* Offical Velodyne Support Thread * - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 9850 Old 10-01-2003, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Yousaf
Curt or Bruce,

I was also wondering if either of you could answer my question (on the 2nd page)

Thanks.

Hi Yousaf,
We both sent you a PM on your question. Are you not getting them? I tracked the one I sent and it shows 'unopened'.
Curt
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post #62 of 9850 Old 10-01-2003, 01:43 PM
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Oh boy, now I'm a little embarrassed...I think I checked my PMs right before he sent it then haven't looked again since, figuring one of you would mention it in the thread. My mistake, sorry I'm following up with Bruce now.
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post #63 of 9850 Old 10-01-2003, 01:51 PM
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When are the HGSx sub's shipping? What is their MSRP? Any pictures of the finish?

Hear me now, Listen to me later....
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post #64 of 9850 Old 10-01-2003, 10:49 PM
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Curt,

Thanks for the reply.

Henry
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post #65 of 9850 Old 10-02-2003, 12:07 AM
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Welcome to the forum Bruce. Do you ever consult with M&Ks Barry, or Doug, or any of the SVS and HSU folks to try to find happy mediums with competition and share any design creativity simultaneously? I understand the world of making things different, but sub manufacturers share some common ground. Thanks for your time.
Scott

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post #66 of 9850 Old 10-02-2003, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tom Grooms
When are the HGSx sub's shipping? What is their MSRP? Any pictures of the finish?

Hi Tom,
HGSx's should be shipping by the end of this month. No pictures yet. List price will be $1999. for the 12, and $2499. for the 15.
Thanks,
Curt
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post #67 of 9850 Old 10-02-2003, 11:23 AM
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Curt or David,

I seem to recall the compression ratio of the HGS series(as it approached it's predetermined limits) as being approximately 8:1...a ratio which some folks derided as being a bit too strict. Care to comment on the compression ratio of the new DD models?

thanks,

Randy
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post #68 of 9850 Old 10-02-2003, 06:08 PM
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Bruce,
What are your thoughts on manufacturing your subs out of the USA?
Are you solicited by overseas manufacturers?

Always wondered how this works....
Thanks in advance...

PS Thanks for NOT doing so.
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post #69 of 9850 Old 10-02-2003, 07:02 PM
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Bruce,

I am currently using a pair of HGS 18's in a 2048 cu ft bedroom based system. I use an ART 1/3 octave graphic in conjunction with a RANE PE-17 five band parametric for room correction equalization.

In your opinion would a pair of DD18's offer better performance?

Thank you,
John
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post #70 of 9850 Old 10-02-2003, 09:55 PM
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Looking for better performance than 2- HGS-18's in 2000 cu.ft.??? You're kidding, right?

Ran
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post #71 of 9850 Old 10-03-2003, 09:59 AM
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Quote:


Curt or David,

I seem to recall the compression ratio of the HGS series(as it approached it's predetermined limits) as being approximately 8:1...a ratio which some folks derided as being a bit too strict. Care to comment on the compression ratio of the new DD models?

thanks,

Randy

Hi Randy,
Not sure where that 8:1 number came from, but it's a bit overstated. Another way to look at compression is in terms on internal box pressure, which for DD subs (varies depending on model) comes in at somewhere between .3 and .5 PSI or possibly a bit higher. If we start at sea level of 14.7 PSI, and add .3 PSI, we get 15/14.7 which comes out to only about 1.02 to one.

This is still quite a bit of air compression by speaker standards, but it's not nearly the same as, say, a racing engine that takes air/gas and compresses it mightily with a long throw large diameter metal piston before igniting it.

Still, this compression does cause non-linearity that is corrected by the combination of dual voice coils and the digital servo.

Hope this helps,
Bruce

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Velodyne Acoustics
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post #72 of 9850 Old 10-03-2003, 10:19 AM
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Bruce,

Thanks for the reply, but perhaps I should have used the term "limiter" instead of compression ration. What I was curious to know was how agressive the limiter is on the signal as it reaches it's excursion limits. I believe that it was either one of your techies(maybe Curt?) that threw out that 8:1 ratio(at the predetermined excursion limit, for every 8dbl of spl signal increase, only 1 dbl gets thru)or some of the "basshead" folks over at Home Theater Forum had tested some of them, I forgot which. Of course, this is to protect the driver from over excursion damage and/or too much distortion, but as I said, some folks thought that the concern for that ultra low distortion on the bottom end came at a little bit of a sacrifice of ultimate volume. Perhaps the increase in driver excursion in the new models will ameliorate that concern. I'm looking forward to a demo of these new models. Congrats on such a high-tech approach.


Randy
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post #73 of 9850 Old 10-03-2003, 01:52 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by John H
Bruce,

I am currently using a pair of HGS 18's in a 2048 cu ft bedroom based system. I use an ART 1/3 octave graphic in conjunction with a RANE PE-17 five band parametric for room correction equalization.

In your opinion would a pair of DD18's offer better performance?

