Port or sealed dilemma... - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 08:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Port or sealed dilemma...

I have a 19x13 dedicated media room. B&W 683s, HTM61 center, M1 (4) and ASW610 sub. Had a JBL 8400p second sub only because it was free and had an AVR for dual subs. Well, the JBL crapped out and now the contemplation begins.

I like the balance you get with dual subs, but could be losing some range. After talking with several sub manufactures, I'm even more confused.

So....should I keep the B&W ASW610 and buy another, similar sealed sub for the dual 10" sub route (200 or 300 watt) OR sell the one B&W ASW610 and buy one ported, bigger sub? I've looked at HSU, SVS and all of the well built subwoofers. If I match the asw610, I want to pay about $600 or so. If I switch to one ported and sell the asw610, I could go to $1000ish. Would i lose the balanced feel with one big, ported sub? I know I would gain range etc.

My preference is big bass, but balanced. I'm not into the technical jargon and not real picky....just want a well balanced, big, punchy bass sound for movies that shake the house for those awesome scenes. I am almost 100% movies rather than music in this room.

Thx for the recommendations.
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post #2 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Scurly View Post
I have a 19x13 dedicated media room. B&W 683s, HTM61 center, M1 (4) and ASW610 sub. Had a JBL 8400p second sub only because it was free and had an AVR for dual subs. Well, the JBL crapped out and now the contemplation begins.

I like the balance you get with dual subs, but could be losing some range. After talking with several sub manufactures, I'm even more confused.

So....should I keep the B&W ASW610 and buy another, similar sealed sub for the dual 10" sub route (200 or 300 watt) OR sell the one B&W ASW610 and buy one ported, bigger sub? I've looked at HSU, SVS and all of the well built subwoofers. If I match the asw610, I want to pay about $600 or so. If I switch to one ported and sell the asw610, I could go to $1000ish. Would i lose the balanced feel with one big, ported sub? I know I would gain range etc.

My preference is big bass, but balanced. I'm not into the technical jargon and not real picky....just want a well balanced, big, punchy bass sound for movies that shake the house for those awesome scenes. I am almost 100% movies rather than music in this room.

Thx for the recommendations.
I think you answered your own question. Ported it is!
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post #3 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 08:26 PM
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If you stretch your budget to $1250, you can get a V1801 from the PSA outlet center!

https://www.powersoundaudio.com/coll...oducts/v1801-b

My humble system:

Sony X900e; Sony UBP-X800; Pioneer Elite BDP-62FD universal blu-ray player; Denon 4300H AVR, Dual PSA S1801's; Monitor Audio Silver RX-6 mains, RX center, and RX surrounds; one pair NHT mini Atmos speakers; Home-built HTPC (Xeon E1230, 16gb RAM, Crucial M500 480gb SSD, GeForce 980Ti, Corsair CX600, CoolerMaster mini-ITX case)
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post #4 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 08:48 PM - Thread Starter
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If you stretch your budget to $1250, you can get a V1801 from the PSA outlet center!

https://www.powersoundaudio.com/coll...oducts/v1801-b
Would love to stretch but would cost me my marriage. I hadn't even thought of an 18" sub. Wouldn't that be overkill for a ~2500 cubic ft room? Don't get me wrong, go big or go home is my motto but....
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post #5 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:00 PM
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Would love to stretch but would cost me my marriage. I hadn't even thought of an 18" sub. Wouldn't that be overkill for a ~2500 cubic ft room? Don't get me wrong, go big or go home is my motto but....
Overkill? No way! I have dual S1801's (the sealed versions)in a 1900 cu ft room, and I'm prolly one of the more "reasonable" bassheads in this forum 😄

Don't want to cost you your marriage, but my wife never saw the reason for getting subs like the S1801's until she experienced them. Now she'll never go back!

BTW, the V1801 is actually quite compact for a ported 18" sub. It really isn't any larger than the major 15" competitors. If you are looking for room shaking bass and impact for movies, there's no substitute for displacement!

That being said, a ported 15" from HSU, PSA, or Rythmik would work well for u, if u can't spring for the V1801.

