Seaton MFW-15 Turbo SS - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews

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post #1 of 189 Old 04-04-2016, 05:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Seaton MFW-15 Turbo SS

MFW-15 Turbo SS.

15 inch subwoofer by Mark Sutton of Seaton Sound:
Modified old-stock cabinet from AV123's MFW-15.
New 700 watt ICE amplifier.
New 43 lb turbo woofer.

Two finishes: Black, Moho (natural).

Mark Seaton Seaton Sound, Inc.
sales@seatonsound.net
773-290-8436

Seaton Sound Forum thread.
http://www.seaton-sound-forum.com/po...2317?&trail=20

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post #2 of 189 Old 04-04-2016, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
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I am to get one of these on Thursday. My first serious subwoofer.

Intend to take and post some photos.

I am also getting a Umik-1. What with REW, which I've downloaded, I should be able to take and post some measurements. I also recently bought a used MiniDSP nanoAvr HD. But I have never done any such thing before, so I will need your patience / instructions / encouragement.

Like if I intend to take an 1 meter measurement, should the tip of the microphone be 1 meter from the middle of the woofer? On a microphone stand? Pointing at the driver?
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post #3 of 189 Old 04-04-2016, 06:23 PM
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Seaton Link

  • Frequency response: 16-200Hz +/-3dB
  • Dimensions are 18" wide x 24" tall x 22.5" deep
  • Optional magnetic grill adds $50 and 1/2" to depth
  • Included and removable rubber feet at 3/4" to height spikes can be upgraded using the M6 threaded inserts.












Here with the magnetic grill in place:




From Seaton MFW-15 Turbo SS










Panasonic TC-P55UT50
Pioneer SC-1222-K
Polk Audio LSiM703 / LSiM706c / RTiA3
JTR Captivator 1400

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post #4 of 189 Old 04-05-2016, 08:18 AM
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Surely there must be some Moho finish recipients out there by now who can share their impressions? My understanding was that were shipping out two weeks ago. So far seems like the only ones chiming in are the handful of black painted units. Has anyone received the email with pics yet?
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post #5 of 189 Old 04-05-2016, 11:26 AM
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Surely there must be some Moho finish recipients out there by now who can share their impressions? My understanding was that were shipping out two weeks ago. So far seems like the only ones chiming in are the handful of black painted units. Has anyone received the email with pics yet?
The first units went out yesterday with more going out today. I have now e-mailed all of the customers who had units on order.

I did make some very worthwhile refinements this past weekend when I again spent a lot of time dialing in, measuring and listening to the MFW-15 Turbo. I have no hesitation stating this sub will hit well above it's class so far as size and cost. I would have no hesitation shipping a product with this level of performance for a ~$1500 sale price. I will post up some frequency response measurements I took in our warehouse this weekend.
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post #6 of 189 Old 04-05-2016, 11:40 AM
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Thanks for the updates and pics and looking very forward to my MFW! I didn't realize you were still tweaking them, but I am sure everyone will appreciate the extra attention to detail. It's Awesome to hear how pleased you are with the result, makes the wait very worth it . Thanks again!
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post #7 of 189 Old 04-05-2016, 01:05 PM - Thread Starter
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"Michelangelo! I know you are painting the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel, but when are you going to be done?"
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post #8 of 189 Old 04-05-2016, 07:30 PM
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Subscribed. I should be getting my review unit once customer orders have been fulfilled, so I'll be able to post an eval in the not too distant future.
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post #9 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Delivery scheduled for today!

Originally it was to arrive Thursday, but FedEx must know how eager I am, so they probably drove thru the night. As it is listed as weighing 126 pounds, I hope they brought 2 guys with them. Don't want them to drive by house, say 'No one is home' and tell me that I have to go pick it up. I made the mistake of going to a website where people detailed their experiences with FedEx, and now I am worried that those stories will apply to me. My wife tells me that no one ever goes to those websites to say that their delivery was fine. I know, but those people aren't getting a new subwoofer!

Update: It has arrived at home! There will be some BASS-kicking tonight!
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post #10 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XBR11 View Post
Originally it was to arrive Thursday, but FedEx must know how eager I am, so they probably drove thru the night. As it is listed as weighing 126 pounds, I hope they brought 2 guys with them. Don't want them to drive by house, say 'No one is home' and tell me that I have to go pick it up. I made the mistake of going to a website where people detailed their experiences with FedEx, and now I am worried that those stories will apply to me. My wife tells me that no one ever goes to those websites to say that their delivery was fine. I know, but those people aren't getting a new subwoofer!

