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post #9631 of 10424 Old 08-04-2014, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post
No. The graph "window" goes to 87 dB. You just need to keep all the peaks below 87 dB. If some of the peaks are above 87 dB, just lower the overall level until they're into the 87 dB "window", EQ the peaks down, then re-raise the overall level.


It's been a few years since I used an SMS-1, but IIRC, you just use Preset 1, which is the "flat" preset. The SMS-1 manual would be able to confirm this.

Craig
here is my base line, whats your thought ?
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post #9632 of 10424 Old 08-04-2014, 10:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motogp34 View Post
here is my base line, whats your thought ?
I am also using an SMS-1 and pair it with REW and a calibration mic to allow me to logically model the filters that I then manually enter into the SMS. One thing I have also noted is that the SMS-1 readout is pretty low resolution (or heavily smoothed). I would recommend using a REW setup to actually calibrate the setup.

My goal is to use the SMS to flatten out the bass response between 20hz to 80hz with Audyssey on but DEQ off. Then, after I have flattened the response, I turn back on DEQ to allow it to add the 'house curve'.

Couple of added notes:

1. I would definatley connect the EQ output on the SMS to an available RCA input on your receiver. This will allow you to see how well the sub is integrating with the mains at the crossover point (80hz in your case).

2. It looks like you have pretty large hump from 22hz up through 50hz. Now that may be DEQ (I did not see if you had it on or off). If it is on -- turn it off and see what your curves look like. If it is off -- then I would use the filters to pull that response down. Try to get it all relatively flat at 80db. Then around 63hz -- you have a big null. You could add a boost around there to try to EQ that -- but I don't think it you will get it flat as it looks like a steep null. If you can -- you may want to try varying the position of the subs if you can.

BTW -- Preset 6 is the EQ Defeat preset. I use Preset 2 as my standard preset once I have the curve set in the "Setup" preset.

Regards,

CT

Last edited by Skrill; 08-04-2014 at 11:39 AM.
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post #9633 of 10424 Old 08-04-2014, 02:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skrill View Post
I am also using an SMS-1 and pair it with REW and a calibration mic to allow me to logically model the filters that I then manually enter into the SMS. One thing I have also noted is that the SMS-1 readout is pretty low resolution (or heavily smoothed). I would recommend using a REW setup to actually calibrate the setup.

My goal is to use the SMS to flatten out the bass response between 20hz to 80hz with Audyssey on but DEQ off. Then, after I have flattened the response, I turn back on DEQ to allow it to add the 'house curve'.

Couple of added notes:

1. I would definatley connect the EQ output on the SMS to an available RCA input on your receiver. This will allow you to see how well the sub is integrating with the mains at the crossover point (80hz in your case).

2. It looks like you have pretty large hump from 22hz up through 50hz. Now that may be DEQ (I did not see if you had it on or off). If it is on -- turn it off and see what your curves look like. If it is off -- then I would use the filters to pull that response down. Try to get it all relatively flat at 80db. Then around 63hz -- you have a big null. You could add a boost around there to try to EQ that -- but I don't think it you will get it flat as it looks like a steep null. If you can -- you may want to try varying the position of the subs if you can.

BTW -- Preset 6 is the EQ Defeat preset. I use Preset 2 as my standard preset once I have the curve set in the "Setup" preset.

Regards,

CT
this is what i have
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post #9634 of 10424 Old 08-04-2014, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motogp34 View Post
this is what i have
Looks great below 63hz. But a big peak between there and 80hz -- you might want to address that. Again -- I would add in the mains if you can so you can see how everything is working at the crossover. BTW -- I am just a another user, and by no stretch an expert.

Also, when I bought mine, the seller sent me this link about how to use the SMS-1 which I found invaluable. It is the unofficial setup and use guide made by Outlaw. http://pdf.outlawaudio.com/outlaw/docs/sms1guide.pdf

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post #9635 of 10424 Old 08-04-2014, 05:25 PM
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It looks like you're using 2 bands and significant boost just above 63 Hz to try to boost that depression. It's generally not a good idea to "stack" filters like that. It can really stress the amps and drivers. Better to use just one band there and play around with the Q to impact the depression. Then move the other band up to the higher range and try to knock down that large peak. A wide Q band set at about 80 Hz should work.

However, as Skrill says, you should add in your mains to see how they affect the response around the crossover. If you're using an 80 Hz crossover, you should add the mains BEFORE you try to do anything at 80 Hz. In addition, the crossovers are not brick walls. The speakers could have a significant impact at 63 Hz and you may not need all that boost to get 63 Hz flat.

