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post #10261 of 10290 Old 02-02-2016, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by audnutz View Post
According to his site, he had 40 cabinets in process a couple of weeks ago (32 of which were already bought/paid for as of that time). Last Friday, he confirmed that he received the 32 cabinets that had already been bought, and that the remaining 8 cabinets (of the 40 he had in process) would arrive this week. However, there have been recent submersive and F18 orders, so they currently only have enough amplifiers in stock to accommodate his existing orders; therefore, any new orders of submersives/f2s/f18s will need to wait until they get their next shipments of amplifiers, which he said should arrive within 2 weeks (which would be by feb 19th).
Early orders of F18s are shipping out today with more shipping through the course of the week. We were able to get more amplifiers on the way, so we'll have some inventory for new orders arriving late Thursday. One of the customers getting 8 can wait for the next batch as they are still remodeling the theater, so we have 15 available to ship next week as of this morning.
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post #10262 of 10290 Old 02-03-2016, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
Early orders of F18s are shipping out today with more shipping through the course of the week. We were able to get more amplifiers on the way, so we'll have some inventory for new orders arriving late Thursday. One of the customers getting 8 can wait for the next batch as they are still remodeling the theater, so we have 15 available to ship next week as of this morning.
Thats great news. I'll be sure to post pictures. Sounds like I'll have these Thursday the 4th? Please forward fed ex tracking. You can email it. Thanks...


EDIT: doh! I already had tracking. Was checking wrong email. Thanks Mark. This has been the easiest purchase ever. Can't wait for the beastly subs to arrive.
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post #10263 of 10290 Old 02-03-2016, 05:44 PM
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I expect to see some detailed new-product reports!
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post #10264 of 10290 Old 02-04-2016, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by jjackkrash View Post
I expect to see some detailed new-product reports!
A first few customers will have their F18s arriving Friday, with all others ordered shipping between today and Tuesday.
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post #10265 of 10290 Old 02-05-2016, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
A first few customers will have their F18s arriving Friday, with all others ordered shipping between today and Tuesday.
I got home and two of my three subs are here!

They are packaged very well and I'm excited!

I was tripping out earlier thinking one was missing but turns out fed ex just didn't put third on truck. Lol that's how big they are. Oh well should be here tomorrow or Monday.

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post #10266 of 10290 Old 02-05-2016, 08:00 PM
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Hey guys, did Mark change the website address? Does anyone have the new one? The one I had does not work anymore for some reason, it takes me to some website domain name thing. Thanks
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post #10267 of 10290 Old 02-05-2016, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Modicen View Post
Hey guys, did Mark change the website address? Does anyone have the new one? The one I had does not work anymore for some reason, it takes me to some website domain name thing. Thanks
Mark said that he was going to correct the problem, I guess he hasn't got to it yet.

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post #10268 of 10290 Old 02-05-2016, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Modicen View Post
Hey guys, did Mark change the website address? Does anyone have the new one? The one I had does not work anymore for some reason, it takes me to some website domain name thing. Thanks
He does not have a formal website. The only site they have is http://www.seaton-sound-forum.com/. The site has all the information you'd need - Product information, pictures, availability etc.

Last edited by joaquin; 02-05-2016 at 11:31 PM.
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post #10269 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveyMac View Post
I got home and two of my three subs are here!

They are packaged very well and I'm excited!

I was tripping out earlier thinking one was missing but turns out fed ex just didn't put third on truck. Lol that's how big they are. Oh well should be here tomorrow or Monday.
Pictures when you have time. Congrats and its going to be a fun weekend!
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post #10270 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveyMac View Post
I got home and two of my three subs are here!

They are packaged very well and I'm excited!

I was tripping out earlier thinking one was missing but turns out fed ex just didn't put third on truck. Lol that's how big they are. Oh well should be here tomorrow or Monday.
Looking forward to reading your thoughts/impressions!
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post #10271 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by joaquin View Post
He does not have a formal website. The only site they have is http://www.seaton-sound-forum.com/. The site has all the information you'd need - Product information, pictures, availability etc.
Thanks, that's the link I always used but for some reason it didn't work for me yesterday.
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post #10272 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 04:35 PM
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Pictures when you have time. Congrats and its going to be a fun weekend!
Last night I dropped 6 F18s off at a local customer's home. "Intense" would be a great description... and yes, he's looking forward to hearing Catalysts at Axpona so he can properly keep up with them rather than the pair of DefTech towers at each location. For scale, that's an 85" flat panel, and the vaulted ceiling above the triple stack of F18s starts at ~12'.





