Need help on JTR S2 or Captivator 2400!!!!!!!! - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:27 AM - Thread Starter
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I was going to pick up the cap 2400 but the s2 has me really intrigued! After a lot of research, I see that the S2 has as much output as the 2400 and a lot more below tuning. The problem is that I do not know if a sealed sub is good for my room? I have never owned a sealed sub so I am kind of clueless about them as far as sound goes. I know that ported subs have a real tactical sound to them and not sure if sealed subs do.

My room is 17x16x10 and has an open regular sized doorway. This is for 99% movies.

1. Is a sealed sub good for my room?

2. Will I get the tactical feeling like the cap 2400?

3. Would I be able to tell the difference in a blind test between the two subs above 17.5hz?

Please help me out! Thanks a bunch!


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post #2 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:33 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pain Infliction View Post

Please help me out! Thanks a bunch!

Please check out the last few days of posts in the ULF thread. Regarding tactile sensation, there's been a continuous discussion going on.

Read the last few days worth of posts and ask this question there and you should get a satisfactory answer to your above question.

(currently, if I understand the conversation correctly, for tactile sensation, the vented/ported subwoofers are winning out over sealed)
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post #3 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:36 AM
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I have lots of tactile feel with my S2's... Whata you talking about? smile.gif
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post #4 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:38 AM
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I feel like a sealed sub is good for any room b/c if one is not enough you can add as many sealed subs as you want.

Between the S2 and the Cap 2400 I would choose the S2 every time.

It would be a much harder choice if it was the Cap S2 vs The Orbit Shifter. Is there any reason the OS is not one of your choices?

Chris
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post #5 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:40 AM
 
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Originally Posted by rhed View Post

I have lots of tactile feel with my S2's... Whata you talking about? smile.gif

I have no idea what I'm going on about, that's why I suggest folks check out the conversation going on in the ULF thread. These folks are comparing high output systems, vented vs sealed.

We have a dual vented system so I'm not qualified to say anything about nothing cause I ain't got nothin to compare anything to.
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post #6 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post

I feel like a sealed sub is good for any room b/c if one is not enough you can add as many sealed subs as you want.

Between the S2 and the Cap 2400 I would choose the S2 every time.

It would be a much harder choice if it was the Cap S2 vs The Orbit Shifter. Is there any reason the OS is not one of your choices?

Chris

That was my first choice before the S2. But because of WAF, I ended with the S2's. If it didn't matter with the wifey, I would have got quad OS instead.... smile.gif
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post #7 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 07:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

Please check out the last few days of posts in the ULF thread. Regarding tactile sensation, there's been a continuous discussion going on.

Read the last few days worth of posts and ask this question there and you should get a satisfactory answer to your above question.

(currently, if I understand the conversation correctly, for tactile sensation, the vented/ported subwoofers are winning out over sealed)

I will check it out.
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post

I feel like a sealed sub is good for any room b/c if one is not enough you can add as many sealed subs as you want.

Between the S2 and the Cap 2400 I would choose the S2 every time.

It would be a much harder choice if it was the Cap S2 vs The Orbit Shifter. Is there any reason the OS is not one of your choices?

Chris

Would you take the S2 over the 2400 because of the reasons that I listed or something else?

I do not want the OS mainly because of the size. Also, If I am going to spend 3k on a sub, I want it to dig pretty deep.


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post #8 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 08:25 AM
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^^ I read somewhere that the OS was good to 10 or 7hz corner load. But I think it's the beauty of horns.. They want the corners if one can.. Anyway which ever route you end up with. If budget permits, and because price will increase in a few weeks from now. Here's my choice if I was in your shoe with I think is you budget.. 1. Dual Captivator 2400. 2. S2 3. OS . There, that would be my choice..smile.gif I strongly suggest duals because not only the price increase but you'll get a more even FR and EVERYONE wants more bass later if not sooner.. ALWAYS! smile.gif And dual 2400 or even S1 will be more then enough. Reading materiel...
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1387178/archaeas-kansas-city-blind-subwoofer-shootout-2012
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post #9 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 08:51 AM - Thread Starter
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^^ I read somewhere that the OS was good to 10 or 7hz corner load. But I think it's the beauty of horns.. They want the corners if one can.. Anyway which ever route you end up with. If budget permits, and because price will increase in a few weeks from now. Here's my choice if I was in your shoe with I think is you budget.. 1. Dual Captivator 2400. 2. S2 3. OS . There, that would be my choice..smile.gif I strongly suggest duals because not only the price increase but you'll get a more even FR and EVERYONE wants more bass later if not sooner.. ALWAYS! smile.gif And dual 2400 or even S1 will be more then enough. Reading materiel...
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1387178/archaeas-kansas-city-blind-subwoofer-shootout-2012