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post #9636 of 10424 Old 08-05-2014, 05:01 PM
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Speaking of Seaton Submersives.. Mark Seaton is coming out tomorrow to do a cursory install of 6 of them as I'm nearly done with my theater renovation (I had purchased 5, but Mark is certain, I needed one more)..

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post #9637 of 10424 Old 08-05-2014, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post






It looks like you're using 2 bands and significant boost just above 63 Hz to try to boost that depression. It's generally not a good idea to "stack" filters like that. It can really stress the amps and drivers. Better to use just one band there and play around with the Q to impact the depression. Then move the other band up to the higher range and try to knock down that large peak. A wide Q band set at about 80 Hz should work.

However, as Skrill says, you should add in your mains to see how they affect the response around the crossover. If you're using an 80 Hz crossover, you should add the mains BEFORE you try to do anything at 80 Hz. In addition, the crossovers are not brick walls. The speakers could have a significant impact at 63 Hz and you may not need all that boost to get 63 Hz flat.

Craig

updated eq

tried with speakers on but no help in dip

is the line good alone 80 or should i raise the overall level ?
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post #9638 of 10424 Old 08-10-2014, 11:27 PM
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I skipped the SMS and all other equalization i have. I am also not the biggest fan of Audysee, but went with a Audysee Pro calibration by Chad B. I believe i have achieved perfection. The Holy Grail of balance, music, sound effects. Listening to my pair of F2's after this, i just don't see how it can get better.

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post #9639 of 10424 Old 08-11-2014, 01:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgiorgio View Post
I skipped the SMS and all other equalization i have. I am also not the biggest fan of Audysee, but went with a Audysee Pro calibration by Chad B. I believe i have achieved perfection. The Holy Grail of balance, music, sound effects. Listening to my pair of F2's after this, i just don't see how it can get better.
4 F2's.
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post #9640 of 10424 Old 08-11-2014, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary J View Post
Yes you are right. Flat as possible to a target curve like Audyssey's is choosing a reference. Others are talking about a preference. Let's hope others in their room like their preference better than a standard known as reference.
Seriously???

I don't know how to break this to you but the human ear/brain perceives sound in a room differently at different volumes. (That 's called "science", and not "preference"). And one of many reasons that Audyssey offers Dynamic Volume. The curve presented by Roger that was developed by Harmon is an attempt to to find a sort of average static response (versus what Dynamic Volume does).
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Last edited by audioguy; 08-11-2014 at 09:28 AM.
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post #9641 of 10424 Old 08-11-2014, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post
4 F2's.
+1
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post #9642 of 10424 Old 08-11-2014, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post
Seriously???

I don't know how to break this to you but the human ear/brain perceives sound in a room differently at different volumes. (That 's called "science", and not "preference"). And one of many reasons that Audyssey offers Dynamic Volume. The curve presented by Roger that was developed by Harmon is an attempt to to find a sort of average static response (versus what Dynamic Volume does).
Did you see anyone say anything different or anything about volume in those posts? No? That is all my time you get to wate.
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post #9643 of 10424 Old 08-11-2014, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary J View Post
Did you see anyone say anything different or anything about volume in those posts? No? That is all my time you get to wate.
I have no interest in wanting to "wate" your time. Your post suggests that anything other than "flat" response is "preference". I am suggesting that "science" says otherwise.
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post #9644 of 10424 Old 08-11-2014, 05:48 PM
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I just discovered the social network soundtrack. May not be your cup of tea but some very good bass demos!!!!

here is my fav...
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post #9645 of 10424 Old 08-13-2014, 12:47 AM
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mark,

are you checking your email. Trying to get a response from you for an email I sent you on Aug 4
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post #9646 of 10424 Old 08-13-2014, 08:00 PM
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Question on the Submersive HP+ and F2+. What type of cable connects the master to the slave? Is it a Speakon? If so, does the connector of this cable have the ability to be "taken off" the wire and re-applied? Reason I ask is, I have PVC running through my theater that will fit the wire, but probably wouldn't fit the Speakon connector. If I could take the connector off, run the wire, then re-connect, that would work.

Thanks for any feedback.
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post #9647 of 10424 Old 08-13-2014, 08:59 PM
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Cables are a 4 core (typically 12awg) speakon connection.

These are purchased separately.

The connectors are generally easy remove

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post #9648 of 10424 Old 08-13-2014, 11:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bambam View Post
Question on the Submersive HP+ and F2+. What type of cable connects the master to the slave? Is it a Speakon? If so, does the connector of this cable have the ability to be "taken off" the wire and re-applied? Reason I ask is, I have PVC running through my theater that will fit the wire, but probably wouldn't fit the Speakon connector. If I could take the connector off, run the wire, then re-connect, that would work.