My humble system:

Sony X900e; Sony UBP-X800; Pioneer Elite BDP-62FD universal blu-ray player; Denon 4300H AVR, Dual PSA S1801's; Monitor Audio Silver RX-6 mains, RX center, and RX surrounds; one pair NHT mini Atmos speakers; Home-built HTPC (Xeon E1230, 16gb RAM, Crucial M500 480gb SSD, GeForce 980Ti, Corsair CX600, CoolerMaster mini-ITX case)
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post #6 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurly View Post
I have a 19x13 dedicated media room. B&W 683s, HTM61 center, M1 (4) and ASW610 sub. Had a JBL 8400p second sub only because it was free and had an AVR for dual subs. Well, the JBL crapped out and now the contemplation begins.

I like the balance you get with dual subs, but could be losing some range. After talking with several sub manufactures, I'm even more confused.

So....should I keep the B&W ASW610 and buy another, similar sealed sub for the dual 10" sub route (200 or 300 watt) OR sell the one B&W ASW610 and buy one ported, bigger sub? I've looked at HSU, SVS and all of the well built subwoofers. If I match the asw610, I want to pay about $600 or so. If I switch to one ported and sell the asw610, I could go to $1000ish. Would i lose the balanced feel with one big, ported sub? I know I would gain range etc.

My preference is big bass, but balanced. I'm not into the technical jargon and not real picky....just want a well balanced, big, punchy bass sound for movies that shake the house for those awesome scenes. I am almost 100% movies rather than music in this room.

Thx for the recommendations.
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Would love to stretch but would cost me my marriage. I hadn't even thought of an 18" sub. Wouldn't that be overkill for a ~2500 cubic ft room? Don't get me wrong, go big or go home is my motto but....
I think you should aim for one sub for now and add more as needed or when the wife is a happier mood .

It is easy to get caught up with so many guys here suggesting you get multiple of the biggest and baddest subs available.

If your budget is 1000, get the best sub you can for that price. Learn to integrate that sub well and enjoy it for the time being. Dont get caught up with trying to buy multiple lesser subs. It will just cost you more down the road having to either upgrade or selling them.

Set your self a budget and stick with it.
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post #7 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Overkill? No way! I have dual S1801's (the sealed versions)in a 1900 cu ft room, and I'm prolly one of the more "reasonable" bassheads in this forum 😄

Don't want to cost you your marriage, but my wife never saw the reason for getting subs like the S1801's until she experienced them. Now she'll never go back!

BTW, the V1801 is actually quite compact for a ported 18" sub. It really isn't any larger than the major 15" competitors. If you are looking for room shaking bass and impact for movies, there's no substitute for displacement!

That being said, a ported 15" from HSU, PSA, or Rythmik would work well for u, if u can't spring for the V1801.
Ok, quick down and dirty on forward vs downward firing?
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post #8 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:12 PM
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Did HSU tell you that even plugging the ports in the sub you were looking at to make it sealed would not be a good match for the B&W? If so, I suspected as much, which is why I encouraged you to call first (as I just think even sealed the HSU is going to outrun the B&W).

If you want to stretch budget a bit, these Rythmiks are on sale for $1200 through this site (I just ordered one of these this weekend for my living room):

http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages...bs/fv15hp.html

If you want to save some cash, get one of these and, if you find you still need to smooth things out and add another sub, save up a bit and add one later:

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk5HP.html

Either one of these subs is going to crush what you are used to and sound great; one more down the road would be even better.
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post #9 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:13 PM
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Ok, quick down and dirty on forward vs downward firing?
Not much difference really. I had downfiring PSA XS-15se's before I got the front-firing S1801's. More a matter of aesthetic preference. If you have small children or pets, downfiring will protect the driver from their curiosity.

My humble system:

Sony X900e; Sony UBP-X800; Pioneer Elite BDP-62FD universal blu-ray player; Denon 4300H AVR, Dual PSA S1801's; Monitor Audio Silver RX-6 mains, RX center, and RX surrounds; one pair NHT mini Atmos speakers; Home-built HTPC (Xeon E1230, 16gb RAM, Crucial M500 480gb SSD, GeForce 980Ti, Corsair CX600, CoolerMaster mini-ITX case)
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post #10 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:17 PM
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Ok, quick down and dirty on forward vs downward firing?
Probably no material sound difference; some say facing the driver one way or the other can make a minor difference in frequency response during set up. Downfiring is less vulnerable to kids and pets. But some also say gravity can take its toll on the down firing driver over time. I personally would not sweat down firing versus side firing. HSU, Rythmik, and PSA all make good products in this price range.
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post #11 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jjackkrash View Post
Did HSU tell you that even plugging the ports in the sub you were looking at to make it sealed would not be a good match for the B&W? If so, I suspected as much, which is why I encouraged you to call first (as I just think even sealed the HSU is going to outrun the B&W).