Thanks for the reply! Dual captivators are out of the question as I would get them active and not passive. I do not have clearance to spend 5k, but I did surprisingly get the ok to spend 3k. Probably because the wife knows she will get a nice new wedding ring soon lol. Isn't dual S1's the same as an S2? Also, I really only have one spot for the sub and the is in the back corner of my theater close to my seats. All seats get good responses so I am not too concerned about dual subs and spreading them out. If I end up getting another S2 ( I doubt it though), I would co-locate them. So I am assuming that the order you would chose would be 1. S2 2. OS 3. Cap 2400.


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post #10 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Pain Infliction View Post

I will check it out.
Would you take the S2 over the 2400 because of the reasons that I listed or something else?

I do not want the OS mainly because of the size. Also, If I am going to spend 3k on a sub, I want it to dig pretty deep.
With the size of your room any JTR sub properly set up will be Oustanding so there are no bad choices. smile.gif

I tend to compare the Cap 2400 to the S1 and the S2 to the Orbit Shifter. It's not exact but close enough for me to pick the S2 over the the Cap2400 b/c its more sub. 2 drivers with a 4000wpc amp.

Any choice you make between the 2400 and the S2 will be a Good one.

Good Luck
Chris
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post #11 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 08:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post


With the size of your room any JTR sub properly set up will be Oustanding so there are no bad choices. smile.gif

I tend to compare the Cap 2400 to the S1 and the S2 to the Orbit Shifter. It's not exact but close enough for me to pick the S2 over the the Cap2400 b/c its more sub. 2 drivers with a 4000wpc amp.

Any choice you make between the 2400 and the S2 will be a Good one.

Good Luck
Chris

Do you think it is worth the extra $500?


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post #12 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:01 AM
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Do you think it is worth the extra $500?
Yes I do. I think the S2 is the single best value of any ID sub out there.
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post #13 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:04 AM
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S1: single 18" driver single amp
S2: dual 18" driver single amp ( same amp as S1)
Cap 2400: single 18" driver single amp ( same amp as S1 and S2)

Talk to Jeff about multiples. He's a good guy..wink.gif
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post #14 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:07 AM
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The S1 has the same 2400wpc amp as the Cap 2400 and the S2 has the same 4000wpc amp as the OS. smile.gif
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post #15 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:07 AM
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Not to throw a wrench in what was already suggested... but personally.. I would say if you ONLY had one spot for a sub and are not willing to ever shift the room around to accommodate 2 subs to even out the FR... my order would be OS, then cap 2400, then the S2. Don't sell the active 2400 short, it actually has more or less the same output of the S2 above tune... the OS about twice the output of the S2 above tune. Do you currently have a sub in the room? Anyway to measure the room with REW or Omnimic? In your room, without knowing how much gain you'll get down low... if I were going to blind buy between the 3 I would probably go ported/horn all the way.

Take it for what its worth I guess... ultimately it's your decision. I would suggest before you buy to try and hear a quality ported/horn system and a quality sealed system before you take the leap of faith. There are many JTR owners who could care less about <15hz material.. and others (like me) who couldn't live without it!

BTW, I'm a Cap S2 owner and was in the same position as you (just a single spot for 1 sub) and got lucky I guess with my results.. then again, this is corner loaded in an 842cf room.



If I didn't get the extension I'm getting, I probably would have went with a single OS. Just my opinion tho..
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Yes I do. I think the S2 is the single best value of any ID sub out there.

^^ Agreed 100%
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Pain Infliction, if the budget is limited to a hard $3k, when they are available (end of Q1 2014), consider a pair of Rythmik FV15HPs and if needed, keep an open eye out for adding a third FV15HP. The FV15HP is a very nice subwoofer, well suited for a small room of your Home Theater size with lots of tactile sensation but operationally, frequency wise, they're limited to the 10Hz to 12.5Hz range.