Thanks for any feedback.
Yes, Speakon connectors were designed for professional use to be 'field-serviceable'. All you need is a screwdriver.


Max
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post #9649 of 10424 Old 08-14-2014, 02:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bambam View Post
Question on the Submersive HP+ and F2+. What type of cable connects the master to the slave? Is it a Speakon? If so, does the connector of this cable have the ability to be "taken off" the wire and re-applied? Reason I ask is, I have PVC running through my theater that will fit the wire, but probably wouldn't fit the Speakon connector. If I could take the connector off, run the wire, then re-connect, that would work.

Thanks for any feedback.
That is exactly what I had to do. All Speakon connectors are field-serviceable. They were specifically designed to be so. This means you can take the connector off and replace it using nothing more than a screwdriver - no soldering or anything is needed. Just be sure to reconnect the wires to the correct pins, so make sure you make a note of how it is wired before you take it apart. I always take a couple of photos with my cellphone camera before I dismantle anything - it's easy to forget an hour or so later, and diagrams and drawings can seem clear when you make them, but less clear a couple of hours later when you refer back to them.
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post #9650 of 10424 Old 08-14-2014, 01:28 PM
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Great feedback guys. Thanks!
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post #9651 of 10424 Old 08-14-2014, 03:57 PM
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Do most people leave their subs on all the time, or put them on switched circuits? It seems like the draw is pretty low in standby mode.
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post #9652 of 10424 Old 08-14-2014, 03:59 PM
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Do most people leave their subs on all the time, or put them on switched circuits? It seems like the draw is pretty low in standby mode.
I think this question gets asked a lot by new owners. The anwer is yes -- most leave them on (including me). I believe the HP+ SpeakerPower amp only pulls 7w or 8w (the same as my son's night light) when idling.
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post #9653 of 10424 Old 08-15-2014, 07:44 AM
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Do most people leave their subs on all the time, or put them on switched circuits? It seems like the draw is pretty low in standby mode.
Mine have been left ON ever since I got them.
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post #9654 of 10424 Old 08-16-2014, 11:26 PM
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any FB on the XTZ Room analyzer II ?
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post #9655 of 10424 Old 08-24-2014, 05:04 AM
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Just wondering if Mark's international customer usually wait for 3 weeks before he replies to emails. I have sent him 3 emails in the last 3 weeks and he hasn't replied. In the past I have had poor service trying to get issues sorted. It usually takes about 3-4 emails and 2 weeks before I get an reply. This time I haven't had any replies after 3 weeks. It is a shame that his subs are great but after 2 years( had problem in the past trying to get a response from Mark) he still hasn't lifted his game when it comes to customer service. As soon as he fixes the problem I will probably sell the sub and buy something else. Tired of getting crappy service and waiting weeks for him to get back to me.
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post #9656 of 10424 Old 08-24-2014, 06:18 AM
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Corner loading

Can someone explain what corner loading a sub is. what the benefits are as well as any negatives. Also does this mean that no bass trapping is placed in this corner?

THanks
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post #9657 of 10424 Old 08-24-2014, 08:18 AM
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Corner loading a sub is simply placing it in the corner for max spl. It can be a couple of db's louder in the corner. Bass trapping depends on measurements taken in room. If you need to put a trap in the corner with the sub, then that is what you need to do.


On to the reason I came in this thread......I got a chance to finally hear a dual submersive setup and it sounded fantastic! This sub lives up to the hype you read about it!

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post #9658 of 10424 Old 08-24-2014, 08:57 AM
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Anybody here see those last 2 protoype Terraform XL-D18's on Seaton's forum? Dual UM-18 front loaded drivers tuned to 11hz. He is offering the master slave combo with the 4500watt speaker power amp for 4590.00. Man If I had a dedicated theater these babies would be mine!!

http://www.seaton-sound-forum.com/po...d=1283985429#8
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post #9659 of 10424 Old 08-24-2014, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
Anybody here see those last 2 protoype Terraform XL-D18's on Seaton's forum? Dual UM-18 front loaded drivers tuned to 11hz. He is offering the master slave combo with the 4500watt speaker power amp for 4590.00. Man If I had a dedicated theater these babies would be mine!!
If my theater were in a basement instead of a loft, they would have already been sold. I have 4 SubMersive HP's and as it is, my entire room really moves on heavy bass scenes. But for a basement HT, I'm not sure you can have too much woof.

According to Mark, he estimates that those two speakers would be the approximate equivalent of quad SubMersives !!!!!!
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post #9660 of 10424 Old 08-24-2014, 05:09 PM
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Man I wish I had the space for them. That would be one amazing setup!!
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