Thank you,
John

Hi John,
You certainly have enough subwoofer for the room. I'm not familiar with the Rane or ART that you are using. The DD's EQ has 8 bands that are adjustable as to frequency and width of frequency spectrum. Included is a very high quality (bass) calibrated microphone. In addition it offers the most flexible crossover ever designed. You can choose frequency, slope, phase and many other parameters including fine tuning the servo. So if you are having issues with equalizing or integrating the DD would certainly offer you more flexibility.
Curt
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post #74 of 9850 Old 10-03-2003, 02:30 PM
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I just realized that if you can "fine tune the servo", you can loosen it up a bit to get the volume down low....great idea!

Ran
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post #75 of 9850 Old 10-04-2003, 08:09 PM
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Bruce or Curt, why is it that no one sells the CHT Satellite speakers? I have never seen any local in Washington state nor even knew Velodyne made anything other then subs. So another question is also why don't you advertise them or get the word out about the CHT Satellite speakers? Why don't more stores in Washington state carry velodyne and the CHT sat speakers?
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post #76 of 9850 Old 10-05-2003, 10:33 AM
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What are the differences between a DD series sub and a standard sub combined with a Behringer Feedback Destroyer?
Do they share any similar parts?
(this may be a stupid question since I have zero experience with the BFD.)
I ask this because the microphone is nearly identical.
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post #77 of 9850 Old 10-06-2003, 02:57 PM
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Quote:


Bruce,
What are your thoughts on manufacturing your subs out of the USA?
Are you solicited by overseas manufacturers?

Always wondered how this works....
Thanks in advance...

PS Thanks for NOT doing so.

Quote:


What are the differences between a DD series sub and a standard sub combined with a Behringer Feedback Destroyer?
Do they share any similar parts?
(this may be a stupid question since I have zero experience with the BFD.)
I ask this because the microphone is nearly identical.

Hi Cajun,
Let me do a twofer with you...

Regarding made in USA, to us it is a matter of quality control. There are many fine subs, speakers, and other consumer electronic components designed in the U.S. but made, either wholly or partly, outside the U.S. (China is a hugely popular source for the speaker industry). We make DD here so we can keep control over the quality - it is simply too new and detailed a product to make anywhere else.

Re the BFD - I'm not too familiar with the component but I can tell you that is shares NO technology whatsoever with DD - DD is completely designed and programmed by us with no external or OEM'd components.

Hope this helps...

Bruce

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Velodyne Acoustics
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post #78 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 06:39 AM
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Hi Bruce...I'll aim this 1 here rather then at AV talk as you seem to be local here

Does the SPL 1200 go deeper then the CHT 15 or are they similar?

i've no concerns over size only over depth and how clean it goes down.

Thanks in advance..

Respectamonkeeee@hotmail.com MSN
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post #79 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 08:27 AM
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Hi,
Yes the SPL-1200 goes a little deeper and is a bit more accurate than the CHT-15. The SPL is a very musical sub and handles home theater fine in a small to medium room. The CHT-15 is a better choice for home theater in a large room or home theater on a budget.
Curt
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post #80 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 08:37 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by buggs1a
Bruce or Curt, why is it that no one sells the CHT Satellite speakers? I have never seen any local in Washington state nor even knew Velodyne made anything other then subs. So another question is also why don't you advertise them or get the word out about the CHT Satellite speakers? Why don't more stores in Washington state carry velodyne and the CHT sat speakers?

Hi Joe,
We certainly try to place our satellites in as many places as possible. We have and will continue to advertise our speakers. In the current issue of 'Sound & Vision' we are running a full page ad on the DECO system. If anyone is having a problem purchasing our speakers, let us know and we will make every attempt to put you in touch with a dealer.
Curt
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post #81 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 09:13 AM
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For those interested in the Deco ..


Here is a review done last year from Home Theater Hifi on the Deco system...


http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...ne-9-2002.html


Here is a shootout against the Deco sat and several others..
You'll see the Deco came in second for lowest distortion @ 110db & 1.52 %.


http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...up-9-2002.html


Deco review @ Sound and Vision..........
"Bruce was absolutely The Boss on the Deco, with his voice sounding more natural and less abrasive than it did on the other systems, yet still authoritative. Clark Terry wailed with pure honey, although the system tended to gloss over a bit of his horn's inherent edginess. And the sub produced ample bass without thumping its port. The Velodyne Deco system has the heftiest price tag of the four systems here, but it's money well spent.
In this comparison at least, price was a pretty accurate indicator of quality. The $1,499 Velodyne system takes top honors for sound."

