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post #1081 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 01:04 PM
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When I said "pro" the exact words was "one of the best there is " I will give praise when it is due. Rod
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post #1082 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 02:25 PM
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By the way the calibrater in Sacramento said he has a private plane and since I live in a small town that is a famous fly in location for private pilots he would just fly here for the same as driving here since its such a long drive to get here. Very reasonable for what I am getting. So there is someone for Northern California if you have a airport. Interesting, Yes?
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post #1083 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 02:26 PM
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Roddey
Will you be using the Submersive for audio or just movies? If audio what are your main speakers?
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post #1084 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry7995 View Post

Roddey
Will you be using the Submersive for audio or just movies? If audio what are your main speakers?

Both. But my main concern was music. Hence a sealed sub. The speakers I have for front left and right is a modified Klipsch la Scala. I am using the horn loaded bass bins with altec horns and drivers.
But from what I understand some people dont like horns. A personal choice for sure. Be aware la Scala has a distortion at higher volumes because of the design of the horns. So people do like I did a lot and use altec for the mids and highs.
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post #1085 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 02:44 PM
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I just hooked up a Denon 3808ci to them also. On my new remote I hit "up" volume when I should of hit "down" in the dark. It took me awhile fumbling in the dark to find the down volume button. It caused pain in my ears for awhile. Volume is not an issue
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post #1086 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kain View Post

Here is a graph of the SubMersive in someone's room (can't find how big) but it gives you the estimate of the general SPL over 8-80Hz.



Pretty darn impressive I must say.

That would be my theater its kind of an odd ball shape, but right at about 2300ft^3 The room is closed off to the rest of the house, but the door flaps like a humming bird when you crank it up

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post #1087 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 08:54 PM
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I am getting ready to buy the xlr cables. Can someone tell me what cable end I need to connect to the submersive sub. Male or female?
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post #1088 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddey View Post

I am getting ready to buy the xlr cables. Can someone tell me what cable end I need to connect to the submersive sub. Male or female?

Honestly, you can just get a subwoofer rca cable. The Submersive comes with an XLR cable which connects to the rca.
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post #1089 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperM3 View Post

Honestly, you can just get a subwoofer rca cable. The Submersive comes with an XLR cable which connects to the rca.

Mark suggested that since I am getting an Valodyne sms-1 with xlr out I use that. Also I am going to have to switch wires when going between home theatre and tube amps,preamps so he said xlr would be better because rca wear out if you plug and unplug them on a regular basis. So I will be using xlr adapters on the amp side also. I have looked for a photo of the xlr input plug on the sub but cant find one. Do I need a female end on the xlr connector that plugs into the sub? That is how the valodyne is set up. It has a male output plug. So if I am right I would need a 75 foot female to female xlr cord. Is this correct? Thanks, Rod
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post #1090 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 10:19 PM
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Has anyone used one of these or what do you guys think of these cords? Do they look like what I need ? I have never used xlr before. http://www.onevisitmedia.com/cablesxlrftoxlrf.html
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post #1091 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 10:28 PM
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http://www.monoprice.com/products/se...rd=xlr&x=0&y=0

I have purchased from monoprice a few times and have always been pleased.
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post #1092 of 9618 Old 05-17-2009, 10:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry7995 View Post

http://www.monoprice.com/products/se...rd=xlr&x=0&y=0

I have purchased from monoprice a few times and have always been pleased.

Thanks for the tip. I will use them.
Do I need a female connector on the cord for the sub side? I hate to keep asking but??????
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post #1093 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 04:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sandbagger View Post

That would be my theater its kind of an odd ball shape, but right at about 2300ft^3 The room is closed off to the rest of the house, but the door flaps like a humming bird when you crank it up

Yea. When I saw that my mouth just about hit the floor as well. We did not do any MAX SPL in my room. I really don't think that would have been a good idea.

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post #1094 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddey View Post

Has anyone used one of these or what do you guys think of these cords? Do they look like what I need ? I have never used xlr before. http://www.onevisitmedia.com/cablesxlrftoxlrf.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by larry7995 View Post

http://www.monoprice.com/products/se...rd=xlr&x=0&y=0

I have purchased from monoprice a few times and have always been pleased.

