Thin 35+ ft subwoofer cable - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 11:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Does anyone know where I can buy a 35 foot or longer thin sub cable? Something like this http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021810&p_id=655&seq=1&format=2
I bought the more premium mono price cable but its thick and for my parents living room and mom does not approve. It's going under the carpet. Also the cable will be running next to the surround speaker wire so some shielding is probably useful. My parents don't really k ow any better so thinness and length are the most important
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post #2 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 02:48 PM
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Monoprice's Redmere cables are about as thin as you're going to get.
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post #3 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by eljaycanuck View Post

Monoprice's Redmere cables are about as thin as you're going to get.
Haven't seen very many subwoofers that take HDMI.
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post #4 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by crn3371 View Post

Haven't seen very many subwoofers that take HDMI.

Lol.

Can you use the hi level input instead. This way you can run flat speaker wire which would be very discrete and hide easily.

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post #5 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 04:30 PM
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Lol.

Can you use the hi level input instead.
Not from the LFE output.

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post #6 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 09:23 PM
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Haven't seen very many subwoofers that take HDMI.
I misread, and I screwed up. I am appropriately chagrined. redface.gif
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post #7 of 28 Old 07-06-2013, 10:27 PM
 
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Unless you are running along power wires, you do not need a shielded cable. As for running it under the carpet, do not advise. Same reason you do not run power cables under the carpet. The only place you should be running the wires is either down through the wall into the attic and across, or into a crawl space or basement across to the other side of the room where the subwoofer is, or along the baseboard below it and where the carpet is.

You can use RG-6 for the Subwoofer with RCA ends, or i using a sub off an amp, #16 will do fine at that distance, which you can get as CL-2 jacketed either in white or black, and run again below the baseboard where the carpet and base meets.
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post #8 of 28 Old 07-07-2013, 06:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ardothewan View Post

Does anyone know where I can buy a 35 foot or longer thin sub cable? Something like this http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10218&cs_id=1021810&p_id=655&seq=1&format=2
I bought the more premium mono price cable but its thick and for my parents living room and mom does not approve. It's going under the carpet. Also the cable will be running next to the surround speaker wire so some shielding is probably useful. My parents don't really k ow any better so thinness and length are the most important

There should be no problem using really thin RCA cables like this one:

http://www.cablesondemand.com/category/SINGLERCA/product/AV-THLIN2RCAM/URvars/Items/Library/InfoManage/AV-THLIN2RCAM.htm

The entire 35 foot cable is probably not going to be under the carpet, so you may only need 25' of thin cable with 3-6' extensions at each end. The extensions expose you to the lengths of cable separating at the connectors, but you can make things more permanent with heat shrink tubing.
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post #9 of 28 Old 07-07-2013, 09:22 AM - Thread Starter
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post #10 of 28 Old 07-08-2013, 12:55 PM
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Um using 10 meters long Chord Crimson Plus subwoofer cable from Chord UK. It is thin, very flexible, and the best cable I've used so far.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/CHORD-CRIMSON-SUBWOOFER-INTERCONNECT-METRES/dp/B005K2UJ6I

I don't know if it is available in the US or not.

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post #11 of 28 Old 07-09-2013, 08:50 AM
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You could always go wireless.
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post #12 of 28 Old 07-09-2013, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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They have wireless things for subs? Is the quality/price ok?
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post #13 of 28 Old 07-09-2013, 10:52 AM
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Yes, they have wireless for subs. While wireless solutions for speakers seem to be not quite ready for prime time, it seems that wireless for subs might be ready. At the low end there's the Rocketfish wireless sub kit that goes for about $69. Pretty sure Outlaw, and maybe SVS also have wireless. Hsu has a wireless sub, but I don't believe they offer a seperate wireless kit.
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post #14 of 28 Old 07-10-2013, 02:09 PM
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You can also try the Wireworld Terra subwoofer cable.
http://www.wireworldcable.com/products/111.html

It is shielded and quite thin. The longest is 8m (about 26ft) for $35. So you still need an extension RCA cable. Though it is thin enough to be hidden under carpet, I would recommend you to hide it under the baseboard. I broke the cable when trying to pull it under the carpet with a fish tape.
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post #15 of 28 Old 07-11-2013, 12:00 PM
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You can get something like this and put F to RCA adapters on the ends:
http://www.amazon.com/Cables-Go-29123-Velocity-Mini-Coax/dp/B0002J2BBU

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post #16 of 28 Old 07-12-2013, 12:08 PM
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Coax cables with 'F' connectors are often optimized for the 50 MHz to 1GHz frequency range. Not exactly audio cable.

