* Offical Velodyne Support Thread * - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 9685 Old 10-08-2003, 11:00 AM
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When should we look for a software upgrade for the DD's later than version 1.2?

We've got some updates in mind that we are working on, but don't have a final schedule yet. Unlike Microsoft products, there are no "critical updates" required to prevent a security breach or fix obvious bugs!

Bruce

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post #92 of 9685 Old 10-08-2003, 11:01 AM
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Woodley71,
That's what I thought until I realized my dealer was not authorized for the DD line.
He somehow could get me the HGS but not the DD (said the DD was not distributed thru "distribution" but direct only?).
Meanwhile several months went by with no sub.
He finally admitted it.
I had to get a refund & purchase it thru an authorized dealer.
FWIW, it made absolutely no difference since I set it up myself.
Also the Velo website won't tell you who is authorized to sell DD.
PS Circuit City is NOT authorized
Curt fixed me up
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post #93 of 9685 Old 10-08-2003, 11:53 AM
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Just a thought:
Personally I dont think Velodyne is getting the proper represention to the masses, Good Guys and Circuit City being the main chains that the majority of the people can get their first taste of Velodyne, the stuff they carry is excellent but IMO its not enough. I think you need to saturate each store with your product so the consumer has a wider selection and price/quality range to choose from. Its too easy to look at something else when a newb goes into CCs listening room and sees a sea of speakers with only a few specs of Velodydne. I'd like to see Velodyne go internet direct .
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post #94 of 9685 Old 10-08-2003, 02:05 PM
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The internet direct model is not gonna work with a company that also sells retail through audio specialty shops - unless each channel gets separate and distinct product lines.

I want a Masquerade.
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post #95 of 9685 Old 10-09-2003, 09:55 AM
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Hello Bruce,
I am about to buy Velo sub. My current setup is
Amp: Arcam P7
Pre-Amp Arcam AV8
LF and RF: NHT 1.5
RL and RR NHT SuperOnes
SL and SR NHT Super Zeros
Center Speaker: NHT Audio Center 1
I am considering an upgrade to some of those speakers, but am not sure yet.

The room: it is a large space, room opens into a largish corridor and a kitchen. There are various dividers like pillars, floor-to-ceiling cabinets. I attache a picture, the green dots are the speekers, the blu would be the sub and the red line is the screen. The main part of the room has about 45sq. meters and the rest (corridor and other) another 30sq. meters (the hight of the rooms is 2.6m). I sit about 5-6m from the screen.
Which of the subs would be the best for me. I was considering DD15 or DD18? Wouldn't they be too big?? I was also thinking about HGS18 (could get it in Poland, this is where I live, for $2900, ex-demo 110V version wich in Poland requires a transformer from 220v to 110V I would get a third party transformer, do you think it is worth it???). However, I thought that DD series would be much better due to the irregular shape of the room ( i might hit serious problems setting up the HGS18. Pls help, as in Poland this is very difficult to listen to any of your subs, as they do not have anything in stock and I have to make up my mind purely on reviews, recommendations and the internet.

One last question, can place the DD18 on its side as it is too tall to fit in a place I would like to keep it (given I woul dgo for DD18)
Thank you very much
Adam Rodecki
LL
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post #96 of 9685 Old 10-09-2003, 11:21 AM
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Bruce or curt - what do you guys recommend when placing Velodyne subs on hardwood floor - nothing, spikes, marble slab, etc? Please answer in general, and also specifically in regards to the SLP-12. Thanks.

I want a Masquerade.
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post #97 of 9685 Old 10-09-2003, 12:01 PM
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Mit07
I certainly would not use spikes on a hardwood floor. I prefer a small rug or rubber mat. I see nothing wrong with using a slab of marble or other solid material. Some users have had the small subs, like the SPL-12, move a bit on hardwood floors, that's why I like the rug or mat solution. Performance should be the same regardless.
Thanks,
Curt
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post #98 of 9685 Old 10-09-2003, 01:30 PM
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I too pondered laying
a rug atop my head,
but visions of slipping and sliding
filled my head with thoughts of dread.
So now I leave it bare
for everyone to see;
the shine from my subwoofer,
my maple floor, and me.