If you have wiggle room and you want maximum output and depth of extension, consider a single Captivator 2400 or S2 with a near term eye on a second one.

(regarding overall sound quality, yes, a second subwoofer makes a noticeable, world of difference)

-
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post #18 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by countryWV View Post

I feel like a sealed sub is good for any room b/c if one is not enough you can add as many sealed subs as you want.

Between the S2 and the Cap 2400 I would choose the S2 every time.

It would be a much harder choice if it was the Cap S2 vs The Orbit Shifter. Is there any reason the OS is not one of your choices?

Chris
Quote:
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The S1 has the same 2400wpc amp as the Cap 2400 and the S2 has the same 4000wpc amp as the OS. smile.gif

Same plate amp though.. The difference is Ohms. With 2 drivers the it's 4000 wpc @ 2 ohms. With 1 driver it's 2400 wpc @ 4 ohms..
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post #19 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:16 AM
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Not to throw a wrench in what was already suggested... but personally.. I would say if you ONLY had one spot for a sub and are not willing to ever shift the room around to accommodate 2 subs to even out the FR... my order would be OS, then cap 2400, then the S2. Don't sell the active 2400 short, it actually has more or less the same output of the S2 above tune... the OS about twice the output of the S2 above tune. Do you currently have a sub in the room? Anyway to measure the room with REW or Omnimic? In your room, without knowing how much gain you'll get down low... if I were going to blind buy between the 3 I would probably go ported/horn all the way.

Take it for what its worth I guess... ultimately it's your decision. I would suggest before you buy to try and hear a quality ported/horn system and a quality sealed system before you take the leap of faith. There are many JTR owners who could care less about <15hz material.. and others (like me) who couldn't live without it!

BTW, I'm a Cap S2 owner and was in the same position as you (just a single spot for 1 sub) and got lucky I guess with my results.. then again, this is corner loaded in an 842cf room.



If I didn't get the extension I'm getting, I probably would have went with a single OS. Just my opinion tho..

My exact choice in previous post... But I still would go dual Cap 2400 instead.
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post #20 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:18 AM
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^^ You're right in that the S2 is wired 2ohm and S1 is wired 4ohm but they are 2 different amps.. SPI-2400 and SPI-4000.. check out the speakerpower site.
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post #21 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:19 AM
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Same plate amp though.. The difference is Ohms. With 2 drivers the it's 4000 wpc @ 2 ohms. With 1 driver it's 2400 wpc @ 4 ohms..
Cool!!smile.gif

I take it Speakerpower has combined the two (2400/4000) into one amp as with the Submersive Hp is now The HP+.

Chris
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post #22 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

If the budget is limited to a hard $3k, when they are available (end of Q1 2014), consider a pair of Rythmik FV15HPs and if needed, keep an open eye out for adding a third FV15HP. The FV15HP is a very nice subwoofer, well suited for a small room of your Home Theater size with lots of tactile sensation but operationally, frequency wise, they're limited to the 10Hz to 12.5Hz range.

If you have wiggle room and you want maximum output and depth of extension, consider a single Captivator 2400 or S2 with a near term eye on a second one.

(regarding overall sound quality, yes, a second subwoofer makes a noticeable, world of difference)
Exactly.. As I said everyone will want more later. BTW, those Rythmics are badass too. Considering the price range. Damn, I could get 8 F25 for the price of 4 S2.. Lol.. Holy sh!t!
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post #23 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:23 AM
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Cool!!smile.gif

I take it Speakerpower has combined the two (2400/4000) into one amp as with the Submersive Hp is now The HP+.

Chris
Yes..
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post #24 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:23 AM
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My exact choice in previous post... But I still would go dual Cap 2400 instead.

Only thing is, OP said IF he were to eventually get a second... he would end up stacking them or co-locating them. In that case, 2 2400's or 1 OS would have roughly the same output.. making the single OS a much better value. That's IF he can fit a medium sized fridge in his room! eek.gif
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post #25 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:32 AM
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^^ You're right in that the S2 is wired 2ohm and S1 is wired 4ohm but they are 2 different amps.. SPI-2400 and SPI-4000.. check out the speakerpower site.

