion is the key difference between the two and maybe some other small details. A person with far more knowledge than myself responded to one of my posts somewhere stating this. Anyway, I have a couple of months before I actually buy.

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post #68 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mini-Wheat View Post

I am under the impression that distortion is the key difference between the two and maybe some other small details. A person with far more knowledge than myself responded to one of my posts somewhere stating this. Anyway, I have a couple of months before I actually buy.

Distortion is a big player but keep in mind all subs mentioned will have even less thd when placed in room compared to what they tested 2m open ground plane. Also Cea2010 does not register port noise or mechanical distress, which are far more offensive then 2nd and 3rd order harmonics.
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post #69 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 04:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post

Distortion is a big player but keep in mind all subs mentioned will have even less thd when placed in room compared to what they tested 2m open ground plane. Also Cea2010 does not register port noise or mechanical distress, which are far more offensive then 2nd and 3rd order harmonics.

If a sub is running into mechanical noise, the THD is likely to be very high at that point, so that is kind of moot. Also, ports do generate THD, which may be quite high at the point the subs run into chuffing as well. CEA certainly has its limitations, but I don't think mechanical noise and chuffing are the main limitations of CEA.
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post #70 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by shadyJ View Post

If a sub is running into mechanical noise, the THD is likely to be very high at that point, so that is kind of moot. Also, ports do generate THD, which may be quite high at the point the subs run into chuffing as well. CEA certainly has its limitations, but I don't think mechanical noise and chuffing are the main limitations of CEA.

Instead of consistently trying to argue, why don't YOU start your own site and begin testing subs. I am just passing on what Ricci has stated. smile.gif
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post #71 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post

Distortion is a big player but keep in mind all subs mentioned will have even less thd when placed in room compared to what they tested 2m open ground plane. Also Cea2010 does not register port noise or mechanical distress, which are far more offensive then 2nd and 3rd order harmonics.
THD is the presence of anything in the playback not present in the original signal, so that would include port noise and 'mechanical distress'. The measurement mic can't tell the source of spurious content, so anything that is there that shouldn't be will get lumped in with the actual harmonics. As for indoors versus out, THD is directly related to power input. If you test outdoors at maximum power the THD will be less than playing the sub indoors at lower levels. But if you play indoors at full power THD will be the same as outdoors at full power.

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post #72 of 74 Old 03-11-2014, 08:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

THD is the presence of anything in the playback not present in the original signal, so that would include port noise and 'mechanical distress'. The measurement mic can't tell the source of spurious content, so anything that is there that shouldn't be will get lumped in with the actual harmonics. As for indoors versus out, THD is directly related to power input. If you test outdoors at maximum power the THD will be less than playing the sub indoors at lower levels. But if you play indoors at full power THD will be the same as outdoors at full power.

I appreciate the explanation!

From my understanding when you place the sub in room you gain output from boundry reinforcement. Therefore in theory you should be able to reach the 2m rms max burst numbers with less thd because the sub does not have to work as hard to get there? Also what you and shady said about port and mechanical noise being grouped into thd makes sense. I was just relaying what Ricci posted in the know-how tab over at data-bass.com.

Here is part of Ricci's explanation in #9 of the know-how tab over at data-bass.com


Also many systems may sound ok while failing the distortion thresholds while another sounds very bad and overdriven while passing. This is because when driven to their limits some units exhibit otehr overload noises or bad sounds that are not harmonically related to the signal input into the subwoofer. These types of sounds are far more audible and offensive than any harmonic related output as these rattles, buzzes, clacks, pops and other artifacts do not blend in with the sound at all and are obviously non-harmonically related to the output at all and typically are a wider bandwidth mechanical sounding noise that is higher in frequency. The CEA-2010 program will sometimes pick these up but not always.
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post #73 of 74 Old 03-12-2014, 07:50 AM
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My advice go which ever subs you feel you will like best. They are all good stubs that should be very good.

ShaunH
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post #74 of 74 Old 03-12-2014, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post

From my understanding when you place the sub in room you gain output from boundry reinforcement. Therefore in theory you should be able to reach the 2m rms max burst numbers with less thd because the sub does not have to work as hard to get there?
Indoors versus outdoors you will reach the same dB output with no more than half the voltage input, which translates to half the cone excursion and therefore much lower THD.

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