If you want to stretch budget a bit, these Rythmiks are on sale for $1200 through this site (I just ordered one of these this weekend for my living room):

http://www.ascendacoustics.com/pages...bs/fv15hp.html

If you want to save some cash, get one of these and, if you find you still need to smooth things out and add another sub, save up a bit and add one later:

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-3mk5HP.html

Either one of these subs is going to crush what you are used to and sound great; one more down the road would be even better.
Both HSU and SVS said to either match sealed or go with ported. Both said one 15" ported would out perform 2 sealed (I.e. B&W)...so sound advise. I am leaning towards one ported. 15" or 18". Big decision. Thx
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post #12 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:30 PM
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Both HSU and SVS said to either match sealed or go with ported. Both said one 15" ported would out perform 2 sealed (I.e. B&W)...so sound advise. I am leaning towards one ported. 15" or 18". Big decision. Thx
I know it seems like big decision, but you are on the right track. Your choices are getting down to choices between fundamentally good options where its just a preference thing, so don't sweat it. Shop around a bit, then go with your gut. I am confident you are going to be pretty pleased with any one of the subs you are looking at now.
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post #13 of 19 Old 08-21-2017, 09:52 PM
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With you stating you enjoy using dual subs, it boils down to this. Spend $1159 right now on dual hsu vtf-2.5 subs for $1159, shipped. This sub is close in performance to the svs pb2000. Or if you don't mind spending 1k now and close to 1k later on a second of the same, get a 15" ported now, adding it's twin later.
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post #14 of 19 Old 08-22-2017, 08:16 AM
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V1801.....you won't look back.
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post #15 of 19 Old 08-22-2017, 08:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scurly View Post
I have a 19x13 dedicated media room. B&W 683s, HTM61 center, M1 (4) and ASW610 sub. Had a JBL 8400p second sub only because it was free and had an AVR for dual subs. Well, the JBL crapped out and now the contemplation begins.

I like the balance you get with dual subs, but could be losing some range. After talking with several sub manufactures, I'm even more confused.

So....should I keep the B&W ASW610 and buy another, similar sealed sub for the dual 10" sub route (200 or 300 watt) OR sell the one B&W ASW610 and buy one ported, bigger sub? I've looked at HSU, SVS and all of the well built subwoofers. If I match the asw610, I want to pay about $600 or so. If I switch to one ported and sell the asw610, I could go to $1000ish. Would i lose the balanced feel with one big, ported sub? I know I would gain range etc.

My preference is big bass, but balanced. I'm not into the technical jargon and not real picky....just want a well balanced, big, punchy bass sound for movies that shake the house for those awesome scenes. I am almost 100% movies rather than music in this room.

Thx for the recommendations.
Hi,

I want to echo all the good advice you have already gotten, and to add a couple of thoughts of my own. First, I believe that based on your description of what you are looking for, you should definitely go with a ported sub. Ported subs are larger and more expensive than their sealed counterparts specifically in order to deliver more loud, low bass. And, we especially notice the extra SPL and tactile benefits of that in 5.1 movies.

Second, I believe that a really powerful subwoofer will change the way that you perceive bass in movies. As most of us add subwoofage, we find that our awareness of, and appetite for, bass increases. So, I would start with a single ported sub, and go as large as my budget would permit me to go. If your budget is $1000 and you need to stick with that, so be it, but I wouldn't try to accommodate two less powerful subs within that budget. I would start with a single good one, with a plan to add a second one when the opportunity presents itself.

I believe that you will want to work your way back to dual subs. But, that can be a process for most of us. If you start with two lesser subs now, it can be difficult to ever get all the low extension you want from them without replacing and upgrading both subs. If you start with one really good sub, adding a second will increase your headroom and help to smooth your frequency response, but you will already have most (or all) of the low extension you are after.

FWIW, I believe that there is a lot of difference between an HT system that can go down effectively to about 20Hz or 22Hz, and a system that can go down to about 15 or 16Hz with some significant SPL. The floor shaking effects are primarily <20Hz, for instance. So, the low extension that you can get with a single larger, more powerful sub, can be an important aspect of the initial buying decision.

