SVS SB13 Ultra vs JL Audio E112 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 59 Old 10-01-2013, 09:06 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm trying to decide on a sub to pair with my Golden Ear Super Cinema 3D Array and Super Sat 3's but I don't like the look or sound of the Golden Ear Subwoofers. I was thinking of going with a SVS SB13 Ultra but now that JL Audio has the new E Series I've been thinking about changing my mind. I have a room which opens up to a dining room and kitchen which is around 5,000 cubic feet for the whole area within a High Rise Condo. Any suggestions which would pair best with the soundbar?
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post #2 of 59 Old 10-01-2013, 09:12 PM
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Considering the SVS SB13 shoud be more comparable to the JL Fathom f113, I would choose the SVS SB13 over the JL. The new JL line does look very interesting though.

I haven't seen any definitive testing to support my statement though. I t would be hard to imagine JL making their "entry " level subs a direct competitor to their flagship models.

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post #3 of 59 Old 10-01-2013, 09:17 PM - Thread Starter
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I've owned a PB 13 Ultra in the past but I currently don't have the room for it. I like the smaller size of the JL but I'm not sure about its performance. I'm using the setup for about 50/50 Music and Movies. I'm not quite sure if the SB 13 Ultra is a good value compared to the JL E Series offerings.
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post #4 of 59 Old 10-01-2013, 09:33 PM
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Did you like PB-13 Ultra? What is your room size

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post #5 of 59 Old 10-01-2013, 09:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Coming from a pair of Mirage subwoofers the PB 13 Ultra was awesome. The room itself is 13x15 but opens up to another 13x15 room along with a 8x10 kitchen/bar. I can't go too loud since I'm in a high rise condo but I want the best sound quality.
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post #6 of 59 Old 10-01-2013, 10:32 PM
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In that case, PC-13 Ultra would serve you better. It has smaller footprint, easy to lug around, and roughly same performance as its box counterpart.
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The room itself is 13x15 but opens up to another 13x15 room along with a 8x10 kitchen/bar.

Though the listening area is small, but the rest are all leaks and would require multiple sealed subs jacking up your cost beyond your estimate.

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post #7 of 59 Old 10-02-2013, 07:35 AM
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You can read a review of the E112 here... http://www.soundstagehifi.com/index.php/equipment-reviews/634

Performance is very close to an f112 in terms of output, right at 1.5 dB shy of the f112. It is not the equal of the f113 in terms of output, but in terms of sound quality it is right there with any of the Fathoms.

-Manville Smith - JL Audio, Inc.
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post #8 of 59 Old 10-02-2013, 09:49 AM - Thread Starter
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My biggest concern is the sound quality as I'm in a high rise building I can't play super loud. The price point on the JL Audio E Series seems good especially compared to SVS's SB13 Ultra which seems a bit high for internet direct.

I'd love a PC-13 Ultra but I don't really want to stray away from the "normal" subwoofer look.

Between the SVS SB13 Ultra and the JL Audio E110 or E112 would blend better with my Golden Ear Soundbar without being too powerful?
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post #9 of 59 Old 10-02-2013, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benamaster View Post

My biggest concern is the sound quality as I'm in a high rise building I can't play super loud. The price point on the JL Audio E Series seems good especially compared to SVS's SB13 Ultra which seems a bit high for internet direct.

I'd love a PC-13 Ultra but I don't really want to stray away from the "normal" subwoofer look.

Between the SVS SB13 Ultra and the JL Audio E110 or E112 would blend better with my Golden Ear Soundbar without being too powerful?

I can't speak to the SVS product, but I can share that the e112 and e110 both have very similar upper frequency extension (118 Hz and 120 Hz -3dB, respectively)... either will blend very nicely with most satellite systems. Sound quality is excellent with both units and very comparable to our higher-end Fathom products.
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post #10 of 59 Old 10-03-2013, 12:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Would the SVS SB13 Ultra outperform both the JL Audio E110 and E112? If so then it appears to be a better value but if not the JL might be the better buy for me.
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post #11 of 59 Old 10-03-2013, 03:33 PM
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The SB13 will beat both the e110 and 112.
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post #12 of 59 Old 10-03-2013, 09:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by TVMAN1991 View Post

The SB13 will beat both the e110 and 112.

As far as output or sound quality or both? I'm most concerned with Sound Quality.
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post #13 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 04:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benamaster View Post

As far as output or sound quality or both? I'm most concerned with Sound Quality.

That's hard to answer because the metrics most people use here to choose ID brand subs *without hearing them* don't really indicate sound quality in any reliable way.

A sad side effect is that lots of users here *only* recognize the simple metrics and have no real idea about the sound quality differences between makes and models.

You will always be steered here toward ID brands. Most people here perceive 'value' as a function involving cost, output, and extension. Unfortunately this reductionist approach hides subtler characteristics that aren't well measured.
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post #14 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 05:12 AM
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Originally Posted by TVMAN1991 View Post

The SB13 will beat both the e110 and 112.

Based on????
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post #15 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benamaster View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by TVMAN1991 View Post

The SB13 will beat both the e110 and 112.

As far as output or sound quality or both? I'm most concerned with Sound Quality.

I doubt that. Let's say that a sub had a wonderful sound quality, but unless you put your ear right up to it, you couldn't hear it.

With subwoofers, output is an important and undeniable component of sound quality. What may not be obvious to people just getting into high performance subwoofers is the fact that even just producing audible sound at 20 Hz is no mean feat.