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post #17 of 28 Old 07-12-2013, 12:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post

Coax cables with 'F' connectors are often optimized for the 50 MHz to 1GHz frequency range. Not exactly audio cable.
Used all the time for component hookup with no problems. If you look at the heavy duty monoprice, they are RG-6 with RCA ends
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post #18 of 28 Old 07-12-2013, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

Used all the time for component hookup with no problems. If you look at the heavy duty monoprice, they are RG-6 with RCA ends

The referenced:
http://www.amazon.com/Cables-Go-29123-Velocity-Mini-Coax/dp/B0002J2BBU
is not RG-6.

Sure, a copper plated steel center conductor is a good choice for audio.
Sure, poor low frequency shielding is a good choice for audio.
Sure, high end to end shield resistance is good for audio.

But at least you are not one of those audiophiles that claims every interconnect sounds different.

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post #19 of 28 Old 07-12-2013, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post

Coax cables with 'F' connectors are often optimized for the 50 MHz to 1GHz frequency range. Not exactly audio cable.
Any cable that will work well to the GHz range has no difficulty handling a 20kHz bandwidth. The main reason RG cables work well to GHz is their low capacitance, which is also desirable for audio cables. The fact of the matter is that most of the selling claims made for high priced cables are for properties that are important in the radio frequencies, but are totally irrelevant where audio is concerned.

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post #20 of 28 Old 07-12-2013, 11:48 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post

The referenced:
http://www.amazon.com/Cables-Go-29123-Velocity-Mini-Coax/dp/B0002J2BBU
is not RG-6.

Sure, a copper plated steel center conductor is a good choice for audio.
Sure, poor low frequency shielding is a good choice for audio.
Sure, high end to end shield resistance is good for audio.

But at least you are not one of those audiophiles that claims every interconnect sounds different.
It is a RG-59 or RG-6/u most likely. All cables in these Component bundles are RG-59 & RG-6/U http://www.monoprice.com/products/subdepartment.asp?c_id=102&cp_id=10235 Any Digital audio cable out there is going to be RG-6/u. BTW, 50 Ohm Coax is RG-58, previously used for Thinnet or Token-Ring networking setup http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RG-58 Not a good choice for audio or video, same goes for RG-11 or RG-8. The later is a different topic, but had to add that, since the mistake of stating that coax cable is 50 ohm, but not stated which one was being talked about.

Personally if I was doing it, I would pull one run of Coax for OTA, two Cat-5e or Cat-6 (one for networking, one for hdmi), two runs of RG-6 for audio if hanging a sound bar also if not always going to use the home theater. Run everything back to a closet for the equipment, or rack in a cabinet, if the equipment is going to be next to where the tv is, but say bookshelves on either side.

Octopus cable is best to be used in these situations, since it is a one cable pull, so that you are not having to deal with multiple boxes or spools of cable and having to tape the lines at so many feet, to keep the bundle neat and tight, while pulling through Smurf tube vs. conduit. Only time I would use conduit, is if required for fire reasons between floors, and then having to use either "monkey poop, which is like Plumbers putty, that is used for fire stop, or Big stuff fire stop at the end, if the run goes between multiple floors of the structure.

Now the even better thing to do, if you are hanging the flat panel up, is place a panel of 1/2" or 3/4" plywood painted behind the tv, that is attached by screws, so that you can remove it if you ever have to redo or add to the wires for some reason down the road, if you did not use Smurf tube or Conduit for the pull.

No one really knows what the future will hold, but we all know that Copper is still here to stay for a long time down the road, but now we are seeing Consumer network switches with Fiber Backhaul finally coming down in price (Netgear GS110 8 10/100/1000 ethernet ports, POE & 2x2GB Fiber interconnect) around $130. That adds to the fact, that it would add to a reason pulling Fiber at the a/v equipment location if you do go with one of these switches at that point for gear and the ethernet connect where the flat panel is hung up.

I may be actually getting two of the Netgear GS110's, so that I would not only be future proofed at this time for the future, but also so I can move my network to the next step for media streaming, and relieve some of the congestion off of the backhaul between the upstairs switch that has a A/P on it, to the downstairs switch that is handling everything going to the router.
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post #21 of 28 Old 07-13-2013, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

No one really knows what the future will hold, but we all know that Copper is still here to stay for a long time down the road,
Probably not, and it won't be replaced by another material but by radio waves. The time is not all that far off when we'll see all wireless connections.