Update: It has arrived at home! There will be some BASS-kicking tonight!
Awesome!! Put some pics up ASAP! After you test her out of course . Mine is now officially en route now!
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post #11 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 04:34 PM - Thread Starter
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It's here!
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post #12 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 05:09 PM - Thread Starter
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post #13 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 05:13 PM
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Dude that thing is beautiful! That front baffle looks so sweet. You just had to rub it in you got #1! Lol
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post #14 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Removed my JBL PSW-1200, and plugged in MFW-15 and turned it on.

Played clips at medium volume (somewhat lower volume than I use for demo-ing) from The Man From Uncle, Pacific Time, U-571, Star Trek, Gravedigger music video.

I have a huge open room (9000 cubic feet) on top of tile floors, so there is not much chance for pressurization. My old JBL PSW-1200 was/is still working. Didn't do any equalization or such.

It sounded good. I felt the sub speaker cover vibrating. I thought the all speakers sounded clearer, but that may be wishful thinking. It did not sound life-changing better. BUT in no way do I mean to imply, nor should you infer, anything negative about the Seaton MFW-15 Turbo SS. I need to do some measurements, some tweaking, some loud listening.

When I got my plasma TV professionally calibrated, it did not all of sudden make me taller, younger, skinnier, or debt free. The calibrated TV looks good. Other tv's may appear better. But I KNOW that I have one of best looking displays ever.

With my new sub I KNOW I have a great subwoofer. I just have to spend some proving it to myself (and my family who think I am crazy for buying such an expensive toys).

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post #15 of 189 Old 04-06-2016, 06:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Dude that thing is beautiful! That front baffle looks so sweet. You just had to rub it in you got #1 ! Lol
It is beautiful!
It is huge!
And getting serial #1 , is better!
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post #16 of 189 Old 04-07-2016, 07:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Wink

My son suggested that I get one of those special-properties power cord and use that, and what a difference it would make! Does anyone have a $10,000 power cord laying around that I can try out?
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post #17 of 189 Old 04-07-2016, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by XBR11 View Post
Removed my JBL PSW-1200, and plugged in MFW-15 and turned it on.

Played clips at medium volume (somewhat lower volume than I use for demo-ing) from The Man From Uncle, Pacific Time, U-571, Star Trek, Gravedigger music video.

I have a huge open room (9000 cubic feet) on top of tile floors, so there is not much chance for pressurization. My old JBL PSW-1200 was/is still working. Didn't do any equalization or such.

It sounded good. I felt the sub speaker cover vibrating. I thought the all speakers sounded clearer, but that may be wishful thinking. It did not sound life-changing better. BUT in no way do I mean to imply, nor should you infer, anything negative about the Seaton MFW-15 Turbo SS. I need to do some measurements, some tweaking, some loud listening.

When I got my plasma TV professionally calibrated, it did not all of sudden make me taller, younger, skinnier, or debt free. The calibrated TV looks good. Other tv's may appear better. But I KNOW that I have one of best looking displays ever.

With my new sub I KNOW I have a great subwoofer. I just have to spend some proving it to myself (and my family who think I am crazy for buying such an expensive toys).
Good to hear your sub arrived safely, and thank you for posting the pictures.

From the above comments it wasn't clear, but how did you set the level of the sub? I don't recall at the moment, but does your receiver have Audyssey or any other room-EQ features? If so, these should be turned off or re-run with the new subwoofer.

U-571's depth charged scene should be giving the sub a real workout... along with any loose items in your room. From above comments, I'd wager you could turn up the Level knob some and don't be afraid to play at a bit higher level. Be sure all of your speakers are set to "small" and start with an 80Hz crossover. The setup suggestions posted here on our forum for the MFW-15 Mk2 amplifier define all the functions of the amplifier which are the same. Remember you can also use your UMIK-1 with REW as a very nice SPL meter, even before you get the HDMI output working. Just set to SPL or RTA mode after loading the calibration file for the UMIK in the preferences window of REW. You can download the calibration file by entering your serial number on the mic 1/2 way down this page at MiniDSP's site.
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post #18 of 189 Old 04-07-2016, 07:08 PM - Thread Starter
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That I can't report that my new subwoofer sounds life-changingly fantastic, the problem is with me, not with the subwoofer. Haven't had time to dial it in. And my room is very audio-ly challenged. But still I am very happy with my new sub.