For the price difference I use and recommend the Premium Canare TecNec Cables from Markertek which are both durable, well made, and very flexible. You can even choose different colors to help with cable ID, or just go with black.

If you are hiding wires or using long wires you won't want to have to re-terminate or buy new in a system that has RCA output only, I often recommend running XLR-XLR the full length and adding a 1.5' long, wired XLR-RCA adapter at the rack. If you later upgrade to a pre-amp or EQ that has XLR outputs, just remove the $14 adapter and plug in. This also generally provides less opportunity for hum/buzz system issues when running longer RCA-XLR connections.

I do provide a 3' XLR Male - RCA Female adapter with the SubMersive which works well, and allows immediate drop in for any existing RCA cables, particularly if they are already run in the wall.

Note that common usage of XLR connectors is intended to make some sense... male is signal output and female is signal input. The outputs from a pre-amp are male (you see 3 metal pins inside the housing), with the input to the SubMersive or any amplifier being female (holes for the 3 pins inside the plastic filled tip).

Mark Seaton
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post #1095 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roddey View Post

By the way the calibrater in Sacramento said he has a private plane and since I live in a small town that is a famous fly in location for private pilots he would just fly here for the same as driving here since its such a long drive to get here. Very reasonable for what I am getting. So there is someone for Northern California if you have a airport. Interesting, Yes?

Now there's some unique service.

FYI, I will be in the N. Cal region for a meet planned for July 11th in the Bay Area. Should be a lot of fun.

Mark Seaton
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post #1096 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperM3 View Post

Honestly, you can just get a subwoofer rca cable. The Submersive comes with an XLR cable which connects to the rca.


XLR? While ive heard the name before I do not know what it is. Can someone tell me about the XLR ? Receivers with XLRs ?

thanks
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post #1097 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 07:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James W. Johnson View Post

XLR? While ive heard the name before I do not know what it is. Can someone tell me about the XLR ? Receivers with XLRs ?

thanks

These are the standard connection used for balanced audio connections in both consumer and pro audio. You will often find the cables listed as "microphone cables." For pictures click on any of the links in my post above.

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post #1098 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

Under what conditions? At 1m ground plane the answer would range from 95-125dB.

Is that at maximum amp capacity? The chart that was posted only goes upto 80Hz, would the SPL output drop further after 80 Hz?

I'm not sure what is meant by ground plane, but I was referring to 1m measurement.
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post #1099 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decadent_Spectre View Post

Is that at maximum amp capacity? The chart that was posted only goes upto 80Hz, would the SPL output drop further after 80 Hz?

I'm not sure what is meant by ground plane, but I was referring to 1m measurement.

That measurment was in my room, if I remember corectly, it doesnt roll off up top for quite a bit, but mark will have to answer that.

also my room is pretty crazy shaped, and has issues due to that.

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post #1100 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James W. Johnson View Post

XLR? While ive heard the name before I do not know what it is. Can someone tell me about the XLR ? Receivers with XLRs ?

thanks


Usually you have to step up to dedicated Pre-Amps to get XLR's onboard, not too many receivers that have them, in fact I can't think of any...

Hence Mark showing the RCA to XLR adapter to accommodate the needs of the many...
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post #1101 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Decadent_Spectre View Post

Is that at maximum amp capacity? The chart that was posted only goes upto 80Hz, would the SPL output drop further after 80 Hz?

I'm not sure what is meant by ground plane, but I was referring to 1m measurement.

That's outdoors on the ground. You can see the outdoor frequency response I posted on my forum which shows the SubMersive's extension to ~200Hz. I haven't really concerned myself with maximum output above 100-120Hz, but it should do 120dB @1m or more. The Terraform XL will do 120-124dB in the upper octave with much greater output down to 10-12Hz... but is ~3x the size and 75% greater cost.

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post #1102 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

For the price difference I use and recommend the Premium Canare TecNec Cables from Markertek which are both durable, well made, and very flexible. You can even choose different colors to help with cable ID, or just go with black.