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post #22 of 28 Old 07-13-2013, 06:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

No one really knows what the future will hold, but we all know that Copper is still here to stay for a long time down the road,
Probably not, and it won't be replaced by another material but by radio waves. The time is not all that far off when we'll see all wireless connections.

It appears that subwoofers with wireless links are already here. I haven't seen any customer experiences, but based on the SQ of my Sennheiser RS 170 wireless headphones, there should be no SQ problems if its done right.

The problem with wireless speakers is that you still need to run a power cord.

I think that people would get some added value from a system that was based on a bus cable that carries both power (at a non-lethal voltage) and signal. You run the bus cable around the room, position the speakers which may be identical other than the subwoofer, clamp the bus cable onto the back of each speaker, and tell each speaker what role to play with a switch on its back side. The line voltage power supply would be centralized and therefore have minimal cost for whatever capacity it needed to have.
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post #23 of 28 Old 07-13-2013, 07:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

Used all the time for component hookup with no problems. If you look at the heavy duty monoprice, they are RG-6 with RCA ends

The referenced:
http://www.amazon.com/Cables-Go-29123-Velocity-Mini-Coax/dp/B0002J2BBU
is not RG-6.

Sure, a copper plated steel center conductor is a good choice for audio.

Copperweld is usually half steel, half copper and 20-24 gauge. Not a problem for line level signals. So 20 gauge copperweld actually has more copper than the common 24 gauge pure copper that we use with a smile. I've ne er seen conductivity be an issue with line level signals over typical household distances.
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Sure, poor low frequency shielding is a good choice for audio.

If you try it, you may be surprised how well unshielded wire works. Usual rule of thumb is that shielding only makes a practical difference above 10 KHz, which means that it doesn't make a big difference for audio.
Quote:
Sure, high end to end shield resistance is good for audio.

My real world tests find that the seemingly flakey aluminum foil mylar shielding on coax doesn't cause a problem.

Yup, it looks and seems to be scary.
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post #24 of 28 Old 07-13-2013, 11:12 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Fitzmaurice View Post

Probably not, and it won't be replaced by another material but by radio waves. The time is not all that far off when we'll see all wireless connections.
The Vizio soundbar I have, has a wireless sub, and works fine. Wireless speakers and headphones have been around for years. As for wirelesss, it is too slow and also can be compromised or go down for backhauls.

Only two best ways to do network backhaul is Microwave or Fiber, with Fiber being the better.
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post #25 of 28 Old 07-13-2013, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

As for wirelesss, it is too slow and also can be compromised or go down for backhauls.
Not with a wi-fi connection, which is fast enough for video, let alone audio. Wi-fi is already in TVs and DVD decks, chances are it will soon be expanded into the rest of the system as well.

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post #26 of 28 Old 07-13-2013, 02:33 PM
 
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Not with a wi-fi connection, which is fast enough for video, let alone audio. Wi-fi is already in TVs and DVD decks, chances are it will soon be expanded into the rest of the system as well.
Only if you are using Wireless-ac. Wireless-n has been shown to be saturated in high use areas. Wired with a fiber 2gb backhaul is the best way to go, if you want to keep down latency between switches, vs. 1gb Copper connection.

The thing about Wireless, is max rate for G is around 45, 54 max, N 150 max for majority of devices, 65 avg., ac is showing 1.3gb avg, 2.8gb peak. There are no devices out there that will currently utilize Wireless-ac, unless it is a laptop or desktop with an add-on card. Other than that, it is G, N, or a hybrid of G & N together. Any blu ray players or game systems are either going to have Wireless-G or Wireless-N, or wired 100meg, but avg speeds around 65meg.
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post #27 of 28 Old 07-14-2013, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post

But at least you are not one of those audiophiles that claims every interconnect sounds different.
No, we're not. The cable I linked to will sound just like any other sutiable "subwoofer cable" will sound.

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post #28 of 28 Old 07-14-2013, 01:16 PM
 
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No, we're not. The cable I linked to will sound just like any other sutiable "subwoofer cable" will sound.
A Subwoofer does not care, due to it is low end frequency. You could use #14 Romex and make the connection that way, it will still sound fine.
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