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post #10273 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
Last night I dropped 6 F18s off at a local customer's home. "Intense" would be a great description... and yes, he's looking forward to hearing Catalysts at Axpona so he can properly keep up with them rather than the pair of DefTech towers at each location. For scale, that's an 85" flat panel, and the vaulted ceiling above the triple stack of F18s starts at ~12'.





Mark,

F18s look very nice are you going to have them at Axpona in your room. this room has 8 towers and two center channels?

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post #10274 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 09:14 PM
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where are you seeing the 2nd center channel?

EDIT: Never mind had to turn up the brightness of monitor a tad.

Who needs 4K?... just go see your optometrist.

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post #10275 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 09:56 PM
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where are you seeing the 2nd center channel?

EDIT: Never mind had to turn up the brightness of monitor a tad.

It took me a second to see it as well. I don't think I ever seen a setup like that would be curious as to how it sounds and what AV equipment are they using.
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post #10276 of 10290 Old 02-06-2016, 10:06 PM
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Mark,

F18s look very nice are you going to have them at Axpona in your room. this room has 8 towers and two center channels?
Indeed, we will have 2 stacks of four F18s in the room at Axpona, April 15-17th.

Yes, I believe an enterprising salesperson convinced the owner to just double up on the big Deftech towers rather than searching out more capable speakers. Good eye on the pair of center channels under the TV. In case anyone is thinking this is a cool idea, it does NOT work very well. You do get more sound, but not better sound.
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post #10277 of 10290 Old 02-07-2016, 05:28 AM
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Room looks overwhelmed to me.
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post #10278 of 10290 Old 02-07-2016, 06:02 AM
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Room looks overwhelmed to me.
That sounds dangerously close to implying "overkill", which of course doesn't exist. Anything worth doing is worth overdoing
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post #10279 of 10290 Old 02-07-2016, 07:02 AM
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Man- they look fantastic! Nice space too. Considering the placement options we discussed, but may require some dust, HAHA.

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post #10280 of 10290 Old 02-07-2016, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
Indeed, we will have 2 stacks of four F18s in the room at Axpona, April 15-17th.
Mark,

Maybe this has been asked and answered before, but are you considering offering two F18s in one cabinet, basically an 18-inch version of the F2+?

Seeing all these stacked 18-inch subs, it seems to me it would make sense to offer a product with two front-facing 18-inch drivers in one cabinet.

Thanks.
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post #10281 of 10290 Old 02-07-2016, 09:22 AM
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I would guess NOT
Mark likes his back.

you would be looking at a cabinet almost 4ft tall at that point, between the weight and size I would not want to ship it either

Quote:
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Mark,

Maybe this has been asked and answered before, but are you considering offering two F18s in one cabinet, basically an 18-inch version of the F2+?

Seeing all these stacked 18-inch subs, it seems to me it would make sense to offer a product with two front-facing 18-inch drivers in one cabinet.

Thanks.

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Bringing you Custom subwoofer kits, with flames if you want
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post #10282 of 10290 Old Yesterday, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary J View Post
Room looks overwhelmed to me.
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Originally Posted by Magibeg View Post
That sounds dangerously close to implying "overkill", which of course doesn't exist. Anything worth doing is worth overdoing
I'm sure an interior decorator would object to many items in the room, including the 3 ~50" screens above the windows and 85" screen and certainly the many large DefTech' towers around the room. The 3rd sub in the stacks vs. just 2 per side making them a 6' tall stack of subwoofer definitely pushes into the "look at me" presentation, but much less so with the grills on. Fortunately everyone gets to assemble their own system to suit their taste and use of their system. In rooms like this with a lot of open space and openings behind the seating area, the front stack of subs perform very well in-room. While the room would benefit from more soft surfaces & treatments, it's very high on the fun factor, which was the owner's top priority.