thank you, thank you very much

Ran
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post #99 of 9685 Old 10-12-2003, 04:51 PM
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Hi guys,
I just auditioned the new mighty velodyne DD18 in a medium sized room at my local dealer. I was very impresed with it's EQ's and all the adjustable settings.
But when we auditioned the Two Towers dvd in the Helm's Deep explosion I wasn't comletely blowen away.
Don't get me wrong it was very impresive with excellent bass extension,but when we compared the DD18 to the older HGS15 it wasn't a night and day difference. The HGS15 had probably 3-4 db less overal output then the DD18.
I am wondering if anybody has any first hand experience with the new DD subs.
Gabor
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post #100 of 9685 Old 10-12-2003, 07:05 PM
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I'll betcha 3-4 dbs is about right, but you'll get a little bit lower extension to boot with the "18".
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post #101 of 9685 Old 10-12-2003, 07:59 PM
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I agre the the bass was lower, tactile extension was noticably lower.
The point I was trying to make is in my opinion the DD18 compare to the HGS18 might be identical or very close in ultimate output.
But than agin maybe the DD18 wasn't optimized for the room or at least it wasn't set up right for movies as the DD18 have the option to loosen the servo for Movies/Music mode.
I still think the new DD subs are a great choice for either movies or a music system. I would love to try one out with my own setup and speakers my room is only 14 by 19 so I might give a DD15 a try
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post #102 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 06:55 AM
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Bruce,

Just so you guys know I purchased the Velodyne Deco Home Theater Speaker System after reading about them online. I listened to them at Circuit City before and thought they sounded great. Since they were going in my den I wasn't sure I wanted to invest that much and I was hoping for styling that would disappear in the room.

After a little research online I gave them another listen and not finding any other speakers with such a transparent sound (versus "boomy") that I could listen to for hour after hour I was sold.

I didn't find this thread until after I purchased them but your online presence does help!
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post #103 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 09:17 AM
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Good choice on the Deco's , I love mine. This weekend I decided to give mine a good workout and see what sort of SPLs I could extract out of them. I am running my Decos with a Yamaha RX-V3300 which is just one step down from their Flagship Z1. I bought both the Deco and the receiver at the same time so both of them needed to get a good run in.
Two channel purists might not like it but I found that the Deco system in my small room sound awesome with Yamaha's 8 channel stereo DSP mode.
The Deco's took everything the 3300 could dish out, I know I had the amp at near full output because I got the fan to kick in, the Decos never sounded strained. The 5 Decos and the Deco sub can go VERY VERY loud! I wont say just how loud though because I dont want my warranty voided. The 5 Decos and Deco sub go much louder than my 80lb 4' tall Adire Kit281 speakers which use dual 8" drivers and 1" tweeters and the Kit281s go louder than many commerical speakers.
Amazingly the Deco subwoofer could hang in with the sats all the way up to even the highest SPLs.
I am using my Decos in my 12'x8.5' dedicated HT room and I am confident that they could be used in a room 2X the size and still have some headroom left.

BTW the Decos seem to sound better and better as they break in more, they really opened up nicely after the hard run in this weekend.

Good Luck with your Decos.
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post #104 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 09:19 AM
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Charles,
Thanks for the positive feedback on the DECO system. It's truly a fine system and outstanding value.

Curt
Velodyne Acoustics
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post #105 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 09:32 AM
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Gabi,
Under the same measured conditions, the DD-15 will play 3-4db louder than the HGS-15. The DD-18 will play 6-8db louder than an HGS-15. We added an additional 1/4" throw to the DD drivers. For your room size the DD-15 will do a great job.
Curt
Velodyne Acoustics
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post #106 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 09:45 AM
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curt c
I was wondering if you can list the msrp for the DD12 and let me know how I find a specific dealer that carries the dd line (zip code is 03841).
Thanks
~Glenn
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post #107 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 10:01 AM
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List price for the DD-12 is $2999. Sorry, I can't locate a dealer by zip code. Please check our dealer locater at our website; www.velodyne.com I think it goes by area code.
Thanks for your interest,
Curt
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post #108 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 11:15 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by curt c
List price for the DD-12 is $2999. Sorry, I can't locate a dealer by zip code. Please check our dealer locater at our website; www.velodyne.com I think it goes by area code.
Thanks for your interest,
Curt

Thanks
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post #109 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 11:20 AM
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Gabi - when you get to the HGS15 / DD18 level the point of diminishing returns levels off. The differences become more subtle and will certainly not be night and day different.