Regards,
Mike
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post #16 of 19 Old 08-23-2017, 12:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for everyone's sound advice. I appreciate having a place to go directional information. It's a tremendous help.

I am leaning towards 1k now and 1k later. V1801 looks pretty sweet and no doubt the sound is right but the price...eek. I like the v1500 but 15 vs 18? Is 18" going to make that much of an improvement? Some would say hell yes! I've been out of town and just measured to the bottom of the screen and it's 25". Might not look good at 25" height. Could put it in the back of the room with no problems but puts a damper on the dual eventually.

Also like the hsu vtf-15h or vtf-3 mk5. $100 diff worth it for 2 hz lower or other bennies?

This decision will take some time for sure.
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post #17 of 19 Old 08-23-2017, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Scurly View Post
Thanks for everyone's sound advice. I appreciate having a place to go directional information. It's a tremendous help.

I am leaning towards 1k now and 1k later. V1801 looks pretty sweet and no doubt the sound is right but the price...eek. I like the v1500 but 15 vs 18? Is 18" going to make that much of an improvement? Some would say hell yes! I've been out of town and just measured to the bottom of the screen and it's 25". Might not look good at 25" height. Could put it in the back of the room with no problems but puts a damper on the dual eventually.

Also like the hsu vtf-15h or vtf-3 mk5. $100 diff worth it for 2 hz lower or other bennies?

This decision will take some time for sure.
You are very welcome to any advice I can give! I think that the V1500 would be an excellent choice, and you could always trade up later to a V1801 if you really had a yen to try the 18" driver. But, FWIW, I don't think that there is any special magic in an 18" driver. There are a lot of people with 15" subs who are getting very good low frequency extension and SPL. The main thing, in my opinion is to try to get as much sub as you think you can reasonably afford. And, if you can preserve an upgrade path in the process, all the better. Basically, you would be paying for shipping both ways, but PSA would typically work with customers to keep that from being too expensive.

If I were you, I wouldn't worry too much about the 25" height. You can lay any of these subs on their sides and they will function perfectly well. It won't affect the subs performance at all, and in some cases might work even better from the standpoint of frequency response. That's a trial-and-error thing, and depends on specific placement in a room. So, you would still be able to preserve your future flexibility for front/back placement. I'm not specifically trying to direct you toward PSA subs (I'm an SVS owner myself) but for your budget, either a V1500, or if you want to stretch a little further, a V1801, would be hard to beat.

Regards,
Mike
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post #18 of 19 Old 08-23-2017, 05:17 PM
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Also like the hsu vtf-15h or vtf-3 mk5. $100 diff worth it for 2 hz lower or other bennies?
Ask Hsu and get advice from the horse's mouth! The VTF-3 mk5 comes in Rosewood and the other doesn't (albeit for more money, but maybe your wife would like it a lot more. Better show her pictures before buying anything methinks). And several decibels more it seems, from a similar size.

Yeah, if you really want to slam, that is probably indicating something besides B&W much as I respect their regular speaker engineering.
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post #19 of 19 Old 08-23-2017, 05:44 PM
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My personal choice would be the $950 PSA 15V, which is extremely close in performance to the $150 more expensive V1500. Both give you a full 5 year warranty, while with HSU you have to pay extra to get the amp warranty to 5 years. PSA subs are also single ported, which I prefer over the either/or extension/output with the dual ported HSU subs. Others like the dual ported design, so it's just personal preference.

Rec Room>Vivitek 1080p projector w/100" screen/Hisense 65" 4K, Onkyo TXNR656, Klipsch KF-28 L/R, KC-25 center, KB-15 side, Loft 40 rear, RBH I-12/e (x2), I-12 (x2) subs. Living Room>Sammy 59" Plasma, Onkyo HTRC560, Primus P363 L/R, P163 center, Polk RC60i in-wall rears, SVS PB12-NSD (x2) subs. PC set up> 27" LG IPS, Onkyo TXNR509, Polk M60 SII, SVS PC12-NSD (x2) subs. Master Bedroom>Samsung 42" LED, Pioneer VSX532, Denon 5 spkr set, Bic V1020 sub. Gaming> PS4 (x2), PS3, XBox One (x2), XBox 360
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