I did no room correction after hooking up the new subwoofer. My avr doesn't have any. With my old subwoofer, I had used a SPL meter to level match the speakers. After swapping in my new subwoofer, I didn't even retake the levels. I intend to use my new Umik-1 (that I bought from Seaton Sound) and REW and nanoAvr HD to do all the measurements and correction. (That stuff is brand new to me). Just haven't had the time yet. I did turn up the LFE Gain all the way to the right. But I haven't played anything after that but "Home" and that barely has any bass. Hopefully this weekend I can play Godzilla, Apollo 13, Cloverfield, Gravity. And loudly.

Can't wait to read others impressions of their new MFW-15.
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post #19 of 189 Old 04-07-2016, 07:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Can someone please explain what these frequency numbers mean? Specifically "-15/24-200Hz".

I assume that it goes up to 200Hz. Got that. But does it go down to 15 or 24 Hz dB?
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post #20 of 189 Old 04-09-2016, 02:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Apology, and WOW!

If anyone read my previous posts and thought anything badly of the Seaton Sound MFW-15 Turbo SS, I owe you a big apology. Mark Seaton offered me some advice about why I wasn't feeling a physical impact from his subwoofer. Paraphrasing him, he said "Turn it up." And was he ever correct! I turned it up, and Holy WOW!

Initially I had used my SPL meter to level set all speakers and the subwoofer (I used the World Of Wonder Disney blu-ray and matched them at 75dB). On the subwoofer amplifier, the Level knob was set at "MID" (noon), and the LF EQ knob was set at 0dB (noon). My avr does not have its volume control in dB, but rather in relative numbers, so it is hard to know exactly what dB level I am listening to. I have since done some tests and I have a better idea what those relative numbers mean in terms of dB. The other day, when I was watching those blu-rays, I didn't note the relative number, but it probably was at about 70-ish dBs. And I didn't feel much from this subwoofer. Remember my room is extremely large at about 9000 cubic feet, with a tile floor on top of concrete. So I just figured that the room was too big for the subwoofer.

And then Mark Seaton suggested I turn it up.

This morning, my wife said she was going to take a nap [because she didn't sleep good last night], and she said that I could play with my subwoofer. I said 'Won't the noise bother you?' and she said 'No, I will just turn on the air cleaner and I won't hear anything'.

So I turned up the Level knob to about 2:30 (about three quarters), and the LF EQ knob to about to about three quarters. I since have learned that the Level knob at about 1:15-ish is about 13 dB hot. I don't know what three quarters is in terms of dB hot, perhaps 15-18? dB On the avr, I had the volume at 40, which translates to about 75 dB. 45 is about 80 dB. Usually when no one is home, I might listen at 40 to 45 on the volume knob.

Played "Depth Charged" of U-571 and lots of other LFE clips from my ScubaSteve Demo Disc, volume 1, and from Cloverfield, and from Pacific Rim. And I really FELT it! Sitting 12 feet away. My pants were flapping. My tibia/fibula were vibrating. An LED lamp was blinking. Felt compression in my chest. My son called me into the garage, where the ladder was vibrating on its hooks.

Two hours latter my wife came out of the bedroom, and said "Aren't you finished yet! I haven't gotten any sleep. The bed is vibrating and the windows are rattling".

So I had to stop my play time.

But oh my WOW, it was wonderful loud physical bass!

Of course 15-18 db hot is ridiculous too much. I have to find more time to dial it in. But this subwoofer in my huge room is very capable of producing a visceral feel.
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post #21 of 189 Old 04-09-2016, 04:51 PM
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And then Mark Seaton suggested I turn it up...

Played "Depth Charged" of U-571 and lots of other LFE clips from my ScubaSteve Demo Disc, volume 1, and from Cloverfield, and from Pacific Rim. And I really FELT it! Sitting 12 feet away. My pants were flapping. My tibia/fibula were vibrating. An LED lamp was blinking. Felt compression in my chest. My son called me into the garage, where the ladder was vibrating on its hooks.

Two hours latter my wife came out of the bedroom, and said "Aren't you finished yet! I haven't gotten any sleep. The bed is vibrating and the windows are rattling".

So I had to stop my play time.

But oh my WOW, it was wonderful loud physical bass!

Of course 15-18 db hot is ridiculous too much. I have to find more time to dial it in. But this subwoofer in my huge room is very capable of producing a visceral feel.
Progress.

Thanks for sharing the process you've been working through. It sounds like you've explored "not enough" and now "a bit too much" with "just right" being the next target.

Quickly setting the level of the subwoofer with an SPL meter is still a bit of a fuzzy stab since all it takes is a few peaks or dips in the response to greatly skew what that "75dB C" reading is, or is not telling you. Ultimately you have to please your ear, and I would wager that when you get around to a few frequency response measurements we will get some insight as to what you experienced in both of the above extremes.