Oh.. Ok. I thought or read some where that Jeff uses the SPI-4000 for all his active subs. Since he gets it by bulk I assumed. Well I could be wrong..
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post #26 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:42 AM
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I have lots of tactile feel with my S2's... Whata you talking about? smile.gif

I would really hope so with four S2's!!!!! LOL eek.gif
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post #27 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:49 AM
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I tend to compare the Cap 2400 to the S1 and the S2 to the Orbit Shifter. It's not exact but close enough for me to pick the S2 over the the Cap2400 b/c its more sub. 2 drivers with a 4000wpc amp.

From everything I've read and some responses from Jeff when I asked him I think your comparison is only partially right. A Cap 2400 has the same about of output as a Cap S2 down to its port tune. Below the port tune of the Cap 2400 the S2 would just walk away with it.

Above the port tune a Cap S1 wouldn't be able to keep up with a Cap 2400.
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post #28 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:56 AM
 
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That's IF he can fit a medium sized fridge in his room! eek.gif

One of the guys delivering our pair of FV15HPs thought they were a matched set of stacking compact washer and dryer. Sometimes one has to take into consideration, after all is considered, maybe a medium sized fridge for a subwoofer, ain't such a bad idea. tongue.gif

If the S2 can deliver on much wanted tactile sensation and the budget is there to light the candle, I'd start working to buy a pair of S2s.

I am absolutely happy, happy, happy with the pair of subs we purchased. They look good and in my opinion, are the Top Dog of their price point. Believe it or not, I consider the FV15HPs to be the Top Dog of the budget minded subwoofer class. LOL! When I look out at the subs, I don't have buyer's remorse and I know, for our budget, I got what I consider to be the best subs, for our situation, possible. No regrets. The point, if buying something like the S2s or the 2400s, buy with the thought, is this what you really want?

If the budget is there to support this purchase, don't hold back. Don't buy down to save a few bucks today, so you'll wish you had spent the money later. Our budget won't support the likes of a pair of S2s or 2400s but our budget was able to handle what we purchased. In my mind, I know, we got the best and that goes a long way in providing one with that warm and fuzzy feeling we all want to experience when we look over our subwoofer purchase.
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post #29 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post

From everything I've read and some responses from Jeff when I asked him I don't think your comparison is only partially right. A Cap 2400 has the same about of output as a Cap S2 down to its port tune. Below the port tune of the Cap 2400 the S2 would just walk away with it.

Above the port tune a Cap S1 wouldn't be able to keep up with a Cap 2400.
I agree with the above that's why I compare the S1 digs deeper vs the Cap 2400 has the advantage above.

In comparison The S2 digs deeper vs the Orbit Shifter has the advantage above 30hz.

IMO the choice between the S2 or Cap 2400 is based on total performance with the S2 having the a clear advantage below and the same or more above. That's why these decisions are such hard ones

b/c it's always give and take with a clear winner being the most expensive (with JTR subwoofers) so Money is the Give.
Chris
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post #30 of 67 Old 12-22-2013, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

One of the guys delivering our pair of FV15HPs thought they were a matched set of stacking compact washer and dryer. Sometimes one has to take into consideration, after all is considered, maybe a medium sized fridge for a subwoofer, ain't such a bad idea. tongue.gif

If the S2 can deliver on much wanted tactile sensation and the budget is there to light the candle, I'd start working to buy a pair of S2s.

I am absolutely happy, happy, happy with the pair of subs we purchased. They look good and are the Top Dog of their price point. Believe it or not, I consider the FV15HPs to be the Top Dog of the budget minded subwoofer class. LOL! When I look out at the subs, I don't have buyer's remorse and I know, for our budget, I got what I consider to be the best subs, for our situation, possible. No regrets. The point, if buying something like the S2s or the 2400s, buy with the thought, is this what you really want?

If the budget is there to support this purchase, don't hold back. Don't buy down to save a few bucks today, so you'll wish you had spent the money later. Our budget won't support the likes of a pair of S2s or 2400s but our budget was able to handle what we purchased. In my mind, I know, we got the best and that goes a long way in providing one with that warm and fuzzy feeling we all want to experience when we look out over our subwoofer purchase.

BeeMan you definitely bought yourself two of the best subs of the market at that price point.
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