The above chart shows that the threshold of audibility at 20 Hz is around 75 dB. I've actually seen tests of nontrivial subwoofers that could only put out 80 dB SPL at 20 Hz with reasonably low distortion. Trust me - only 5 dB above threshold is not much of a listening experience!
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post #16 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 06:50 AM
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Based on????

Just based on the fact that the E112 outputs slightly less than the F112 which in turn outputs less than the SB13.
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post #17 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 07:20 AM
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Yeah output, output, output. But the OP repeatedly stresses that output is not his concern.

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post #18 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by SaviorMachine View Post

Yeah output, output, output. But the OP repeatedly stresses that output is not his concern.

How about headroom then? It will be interesting to see the CEA 2010 figures, which hopefully will be available no later than next year. I also like the 13.5 inch driver in the SB-13 Ultra. The SB-13 Ultra must be built like a tank weighing 92 pounds. 5 year warranty versus 3 years for JL.

Never the less, I like the E112 quite a bit and could be happy with either the E112 or the SB-13 Ultra.
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post #19 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 08:17 AM
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Headroom is certainly a very good thing, yes. But you know what I'm going on about, Spyboy, you're one of the regulars. People get caught up in SPL, as if that's the only concern, and automatically dismiss any product from the traditional retail distribution chain.

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post #20 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 08:18 AM
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The SB-13 Ultra must be built like a tank weighing 92 pounds.

Yeah the driver comes in at 50.5 pounds! The SDX 12" comes in at 40 pounds which is very heavy also.. many 18”s come in at in-between 30-40 pounds, so that hives you a idea. The mae-x 18” driver is 50 pounds which the Ultra driver is still a 1/2 pound heavier. Weight isn't everything I admit, but..

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post #21 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 10:04 AM
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I actually have an SB13 and the E112 sitting in my other room, waiting for me to spend some quality time with them... wink.gif

Both are built to exacting standards, including rock solid enclosures with beautiful veneer work - rap your knuckles on either at your own peril. The drivers are beasts, replete with extremely long throws and lots of linear travel. The amp on the E112 is mostly enclosed, so it's difficult to see the components, but neither gets terribly warm when pushed. SQ, extension and total output are all very good, as one would expect given the price they fetch.

And before anyone asks... no, I haven't compared them head-to-head. I've barely put more than a couple of hours run time on the E112 thus far - because I have several other units to review that are ahead of it - but I wanted to at least throw out a few quick observations. I suspect there aren't too many people who have both of these units in the next room, so I wanted to at least provide what info I could.
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post #22 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 10:11 AM
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Jim, get your priority straight, stop fooling around! I will happily donate my time and review them for you. J/k biggrin.gif

Will wait anxiously for your review.
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post #23 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 10:23 AM
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I use to own dual SB13U's. While they were good for music, I couldn't get over the metal grills. IMO, they looked terrible and would never stay in place. Otherwise, they were good performers... If they would replace them with some cloth magnetic grills, they would be great!
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post #24 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cvetan1 View Post

I use to own dual SB13U's. While they were good for music, I couldn't get over the metal grills. IMO, they looked terrible and would never stay in place. Otherwise, they were good performers... If they would replace them with some cloth magnetic grills, they would be great!

First time I saw somebody say they'd prefer cloth over the SVS metal grilles eek.gif

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post #25 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 11:25 AM - Thread Starter
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I really liked the cloth grill on my PB13 Ultra and wish they had that available for the SB13 Ultra. I have to say just by looking at the front of the sub I now prefer the look of the metal grill compared to JL's cloth but that is one of the minor details, neither looks bad.
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post #26 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 11:28 AM
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Hey cmon! I like no grill and seeing the long excursion happen when I put Transformers on.
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post #27 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by its phillip View Post

First time I saw somebody say they'd prefer cloth over the SVS metal grilles eek.gif

He seems to be saying that in hearty use, the magnets don't hold the metal grill on securely. If that was the case with him, I don't blame him for unloading the SB-13 Ultras. However, I haven't heard of this being a wide spread issue.
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post #28 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by its phillip View Post

First time I saw somebody say they'd prefer cloth over the SVS metal grilles eek.gif

Make me number two then. smile.gif While I like the concept of a metal grill, the implementation is the issue for me. It sticks out pretty far and just doesn't strike me as all that esthetically pleasing. Personal preference I suppose.

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Originally Posted by spyboy View Post

He seems to be saying that in hearty use, the magnets don't hold the metal grill on securely. If that was the case with him, I don't blame him for unloading the SB-13 Ultras. However, I haven't heard of this being a wide spread issue.

The grill on the SB13U is held in by pins, so if his is walking around he must be listening to some very brutal content. eek.gif

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post #29 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 12:17 PM
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^^^ Jim - Yep! smile.gif

I went from the SB13U's to JTR S1's. Different beasts. smile.gif

Spyboy- The heavy SVS grill is held in by pins and more of a pressure contact inside. On some heavy HT passages, the pins tend to walk out of the holes. Next thing you know the damn grill is laying on my hardwood floor. When you are snuggled up on the couch with your significant other, then all of a sudden you hear a big CRASH coming from the subwoofers, its not something that is very comforting during a movie. eek.gif

Also, I keep my mains close to the subs in my room. If that metal grill came crashing on my Salk Veracity speakers, i'd be throwing the SVS sub out in the trash! tongue.gif
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post #30 of 59 Old 10-04-2013, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TVMAN1991 View Post

Hey cmon! I like no grill and seeing the long excursion happen when I put Transformers on.

I like no grill as well sometimes, but I HATE those holes on the front for the grill, especially when you have piano black. To me it just ruins the appearance.
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