It's hard to convey scale in quick photos, but here is another taken from the top of the open stairway/balcony at the back/above the room:
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post #10283 of 10290 Old Yesterday, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LRS3 View Post
Mark,

Maybe this has been asked and answered before, but are you considering offering two F18s in one cabinet, basically an 18-inch version of the F2+?

Seeing all these stacked 18-inch subs, it seems to me it would make sense to offer a product with two front-facing 18-inch drivers in one cabinet.

Thanks.
The intent with the modular approach is to allow a wider range of configurations and flexibility in both starting points and future upgrades. There is also a significant benefit in keeping to one cabinet type that we can order in larger quantities and keep better stock of. If someone wanted to start with just an F18+ and single slave unit, they could place the subs in the front corners to start, getting the benefit of smoothing some of the width modes in the room. Then for the price of 2 F18-slaves (~60% the price of the first pair) they can double the systems capability and set up 2 F18s in each front corner.

A dual front firing 18" cabinet would not offer any performance advantage, and any cost reduction in one cabinet vs. two would likely get offset by building in lower quantities vs the modules and the added handling, packaging and freight shipping costs of the much heavier and larger subwoofer. The custom packaging with heavy duty box and waterjet cut foam caps allow us to ship to the majority of the US for $75-105, and offer a package that mere mortals can safely get into a basement or up to a second floor, while allowing the option of multiple placements or assembling a 450 lb subwoofer tower. Having worked on the limited run of the Terraform D18/XL designs, I'm well aware of what is involved in safe handling of large cabinets, both during assembly, packing, shipping and installation. While I'm open to larger subwoofers, the bigger the item, the more the process becomes riddled with pitfalls for a direct sale company, and those inevitable issues have to be built into the pricing if we want to be around another 11 years to take care of owners. Fortunately a dual 18" is at the lower end of the range where handling becomes a complete nightmare, and I have already considered a dual driver cabinet to allow us to fit long dimensions less than $47" tall or wide.

I am genuinely curious to hear what you would be looking to gain in a dual driver cabinet vs stacking 2 modules. Could you elaborate on what need/desire you would hope a dual driver variation would fill?
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post #10284 of 10290 Old Yesterday, 02:02 PM
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I'm keeping my eye out for a Seaton F2 in rosenut color to match my B&W's. But now this F18 has my interest too. I just like the shallower depth of the F2 a bit more. That shallower depth will help flexibility of placement in my living room more than most of the big boxes out there now.

Why do all of my threads suck? Is there an internet posting school somewhere? -wes k
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post #10285 of 10290 Old Yesterday, 04:28 PM
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I'm keeping my eye out for a Seaton F2 in rosenut color to match my B&W's. But now this F18 has my interest too. I just like the shallower depth of the F2 a bit more. That shallower depth will help flexibility of placement in my living room more than most of the big boxes out there now.
The F2 does fit rather nicely where floor space is limited with the caveat of it's 36" height. The F18 is 2.5" deeper with the grill on and 3.5" wider. The F2 also has the large, 4" chamfers on each vertical rear corner, which allows it to angle or tuck into a corner while not sticking out so far from the wall.
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post #10286 of 10290 Old Today, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
I am genuinely curious to hear what you would be looking to gain in a dual driver cabinet vs stacking 2 modules. Could you elaborate on what need/desire you would hope a dual driver variation would fill?
I think the main advantage of one cabinet versus two is that the customer would have absolutely no concerns that the top subwoofer cabinet would shift somehow during use relative to the bottom subwoofer cabinet. Or, God forbid, shift enough to actually fall off! Maybe your experience has been that been that the top cabinet never wobbles or moves at all relative to the bottom one, but a single cabinet would eliminate all customer concerns, however unjustified, about that.

Appearance is a matter of individual taste, but I think a single cabinet looks more attractive than two stacked cabinets.

And finally, it seems like you're selling a lot of these units as stacked multiples, so it seems there could be reasonable customer demand for a dual-driver version. I wasn't thinking of having two different versions (master and slave) of a dual-driver model; I was thinking of only one conventional powered model.