Since you're still in the general tinkering and listening stage, I would suggest if you have a 10' or less ceiling height to experiment with lowering the LF EQ knob to 12-10 o'clock position and then adjusting to a level that doesn't overtake the main speakers and male dialog too much. Be sure your speakers are all set to 80Hz and try lowering the sub level to about 1/2 way between "too much" and where you started. From there you can try playing the system a little louder as this gives you more bass along with more detail from the speakers. There are plenty who enjoy a +10-20dB ramping in level at the lowest frequencies, but if your speakers and room acoustics are comfortable at a little higher playback level, the bass and overall detail will be greater if the mains are adding all of that detail at a more appropriate level. In simplest terms, if you have the subwoofer +15dB vs the mains and listening at -15dB on the main volume, you can lower the subs by 5dB and raise the main volume 5dB to -10dB, and you are now hearing the same intensity of bass, with more main speaker to compliment it, potentially making for a more exciting and more detailed presentation.
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post #22 of 189 Old 04-09-2016, 05:02 PM
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Can someone please explain what these frequency numbers mean? Specifically "-15/24-200Hz".

I assume that it goes up to 200Hz. Got that. But does it go down to 15 or 24 Hz dB?
The 15/24Hz is the approximate low and high range of the +/-3dB response window when you adjust the "LF EQ" knob on the MFW-15. Yesterday I posted these measurements of the MFW-15 Turbo to our forum.

For those following along, here is the amplifier panel:


With the knobs in the above position (LF EQ @ 12 noon on the dial), this is the approximate frequency response +/- a few bumps from measuring inside our warhouse:

NOTE: Numbers on the left in these measurements have no correlation to maximum capability.


Now let's overlay the changes to this curve with the LF EQ knob at maximum (RED) and minimum (GREEN):


Of course there are a range of responses available between this minimum and maximum shown below:
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post #23 of 189 Old 04-10-2016, 02:04 PM
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If anyone read my previous posts and thought anything badly of the Seaton Sound MFW-15 Turbo SS, I owe you a big apology. Mark Seaton offered me some advice about why I wasn't feeling a physical impact from his subwoofer. Paraphrasing him, he said "Turn it up." And was he ever correct! I turned it up, and Holy WOW!

But oh my WOW, it was wonderful loud physical bass!

Of course 15-18 db hot is ridiculous too much. I have to find more time to dial it in. But this subwoofer in my huge room is very capable of producing a visceral feel.
Thank you for the update and great impressions! I am even more excited now to get mine tomorrow. No gym tomorrow, straight home after work to the MFW. The room it is going into is 1800 cu ft so it should rock it pretty good!
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post #24 of 189 Old 04-11-2016, 06:48 AM - Thread Starter
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So Mark seeing your impressive graphs, would this suggest that the LF EQ knob should be somewhere between 0dB and maximum (like at maybe three quarters clock wise, which looks to be about +3 dB), in order to keep the low end as flat as possible? Any negative to doing this?

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post #25 of 189 Old 04-11-2016, 09:09 AM
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So Mark seeing your impressive graphs, would this suggest that the LF EQ knob should be somewhere between 0dB and maximum (like at maybe three quarters clock wise, which looks to be about +3 dB), in order to keep the low end as flat as possible? Any negative to doing this?
If we were listening outdoors or mostly at lower levels that might be true. In real rooms, most will find 12 o'clock and down to 9 o'clock to subjectively sound tighter and punchier, but you will want to bump the level slightly to more appropriately compare to turning the LF EQ knob into the positive range. This comment/suggestion in my previous post wasn't a mistype:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
Since you're still in the general tinkering and listening stage, I would suggest if you have a 10' or less ceiling height to experiment with lowering the LF EQ knob to 12-10 o'clock position and then adjusting to a level that doesn't overtake the main speakers and male dialog too much.
Most rooms will provide additional reinforcement below 25-35Hz to the point that a subwoofer which measures perfectly flat outdoors sounds a bit heavy or sluggish in common rooms. Of course until you measure, we can only guess what exactly is going on, and there are cases where you might find a positive LF EQ setting will work well in a room without other EQ. In most cases the + range of the LF EQ knob is most useful for those who have run systems like Audyssey, ARC or the like which has already smoothed the response, and they want to bring back a modes upward tilt to the lower range. The red/top curve is actually a decent *in-room* target, but those measurements show what happens in free space, not in your room.

This is a good example of how what might seem like a simple bit of measurements can be easily mis-interpreted for the application.