I want a Masquerade.
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post #110 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 04:13 PM
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curt c,
Can you explain the difference between the Movie/Music setting on the DD sub.
Is the Movie setting basicaly let's the servo produce a couple of extra db spl for a higher distortion compare to the very low distortion in the Music setting, or is it more like an adjustably Q controll like on the Linn or Monitor Audio FPB212 sub?
I am also wondering how much more max spl in the movie mode compare to the music?
Thank you,
Gabor
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post #111 of 9685 Old 10-13-2003, 04:27 PM
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Bruce / Curt:

I have a rather large void to fill. I don't have precise dimensions to provide, but ceilling is 12' and although the viewing / listening area is not overly large (+/- 30' x 35'), there are no physical boundaries on into the formal dining area, kitchen and dinette (big "great room", open archetecture). In other words, a lot of on-going "back space".

One of my (wife's) requirements is that the sub be as small as (im)possible. Common story of woe. Worse, the sub won't quite be in the corner but near it; maybe somewhat shrouded by a leather chair. Argggh.

Seems that Velodyne offers the smallest subs with the most punch. Do you think the DD12 would do the job; primarily for DVD movies? With all the potential accoustical problems due to location, the equilization feature might help to overcome the disadvantages.

Any advise appreciated.

DFA

Wrong information is worse than no information.
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post #112 of 9685 Old 10-14-2003, 05:31 AM
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Bruce,

I have had my Velodyne VA-810X since July 1995 and have had to replace the Passive Radiator three (3) times in that period because of splitting. This seems to be excessive to me and I'm just wondering if you may know of any causes for it. I'm not playing it at extremely loud levels (the dial on the back never goes past 4) and I only watch around 3-4 movies per week so it's not excessively used either. Each time I've replaced it, I have only used original Velodyne parts but of the same type as the original. I wonder if I should use another type or 'grade' of Passive Radiator on it that can last longer.

Any thoughts?

Regards,
Steve.
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post #113 of 9685 Old 10-14-2003, 06:42 AM
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DFA,

If you are strictly limited by subwoofer size(and yes, Velo and Sunfire give you the most punch for size, with the former giving less distortion and the latter, a little more spl), I would seriously consider the installation of some type of tactile transducer(Clark Synthesis, Buttkicker, RBH, Aura etc) to give you more of the oomph you'll lose by not having a BIG subwoofer. You'd be amazed at how well these work.

Ran
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post #114 of 9685 Old 10-14-2003, 09:31 AM
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Curt, I have a quick question about the Deco Satellites, what exactly is the "Automatic resetting solid state "muting" device" ? I got a little carried away trying to push the front stereo pair of Deco sats and the sound cut out for a short time then came back on. I am pretty sure I was not clipping my amp but I probably sent a solid 130 or so clean watts to them before they cut out.

Also I have had the system long enough to be able to nitpick about a few things or actually just one. I find the center channel lacking a tad bit , what are the odds of you guys making a decidated center channel for this system?

One possible solution I have is the try moving the subwoofer closer to the center channel speaker. Right now the subwoofer sits in the back of the room so the lower octaves in voices that has to be handled by the subwoofer are probably arriving at my ears out of time.
Another SPL800 would really help though but then I would have to deal with possible bass cancelation issues.
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post #115 of 9685 Old 10-14-2003, 09:46 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by DFA
Bruce / Curt:

I have a rather large void to fill. I don't have precise dimensions to provide, but ceilling is 12' and although the viewing / listening area is not overly large (+/- 30' x 35'), there are no physical boundaries on into the formal dining area, kitchen and dinette (big "great room", open archetecture). In other words, a lot of on-going "back space".

One of my (wife's) requirements is that the sub be as small as (im)possible. Common story of woe. Worse, the sub won't quite be in the corner but near it; maybe somewhat shrouded by a leather chair. Argggh.

Seems that Velodyne offers the smallest subs with the most punch. Do you think the DD12 would do the job; primarily for DVD movies? With all the potential accoustical problems due to location, the equilization feature might help to overcome the disadvantages.

Any advise appreciated.