Plus, two 18-inch drivers in one cabinet! Is that the ultimate subwoofer or not?!!

Thanks for asking.
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post #10287 of 10290 Old Today, 01:14 PM
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I think the main advantage of one cabinet versus two is that the customer would have absolutely no concerns that the top subwoofer cabinet would shift somehow during use relative to the bottom subwoofer cabinet. Or, God forbid, shift enough to actually fall off! Maybe your experience has been that been that the top cabinet never wobbles or moves at all relative to the bottom one, but a single cabinet would eliminate all customer concerns, however unjustified, about that.

Appearance is a matter of individual taste, but I think a single cabinet looks more attractive than two stacked cabinets.

And finally, it seems like you're selling a lot of these units as stacked multiples, so it seems there could be reasonable customer demand for a dual-driver version. I wasn't thinking of having two different versions (master and slave) of a dual-driver model; I was thinking of only one conventional powered model.

Plus, two 18-inch drivers in one cabinet! Is that the ultimate subwoofer or not?!!

Thanks for asking.
Thanks for the thoughts.

The plus model offerings came about from the interest some customers had in a SubMersive "F4." I have a drawing for the cabinet, and we considered it seriously, but shipping, handling, potential for damage, inventory and availability kept bringing us back to the fact that a 70-72" tall cabinet is a monster to handle when we already have a SubMersive F2 we can produce reliably. Other than possibly saving 1-2" in height, the single cabinet offers no benefit over the single. Those wanting to upgrade would have to sell their current subwoofer and order this new behemoth that would cost on average 3-4 times that of shipping a single F2. For hand delivery service into the home by the freight company add $100-300.

The plus option allowed both F2 and HP owners the option to add the second unit at a later date or purchase them together. Around the same time it became more and more clear that the best solutions for most rooms was a common signal to the front wall subwoofers such as front L/R corners or flanking the center channel with a separate amplifier and signal toward the rear of the room. The plus option makes for an easier and less expensive upgrade path toward the long term goal many have for 4 SubMersives in their home theater. The plus option allowed this benefit to extend to both the HP and F2 owners who could then either stack the units or place them separately in a room.

So far as stability when stacking, this was considered and tested during design of both the F2 and F18. Beneath the included rubber feet is a counter-bore which allows the feet to be removed and the screw re-inserted to seal the hole, but the head sits just below the finished surface of the cabinet's bottom. We offer a foam-rubber pad of the same material we use on top of our speaker stands. This foam has a waffle-texture which creates a lot of resistance to sheer forces under any weight. Once the upper speaker compresses the material you need to lift the upper cabinet to scoot/slide it, or an adult needs to put a shoulder into it. This also eliminates the gap the feet would leave between cabinets and helps create a homogeneous, monolith-like appearance.

More importantly, when the subwoofers are stacked with each having a woofer driven with the same signal, the force on the stack is almost entirely forward-back in unison. As soon as we had a pair of F2s, and later F18s we stacked up the units with the 1/8" foam rubber between and drove them full-tilt with a 10-15Hz sine wave. There is a slight fore-aft reaction force to the entire stack, but there is absolutely zero motion between the upper and lower cabinets. We demonstrated this at 3 shows now where we had the subwoofers playing demanding demo scenes the entire weekend without any shifting of the upper cabinets.

Since the F18 can be stacked more than 2 tall, and we do have customers in earthquake prone regions, we have included 2 3/8-16" threaded inserts at the top and bottom rear of the cabinet. We will soon be offering a rectangular locking plate which will secure the 2 cabinets physically to guarantee they cannot move separately, and even allows the top most insert to be used as an earthquake restraint/anchor. Here is another look at the rear of the cabinet where you can see the 2 large flat head, 3/8" screws which are flush with the box but can be used to secure the units together:



With the locking plate installed, the stack feels like a single monolith and there is no concern at all of separation. A dual cabinet may be a special order offering as I mentioned, but more for space limitations. Our amplifier will still allow us to drive 2 cabinets (4 total woofers) from one amplifier.