If you are hiding wires or using long wires you won't want to have to re-terminate or buy new in a system that has RCA output only, I often recommend running XLR-XLR the full length and adding a 1.5' long, wired XLR-RCA adapter at the rack. If you later upgrade to a pre-amp or EQ that has XLR outputs, just remove the $14 adapter and plug in. This also generally provides less opportunity for hum/buzz system issues when running longer RCA-XLR connections.

I do provide a 3' XLR Male - RCA Female adapter with the SubMersive which works well, and allows immediate drop in for any existing RCA cables, particularly if they are already run in the wall.

Note that common usage of XLR connectors is intended to make some sense... male is signal output and female is signal input. The outputs from a pre-amp are male (you see 3 metal pins inside the housing), with the input to the SubMersive or any amplifier being female (holes for the 3 pins inside the plastic filled tip).

Thanks Mark,
I do have a long run for cable Minimum 50 up to 80 feet depending on were the sub goes. I got the 100 foot cable just in case. The manual on the SMS-1 sub controller says that unbalanced in and balanced out works O.K.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

That's outdoors on the ground. You can see the outdoor frequency response I posted on my forum which shows the SubMersive's extension to ~200Hz. I haven't really concerned myself with maximum output above 100-120Hz, but it should do 120dB @1m or more. The Terraform XL will do 120-124dB in the upper octave with much greater output down to 10-12Hz... but is ~3x the size and 75% greater cost.

Quit! Your making me drool again!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Seaton View Post

That's outdoors on the ground. You can see the outdoor frequency response I posted on my forum which shows the SubMersive's extension to ~200Hz. I haven't really concerned myself with maximum output above 100-120Hz, but it should do 120dB @1m or more. The Terraform XL will do 120-124dB in the upper octave with much greater output down to 10-12Hz... but is ~3x the size and 75% greater cost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluedevilfan View Post

Quit! Your making me drool again!!


I've told him time and time again....Mark, you are a pusher!

He says that he's only an "enabler." Pffft!

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Is anyone in the NY, NJ, CT tristate area planning a get together? I would love to hear/feel a NIN blu ray concert with one of these beasts. I'm a little hesitant to buy this or any ID sub without listening to it first. I was leaning toward a SVS PB-13 then I stumbled across the SubMersive and have a feeling that this will be a better performer all around.

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post #1106 of 9618 Old 05-18-2009, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokerrx View Post

Is anyone in the NY, NJ, CT tristate area planning a get together? I would love to hear/feel a NIN blu ray concert with one of these beasts. I'm a little hesitant to buy this or any ID sub without listening to it first. I was leaning toward a SVS PB-13 then I stumbled across the SubMersive and have a feeling that this will be a better performer all around.

Dunno where you are but Im always willing to let people bring over their own demo material and abuse my system.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperM3 View Post

Dunno where you are but Im always willing to let people bring over their own demo material and abuse my system.

Sweet! I'll be over tomorrow afternoon

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Sorry, Blurays only.
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post #1109 of 9618 Old 05-19-2009, 12:38 AM
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I've been on the verge of buying 1 or 2 ported subs (SVS PB-13s, AV123 MFW-15, Epik Phoenix) for awhile for my +7500ft^3 room (90% HT). As I've read this and other forums, the Submersive emerged to me as the true enthusiast's subwoofer. It is often compared favorably to the top competitors. Some posters have even suggested it is equal to 2 SVS PB-13 Ultras. Never once have I seen a review that suggests that the SVS PB-13 Ultra is even comparable (except for around the tuning frequency). As a result, I have been on the verge of purchasing a Submersive (or two) for weeks now.

However, something keeps gnawing at me as I prepare to spend $2-4K on a sealed sub. How come the Submersive never showed up on Craigsub? Why? It was suggested that Seaton didn't want the incremental demand an outstanding Craigsub rating would create, but I find that a bit hard to believe.
Craigsub has been the best tool for me to make any sense of all the choices. And based on what I've read, nearly everyone values and respects the Craigsub findings. The QUANTITATIVE ANALYSIS OF CRAIGSUB HT SUBWOOFER RATINGS http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=998318 further suggests the validity of the ratings.