DFA,
Given the size of your 'open area', you would need a DD-18 or a pair of them to do it right. In your case it's more about energizing than equalizing. The DD-12 is certainly the best small sub available and you might be able to try one out and see what it does. The DD-15 would be a much better option if you can get it past the wife. It's still fairly small.
Good Luck,
Curt

DFA

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post #116 of 9685 Old 10-14-2003, 10:56 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by James W. Johnson
Curt, I have a quick question about the Deco Satellites, what exactly is the "Automatic resetting solid state "muting" device" ? I got a little carried away trying to push the front stereo pair of Deco sats and the sound cut out for a short time then came back on. I am pretty sure I was not clipping my amp but I probably sent a solid 130 or so clean watts to them before they cut out.

Also I have had the system long enough to be able to nitpick about a few things or actually just one. I find the center channel lacking a tad bit , what are the odds of you guys making a decidated center channel for this system?

One possible solution I have is the try moving the subwoofer closer to the center channel speaker. Right now the subwoofer sits in the back of the room so the lower octaves in voices that has to be handled by the subwoofer are probably arriving at my ears out of time.
Another SPL800 would really help though but then I would have to deal with possible bass cancelation issues.

Hi James,
The muting device is a thermal switch. When heat reaches a certain point it shuts the speaker down, and resumes after a short cool down. At the moment we have no plans to build a dedicated center channel for the DECO system. Most experts feel all five speakers should be identical if possible. I have the sub up front in my system and have never noticed an issue with the voices.
Curt
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post #117 of 9685 Old 10-15-2003, 05:33 PM
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Quote:


curt c,
Can you explain the difference between the Movie/Music setting on the DD sub.
Is the Movie setting basicaly let's the servo produce a couple of extra db spl for a higher distortion compare to the very low distortion in the Music setting, or is it more like an adjustably Q controll like on the Linn or Monitor Audio FPB212 sub?
I am also wondering how much more max spl in the movie mode compare to the music?

Gabi,
I'll take this one if it's okay. TO understand the movie/music setting, first let me explain the servo system. It is based on an accelerometer that senses cone motion and reports it back to the digital controller where it is compared to the input signal and the cone motion corrected as needed. This happens between 6,000 and 15,800 times per second. The more it happens, the tigher the cone motion and the lower the distortion. Distortion is directly related to how loud the woofer plays, as distortion by-products add to the total output of the woofer.

The theater/music setting controls the servo. The theatrical setting (setting 1), causes the cone to be corrected at 6,000 times per second. The music setting (setting 8) causes the full 15,800 times per second correction. The settings in between control the servo in between accordingly. As a reference, HGS corrected at around 3,500 times per second, so even at the lowest setting, the servo is still doing quite a bit of cone correction.

So, action adventure will play louder since there is more distortion, but how much louder is heavily dependant on the frequency of the source material. For example, 60 Hz will play louder since it is closer to resonance, and there may be more output at 120 Hz (the second harmonic distortion product of 60 Hz). There may actually be a bit less infrasonic playback, since the servo ensures flat response down to 15 Hz and below - some of this effect is lost when turning down the servo loop gain.

Overall, look for a couple dB louder for action adventure, and look for the lowest dostortion at setting 8 (Jazz/Classical out of the box).

Hope this helps,
Bruce

Bruce Hall
Velodyne Acoustics
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post #118 of 9685 Old 10-15-2003, 07:25 PM
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Bruce / Curt:
Thanks for the explanation.
Right now I have an HGS12II for a home trial, and the sub is pretty impressive with deep extension and output. (16 by 19 room ).
My plan is to upgrade to the DD15 which should be more than enough in my room.
Actually my dealer has a DD12 in stock, but I don't think it would be a worthwhile investment over the HGS12. (He also has a DD18 in stock)
Thanks for the info,
Gabi
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post #119 of 9685 Old 10-16-2003, 06:19 PM
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Guys,
Am I right in thinking you've never produced downward firers, and what is the reasoning behind this. Although my preference is for forward firers, I know there's some great downward firers out there notably from SVS and a few others.

Also, are there any plans in the near future to send one of the DD models for review. Mr Johnson did a superb job with his HGS-18 review some time ago and I'm looking forward to seeing reviews by folks of equal standing.

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post #120 of 9685 Old 10-16-2003, 09:44 PM
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Hi Eric,
The original Velodyne's, the ULD series were all down firers. It was mainly to get it past the wife as furniture. Subwoofers weren't very popular then. Fortunately things have changed. We made these units from the early 1980's through the middle 1990's. Since then it's been all front firing.
There are currently three DD-18's out for review and a couple of 12's. John Johnson has an eighteen and should have his review on line very soon.
Thanks,
Curt
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