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...&page_number=1


http://mywebpages.comcast.net/bentva...sidethebox.jpg


Curt, I would like to see the review from The Perfect Vision from 5/03, can you post it? Otherwise I found a site that will sell it to me for $3.

http://www.avguide.com/product/Compl...ystem/2484.jsp



I going to dedicate one of my webpages to the Deco system, I am going to post pictures of my theater with the Deco system as well as include some tips, my personal review of the speakers as briefs of the above reviews.
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post #82 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 10:02 AM
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Thanks Curt, my problem is that no one in Washington State sells your Satellite speakers that I know. I checked your site and Circuit City and Video Only were the only place that sells Velodyne in like zip code 98188 or anywhere, might just be the zip code, Video Only does not anymore, they don't even carry the subs. The Satellite for sure not. Circuit City does not carry anything except subs and they even say they didn't even know you make satellites. So this really bothered me and made me have my cousin order the CHT series without my being able to even demo them anywhere, BUT, I'm fairly confident I'll like them and so will the fam here.

Where are some CHT Satellite speaker reviews? I've done searching and all I come up with are online warehouses that sell stuff.
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post #83 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 10:36 AM
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Joe,
For a very complete review on the CHT Satellites go to www.hometheaterhifi.com and enter Velodyne in the search box and the forth review down is the one you're looking for.
Curt
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post #84 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 10:46 AM
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Hi James,
I'm sorry we are not able to post the DECO review from 'The Perfect Vision' at this time. We are going to completely redo our website in the near future and it will include owner's manuals and reviews and the most complete information on subwoofers available.
Thanks for all your feedback.
Curt
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post #85 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 11:18 AM
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Curt,

As long as you're redoing the site, you might want to have the designer throw in the couple extra lines of code for us lowly webtv users...it's barely viewable in its current form...yeah, I know...get a "real" computer.

Ran
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post #86 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 04:47 PM
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Quote:


Thanks for the reply, but perhaps I should have used the term "limiter" instead of compression ration. What I was curious to know was how agressive the limiter is on the signal as it reaches it's excursion limits. I believe that it was either one of your techies(maybe Curt?) that threw out that 8:1 ratio(at the predetermined excursion limit, for every 8dbl of spl signal increase, only 1 dbl gets thru)or some of the "basshead" folks over at Home Theater Forum had tested some of them, I forgot which. Of course, this is to protect the driver from over excursion damage and/or too much distortion, but as I said, some folks thought that the concern for that ultra low distortion on the bottom end came at a little bit of a sacrifice of ultimate volume. Perhaps the increase in driver excursion in the new models will ameliorate that concern. I'm looking forward to a demo of these new models. Congrats on such a high-tech approach.

Hi Randy,

Yes, there are gain limiters on every sub we sell. We've always believed strongly that a driver should be carefully matched with its amplifier and control circuitry for exactly the reasons you've stated - protecting the driver from over excursion and damage. The exact formulas we use for gain limitation differ from sub to sub - I can show you code in DD for example that accounts for the mass of the cone, the size of the cabinet, and other factors as they differ between the 10, 12, 15 and 18 in determining what parameters need to be fed into the digital gain limiting filters.

We do care about distortion but don't limit output to minimize it, as some might believe. We limit output only when the cone is reaching its maximum travel limits. The main job of the limiter is to protect against rogue signals that could bottom out the woofer violently. Distortion comes when a cone travels beyond its point of linearity ? that is, travels near the edge of the suspension limits and/or nears the outside of the magnetic gap. The box designs, servos, dual coils, and other design factors we use for our subs do more to limit distortion (i.e. maximize accuracy) than any gain limiter might do. Of course, a sub must have lots of output, which is why we use very heavy magnets, long throw drivers and lots of power - to provide the cleanest, loudest output possible.


Hope this helps to clarify this...

Bruce

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Velodyne Acoustics
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post #87 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 06:21 PM
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To Bruce and Curt,

Thank you for your reply, it looks as though for the size of my room and for overall performance the Digital Drive Series 12" Sub may be the best way to go instead of the SPL 1200 II. However, I have been unable to locate a dealer here in Ontario that has any in stock. It seems as though any 12" Sub in either the SPL or Digital Drive line is very hard to obtain from Velodyne. Any item on a time frame that these units may arrive to Canadian Dealers?

Regards,
Matthew
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post #88 of 9850 Old 10-07-2003, 06:52 PM
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Curt, thanks, but that review is not for the CHT-14 and 24 speakers. it's for much older speakers or something. Where can I find a review on the speakers that are actually at your site? the CHT14 and 24?
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post #89 of 9850 Old 10-08-2003, 10:35 AM
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When should we look for a software upgrade for the DD's later than version 1.2?
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post #90 of 9850 Old 10-08-2003, 10:44 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Woodley71
To Bruce and Curt,

Thank you for your reply, it looks as though for the size of my room and for overall performance the Digital Drive Series 12" Sub may be the best way to go instead of the SPL 1200 II. However, I have been unable to locate a dealer here in Ontario that has any in stock. It seems as though any 12" Sub in either the SPL or Digital Drive line is very hard to obtain from Velodyne. Any item on a time frame that these units may arrive to Canadian Dealers?

Regards,
Matthew

Hi Mathew,
WE have product available in both DD and SPLII, in all sizes. We're shipping orders daily.
Curt
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