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Seaton Sound, Inc.
"Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood..." Daniel H. Burnham
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post #26 of 189 Old 04-11-2016, 11:03 AM
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I received two Mojo subwoofers Thursday last week, they look great, to me. Ran audyssey (on Onkyo 818-will have to do it again) and did many of the things below with ramping up volume and LFE below. I'm filling a huge space with great sound from movies, music sounds great and I was completely amazed. I had good sound before, my mains didn't sweat mid 30s sound, but the sound when you really can go deep with authority is completely different.

Then my wife saw the 'small ported' subwoofer. Then the other one.

The size of each exceeded the WAF (doubled the non-acceptance with two) so I will be doing some non-audio things such as downsizing the current equipment cabinet and taking advantage of remote technology such as Harmony, probably use some wireless sub solutions. I don't have a home theater space, I'm sharing a living room with someone with a definite opinion on the visuals.

If I have a sub on the front wall, it doesn't really have to face out into the listening space-correct? It may require a little extra gain when setting up, but the orientation doesn't matter in the long run? We are renting and this living room is laid out strangely-if I put a sub behind a sofa into a relatively tight space it's the same thing-run Audyssey, and adjust gain accordingly? How much space do I need to allow from the speaker and vent in a tight space?
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post #27 of 189 Old 04-11-2016, 06:37 PM
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I received my MFW today! I was able to try it out yet as I got home too late to swap it out for the XV15se before the wife noticed but hopefully tomorrow. I did unbox it and wow what excellent packaging! The foam pieces are unbelievably strong and the box was so rugged. Each panel of the sub was wrapped in foam and then extra heavy duty plastic wrapped around everything. This is truly the best ID sub packaging I have seen. The black finish also looks really really nice, more like a soft gloss satin, it has no texture in the paint so it truly feels smooth like the Outlaw sub finishes but feels like wood not plastic. The grill is nice too,very impressed by overall presentation and attention to detail. This thing is heavy tho! Definitely feels every bit the 40 pounds heavier over the XV. Cannot wait to fire it up tomorrow, and just found out the wife will be away Wed-Fri so will have two nights of Turbo testing!
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post #28 of 189 Old 04-12-2016, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Docethic View Post
I received my MFW today! I was able to try it out yet as I got home too late to swap it out for the XV15se before the wife noticed but hopefully tomorrow. I did unbox it and wow what excellent packaging! The foam pieces are unbelievably strong and the box was so rugged. Each panel of the sub was wrapped in foam and then extra heavy duty plastic wrapped around everything. This is truly the best ID sub packaging I have seen. The black finish also looks really really nice, more like a soft gloss satin, it has no texture in the paint so it truly feels smooth like the Outlaw sub finishes but feels like wood not plastic. The grill is nice too,very impressed by overall presentation and attention to detail. This thing is heavy tho! Definitely feels every bit the 40 pounds heavier over the XV. Cannot wait to fire it up tomorrow, and just found out the wife will be away Wed-Fri so will have two nights of Turbo testing!
New Star Wars, chapter 36.
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post #29 of 189 Old 04-13-2016, 08:12 PM
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Love my DIY Turbo'd MFW-15s. I put huge TC Sounds drivers in them - power them with an iNuke 3000DSP - have run Audyssey to smooth out the bass, as well as used REW to perfectly tune them in. Of course, this is a lot more work, and I fully recommend anyone looking to upgrade to go with Mark Seaton's kits.

It's so awesome to see everyone happy with their VERY reliable MFW-15s. This is how the MFW-15 should have originally been.

Mark, you should absolutely keep producing these for the foreseeable future. At the price you offer them, these are a smash hit. These can easily take on the HSU VTF-15h mk2, the Rythmik FV15hp, SVS PB-13 Ultra, ect...

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post #30 of 189 Old 04-13-2016, 08:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powerlifter405 View Post
New Star Wars, chapter 36.
Make it happen, chop-chop!
I didn't test any movie material yet on it yet but cranked some music on it tonight ending with some Bass Mekanik. Compared to the XV15se its not night and day difference but it's definitely very noticeable lower end gain and cleaner output. The cabinet seems to have less resonance so the same material sounds deeper. When I went from the XV15 to the SE I could not notice much of a difference but in this case the difference was immediately apparent. I am still impressed by the XV's performance but the MFW can go to another couple gears and not struggle while it does so. In certain bass tracks I heard/felt tones I had never known were there before so the 15 hz tuning point is legit!

I would advise anyone shopping for a vented 15 to snap one or two of these up while they are still available. They are the real deal!
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