The Submersive was released well before Craigsub retired from ranking subwoofers. How could it be the most celebrated subwoofer ranking system failed to rank the celebrated subwoofer?

I've also been surprised that no one has used the quantitative analysis to fill in the gap and predict the Submersive HT score. Well here it is:
HT = 22.7 + 1.02 DRV_DIAM + 1.24 BOX_VOL + 0.00476 PWR + 2.83 VNT + 7.09 HI_XMAX

HT = 56.3 = 22.7 + 1.02 * 15 + 1.24 * 5.2 + 0.00476 * 1000 + 2.83 * 0 + 7.09 * 1

HT = 56 is respectable, but less than the SVS PB-13 Ultra. Curiously, it is equal to a pair of AV123 MFW-15s (which were also designed by Seaton).

So now I'm confused:

- The antidotal reviews suggest I should invest in a Submersive. It digs the deepest, great in mid-base range, and exposes nuance that no other subwoofer can.

- The Quantitative Analysis regression formula (HT=56) suggest the Submersive is right up there with the best on the Craigsub ranking, but below the SVS Ultra. This suggests the cheaper SVS Ultra (or other EPIK offerings) are a much better value for my HT needs. This assumes the regression formula is predictive (it's R-Sq = 95.7% suggests it is very accurate)

I feel like it is heresy to question the Submersive, but I'm tortured by this decision.
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post #1110 of 9618 Old 05-19-2009, 02:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shultzmeister View Post

I’ve been on the verge of buying 1 or 2 ported subs (SVS PB-13s, AV123 MFW-15, Epik Phoenix) for awhile for my +7500ft^3 room (90% HT). As I’ve read this and other forums, the Submersive emerged to me as the true enthusiast’s subwoofer. It is often compared favorably to the top competitors. Some posters have even suggested it is equal to 2 SVS PB-13 Ultras. Never once have I seen a review that suggests that the SVS PB-13 Ultra is even comparable (except for around the tuning frequency). As a result, I have been on the verge of purchasing a Submersive (or two) for weeks now.

However, something keeps gnawing at me as I prepare to spend $2-4K on a sealed sub. How come the Submersive never showed up on Craigsub? Why? It was suggested that Seaton didn’t want the incremental demand an outstanding Craigsub rating would create, but I find that a bit hard to believe.
Craigsub has been the best tool for me to make any sense of all the choices. And based on what I’ve read, nearly everyone values and respects the Craigsub findings. The “QUANTITATIVE ANALYSIS OF “CRAIGSUB” HT SUBWOOFER RATINGS” http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=998318 further suggests the validity of the ratings.

The Submersive was released well before Craigsub retired from ranking subwoofers. How could it be the most celebrated subwoofer ranking system failed to rank the celebrated subwoofer?

I’ve also been surprised that no one has used the “quantitative analysis” to fill in the gap and predict the Submersive HT score. Well here it is:
HT = 22.7 + 1.02 DRV_DIAM + 1.24 BOX_VOL + 0.00476 PWR + 2.83 VNT + 7.09 HI_XMAX

HT = 56.3 = 22.7 + 1.02 * 15 + 1.24 * 5.2 + 0.00476 * 1000 + 2.83 * 0 + 7.09 * 1

HT = 56 is respectable, but less than the SVS PB-13 Ultra. Curiously, it is equal to a pair of AV123 MFW-15s (which were also designed by Seaton).

So now I’m confused:

- The antidotal reviews suggest I should invest in a Submersive. It digs the deepest, great in mid-base range, and exposes nuance that no other subwoofer can.

- The “Quantitative Analysis” regression formula (HT=56) suggest the Submersive is right up there with the best on the Craigsub ranking, but below the SVS Ultra. This suggests the cheaper SVS Ultra (or other EPIK offerings) are a much better value for my HT needs. This assumes the regression formula is predictive (it’s R-Sq = 95.7% suggests it is very accurate)

I feel like it is heresy to question the Submersive, but I’m tortured by this decision.


what ever happened to go old measuring?

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