Personally I think the stack without the feet between looks pretty slick:



Having assembled and delivered 7' tall, 600 lb subwoofer, I took some ideas from what worked on that project where we needed to move it into the room and assemble it in manageable pieces (4x100 lb modules and 200 lb rear enclosure):










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post #10288 of 10290 Old Today, 05:12 PM
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Thanks for responding, Mark. As an alternative to a single-cabinet dual-18-inch-driver design, I was going to suggest some means of physically tieing two cabinets together. It's good to know that you already have something under development.

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Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post
Last night I dropped 6 F18s off at a local customer's home. "Intense" would be a great description... and yes, he's looking forward to hearing Catalysts at Axpona so he can properly keep up with them rather than the pair of DefTech towers at each location. For scale, that's an 85" flat panel, and the vaulted ceiling above the triple stack of F18s starts at ~12'.





Good grief!

DJ

Overkill IS my middle name.
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post #10290 of 10290 Old Today, 10:01 PM
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Thanks for the thoughts.

The plus model offerings came about from the interest some customers had in a SubMersive "F4." I have a drawing for the cabinet, and we considered it seriously, but shipping, handling, potential for damage, inventory and availability kept bringing us back to the fact that a 70-72" tall cabinet is a monster to handle when we already have a SubMersive F2 we can produce reliably. Other than possibly saving 1-2" in height, the single cabinet offers no benefit over the single. Those wanting to upgrade would have to sell their current subwoofer and order this new behemoth that would cost on average 3-4 times that of shipping a single F2. For hand delivery service into the home by the freight company add $100-300.

The plus option allowed both F2 and HP owners the option to add the second unit at a later date or purchase them together. Around the same time it became more and more clear that the best solutions for most rooms was a common signal to the front wall subwoofers such as front L/R corners or flanking the center channel with a separate amplifier and signal toward the rear of the room. The plus option makes for an easier and less expensive upgrade path toward the long term goal many have for 4 SubMersives in their home theater. The plus option allowed this benefit to extend to both the HP and F2 owners who could then either stack the units or place them separately in a room.

So far as stability when stacking, this was considered and tested during design of both the F2 and F18. Beneath the included rubber feet is a counter-bore which allows the feet to be removed and the screw re-inserted to seal the hole, but the head sits just below the finished surface of the cabinet's bottom. We offer a foam-rubber pad of the same material we use on top of our speaker stands. This foam has a waffle-texture which creates a lot of resistance to sheer forces under any weight. Once the upper speaker compresses the material you need to lift the upper cabinet to scoot/slide it, or an adult needs to put a shoulder into it. This also eliminates the gap the feet would leave between cabinets and helps create a homogeneous, monolith-like appearance.

More importantly, when the subwoofers are stacked with each having a woofer driven with the same signal, the force on the stack is almost entirely forward-back in unison. As soon as we had a pair of F2s, and later F18s we stacked up the units with the 1/8" foam rubber between and drove them full-tilt with a 10-15Hz sine wave. There is a slight fore-aft reaction force to the entire stack, but there is absolutely zero motion between the upper and lower cabinets. We demonstrated this at 3 shows now where we had the subwoofers playing demanding demo scenes the entire weekend without any shifting of the upper cabinets.

Since the F18 can be stacked more than 2 tall, and we do have customers in earthquake prone regions, we have included 2 3/8-16" threaded inserts at the top and bottom rear of the cabinet. We will soon be offering a rectangular locking plate which will secure the 2 cabinets physically to guarantee they cannot move separately, and even allows the top most insert to be used as an earthquake restraint/anchor. Here is another look at the rear of the cabinet where you can see the 2 large flat head, 3/8" screws which are flush with the box but can be used to secure the units together:



With the locking plate installed, the stack feels like a single monolith and there is no concern at all of separation. A dual cabinet may be a special order offering as I mentioned, but more for space limitations. Our amplifier will still allow us to drive 2 cabinets (4 total woofers) from one amplifier.

Personally I think the stack without the feet between looks pretty slick:



Having assembled and delivered 7' tall, 600 lb subwoofer, I took some ideas from what worked on that project where we needed to move it into the room and assemble it in manageable pieces (4x100 lb modules and 200 lb rear enclosure):











Holy Crap!

Overkill IS my middle name.
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